Once Upon a Time podcast forums
Theories and discussion about ABC's Once Upon a Time TV show
Surayya wrote:Also we mostly just see the doors which like 99% of household doors (my own wardrobe included) are much lower than the ceiling or internal height. The images we see looking through the wardrobe show the internal space as being much more hollowed out than just from the door down & last but not least - its TV, budget is budget, if you can use a smaller scale model because its not a major feature in many scenes, you do - just because it doesnt look entirely large enough doesnt mean it isnt when you take into consideration we've been told SW is/;was going to go through
Fair point I suppose. I still say it didn't look wide enough or deep enough to take a heavily pregnant woman though.
Surayya wrote:BF "The tree is enchanted, if fashioned into a vessel it can ward off any curse" ....... Now the term vessel used in this context = 1. A hollow utensil, such as a cup, vase, or pitcher, used as a container, especially for liquids. Or in this case a wardrobe.
Just because we saw what was left of the tree made into a wardrobe in this instance, that doesn't mean it was the ONLY type of vessel that could have been made from the tree, which would maintain the enchantment. Pinocchio's puppet body was a vessel for his human spirit. If he was made from the tree, it still fits with the statement she made.
Surayya wrote:BF "This will work, we ALL must have faith. There is however a catch, the enchantment is indeed powerful, but all power has its limits & this tree can PROTECT only one" Now she clearly said point blank here 1, Not 2, 1 (so if they send another through via that same tree & they are PROTECTED from the curse ie have memories in tack & happiness in their lives, then I'll be really annoyed as that is a massive discrepancy in the story arc & if it's handled like that its just poor writing, which I highly doubt is likely).
What was left of the tree could only ward off the curse for one person. As I said previously, if Pinocchio was made from the tree, he was ALREADY protected. To add to that thought, if he WAS protected from the curse, what would have happened to him if he'd stayed in FTL? When everyone else got swept away and the land was destroyed, would the poor kid have been left there alone? All the more reason for Blue Fairy to send him away with Emma.
Surayya wrote:No she didnt say it transports the person in it- that is just a given (at least it is for me & everyone Ive spoken to about it)
It's a fair assumption to make based on what we saw happen, which is why it's what everyone, (including myself up until yesterday) has assumed and accepted as fact. But if you take her words exactly as spoken, without assuming anything beyond that, she clearly didn't specify that the protection she spoke of involved transportation to another world.
Surayya wrote:Yeah sorry but if we go with the good guys are just lying, then we have to consider everything we've heard out of every 'good' guy's mouth is all just lies- so nope, Im not buying that, we've seen Zero evidence for it nor anything that could even be termed a white lie from BF
I put the bit on the end of my last post about her straight up lying, because I know that not everyone would be willing to automatically buy the theory I'd just spelled out.
She would have been lying, if "protection" = "transportation". So if you don't wanna believe that Blue Fairy is a straight up liar, then "protection" NOT EQUALING "transportation" would be a way people could accept the storyline. The whole "only one can be protected" argument is one sticking point that people have with him being Pinocchio. I'm just saying, they could make it work without having to compromise what they've already shown us.
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After re watching ep 1 I went & edited my post to include when PC puts baby in it he could have in fact fit inside it himself, its just the extreme low camera angle that makes background stuff look much bigger/larger than it really is (we learnt this in high school photography classes lol) Also SW says " the wardrobe, it only takes 1" & "you have to send her through" Sounds like they already new the curse was going to transport them all & that the wardrobe was going to transport their child as well.
If Pino was made from that same tree & he was protected from the curse, fine I'd buy that- BUT he'd NOT have to be transported anywhere then as the curse (or EQ) took ALL FTL folk & plonked them in our non magical world, to live cursed lives - stripping them of their happy endings etc.
So to me if he's protected from the effects of the curse, he'd still have been transported like everything else (remember the glass coffin is in our world as well, so it stands to reason Everything in FTL came- Im actually thinking that the transportation was more like a transference, FTL was transferred to its non magical or opposite equivalent & so our SB is sort of the non magical version of FTL, which is why the wardrobe spat Emma out well away from SB to help protect her from the curse), BUT would not be curse touched & therefore have ALL memories in tact etc- that Id buy I guess, but so not him being transported by the the enchanted wardrobe which can protect only one (Emma had to get AWAY from the EQ as she is the only one who can stop her, Not Pino, so EQ will hardly be looking for a non cursed Pino if he was indeed protected from the curse & so would not have needed transporting out of SB). I do have to wonder tho why it is Gep would have gone looking for away to save his boy if he was already protected from the curse?
At the end of the day if you REALLLLLLLLY want August (or any character for that matter) to be someone, you'll find away to make any situation 'prove' whatever theory you want it to - I am liking the newest Wizard of Oz theory/ stuff - its very well thought out there (even though Im not a fan of WOO I gotta admit they have made a very good case for it lol). I would love for August to be PP, but know its entirely unlikely. I like some of the stuff people have come up with for him being Bae as well (Id rather he's Bae than Pino- but cant fall in love with any Bae theoies enough to get my hopes to high ). I do like your theory that Pino was protected before the curse hit (it makes WAY MORE sense than him being protected by becoming part of the wardrobe), but its the only one that currently makes any sense to me from a logical stand point
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Surayya wrote:Phee If you pause ep one when the camera pans around to show the tree being made into a wardrobe, the wardrobe IS the tree- its just been hollowed out & the doors are made from part of the hollowed out stuff, it was never chopped up & turned into an actual wardrobe in fact it appears it never even was removed from the cart they wheeled it into the council room with- so I just dont get where your interpretation of vessel is coming from re Pino/wardrobe, the BF speech has no context what so ever that could be taken as human vessel that I can work out.
Yes I know it's just the hollowed out tree, that was pretty obvious. LOL Blue Fairy said a vessel made from that tree. "Vessel" can mean various things, including someone's body. She didn't specify what kind of vessels made from this tree, in what form, would offer protection. In this case, it just made sense to hollow it out and slap some doors on it and that's the particular type of vessel that was made. That doesn't exclude other vessels having been made from the tree at some previous point in time.
Surayya wrote:Also SW says " the wardrobe, it only takes 1" & "you have to send her through" Sounds like they already new the curse was going to transport them all & that the wardrobe was going to transport their child as well.
Which doesn't necessarily exclude the fact that that transportation ability wasn't a separate spell. If Blue Fairy WAS the one responsible for the spell that actually transported, she's not gonna go around telling everyone that she can do that, coz then everyone will be bugging her to save them, and it's not everyone's destiny to be saved yet.
Surayya wrote:If Pino was made from that same tree & he was protected from the curse, fine I'd buy that- BUT he'd NOT have to be transported anywhere then as the curse (or EQ) took ALL FTL folk & plonked them in our non magical world, to live cursed lives - stripping them of their happy endings etc.
So to me if he's protected from the effects of the curse, he'd still have been transported like everything else (remember the glass coffin is in our world as well, so it stands to reason Everything in FTL came-
If he was immune to the curse due to being made from the tree which was immune to the curse, then I don't think the curse would have picked him up and plonked him down in our world. We haven't seen the tree stump wardrobe in our world either. If we had, then obviously this theory of mine wouldn't hold water because that would mean that the enchanted tree and anything made from it was still subjected to the curse. But unless and until we're shown that, what I'm saying is still a valid possibility.
Surayya wrote:(Emma had to get AWAY from the EQ as she is the only one who can stop her, Not Pino, so EQ will hardly be looking for a non cursed Pino if he was indeed protected from the curse & so would not have needed transporting out of SB).
Well, the other part of my speculation is that Pinocchio was also sent as a protector for Emma, so someone would definitely be there to find her by the roadside, and someone who knows FTL to be true would be an adult along with Emma and could convince her it's all real, to help her save them all. Which is exactly what August has been doing since he came to Storybrooke. So in keeping with that particular theory, YES he needed to be transported to the same place as Emma, he couldn't have just been sent to Storybrooke.
Surayya wrote:I do have to wonder tho why it is Gep would have gone looking for away to save his boy if he was already protected from the curse?
Well, that goes back to my idea about the kid potentially being left stranded in a destroyed FTL. Of course Geppetto wouldn't want that for his son.
Surayya wrote:At the end of the day if you REALLLLLLLLY want August (or any character for that matter) to be someone, you'll find away to make any situation 'prove' whatever theory you want it to
Not gonna lie, pretty much every time someone comes up with reasons to debunk the Pinocchio theory, when I think it through, it usually just ends up just making me believe it even more. None of the other theories about his identity make much sense to me, but Pinocchio does. If he IS someone else though, and the writers give me a plausible explanation for it, I'll get over being wrong and will still love the character of August.
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Rumple tries to figure out who August is.
At the same time, we're watching the story of Rumple and his son after Rumple becomes the Dark One.
Because Rumple remembers who he really is, he is remembering Bae in this episode. In fact, he is "so shaken by what he's learning," that he's going to go see Archie.
The episode will also be about the thing that Rumple wants most- "what does Gold want and why" and: If Bae can find a way to take away Rumple's power, would Rumple be okay with it.
While all of this is going on, apparently we need to take notice of the moment before Rumple knocks on Archie's door, which is supposed to tell us something....
Well, I guess we'll find out in 6 hours and 36 minutes... but who's counting?
Keeper of Rumple's deals with Emma, Dreamy's boat, and the Movement of Time in Storybrooke
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