Belle

[PriceofMagic]

@Gaultheria wrote:

One of the hosts — DJL, I think — suggested Stockholm on the podcast, too.

I think Belle might be the kind of sympathetic character who would always have had the potential to see the good in Rumpel and to fall in love with him, but I think the first imprisonment added a layer of unhealthy complexity to that relationship.

We don’t know how long Belle spent in the dungeon, it could be from a couple of hours to a night. I do think Belle was upgraded to a proper room during her stay with Rumple hence why she was a bit upset when she ended up back in the dungeon. As for why Rumple put her in the dungeon to begin with, he could have been making a point that she wasn’t going to be treated like royalty and that she was there to work, also he thought it funny.

[hjbau]

I don’t think Belle really knows Rumpel at all either. All she knows about him is when they were alone and like oncescape said she knows nothing about the fact that he is actively ruining the lives of people around him for his own purposes still. And they aren’t even for anyone else they are all his own reasons. Bae did not want Rumpel to save him from the wars, he did not want him to kill the cart guy or the mute maid, and he wanted Rumpel to give up his magic and power and come through the vortex with him to our world. Rumpel didn’t do any of those things. He just does what he wants for his own purposes without any regard for anyone else including Bae. And so far we haven’t seen any change.

I actually think they heavily implied Stockholm syndrome in the show with Regina’s whole comment about not telling a woman to kiss a man who held her captive. And with the way Belle chipped the cup and thought Rumpel would freak out and then was happy when he didn’t scream at her which is pretty much what Stockholm syndrome is. It does seem like they are implying that she is his love though for the purposes if the show.

[thedarkone]

@Elle wrote:

Belle does deserve vengeance, as does everyone in the town, but it does depend on her treatment as well. We know that she was in the hospital for twenty eight years, but we don’t really know her treatment beforehand. She hadn’t been captured by the Queen right after she left (we are not even told if she was captured by the Queen in Fairytale world, though it is likely) and we don’t know what Regina did to her. Of course being locked away for years is torture enough.

Also, something that I noticed, Belle’s Counterpart has either been heavily dressed (last episode with a long-sleeved shirt under her hospital gown and a thick coat) or she has never been seen fully (end of Skin Deep, she was curled up and the room was dark). It does pose the question if maybe she was hurt in some physical way that would leave scars. I know a lot of popular theories are that either her father or the Queen hurt her, and remembering the anger in her tone when she said Regin’a name is enough to wonder.

I’m still not clear on what Regina did to Belle either. So far, it appears that all Regina did was kidnap Belle and lock her in a mental institution. And we’re still not entirely sure why. As the finale inched closer, I was expecting Regina to use the “Belle card” to make Rumpel do something for her. But she didn’t. So her keeping Belle locked up was just a flight of fancy as far I’m concerned. And it didn’t turn out very well for her either. All she did was make an even bigger enemy of Rumpel.

But to be honest, I have a feeling the reason why Regina kidnapped Belle was so the writers could keep Belle in the story. And hey, I’m not complaining. 😆

[a_desperate_soul]

@TheDarkOne wrote:

@Elle wrote:

Belle does deserve vengeance, as does everyone in the town, but it does depend on her treatment as well. We know that she was in the hospital for twenty eight years, but we don’t really know her treatment beforehand. She hadn’t been captured by the Queen right after she left (we are not even told if she was captured by the Queen in Fairytale world, though it is likely) and we don’t know what Regina did to her. Of course being locked away for years is torture enough.

Also, something that I noticed, Belle’s Counterpart has either been heavily dressed (last episode with a long-sleeved shirt under her hospital gown and a thick coat) or she has never been seen fully (end of Skin Deep, she was curled up and the room was dark). It does pose the question if maybe she was hurt in some physical way that would leave scars. I know a lot of popular theories are that either her father or the Queen hurt her, and remembering the anger in her tone when she said Regin’a name is enough to wonder.

I’m still not clear on what Regina did to Belle either. So far, it appears that all Regina did was kidnap Belle and lock her in a mental institution. And we’re still not entirely sure why. As the finale inched closer, I was expecting Regina to use the “Belle card” to make Rumpel do something for her. But she didn’t. So her keeping Belle locked up was just a flight of fancy as far I’m concerned. And it didn’t turn out very well for her either. All she did was make an even bigger enemy of Rumpel.

But to be honest, I have a feeling the reason why Regina kidnapped Belle was so the writers could keep Belle in the story. And hey, I’m not complaining. 😆

I’m almost positive that Regina kidnapping Belle was a plot device. They needed to keep Belle in the story, and they also needed to create a situation that would finally put Rumpel and Regina on opposite sides. But like you said, I’m not complaining. 😀

But then this whole situation makes Regina look kind of short-sided. If she wasn’t planning on using Belle as leverage, then why did she kidnap her in the first place? What’s the point? All it does is highlight the differences between Rumpel and Regina. Rumpel thinks before he acts. But Regina? Not so much.

[a chipped cup]

Regina holding Belle hostage was probably just a plot device to move the story forward and to create more tension between Rumpel and Regina. However, it was at the expense of Regina’s villain status. The show does this all the time. In order to move a story a forward, they sacrifice another character’s development or personality. The most notable example of this has been Emma, but it’s happened with Regina too. Everytime she goes up against Rumpel, she loses. Of course, it makes Rumpel look awesome, but Regina loses some of her edge.

Having said that, there’s always the possibility that Regina could have brainwashed Belle against Rumpel during her time in the mental institution. But that would only fuel Rumpel’s hatred and need for vengence against Regina.

[a_desperate_soul]

@A Chipped Cup wrote:

Regina holding Belle hostage was probably just a plot device to move the story forward and to create more tension between Rumpel and Regina. However, it was at the expense of Regina’s villain status. The show does this all the time. In order to move a story a forward, they sacrifice another character’s development or personality. The most notable example of this has been Emma, but it’s happened with Regina too. Everytime she goes up against Rumpel, she loses. Of course, it makes Rumpel look awesome, but Regina loses some of her edge.

Having said that, there’s always the possibility that Regina could have brainwashed Belle against Rumpel during her time in the mental institution. But that would only fuel Rumpel’s hatred and need for vengence against Regina.

I’ve been wondering about that too. We could end up with a mind controlled Belle in season 2. 😆

[Aliasscape]

@PriceofMagic wrote:

Belle was at Rumple’s for several months which is enough time for them to get to know each other and genuinely develop feelings for each other. It could be argued that, as far as Belle knew, Rumple would be the only person she saw for the rest of her life so it was in her best interests to be on good terms with him.

Which is another way Stockholm Syndrome works. Isolation is an important component so pleasing your captor is your primary motivation in life after awhile. It’ll keep you alive. It’s a psychological defense mechanism run amok basically. They were isolated together for months and a random release here or there (even if she believed it could be permanent release) wouldn’t alter that mentality immediately or in any significant way. Thus her still pining over a guy who violently shook her, screamed at her and threw her out who knows how much later with Grumpy. I also feel it oddly weird she remembers who he is, that’s her LAST memory of him, and she’s still instantly declaring her love for him. After 28 years of isolation, I suppose her view could be quite skewed though.

I do believe really the only way for Regina’s imprisonment of Belle to not really just be a holding pattern for her storyline would be for Regina to have spent that time brainwashing her. But it’d have to be subconscious, sleeper type, since Belle didn’t take one look at Rumpel in the finale, recoil in fear and run away, so she hadn’t be conditioned to fear him on sight.

[a_desperate_soul]

@Oncescape wrote:

I do believe really the only way for Regina’s imprisonment of Belle to not really just be a holding pattern for her storyline would be for Regina to have spent that time brainwashing her. But it’d have to be subconscious, sleeper type, since Belle didn’t take one look at Rumpel in the finale, recoil in fear and run away, so she hadn’t be conditioned to fear him on sight.

Just because Belle didn’t react in a way in which you found fit, doesn’t mean that she’s been brainwashed or conditioned. I wasn’t surprised by Belle’s reaction to the Rumpel in the finale. I saw that storyline for what it was. The show has presented them as true love. We have evidence of this via their kiss in “Skin Deep.” I knew that was the case, so I knew she wouldn’t fear when she was finally reunited with him. I honestly believe we’re overanalyzing something that will never be addressed on the show.

This whole debate is just a symptom of the original tale.

[hjbau]

I thought it didn’t make sense for Belle to tell him she loved him after how the two of them left it in fairytale land. Up until then i thought the show had made sense because the relationship had just been depicted in a disturbing way, but then it seems like they decided that Belle was still in love with him which is still disturbing, but i can’t tell if they mean it or not because it didn’t make sense based on where they left the relationship at the end of Skin Deep.

[a chipped cup]

@A_Desperate_Soul wrote:

@Oncescape wrote:

I do believe really the only way for Regina’s imprisonment of Belle to not really just be a holding pattern for her storyline would be for Regina to have spent that time brainwashing her. But it’d have to be subconscious, sleeper type, since Belle didn’t take one look at Rumpel in the finale, recoil in fear and run away, so she hadn’t be conditioned to fear him on sight.

Just because Belle didn’t react in a way in which you found fit, doesn’t mean that she’s been brainwashed or conditioned. I wasn’t surprised by Belle’s reaction to the Rumpel in the finale. I saw that storyline for what it was. The show has presented them as true love. We have evidence of this via their kiss in “Skin Deep.” I knew that was the case, so I knew she wouldn’t fear when she was finally reunited with him. I honestly believe we’re overanalyzing something that will never be addressed on the show.

This whole debate is just a symptom of the original tale.

This is my thinking as well. This tale is very old and what was considered safe or ok doesn’t really apply to our modern society. The BATB tale is rough. Period. The Beast is a beast. He kills, he’s cruel. That’s the characterization of the the Beast. There’s no way around that. Even the Disney version of the film had a pretty terrifying Beast. So, Rumpel’s version of the Beast was actually rather tame compared to other versions of the tale.

And yes, I agree. We’re overanalyzing something that the writers will never address in the future. They meant for Belle and Rumpel to be true love. And no, it can’t be false true love because we’ve already seen an example of that and it failed. Everyone here can agree that Regina loves Henry’s, but can we truly consider it true love? No. For one, the purity of Regina’s love for Henry is questionable. And two, Henry doesn’t truly love her back. There are many factors to consider when true love is involved.

[Author]

Posts