- This topic has 68 replies, 20 voices, and was last updated 8 years, 6 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
Instead of a show about heroes and hope, this has become a show about “see what being good gets you.” That’s the message of obliterating Robin and reviving Hook by pure deus ex in the same episode. That’s the message of Neal’s disappearance and Belle’s constant punishment.
[adrotate group="5"]Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
If anyone should have dealt with their past in this arc it was Regina. The thousands of slaughtered villagers filled with the blood of men, women, and children that she killed. I’m sure would have loved to meet her in the Underworld. But instead of her dealing with her past crimes, they just had her spend time with her family. Talk about getting the easy way out.
Meanwhile Hook died 3 times. Sacrificing everything for his family and true love. He wears the rings of the people he’s killed on his hand as a reminder to not go down that route again. He was infused with the darkest magic of all and in the end ultimately conquered the darkness and CHOSE to save everyone by sacrificing his life. Nobody stopped his plan, he did it himself. Which is more than I can say for Regina and Rumple. I’ve never thought of a time where they actually chose to stop what they started. The Failsafe was cause Greg and Tamara stole it from her, and I mean Rumple….do we even have to list those?
Can we also stop with the Hook only cares for Emma crud, it’s completely false. He cares a lot for Henry(enough to plan an entire operation with him), he’s got his bromance with Charming, sibling relationship with Regina, friendships with Snow and Belle and the latter he even comforted her when she kicked Rumple over the townline. He could have mocked Rumple, or made him look worse then he was but he was there for Belle and told her that even though he was a bastard, he truly loved her. So he’s grown to care for all of these characters very much. Don’t let one decision when he was engulfed with the darkest of magic unwillingly cloud those facts please.
.
I’m not saying Hook cares for no one else. I’m saying his relationships with them have been shortchanged; we did not see development for those relationships even though there were promising starts. The only truly developed relationships Hook has are with Emma and Rumple.
Bringing him back as they did, while obliterating another main character, heightens the contrast. (Granted, Robin’s relationships were even less developed, which is sad–as it would have made his death more potent had they been explored more fully.)
Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
If anyone should have dealt with their past in this arc it was Regina. The thousands of slaughtered villagers filled with the blood of men, women, and children that she killed. I’m sure would have loved to meet her in the Underworld. But instead of her dealing with her past crimes, they just had her spend time with her family. Talk about getting the easy way out.
Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait one minute….
First of all, Regina did not kill thousands, she killed just a couple of hundred. Second of all, Hook is at least two to three hundred years older than Regina, so he’s been in the villain game far longer than she ever was! So that’s who should probably be getting around the thousand count number….especially if he was running around being Peter Pan’s errand boy.
Thirdly, although the original plan was for all three villains, Regina, Rumple, and Hook to face their dark pasts, obviously last minute changes were made to this arc. But out of those three villains, it was Regina who ended up assisting her son in finding Underworld Citizens, some who were her victims, and giving them their unfinished business in Firebird….least till Cruella and Blind Witch showed up to the party.
And do you really want to talk about the easy way out? I mean really….because from Season 1 all the way to Season 5, Regina has been suffering every arc in some form or fashion, which Adam and Eddy simply call “Karmic Debt”? Even Rumplestilskin had to pay his karmic debt, as he spent centuries looking for his son only to hold him in the end as he died. Just what did Hook have to give up besides a ship that he eventually got back?
Meanwhile Hook died 3 times. Sacrificing everything for his family and true love. He wears the rings of the people he’s killed on his hand as a reminder to not go down that route again. He was infused with the darkest magic of all and in the end ultimately conquered the darkness and CHOSE to save everyone by sacrificing his life. Nobody stopped his plan, he did it himself. Which is more than I can say for Regina and Rumple. I’ve never thought of a time where they actually chose to stop what they started. The Failsafe was cause Greg and Tamara stole it from her, and I mean Rumple….do we even have to list those?
Wearing the rings of the people he’s killed is the equivalent of Regina’s Heart Collection & Rumplestilskin Pawn Store, only difference is Regina and Rumplestilskin’s collections are still alive. As for that plan of his, yeah, I’m pretty sure it was Regina reminding of his past mistakes and asking him what sort of man he really wanted to be, that sort of jogged his senses back in. And if you’re not willing to count Regina nearly sacrificing herself and stopping that Fail Safe to save Storybrooke simply because she started it, then how can we count Hook sacrificing himself and stopping his plan to send Emma’s entire family, including her son, to Hell when he was the one who started it?
And if we want to talk about who saved the day the most between the three villains, I don’t really think that needs to be up for discussion because all Season 3, & 4B pretty much sets the record so far….and new anti-hero Zelena just earned her first one with 5B.
Can we also stop with the Hook only cares for Emma crud, it’s completely false. He cares a lot for Henry(enough to plan an entire operation with him), he’s got his bromance with Charming, sibling relationship with Regina, friendships with Snow and Belle and the latter he even comforted her when she kicked Rumple over the townline. He could have mocked Rumple, or made him look worse then he was but he was there for Belle and told her that even though he was a bastard, he truly loved her. So he’s grown to care for all of these characters very much. Don’t let one decision when he was engulfed with the darkest of magic unwillingly cloud those facts please. .
I’m willing to let you have this one, mostly because some of it is in fact true. Colin O’Donoghue is a great guy with great talent, however that character of his literally is the creator’s pet, just like Rumple is the creator’s scapegoat and Regina is the creator’s favorite victim.
And truth be told, Killian Jones really does have some wasted potential. This past episode sort of proved it when he wasn’t glued to Emma’s side. Had Hook not been written at the expense of other characters, he probably could have grown on more people.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
Screwball Ninja came up with an interesting interpretation. Basically “OUAT is pushing redemption over justice. The villains take precedence over the victims, for better or worse.”
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixHad Hook not been written at the expense of other characters, he probably could have grown on more people.
Oh he’s grown on plenty of people, just take a gander at Tumblr, shows Twitter, and the shows FB. Hating Hook is a minority opinion in the audience. GA does indeed love him, he tracks well with the audience he’s easily one of the most popular characters on the show.
Had Hook not been written at the expense of other characters, he probably could have grown on more people.
Oh he’s grown on plenty of people, just take a gander at Tumblr, shows Twitter, and the shows FB. Hating Hook is a minority opinion in the audience. GA does indeed love him, he tracks well with the audience he’s easily one of the most popular characters on the show.
We all know that, otherwise he would have been gone a long time ago.
"All your questions are pointless"
Oh he’s grown on plenty of people, just take a gander at Tumblr, shows Twitter, and the shows FB. Hating Hook is a minority opinion in the audience. GA does indeed love him, he tracks well with the audience he’s easily one of the most popular characters on the show.
I have no doubt that Hook translates into eyeballs, and that many people like him. For what it’s worth, I think your original post gives a very generous interpretation of Hook’s characterization. Don’t get me wrong, we all do this with the characters we like, in the same way that we tend to read those we dislike rather less generously. For example, we can argue until the cows come home over whether or not Hook’s bling translates into something a repentant villain would wear or into a sign of deep sociopathy, but we won’t agree because the character’s deliberately written in an ambiguous, divisive way. Similarly, we can argue about whether Hook’s sacrifice at the end of the arc was all that “sacrificial” — and we’re likely not going to agree either.
But as a broader approach to character analysis, I think that the general tonality that “[Hook / Regina / Rumple] deserves worse than [Hook / Regina / Rumple] (circle the characters that apply) gets us nowhere fast because this better or worse doesn’t actually translate into changed consequences for the characters. This is what @WR was saying, I think — no matter what Hook does, he is still the creator’s pet and the consequences of the PLOT will, in the end, always be relatively mild for him. Similarly, no matter what Regina does or does not do, she remains the favorite victim, and Rumple is the go-to villain/scapegoat. Since their roles in the plot – and the distribution of negative consequences – is largely predetermined by an existing pattern, it is of absolutely no consequence (for the purposes of where the story might go) who is more or less deserving of redemption. The game, as they say, is rigged.
On a different note, I’m gonna echo @PriceofMagic on this one — I didn’t even mind Hook all that much in this episode, other than the fact that the UW story was trite. I did, however, find the make-out scene at the end by Robin’s casket just plain offensive if not a little grotesque.
Had Hook not been written at the expense of other characters, he probably could have grown on more people.
Oh he’s grown on plenty of people, just take a gander at Tumblr, shows Twitter, and the shows FB. Hating Hook is a minority opinion in the audience. GA does indeed love him, he tracks well with the audience he’s easily one of the most popular characters on the show.
I’ve not been Hook’s biggest fan but I didn’t mind him last episode. I think Hook works best as part of a broship rather than a romantic ship, he’s always at his best when he is interacting with another male character instead of Emma. The problem with CS is that in order to make it work both characters have been forced into a role that doesn’t suit them. Emma’s character has been butchered whilst Hook’s character can come across as very two faced in that, with Emma he’s made to act like a puppy dog whereas with others he’s able to act more in character.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixScrewball Ninja came up with an interesting interpretation. Basically “OUAT is pushing redemption over justice. The villains take precedence over the victims, for better or worse.”
I had come half-way to that conclusion myself. I was thinking earlier today that unless you have a redemption story worth exploiting A&E don’t care about writing your character so much, that you can expect death and no reprieve, unless you are a Charming.
The topic ‘Alive Again’ is closed to new replies.