520 – Sneak Peeks (1 and 2)

Loving the Regina/Hook snark

Yay Hades ripped up the contract for Zelena! I wonder though if Pan is going to try and pull a fast one. Rumple will be ready to give Zelena back and Pan will say “Not so fast”.

@RG I don’t know if it’s entirely fair to compare Zades and RumBelle because, whilst Rumple and Hades may have similar personality/characteristics, Zelena and Belle are completely different.

However I do agree that Zades comes off as the healthier of the two. However, this could be down to 1. Zades onscreen is going to be 5B only and it will continue off-screen with Zelena being the only one seen throughout season 6 therefore the writers want to establish it as a good thing whilst they have the chance. 2. RumBelle have been playing break up/make up since season 1 because the writers don’t know how to progress them further and it’s getting kind of boring. This could be down to RumBelle narrative function though (Screwball Ninja wrote an interesting essay on it). Basically the writers need Rumple as a reserve villain to use as and when necessary. Because of Belle’s characteristics, she’s not going to be okay with Rumple doing villain things therefore Belle needs to be off screen when Rumple is practicing villainy which is more or less every season hence the break up/make up routine.

Okay, if anyone has been listening to the podcast these past few weeks, I’ve been trying to drive home the point that the show is deliberately paralleling Rumbelle and Zades, with one looking decidedly more healthy than the other (though neither is anywhere close to picture perfect or idealized).

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I see what you’re drawing attention to here, but I think the jury’s still out on how this will turn out in the end. If we look at the narrative (rather than the psychological dynamics of each couple), we get another kind of picture:

So, first of all, OUAT likes to do last minute “shocking” reveals (which sometimes fall flat because everyone saw them coming a mile away) where, in the last episode, it “flips the script” on the season. Since the show is currently working hard on putting a very positive spin on Zades, I think this is a bait and switch set up. The more “shippable” the pairing — and, what this boils down to, the more likable Hades, since we’re mostly getting at him through Zelena’s POV, even down to that scene where he is dancing alone — the more “shocking” the twist they probably have planned. Though this likely depends on their plans for Zelena next season. If Bex is done, and Zelena is not coming back, then it makes sense to ship her off to her HEA.

Second, there is the theme of change that’s being explored in both cases. In both cases we have, I think, a negative spin but from different angles. In Belle’s case it’s the standard “I can’t be with you unless you change” that the audience is now very familiar with. The thing with Rumbelle is that the audience can see, very clearly, that this is an impasse (because we know this couple very well). In Zelena’s case, the implied relation is the mirror opposite: “I will be with you for the potential that I can change you.” But we were already told through Rumbelle that this isn’t a good foundation for a relationship. More broadly, this trope (that the ‘beastly’ man can be tamed by the beautiful princess) gets squarely critiqued, anywhere from gender studies, to clinical psychology, to pop self-help. With OUAT’s claims to feminist sensibilities (whether we buy them or not), I think they will go the “you can’t change someone, they must change themselves” route. While we know that Rumple’s going to be some sort of version of shady (that’s the role he fulfills on the show), we actually have no idea how exactly Hades is meant to change, or why. I mean, Hades so far isn’t particularly evil: for all intents and purposes, he’s a snarky mildly inefficient mid-level bureaucrat with a peculiar scalp condition. What’s there to change? Hades’s role as the god of the UW isn’t an inherent attribute, it’s a job. So, it makes sense to assume that there is more to the story.

Another point is that the show likes to flip the script on Rumple too. So if Rumple starts off dark, by the end of the arc he’ll end up on the lighter end of the spectrum. If he starts the season “lighter”, by the end of the arc he’s darkened again. This 1/2 arc, we’re in the dark to light phase of the cycle.

I see what you’re drawing attention to here, but I think the jury’s still out on how this will turn out in the end.

True. I don’t expect it to turn out well for Zades almost by virtue of Greg Germann being a guest star and not a regular. Also, the shocking twist aspect that you mentioned, though…we’ve got this and one more (Hades own centric) before the Underworld arc appears to be over so if there’s a shocking betrayal/unhappy ending coming then it’s going to happen at the 12th hour (not even the 11th!) and frankly be pretty off putting especially if there is more to the story like you said (and something I’m sure is coming).

I’m hoping (gah, #hope) for a more neutral ending to Zades–one that finds Hades in the Underworld and the ship afloat but mostly off screen, with the occasional reemergence of Hades in S6 and beyond (if there is a beyond)

With OUAT’s claims to feminist sensibilities (whether we buy them or not), I think they will go the “you can’t change someone, they must change themselves” route

That’s their claim, yes, but as we’ve seen so often they do end up using other people to change the character is question. They like to make claims of self agency  but there is almost always another factor/character–Henry, Neal, Robin, the concept of True Love itself, Hook, sisters. So I guess I don’t know why it would be different this time ’round–claim A but show B (or some form of A and B)

Another point is that the show likes to flip the script on Rumple too. So if Rumple starts off dark, by the end of the arc he’ll end up on the lighter end of the spectrum. If he starts the season “lighter”, by the end of the arc he’s darkened again. This 1/2 arc, we’re in the dark to light phase of the cycle.

Yay never ending repetition.

One problem: Pan’s deal with Rumple means someone can’t come back. I think Rumple means for that to be Zelena. She’s in serious trouble. And while it’s adorable that Hades was willing to rip it up without question, he never really wanted Rumple’s baby–he just wanted the leverage over Rumple so he could make him do things. He doesn’t currently need that with Rumple, so it’s a low price to get Zelena back…

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Sure, that’s a good point. But when Rumple’s not willing to make any concessions and goes from “I want to be that man for you” to “but not today” and then doesn’t even try a “light” path after Belle makes a silly choice…well. It’s hard to not compare and contrast these two couples and be sad/unhappy/upset/mad about Rumbelle when compared to a ship that is on safer ground if only a wee tiny bit.

A low price is still a price after all.