410: Deleted Scene

Do A&E oversee every editing of each episode, or do they simply rely on an editing team who may not have seen every episode?

I think Adam answered that on Twitter recently? If memory serves, when they first started releasing deleted scenes, someone asked him who decides which scenes get cut and he answered that it was always him and Eddy?

Maybe this is a dumb question, but if she knew he was mute, why gag him?

I think it is very likely that Henry is Regina’s father. I just don’t think Cora is the mother. Prince Henry and Princess Eva knew each other and were together in the same castle the day that Cora the Miller’s daughter showed up. Eva might have found herself pregnant by someone other than Leopold. We’ve learned that Eva had a dark side. Regina and Snow talk about this when Snow learns the truth about her mom. Snow wonders out loud what could have happened to change her. Perhaps giving away or having a child stolen away completely changed Eva’s personality into the person Snow knew.

Eva made a big deal about giving Leopold “a pure child”, she wouldn’t have gone messing around with someone else and risk being thrown out like Cora was. Also Cora would’ve wanted to get pregnant by Henry just to secure her place in the line of succession and since Cora did her own interpretation of lion king with Regina, I think it is safe to say that Regina is Cora’s.

They have a secret marriage in the woods and baby Snow is conceived. Something goes wrong….Cora….Cora….Cora….and then Snow is ripped away from Regina….raised by Eva her grandmother. Regina and Robin get their memories deleted and BAM! It’s a whole new show.

As RG said, it’s not possible timeline wise. We now know for definite that Snow was 10 in Stable boy. Regina would’ve been between 18- early 20s at that time. For Regina to be Snow’s mother, she would’ve had to be pregnant with Snow at 12 or under and that’s just wrong.

In the stable boy episode Cora alludes to Regina’s age and how everyone else her age is already married.

Cora: Well, you’re getting a little old for fun. Who’s going to want to marry you when you behave like a commoner?
Henry I: Honey, please leave her alone.
Cora: Stop coddling her. She’s becoming an old maid. All the other girls her age are married. I had such high hopes.

I don’t think the writers have ever given us a concrete age for Regina in the Stable Boy episode so I do think it is possible. In Once Upon a Time Wonderland there is an interesting scene with Cora and Anastasia. Cora says that Anastasia is the type of daughter she would choose and then it is like she catches herself and sort of says as an after thought, “If one could choose that sort of thing.” I think the only child Cora gave birth to was Zelena. She very well may have become cursed like King George or she may not have been able to bear another child. When Rumple saw Regina he talked about the two of them being reunited and how portable she had been the last time he saw her. I think Rumple procured a baby for Cora…and I think that baby was Regina. This would mean that Zelena was not Regina’s biological sister which is also possible as Zelena got Regina’s blood just like she got Rumple’s blood to open the blood lock.

Regina is not that old in Stable boy, early 20s at most. Back in the olden days, women were married young hence Cora’s “old maid” comment.

First let me say thank you guys for entering into the discussion. I realize the theory is way off the beaten track and I appreciate the opportunity to share some of my observations.

Eva made a big deal about giving Leopold “a pure child”, she wouldn’t have gone messing around with someone else and risk being thrown out like Cora was.

You are right about that, Eva did make a big deal about giving Leopold a pure child. I believe a pure child was born and that pure child was Regina. Young Eva was not good. She was self-centered, sarcastic…a destructive young woman who after outing Cora’s pregnancy and destroying her relationship with Prince Leopold had the audacity to actually trip Cora and publicly humiliate her when she encountered the miller’s daughter at Prince Henry’s castle. She reminds me of Regina before Regina began her journey to the light side.

What began to change Regina’s heart? We have been told it was when she adopted Henry. She had a hole in her heart and loving Henry began to change her before Emma ever came to town. I think it is very possible that Princess Eva could have ironically found herself in the very same situation that Cora found herself. She could have found herself pregnant with another man’s child while engaged to Prince Leopold. It could have been the loss of this child that left a hole in her heart and getting baby Snow (who I believe we will find out was thought to be the child of a peasant) changed her completely. She transformed into the mother that Snow knew

Regina – The Pure
Regina – The Lost Baby

In addition to Eva’s comment about giving Leopold a pure child the word pure is used in eight episodes

We first hear the word pure in The Price of Gold. Rumple and Cinderella are discussing the wand…is it pure magic…pure evil. This discussion comes right before Cinderella signs the contract tricking her into giving away her firstborn.

In The Heart is a Lonely Hunter, we get a definition of pure…it is “Not Selfish and Self-Serving.” We have had instances of Regina purity… not being selfish or self-serving. Regina was willing to sacrifice herself to save the town when Owen and Tamara enacted the failsafe and she was not selfish or self-serving when she sent Emma to New York with Henry and she gave Emma good memories where she would have never given Henry away.

In A Land Without Magic we learn a little more about the word pure. Mary Margaret is reading from the book, “A pulse of pure love shuddered out and engulfed the land, waking up Snow White and bringing light to the darkness.

We saw a pulse of pure love when Regina kissed Henry and broke the second curse.

In The Queen is Dead we hear more about pure but it comes from an unreliable source. Cora, masquerading as the Blue Fairy tells Snow White that fairy magic is the purest magic of all.

The context of this conversation directly involves Cora, Eva and Cora’s hatred of Eva for exposing her pregnancy to Prince Leopold (which we learn about in Bleeding Through.) Cora wants to destroy Eva and her legacy. Cora hates Eva for destroying her engagement with Prince Leopold. Cora poisons Eva and not only wants to destroy Eva but also Eva’s legacy which includes her descendants. I believe this is why Ghost/Spirit Cora attacked Regina in the episode, Bleeding Through.

Bleeding Through has my favorite scene from the entire four years of OUaT. When that door pops open and we see Young Ghost/Spirit Cora sitting at the spinning wheel, Regina steps in front of Snow, places her hand protectively in front of Snow and her unborn child and then Regina says to Snow…

“Your mother was nothing like my mother. She only understands power and weakness. But if she wants to kill you, SHE’S GONNA HAVE TO GO THROUGH ME! This isn’t about you. This is about HER and ME.”

This was a moment of pure love…in this moment Regina was ready to die for Snow.

In The Miller’s Daughter, David is trying to talk Mary Margaret out of killing Cora…not giving into vengeance. David tells Mary Margaret that she has the purest heart of anyone he has ever known and that is who she is and that is who she will stay. We know that Mary Margaret does use the candle on Cora and that her heart does not stay pure, thus the dark spot in it.

Evil is not born…it is made. Regina was born with the lightest of magic. Regina was pure.

In A Curious Thing we hear the word pure more than any other episode. We hear it four times. We also experience a great moment of irony. Here is the dialogue.

Rumples Sing Song Riddle
Snow White: How do we find her?
Rumple: Through the door, step inside, if pure of heart, then she won’t hide. (giggles)

Queen Regina: We’re at the edge of the Dark Forest, trying to find the one person who can stop our imminent doom and save your unborn child. And you two stop to smell the roses?
Snow White: Snowbells.
Queen Regina: I don’t care if they are dancing daffodils. I need to destroy my sister. And so do you. (walks on the other two following close behind) And if that babbling mad man sent us on a wild goose chase, I swear I’ll- (Amidst the path there’s standing a door) What’s that supposed to be?
Prince Charming: Well, it appears to be a door. (Prince Charming carefully approaches the door. He’s able to see that the path continues beyond it)
Snow White: Through the door step inside. If pure of heart, then she won’t hide. It’s Rumple’s riddle. It’s Glinda. (steps through the door and vanishes.)
Prince Charming: Snow! (follows Snow White through the door)
Queen Regina: (scoffs) A portal with a cheap cloaking spell. (Stepping through the door as well, Queen Regina enters the path beyond the door. Realizing that she’s not allowed to use the portal, she briskly walks back and closes the door behind her.) …sound of crickets

The implication is clear…Regina does not have a pure heart therefore she cannot enter. But there is more.

Glinda: But,only a purveyor of the strongest light magic will be able to accomplish such defeat.
Snow White: Light magic?
Glinda: Magic created from love.
Snow White: (in realization) Emma. Our daughter. She’s the product of true love. She’s the savior.
Glinda: If she is as pure and powerful as you say, then yes. She – and only she – can defeat Zelena.

Of course we later see that the pure and powerful one, the purveyor of the strongest light magic that defeats Zelena is not Emma but rather it is Regina. Regina is the pure and powerful one.

In the episode, Kansas, Zelena enters the room right after Snow gives birth and indicates the baby she has just stolen is pure.

Zelena: What a charming family. It’s a shame I have to break it up.
Zelena, looking at the baby she has just stolen: So pure and so innocent. And now… mine.

The next time we see Zelena she holding the baby she just stole and she is humming the song, “Hush Little Baby,” a song which among other things is about Mamma buying the baby a looking glass…and if that looking glass gets broke…

One of the pivotal moments of Regina’s turn to darkness was when she thrust Cora through the looking glass, shattering it into a million pieces. What was it Rumple said about Cora’s name…it sounds like something breaking. I believe, just like baby Neal, Regina was taken away from her mother (Eva) and given to her aunt, adoptive mother, Cora who masqueraded has her birth mother.

The last use to date, of the word pure, is the episode, Fall.

Blackbeard to Anna (again, an unreliable voice): Oh, well, perhaps they didn’t know that the Wishing Star can only be used by those with… Pure hearts.

If the qualification for being a child of Eva is being a baby that is pure, then I think a strong case can be made that Regina fits the bill.

Also Cora would’ve wanted to get pregnant by Henry just to secure her place in the line of succession and since Cora did her own interpretation of lion king with Regina, I think it is safe to say that Regina is Cora’s.

I totally agree…Cora absolutely would want to get pregnant by Henry but we don’t always get what we want. Perhaps Henry could not father children or something else hindered conceiving a child. I think we have a hint to this in some dialogue from two separate conversations that Cora has…one with Fake Prince Jonathan and one with Prince Henry’s father, King Xavier.

Bleeding Through
Fake Prince Jonathan – Well, low and behold, it turned into gold after all.
Cora – How dare you. You must have the brain the size of a pixie to show your face in this kingdom.
Fake Prince Jonathan – Well, I had to see for myself if the commoner who said yes to Prince Leopold was the same one who said it to me Several times In one night. It was quite impressive.
Cora – In two days, I will be a princess, and you will bow down and count yourself lucky to pull the weeds at my feet.
Fake Prince Jonathan – [Chuckles] Been practicing in front of the mirror, eh? You’re as much of a fraud as I ever was.
Cora – My love for Prince Leopold is true, as is his for me.
Fake Prince Jonathan – But does he know how much of you there is to love? Or were you hoping to keep our baby a secret?

The phrase “how much of you there is to love” is referring to her pregnancy.

Now, listen to this conversation with King Xavier.

(Cora enters one of the castle’s towers and finds King Xavier winding the strands of gold onto spools. This seems to be a purposeful reference Sing a Song of Sixpence)

Cora: They told me I’d find you counting your treasure.
King Xavier: Well, you’ve made us a rich kingdom again. How can I help you?
Cora: I don’t love your son.
King Xavier: I didn’t expect you to. Not much there to love, frankly.

It is an interesting play on words…does he know how “much of you there is to love” and there’s “not much there to love”. The first is referring to a pregnancy by a potent man it is possible the second paralells this and is referring to the absence of a pregnancy by an impotent man. Perhaps that is why they were having difficulty marrying him off. Again, it is possible that Henry is the father with Eva but I also think it is very likely that the man who got Eva pregnant was Fake Prince Jonathan. We know very little about him. We have been told that Zelena was powerful because she was the product of the darkest of magic. Perhaps old Fake Jonathan can even shapeshift and he tricked Eva. Anyway…I think old Prince Jonny went around sowing his apple seeds in lots of places. Eva…so much like Eve and perhaps she took some fruit from old Fake Prince Jonny Appleseed’s tree.

As RG said, it’s not possible timeline wise. We now know for definite that Snow was 10 in Stable boy. Regina would’ve been between 18- early 20s at that time. For Regina to be Snow’s mother, she would’ve had to be pregnant with Snow at 12 or under and that’s just wrong.

We do know that Snow was 10…no doubt about that at all. That is the same age Henry was when he first met Emma, who ironically is the same age as her mother…28 years old. So, exactally 28 years after giving birth to Emma, Mary Margaret’s age clock begins ticking again and she starts to age.

This means that in the Enchanted Forest, Snow was 28 years old when she gave birth to Emma. When you look at pregnant Snow in the pilot episode I don’t think she looks any older than Regina does in The Stable Boy, yet, we know that Snow is 28 because right after giving birth she is transported to Storybrooke and frozen in time. When time begins ticking again, exactaly 28 years later, she is the same age as her daughter.

If Enchanted Forest Snow can give birth at 28 I think it is reasonable that Regina very well could have been 28 in The Stable Boy and like Emma, could have been 18 when she gave birth to Snow. Henry is 10 when he first meets unmarried, 28 year old Emma. Snow is 10 when she first meets unmarried, 28 year old Regina.

Regina is not that old in Stable boy, early 20s at most. Back in the olden days, women were married young hence Cora’s “old maid” comment.

Again…Snow was 28 when she gave birth to Emma so I very much believe it is possible that Regina could have been 28 in The Stable Boy and could have given birth at 18 to Snow, thus making Snow 10 when she met 28 year old Regina, just like 10 year old Henry meeting 28 year old Emma.

I think the blood magic, the fact that Cora is definitely Zelena’s biological parent, and the fact that the show really hasn’t even suggested that Regina was anyone else’s–plus the fact that Cora was a princess when Regina was concieved and born (so, serious lack of privacy) all make a very strong case that Regina IS Cora’s daughter, biologically.

It makes for an interesting AU theory, but so much of the plot has hinged upon this relationship being accurately presented up to this point that I don’t think they’d pull a reversal that…drastic on us. Also, the marriage to Leopold was messed up even before we were told he was once engaged to Regina’s mother…having her be Snow’s sister (even half) is…kinda a step too far. (And the havoc on the family tree? Do you REALLY want it to be more impossible to untangle?)