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Wow this was an amazing episode!!! Probably the best since… Season 3 maybe. This truly brought me hope about the show. But of course there was this one big flaw that pissed me off. Yes it’s Megara, but I’ll get to that.
Favorites:
1) Snow actually admitting she wasn’t enough active in the past seasons and trying to change that!
2) Regina’s astonishing golden dress! And politically cunning Regina (which is my favorite Regina)!!!
3) Snow and Hercules were soo cute together! At some point I actually thought that I wouldn’t mind if she was with Hercules and never met Charming.
Also young Snow’s actress was amazing this episode. She obviously grew up a little bit and instead of trying to pass her as a ten year old again the writers used it and showed us the stage in Snow’s life that we never got to see (and a stage we hardly saw in Regina’s life).
4) An episode that is one character’s centric that in the end of it they get their happy ending and the main characters learn something about themselves? And there is a flashback plot that is interesting and fun and features that character and also one or more of the main characters and we learn something new about them? Is it really happening???
5) Henry! And Cruella! And the author being relevant again!! And it makes sense (sort of)! And Henry having a plot this half season and being shady!!!
Mixed:
People are talking about how it’s important to protect the peasants!!! And.. Yet.. Everything the heroes did this episode was still for themselves…
Least favorites:
1) Seriously show? Seriously? You do that the Meg’s character? And less than a week after women’s rights day?!? And yes, I know she used that dagger in the end and showed that she did have strength in her but… Just… No, ok? This is the character whose most known line is “I’m a damsel. I’m in distress. I can handle it.” Her whole point was that she doesn’t need saving. And in the show they kept talking about how amazing Hercules was that he saved her (even though she stabbed one of the heads and if she wasn’t there he would die so I wouldn’t call it saving). She literally fainted and fell into his arms at one point! What the hell?!?
2) The whole point of “I don’t want to be Mary Margaret I want to be Snow White” thing doesn’t match the “we are both” point of view from season 2.
3) You could have brought Neal back AND… YOU… DIDN’T?!?!?!?!? And I bet you’re not going to now. Didn’t we Neal fans had enough?
4) So the better place is… Olympus? This doesn’t even make sense in the Greek mythology.
5) Again Charming and Robin didn’t do anything interesting. Where is prince James when you need him.
[adrotate group="5"]You know what I can't continue with the dead people brought back to life list I'm out of space in the signature and now we have an underworld arc this is to much I quit why do you bring so many people back to life OUAT WHHHYYYY
Do you think showing the Underworld is a “jump the shark” moment of any fantasy show?
No. Fantasy operates with a lot of archetypes and tropes. The Hero for instance. Whether literal or metaphorical, the hero tackles the Underworld/concept of death and is victorious, thus signaling his status as the hero. It can be powerful and very well done–just look at Harry Potter with their metaphorical crossing the threshold to the “Underworld” in book 1 or the more literal Limbo-like status of King’s Crossing in Book 7. Like Lily said, it’s about the stakes. The stakes are extraordinarily high in HP (of Buffy or SPN or even their katabasis moments of fantasy literature, like ASOIAF or the more urban and deconstructed world of the Magicians). The problem isn’t the appearance of the Underworld and a lord of said place—that is a pretty natural situation for OUAT given their adoption of the hero myth. The problem is that the stakes in the Underworld haven’t been made big and bad yet–Hades just sort of blandly threatens them (while being charming, yes) and Cerberus is too easily killed–and at the end there’s a bridge to Heaven. It also doesn’t help that the world building is fairly unimpressive and leave a lot of questions open.
But the books/shows you mentioned never fully described what happens after the person dies. The afterlife stays a mystery and the depictions are either in the forms of dreams (Harry Potter) or a vague memory (Buffy). The stakes remains high because it is not fully known what happens after you die and not everyone can come back on the whims of the writers. The people who came back, did it because of very clear circumstances that allow the reader/viewer to understand why this character was able to come back and that other character wasn’t.
"All your questions are pointless"
But the books/shows you mentioned never fully described what happens after the person dies. The afterlife stays a mystery and the depictions are either in the forms of dreams (Harry Potter) or a vague memory (Buffy)
Those are only a few examples and there are more with clearer depictions of the Underworld: like the actual Greek/Roman mythologies. I don’t think showing the Underworld and what happens after you die is a bad thing (which is the heart of the question).It helps flesh out the shows own cosmology which is vital to world building. And just because you don’t see the Underworld in something like Buffy/HP doesn’t mean the viewer/reader isn’t made to understand what it’s like. Buffy’s song in Once More with Feeling–“there was no pain. No fear no doubt. Until the pushed me out…of heaven.” We may not see the shiny fluffy clouds, we but understand the emotion it wroughts in Buffy.
Where I do agree with you is in that the depiction of the Underworld in OUAT is largely “at the whims” of the writers. It’s not solid enough, scary enough, or well rounded enough for the viewer to feel like it’s worth knowing about. So far the only that the apperance of the Underworld does–along with gods, now–is muddle the cosmology of the Onciverse.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"Liked
Hades- The actor does a great job. The blue fire effect of Hades disappearing was good and is preferable to the fire hair.
Cruella- It’s always good to have Cruella back, she was the highlight of 4B. Her plan makes sense and I could see why Henry would buy into it, it certainly pushes his buttons of wanting to be a hero and save someone.
Hercules- The character was adorable for a oneshot that we’ll never see again to the point that you did kind of feel sorry for him that we’ll never see him again. The actor did a decent job with what he had.
Less Hook- It has been so refreshing not to have Hook be in every scene or having the show revolve around him. Obviously “Find Hook” is the groups main aim but this season so far has been better than the whole of season 4 and 5A put together, which coincidentally is when the show became CS heavy, and I think a big part of that has been because Hook’s not been dominating screentime at every opportunity.
Snow going by Snow not Mary-Margaret- I never got why Snow kept using MM instead of Snow especially Charming using it but apparently Snow chose to go by that name. Hopefully now that she’s going by Snow again, it means she might get back some of the fire she had in season 1.
Mixed
The Snow/Hercules friendship- It was cute enough but not enough to buy it. Snow never mentioned this guy ever before so it was hard to take it as a deep and meaningful friendship. Adult Snow/Hercules was more believable.
“Can you keep a secret?”- It as funny in that for the audience the go to answer is no and even young Snow paused before saying yes. Snow should come with a warning sign “If you tell this woman a secret, somebody will die!”
The pen being alive- I get what they were going for with it but to kind of group it in with the people souls of having unfinished business is a bit much.
Disliked
Hook and Megara stop running for Hook to tell her that he will distract Cerberus- Just run and maybe split off into different direction so at least one of you is guaranteed to get away. Don’t stand around saying how you will distract the creature, doing that means it is already almost upon you.
Young Snow running off into the forest- So a princess who would most likely be considered a valuable bounty is just allowed to run off alone into the woods in a white dress that makes her stand out like a sore thumb? Seriously, shouldn’t there be guards watching her to make sure she’s safe. Also when she knocks all the arrows onto the floor, why the hell does she waste time trying to pick them all up? Just grab a couple and fire them!
Cerberus broke through the wall of the apartment with no problem yet struggled to get through the wall of the library enough for Snow to rally the troops- plot device is plot devicey.
The characterisation of Meg- It was disappointing that she wasn’t more like her Disney self. They even set up one of Disney Meg’s lines “Megara. My friends call me Meg…..at least they would if I had any friends”.
No Rumple- Where the hell is Rumple and what’s he doing?
Overall, whilst it wasn’t as good as 512, it was still better than the whole of 5A.
Question: Is the guy playing the head bandit the same actor from last episode who played the guy that Regina and Cora killed?
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixI have a problem with Snow’s “epiphany”. We, the fans, noticed that this was not the character we used to love, but that was not shown through the narrative of the show. Snow and other characters never commented about this. This is yet another example of viewers know => character know
Dramatic Irony (http://global.britannica.com/art/dramatic-irony)
Shakespeare used this technique a lot.
But I agree, the viewers knew before Snow for too long.
Keeper of Regina's bravery
Is the guy playing the head bandit the same actor from last episode who played the guy that Regina and Cora killed?Quote
You know what? I recognised him too. I thought I was going insane. Not sure if it is the guy that Regina and Cora killed (when was that btw?) but that face…I know it.
Keeper of Regina's bravery
A couple more points
THE PEN
It’s alive….this means it’s a character which means that it has to have (wait for it)…BACKSTORY!So…how was it made? Was it a ”being” before it was a pen?
And where is its gravestone?
LOL
CEREBUS
So Hercules could kill the nine-headed Hydra by himself (in Once) but not Rover?
Besides, it’s a dog, surely playing fetch or a doggie toy would have worked?
Keeper of Regina's bravery
So Hercules could kill the nine-headed Hydra by himself (in Once) but not Rover?
In mythology he’s not even supposed to kill Cerberus. Just capture him. And he did it by making a deal with Hades and then rendered Cerberus unconscious with his hands. When Herc returned to the land of the living to give the king (who had put the labor to him) the dog, the King begged Herc to return Cerberus home because big bad scary puppy dog.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"Is the guy playing the head bandit the same actor from last episode who played the guy that Regina and Cora killed?Quote
You know what? I recognised him too. I thought I was going insane. Not sure if it is the guy that Regina and Cora killed (when was that btw?) but that face…I know it.
It was in 512. Regina killed him in flashback when he tried to demand something from her in return for saying where Snowing was, Cora killed him in the underworld when she was showing Regina what would happen to Henry Sr if she didn’t leave.
Just looked at the press releases for 512 and 513, it doesn’t appear to be the same guy so I looked the bandit guy up on IMDB. He’s been in a few TV series: Intelligence, The 100, Rush, Supernatural, The flash, Lucifer. He’s been in a lot more in bit parts.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixI laughed when I realized that the scene where Hades delivers a message from Hook is a reference to the episode of Game of Thrones that I will never ever watch.
Gaultheria's fanvids: http://youtube.com/sagethrasher
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