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I know I’m entering dangerous territory by saying this, but I must speak on Zelena’s defense with this one.
1. Rumple could have refused to teach Zelena….he didn’t, he decided to teach her. Even though he had already begun darkening Regina, he decided to teach the other sister. Therefore, he’s responsible for Zelena ever knowing how to control her magic in the first place. Just throwing the truth out there….
2. I will admit that Zelena was a bit wacko, and crazy type of ex girlfriend with a weak backstory(Blaming the writers for that)….the fact that she’s Regina’s sister, who Rumple killed, I think that will be a set back for him and Regina. Because not only did Rumple deprive Regina of a possible relationship with her sister, he also ruined her “hero” moment because Zelena didn’t get her second chance.
3. I will say that Rumple had a right for wanting to avenge Bae’s death, as it was PARTIALLY Zelena’s fault. But the moment he swore to Belle that he wouldn’t go after her, and that he’d try to be the better man….the vengeance should have been over! I’m sorry…even though it wasn’t a deal, it was kinda like a deal with Belle that he wouldn’t go for Zelena. A promise he broke that should have consequences behind them, which as RG stated, won’t be resolved with an I’m Sorry, and kiss. Because this isn’t the first time he’s done this, as I would like to bring up the Regina and Wraith incident that set off a chain of events much like him killing Zelena set off a chain of events, that led up to Regina’s Fifth Chance at a Happy Ending being taken away from her.
So in all….there is a heavy price coming for Rumpelstilskin to pay, and may fate ever have mercy on him…
#LearnFromYourMistakesRumple
[adrotate group="5"]"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
POM QUOTE:
The Mills women aren’t renowned for accepting second chances gracefully
WR RESPONSE:
AND WHOSE FAULT IS THAT???
The RUMPELSTILSKIN MEETING BEFORE AND AFTER:
BEFORE:
AFTER:
Cora: Now…there’s no blame on Rumple for his dealings with Cora, as we all know Cora’s wickedness stems from Johnathan’s betrayal.
Zelena: Seriously….had he not taught this woman how to control her powers, she never would have posed a threat. And when Regina tried to give her a second chance, Rumple killed her before she even had a night to think it over.
Regina: Definitely, no matter how you want to spin it, responsible for Regina’s evil! I’d like to throw out what you all are sure to dismiss as had Rumple not met Regina on that road, she never would have been convinced to go back. Then he further darkened her by giving her hope for Daniel, which he had Whale deceive her into thinking there was no hope. Then when Regina was resisting his lessons, he installed in her that the “Anger was all she had, and that her fate to be dark was sealed”, thus scaring her out of meeting Robin Hood. All of this led up to the Evil Queen we saw in the past. And most recently, Rumple killing Zelena set off a chain of events that led to Robin’s wife being brought back, thus ruining Regina’s chance at happiness again! So Rumple is definitely responsible for the creation of his, and I quote: “Monster”
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
I agree with most of what you wrote @WickedRegal
This is Rumbelle discussion thread, not Zelena/Regina defense thread. All I’m going to say is that I’m happy that Zelena is gone, and I hope we never see her again, other than in flashbacks. And just to clarify: if it had been Rumple’s brother torturing Regina like Zelena tortured Rumple, I would have wanted him to die as well. Because Imo one Rumple is enough, as well as one Regina, in this show.
It has been my long standing theory that TLK can’t work on Rumple until after he made the ultimate sacrifice. When Belle TLK-ed him in S1 Skin Deep, it began to crack the curse but Rumple wasn’t ready yet and hadn’t made the ultimate LIGHT sacrifice to allow for TLK to work. Then he did make the ultimate sacrifice in 311 but there was no TLK cause Zelena got to him first (now proceeds to forget 315 ever happened in case she bursts into tears).
but now with the Zelena murder and the lying, I’m not sure how Rumple gives up the curse with TLK if he’s done something so violentMy current headcanon is that Rumple has found a way to prevent the consequences of TLK, because he doesn’t like to take risks. It’s like after he almost died of dreamshade poisoning: he studied the plant and found a cure.
My another theory is that there has to be the will and determination to break the curse in order for TLK to work.
Of course it’s possible that TLK requires the LIGHT sacrifice in order for it to break the DO’s curse.
POM QUOTE:
The Mills women aren’t renowned for accepting second chances gracefully
WR RESPONSE:
AND WHOSE FAULT IS THAT???
Rumple can not be blamed for the CHOICES that the Mills women made! Therefore not accepting second chances gracefully is the Mills women’s fault.
As usual Screwball has an essay.
The RUMPELSTILSKIN MEETING BEFORE AND AFTER:
BEFORE:
AFTER:
Cora: Now…there’s no blame on Rumple for his dealings with Cora, as we all know Cora’s wickedness stems from Johnathan’s betrayal.
Zelena: Seriously….had he not taught this woman how to control her powers, she never would have posed a threat. And when Regina tried to give her a second chance, Rumple killed her before she even had a night to think it over.
Regina: Definitely, no matter how you want to spin it, responsible for Regina’s evil! I’d like to throw out what you all are sure to dismiss as had Rumple not met Regina on that road, she never would have been convinced to go back. Then he further darkened her by giving her hope for Daniel, which he had Whale deceive her into thinking there was no hope. Then when Regina was resisting his lessons, he installed in her that the “Anger was all she had, and that her fate to be dark was sealed”, thus scaring her out of meeting Robin Hood. All of this led up to the Evil Queen we saw in the past. And most recently, Rumple killing Zelena set off a chain of events that led to Robin’s wife being brought back, thus ruining Regina’s chance at happiness again! So Rumple is definitely responsible for the creation of his, and I quote: “Monster”
Zelena already had a good control over her magic, Rumple only helped her hone it some more. She was very co-ordinated as a baby. Rumple never made Zelena do the things she did, Zelena did. Rumple didn’t start Zelena off down a dark path, Zelena was already heading there by herself before she met Rumple. Zelena wanted to be Rumple’s favourite and she wasn’t. She became obsessed with him and he basically told her he wasn’t interested. Zelena was psycho, she just became fixated on Regina and Rumple. Zelena’s troubles were her own doing not Rumple’s.
As for Regina, see Screwball’s essay.
@seamstress, I’m glad Zelena’s gone too. If the shoe had been on the other foot, and Zelena had been Rumple’s sister and killed Henry and Rumple did the give her a second chance, you just know that Regina would’ve killed her before she ever reached the cell. It’s easy for Regina to give Zelena a second chance because Zelena didn’t take away one of the most important people to Regina or force Regina to do things against her will for kicks. Zelena ordered Rumple to kill Belle, right after Rumple had to absorb Neal to save him, just because she could not because Belle was a threat. Rumple could’ve potentially lost the 2 people that mean the most to him, just because Zelena could make him do it.Rumple was going for the kill before Regina stopped him with the dagger and gave her hypocritical “heroes don’t kill” speech. But again, Regina hadn’t suffered at Zelena’s hands like Rumple had.
We don’t know what’s going on in Rumple’s head. But it’s very likely that Rumple focussed on the thought of enacting revenge on Zelena to get him through his enforced servitude. His revenge is what sustained what little free-will he had left. Rumple wasn’t thinking rationally when he enacted his revenge on Zelena so now he is trying to cover up what he’s done because he doesn’t want to risk losing Belle. However, by doing so, he’s only digging a deeper hole for himself.
It’s they lying to Belle that’s going to cause the tension between RumBelle next season rather than Zelena’s death IMO. I also think that Rumple will confess to Belle about his lies either willingly because he can’t face lying to her anymore, or a situation will arise where he is forced to tell the truth.
I’m optimistic that RumBelle will resolve this issue together. Rumple is sometimes going to fall off the wagon, just like Regina has done in the past and will probably do in the future in some form. Belle is not going to give up on Rumple just because he’s screwed up. Is she going to be angry? Definitely. Disappointed in him? Most likely. But is she going to call it a day and be done with him? No.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixPreferably, I liked Lacey….even though I’m very upset about Rumple killing Zelena, Rumbelle would be safe if the Lacey part of Belle came out….but due to that being a low chance, then I’m sure Belle will be highly upset and disappointed, and this will be a temporary separation between Rumbelle least till the end of Season 4A or 4B, or whenever Zelena appears again….
As for Rumple and the Mills women situation….a ripple effect really. Rumple helping Cora that night in the tower, not only helped create happy endings, but tore apart many others in the same process. So technically…all this goes back to Rumple and Cora.
1. Rumple purposefully set out to create his Monster, thus he set up a few events in Regina’s life that turned her into who she was….though I’m sure Cora was smothering Regina enough.
2. True Zelena was a magical prodigy, but Rumple could have just refused her since he was already halfway at work making Regina a monster….he just never realized the true problem Zelena could become.
3. As I said….Cora was on her own, and the only person to point the finger at is Johnathan in my opinion. He broke Cora’s heart(as I do believe Cora loved him, but was a naïve girl who got her heart broken.) and that’s what set Cora off on her Power Only course.
And as for the Shoe had been on the other foot, I think deep down Regina would have known that Henry wouldn’t have wanted her to revert back to her evil ways by killing Zelena….that goes for Emma too. If Zelena had killed Henry, she may not have been given a second chance, but they would have let her rot in prison for the rest of her days, because that’s what Henry would have wanted.
Knowing Neal, Rumple should have honored Bae’s memory, and spared Zelena’s life. Neal wouldn’t have wanted Rumple to revert back to his wicked ways, and in a way, Rumple disregarded Neal’s sacrifice by killing Zelena. And I’m quite sure Neal is disappointed in Rumple, and the only way for Rumple to right this wrong, is if he just fesses up willingly, and face whatever music that will be dealt to him.
(Crosses fingers at a potential Neal ghost appearing to be Rumple’s conscious….)
#BelieveRumpleWillDoTheRightThing
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
Preferably, I liked Lacey….even though I’m very upset about Rumple killing Zelena, Rumbelle would be safe if the Lacey part of Belle came out….but due to that being a low chance, then I’m sure Belle will be highly upset and disappointed, and this will be a temporary separation between Rumbelle least till the end of Season 4A or 4B, or whenever Zelena appears again….
I liked Lacey too. If Belle does react more Lacey like than Belle like, then I can see that being a wake up call for Rumple. He has to be better for Belle’s sake or eventually risk dragging her down into darkness too.
As for Rumple and the Mills women situation….a ripple effect really. Rumple helping Cora that night in the tower, not only helped create happy endings, but tore apart many others in the same process. So technically…all this goes back to Rumple and Cora.
1. Rumple purposefully set out to create his Monster, thus he set up a few events in Regina’s life that turned her into who she was….though I’m sure Cora was smothering Regina enough.
2. True Zelena was a magical prodigy, but Rumple could have just refused her since he was already halfway at work making Regina a monster….he just never realized the true problem Zelena could become.
3. As I said….Cora was on her own, and the only person to point the finger at is Johnathan in my opinion. He broke Cora’s heart(as I do believe Cora loved him, but was a naïve girl who got her heart broken.) and that’s what set Cora off on her Power Only course.
Whilst Rumple may have had a hand in the Mills women’s lives, they still made their own choices. He may have had an influence but every decision they made, he didn’t make for them.
And as for the Shoe had been on the other foot, I think deep down Regina would have known that Henry wouldn’t have wanted her to revert back to her evil ways by killing Zelena….that goes for Emma too. If Zelena had killed Henry, she may not have been given a second chance, but they would have let her rot in prison for the rest of her days, because that’s what Henry would have wanted.
This is what bugged me about Regina in Kansas. She was giving Zelena “a second chance” because she hadn’t particularly suffered at Zelena’s hands. Yet like you said, if Zelena had killed Henry, she would’ve been left to rot in prison and not got a second chance. So why I can agree that Rumple should’ve left Zelena to rot in prison rather than killing her, Regina wasn’t going to leave Zelena in prison, she was going to give her a “second chance” so I can’t blame Rumple for killing her.
Knowing Neal, Rumple should have honored Bae’s memory, and spared Zelena’s life. Neal wouldn’t have wanted Rumple to revert back to his wicked ways, and in a way, Rumple disregarded Neal’s sacrifice by killing Zelena. And I’m quite sure Neal is disappointed in Rumple, and the only way for Rumple to right this wrong, is if he just fesses up willingly, and face whatever music that will be dealt to him.
(Crosses fingers at a potential Neal ghost appearing to be Rumple’s conscious….)
#BelieveRumpleWillDoTheRightThing
That sounds like Belle’s mantra. 😛 #BelieveRumpleWillDoTheRightThing
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixI liked Lacey too. If Belle does react more Lacey like than Belle like, then I can see that being a wake up call for Rumple. He has to be better for Belle’s sake or eventually risk dragging her down into darkness too.
I liked Lacey too. My issue with the Lacey arc is that it tried to be ALL THE THINGS (a common problem with season 2). Amnesiac Belle scared of Rumple to Amnesiac Belle wanting to leave the hospital with Rumple to Lacey to Real! Belle. All in the span of a few episodes. Either the cursed memory storyline OR the amnesia would have been fine. But, too many toys syndrome strikes again.
If Belle responds like Lacey that might be an intriguing storyline. How Rumple’s actions damage those he loves most. He got a taste of it with Nealfire, (“Try abandonment”) and then the consequences of it more in “Nasty Habits.”
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"I liked Lacey too. If Belle does react more Lacey like than Belle like, then I can see that being a wake up call for Rumple. He has to be better for Belle’s sake or eventually risk dragging her down into darkness too.
I liked Lacey too. My issue with the Lacey arc is that it tried to be ALL THE THINGS (a common problem with season 2). Amnesiac Belle scared of Rumple to Amnesiac Belle wanting to leave the hospital with Rumple to Lacey to Real! Belle. All in the span of a few episodes. Either the cursed memory storyline OR the amnesia would have been fine. But, too many toys syndrome strikes again.
If Belle responds like Lacey that might be an intriguing storyline. How Rumple’s actions damage those he loves most. He got a taste of it with Nealfire, (“Try abandonment”) and then the consequences of it more in “Nasty Habits.”
I agree. Season 2 had some potentially interesting and intriguing storylines set up but then overdid everything so it wasn’t as good as it could’ve been. For example: Belle should’ve been either Lacey or amnesia rather than both. Another example is Tamara. She could have been an interesting character if she’d just been Neal’s fiancée. Instead they made her that, working secretly for the home office and Greg’s girlfriend. Likewise with Greg, he could’ve just been a normal person stumbling into Storybrooke but they made him work for the home office, Tamara’s secret boyfriend and had him have a past with Regina. GOAT was too many things and would’ve benefitted from being simplified.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixAm I the only one who is bothered by Belle not talking about the elephat in the room? This was the first time he was free since THE LOSS OF THE CENTER OF HIS UNIVERSE (in RG’s words) its not like he, like the rest of them had time to mourn or even bury him. Where was he while belle was throwing shovelfuls of dirt into his child’s grave? Oh, right, he was being tortured in his cage.
It’s really nice that she is happy that he is alive, but HE is not. HE would rather his son be alive. Who gave Bae the idea that he could “bring him back”? Belle. Who did not use her “book-worm” skills to research what that key really does? Belle. Who did not even TRY to phisically grab that key away even though he might be stronger than her he wouldnt try to hurt her if she STOOD IN HIS WAY
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