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Well yes she consented and it is Rumple not some other guy, but she doesn’t have all the facts. She is believing something about Rumple and he’s deliberately keeping vital information about himself that would likely change Belle’s perception of him, from her. She doesn’t know, in the emotional sense, who she is sleeping with.
Well sure, but people lie about their past all the time. It doesn’t make the sex any less consensual in my eyes. It’s not very nice of Rumple to do that, but there’s no issue with consent for me at all here.
And I like that Rumple now has a HUUGE weak spot for leverage. Sure, he’s always had Belle. But now this child, is his second chance. So people like Hades are going to try and use that against him. Her being pregnant hopefully also means they will write Belle more scenes going forward.
[adrotate group="5"]No, no a thousand times no. This family tree may be approaching a level of twisted to rival that of Olympus, but we do not need to add incest to the ever winding branches.
I agree about the “Ick!” factor, but I don’t think we can rule it out based on what weve seen on-screen so far. If the crystal ball truly answers questions literally, I don’t think it would imply a child by showing the mother. I can certainly believe Rumpel’s reaction if that’s what he realized.
With regards to the contract was it for Rumple’s second born or for Rumple and Milah’s second born or for either parent’s second born, that could lead to some interesting loophole options to the contract. Maybe there is a long lost baby Jones that may have actually payed this debt and Hades is totally bluffing on his end.
Okay, if Belle is the daughter of Hook and Milah…
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. Belle was in her right mind and consented to sleep with Rumple who is actually Rumple and not someone pretending to be him
Well yes she consented and it is Rumple not some other guy, but she doesn’t have all the facts. She is believing something about Rumple and he’s deliberately keeping vital information about himself that would likely change Belle’s perception of him, from her. She doesn’t know, in the emotional sense, who she is sleeping with.
Right. The same thing with Jonathan and Cora. She thought he was a king, but he was a farmer. Then HE called HER greedy, making things worse (i.e. victim-blaming).
. Belle was in her right mind and consented to sleep with Rumple who is actually Rumple and not someone pretending to be him
Well yes she consented and it is Rumple not some other guy, but she doesn’t have all the facts. She is believing something about Rumple and he’s deliberately keeping vital information about himself that would likely change Belle’s perception of him, from her. She doesn’t know, in the emotional sense, who she is sleeping with.
Right. The same thing with Jonathan and Cora. She thought he was a king, but he was a farmer. Then HE called HER greedy, making things worse (i.e. victim-blaming).
I can see both your points but at the same time I still disagree with them.
Belle was in her right mind and knew she was sleeping with Rumple. Rumple didn’t trick her into it. Therefore, Belle fully consented. If a woman chooses to sleep with her husband, and he doesn’t tell her that he’s become the CEO of a company planning world-domination, does that make any difference? He is still her husband, she chose to sleep with her husband. I think the same applies to RumBelle. Although Rumple hasn’t told Belle he’s the DO, he is still Belle’s husband and Belle chose to sleep with her husband.
Jonathan and Cora is a bit more murky. She consented to sleep with the guy. However, she consented to sleep with the guy because she thought he was a king. He duped her in that respect. However, Cora’s motivations were basically gold-digging which in itself is hardly upstanding. Cora was in her right mind when she chose to sleep with the guy so he wasn’t taking advantage as such but did he trick her into it? Jonathan wasn’t pretending to be someone else aka James pretending to be David or Zelena pretending to be Marian so Cora consented to sleep with Jonathan in that regard. However she chose to sleep with him because he led her to believe he was a king which was a lie.
I’m going to say that Cora did consent to sleep with Jonathan of her own free will but it was a choice she later regretted. He didn’t force her or take advantage of her in the sense that she made the choice to sleep with him, however, he did give her false information which led her to come to her decision.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixBelle was in her right mind and knew she was sleeping with Rumple. Rumple didn’t trick her into it. Therefore, Belle fully consented. If a woman chooses to sleep with her husband, and he doesn’t tell her that he’s become the CEO of a company planning world-domination, does that make any difference? He is still her husband, she chose to sleep with her husband. I think the same applies to RumBelle. Although Rumple hasn’t told Belle he’s the DO, he is still Belle’s husband and Belle chose to sleep with her husband.
Agreed.
If a woman chooses to sleep with her husband, and he doesn’t tell her that he’s become the CEO of a company planning world-domination, does that make any difference? He is still her husband, she chose to sleep with her husband. I think the same applies to RumBelle. Although Rumple hasn’t told Belle he’s the DO, he is still Belle’s husband and Belle chose to sleep with her husband.
You know, it’s funny, I was thinking along a very similar metaphor. So on this consent issue, I tend to agree with you, @POM. Sure, it’s absolutely problematic — and the fact that she gets pregnant specifically that time feels like an especially cheap shot. But I don’t think it’s so much an issue of consent, as it is of a profoundly flawed relationship. But I think I’ve learned to apply a sliding scale to how this show interprets consent anyway, because it’s got such a horrible track record so far. *sigh*
I have a different problem with this part of the story, actually, and it has to do with Belle. I find it extremely irritating that the only way in which the writers are able to tell Belle’s story is through a damage narrative. Even in this context of her pregnancy, which should be a joyous news, there’s this potential damage looming over her. Which is to say, that Belle is only interesting when she’s a victim of something (Rumple, Hook, circumstances, the curse, etc and now potentially Hades). She temporarily overcomes her circumstances, but it’s fleeting, and she’s the victim again. This is a classic trope for a lot of narratives that deal with the “subaltern” — minorities, the poor, and for a long time, women. Like the only thing that’s worth knowing about them is how damaged they are (or how they are being progressively damaged further). This type of story doesn’t seek to find other narrative strands, other than occasional examples of doomed resistance. For a show that claims to be feminist, this is a very serious problem precisely because a feminist show would refuse this sort of story, choosing instead to portray a different kind of dynamic, even if it’s acknowledging all the bad things that are happening to Belle. What I dislike about it in particular, is that Belle is one of the only women on the show who is not “strong” because she’s not by and large like a man. I can’t help but get the message that, on OUAT, the only way to be a strong woman is to be as man-like as possible, and if not, then you are a woman, and hence the victim, the passive object. This is tediously patriarchal.
I think Belle is strong in other non-physical ways, especially when it comes to brains over brawn. But yes you are correct when you say that the standard image of a “strong” woman on this show now is one that is as physically strong.
What I find annoying is that the writers don’t seem to be able to move RumBelle beyond the cycle of he lies, she leaves, they get back together. Every season they repeat this cycle. I wish the writers would do something different. How about if the darkness starts to corrupt Belle making her more Lacey/Dark Belle like. Rumple would then have to make a decision, does he keep the power and have to watch as Belle is dragged down by the darkness or does he give it up to save her? That is a true love vs Power decision with some real stakes.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixWhat I find annoying is that the writers don’t seem to be able to move RumBelle beyond the cycle of he lies, she leaves, they get back together. Every season they repeat this cycle. I wish the writers would do something different. How about if the darkness starts to corrupt Belle making her more Lacey/Dark Belle like. Rumple would then have to make a decision, does he keep the power and have to watch as Belle is dragged down by the darkness or does he give it up to save her? That is a true love vs Power decision with some real stakes.
Ahhh! This is brilliant! ABC, take note 😉 The problem you’re pointing out actually affects all the couples (and characters) though. So I’m irritated but not surprised that this is affecting Rumbelle too — I mean, just look at Hook (again with the revenge!), Emma (again with the walls!), Snow (again with “Am I a hero?”), and then Robin and Charming (flatlining for the last 3 seasons) etc etc. None of the characters are really evolving: they are either utterly stagnant or they cycle.
What I find annoying is that the writers don’t seem to be able to move RumBelle beyond the cycle of he lies, she leaves, they get back together.
Yeah I have a lot of problems with this as well. And now they are going to insert a magical baby to fix the problems (when apparently Rumple’s previous baby wasn’t good enough???).
A lot of times, in the real world, when a marriage is as rocky as Rumbelle’s, adding a baby is the worst thing you can do. It makes both parents feel trapped because now they have to stay together “for the kids” no matter how much mommy and daddy should really split up and try to figure out their lives, issues, ect.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"The problem you’re pointing out actually affects all the couples (and characters) though. So I’m irritated but not surprised that this is affecting Rumbelle too — I mean, just look at Hook (again with the revenge!), Emma (again with the walls!), Snow (again with “Am I a hero?”), and then Robin and Charming (flatlining for the last 3 seasons) etc etc. None of the characters are really evolving: they are either utterly stagnant or they cycle.
Yes exactly. Each arc seems to be the same cycle for each character and then a reset button is hit.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"
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