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I’ve been a strong supporter of the Dr. Whale is Dr. Frankenstein theory for a couple of months now but I’ve always felt like they would combine Dr. Frankenstein with another character. I’ve thought of many possibilities…Dr. Jekyll…Dr. Van Helsing, Dr. Moreau, Captain Nemo, Captain Ahab…etc. But none of them were a perfect fit. The closest match was probably Dr. Jekyll.
So, I decided to dig a little deeper and Mary Shelley’s Frankenstein came to live in my Kindle. After reading the book I was even more convinced that Dr. Whale aka Dr. Frankenstein would have to be combined with another character. Why? Because Shelley’s Dr. Frankenstein is not a womanizer and Dr. Whale is. That is how we meet him…a creepy, greasy looking guy who is leering at Ruby’s rear end while on a date with sweet Mary Margaret. Yuck.
Well tonight it came to me. The character that will be combined with Dr. Frankenstein is Jack the Ripper. On a scale of confidence that is 1-10…I’m at an 11. Others may have come to the same conclusion but if they have I haven’t read any of the posts…this is a new thought for me.
Quick summery of info:
1.Attacks ascribed to the Ripper typically involved female prostitutes from the slums – Ruby was sporting the skanty when Whale was checking her out2.The way the women were butchered led to proposals that the killer possessed anatomical or surgical knowledge – Is there a doctor in the house???
3. Rumors that the murders were connected intensified in September and October of 1888 – There has certainly been lots of chatter about Whale these last few months
4. Because of the extraordinarily brutal character of the murders the killer became known as “Jack the Ripper” – “Jack” has the same meaning as the American “John Doe”. When we first discover Whale is a doctor he is standing with his patient, John Doe.
5. Mary Margaret is reading a paper with the headline “Welcome home John Doe” (remember “Jack” is the same thing as “John Doe”..”.identity unknown”. When Whale comes up behind her and says he is one he** of a doctor. There is a letter from Jack the Ripper called The He** letter .There is also a comet on the front page. There is a song about a comet and the title is, “Jack the Ripper – Old Stars” And
6. From wikipedia: As the murders were never solved, the legends surrounding them became a combination of genuine historical research, folklore, and pseudohistory. The term “ripperology” was coined to describe the study and analysis of the Ripper cases. There are now over one hundred theories about the Ripper’s identity, and the murders have inspired multiple works of fiction. – that means ole Jack is now a storybook character.
7. One victim that was attributed to Jack the Ripper was nicknamed, “Fairy Fay” – Whale has been leering at Sister Blue Fairy.
8, He removed the heart of his victim – “Catherine’s” heart had to come from somewhere. Speaking of Catherine…he had a victim named Catherine…hope this isn’t in her future. He also had a victim they called Ginger. I remember there was a Miss Ginger that Ruby talked to and assured her that there was not a prowler outside.
9. Popular suspect for Jack the Ripper – Prince Albert Victor, Duke of Clarence and Avondale son of Prince Albert Edward, Prince of Wales (later King Edward VII), and Alexandra, Princess of Wales (later Queen Alexandra) –You’re not my prince…Whale said to Charming….probably because Dr. Whale’s prince is Prince Wale
10. Prince Albert Victor liked to play polo – remember when Mary Margaret had her “glad you didn’t kill that lady” party…Whale was there and I remember him talking and then swinging his hands like he was talking about golf…well…how much you want to bet it wasn’t golf…it was polo he was talking about.
[/color]11. Two of the fictional portrayals of him as Jack the Ripper cast his character as a vampire. Surely they are not going to throw this in as well. There was a vampire slayer scythe on display at Rumple’s Castle. The newspaper Mary Margaret was reading…the Welcome Home John Doe…well there was a story about lyme disease…which comes from blood sucking ticks. I hope they don’t go this direction…unlike the rest of America, I don’t like vampires.
12. The image of the Ripper merged with or borrowed symbols from horror stories, such as Dracula’s cloak or Victor Frankenstein’s organ harvest.[attachment=1:2zadkv38]Dr. Henry Frankenstein and Dr. Whale.jpg[/attachment:2zadkv38]
13. Believe it or not there is a picture of Prince Albert Victor with a single white carnation.
There are more but I will stop there…folks…he’s Dr. Whale…he’s Dr. Frankenstein…and he is JACK THE RIPPER.[adrotate group="5"]In the thread for the promo for The Doctor, I pondered if the specific heart Daniel gets will be significant, and TheGoldenKey suggested that maybe it’ll be getting a “murderous heart” that makes the whole reanimation go so wrong. I briefly considered if the heart could potentially belong to someone like Jack The Ripper, but ruled him out because he’s too “real” IMO. The point you make about how his story isn’t necessarily strictly historical fact is interesting, but, I dunno, for me, he’s still too much of a real person from our world to be able to qualify as a storybook character in the context of the show. Much of his legend may be pure speculation, and in some cases fiction, but the origin of the character was still a very real world person committing very real world crimes, so I kinda hope they don’t include him in the show.
@Phee wrote:
In the thread for the promo for The Doctor, I pondered if the specific heart Daniel gets will be significant, and TheGoldenKey suggested that maybe it’ll be getting a “murderous heart” that makes the whole reanimation go so wrong. I briefly considered if the heart could potentially belong to someone like Jack The Ripper, but ruled him out because he’s too “real” IMO. The point you make about how his story isn’t necessarily strictly historical fact is interesting, but, I dunno, for me, he’s still too much of a real person from our world to be able to qualify as a storybook character in the context of the show. Much of his legend may be pure speculation, and in some cases fiction, but the origin of the character was still a very real world person committing very real world crimes, so I kinda hope they don’t include him in the show.
I have to agree with Phee on this. Besides, the lecherous part of Dr. Whale has been explained in that in the 1970 movie, The Horror of Frankenstein, Dr. Frankenstein was a notorious womanizer. I’ll even go one step further by suggesting that he is also mimicking Dr. Frank N. Further from Rocky Horror Picture Show. Explains his being a lech to the T! Let’s not forget that Kitsis, Horowitz and Lindenhof are all HUGE Frankenstein fans and are aware of this cult classic movie.
Gypsy has already explained the connection with the line, “I’m one he!! of a doctor, huh?” That, by the way, came from episode 1×06 The Shepperd. It’s when Dr. Whale and MM went out on a date.
The single carnation was also explained as Boris Karloff, who played the Monster many times, stared in a 1950’s series called The Climax. He did two episodes, one of which was called The White Carnation. In Rocky Horror Picture Show, Brad Majors is known for wearing his single white carnation boutineer. Fan goers ALWAYS ensure that they are wearing this when dressing up as Brad Majors for the inter-active shows. The “single carnation” is a MUST.
Glad you liked my & Gypsy’s Frankenstein theory and many thanks for acknowledging your support of it. Here is the link to it in case anyone else would like to read it: https://oncepodcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1613
Equally glad you liked my Bae is Peter Pan & Henry’s Father theory, as I’ve seen how much it has helped you in delevoping Neal Cassady’s personality & character. Again, here’s the link to the original theory in case anyone wishes to read it. https://oncepodcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1462
I’m wondering if they’ll ever get to the…………..! Now that would make for an interesting read!
Cheers!
Keeper of Pandora's Box & The Yellow Brick Road.
I’ve done a lot of ‘research’ on the Frankie theory…lead me down many ‘rabbit holes’ and I didn’t come across Jack The Ripper connections. Not in the Archie’s Notes clues, not in the Grateful Dead lyrics, etc……..K&H and Lindelof are Dead Heads, and cult classic/classic horror movie buffs……they are not big fans of real live psychotic murderers. Seeing the Frankie theory come to life will be a great reward…the speculation is over…he’s Dr Frankenstein and Daniel is the Monster….Go Team Frankie!
@fairy dust wrote:
Actually I was a Frankenstein believer before I ever knew about this forum or your theory…but you guys did a good job on your post. I am going 110% with Jack the Ripper…this is Dr. Frankenstein altar ego…Dr. Frankenstein takes dismembered body parts and creates life…”John Doe Ripper” dismembers bodies to end life. I am going on record though and saying I am not a fan of this inclusion….whoever committed those murders was horribly brutal. I remember a statement that David Andres made…I will not repeat it but it was particularly distasteful in my opinion…his statement had the word hound in it. The phrase he used is slang for a particular action on a woman’s private area that causes ripnping and tearing. “Jack…John Doe Ripper was particularly brutal and mutilation of this area of a woman’s body. The phrase is a perfect fit. I have no doubt about his being the Ripper …and I for one.am a disappointed Oncer. Probably one of the best indications that he is the Ripper was the preview…they showed to much of the story. When they do that you can be certain that there is another unexpected twist. Actually the entire “who is Dr. Whale” tease is a nod to the Ripper….as that is what everyone was saying when he was killing…”who is this man…”
I’m aware of David Anders’ tweet and let’s face it, that’s just how Anders talks, in private tweets & in interviews about his movies. However, it all relates to Dr. Frank N. Furter, the notorious lech from Rocky Horror Picture Show. Same goes with the unidentified blond/blonde patient in the hospital, that we read about in Archie’s diary. First the patient is shown as blond, indicating a male then it’s changed to a blonde indicating a female. Another nod to Rocky Horror Picture Show as the monster there, named Rocky, was a transvestite. ***just edited this to add that Rocky was also very blond.*** So it just further substantiates that the Anders tweet was all about him being a lecherous womanizer like Frank N. Furter who was a womanizing hound.
Again, that tweet was meant as a clue to identify him as someone who was sexually active & fond of sexual encounters and yes, a woman’s private area. How you could interpret it to mean something so awful like ripping, tearing & mutilation, is beyond my realm of understanding. Way too dark for my personal liking and I’m sure way too dark for Kitsis & Horowitz’ as well.
Keeper of Pandora's Box & The Yellow Brick Road.
Aaaaannnnnd now I’m imagining David Anders all dolled up like Frank N Furter, belting out Sweet Transvestite. 😆
@Phee wrote:
Aaaaannnnnd now I’m imagining David Anders all dolled up like Frank N Furter, belting out Sweet Transvestite. 😆
Phee, great minds think alike! LOL! I tweeted Anders & Horowitz this morning asking if we’ll hear Dr. Whale singing that next Sunday!
Keeper of Pandora's Box & The Yellow Brick Road.
Fairy Dust made a compelling case for Dr Frankenstein & Jack the Ripper and I was pretty much sold on it. But then TheGoldenKey made an equally compelling case for Dr Frankenstein and Dr. Frank-N-Furter. Both theories are convincing.
I have to say, though, that I am seriously leaning towards Dr Frankenstein and Dr. Frank-N-Furter. I can’t wait to see everyone do the “Time Warp”.
😆Don't grow up. It's a trap.
@sacrlc wrote:
Fairy Dust made a compelling case for Dr Frankenstein & Jack the Ripper and I was pretty much sold on it. But then TheGoldenKey made an equally compelling case for Dr Frankenstein and Dr. Frank-N-Furter. Both theories are convincing.
I have to say, though, that I am seriously leaning towards Dr Frankenstein and Dr. Frank-N-Furter. I can’t wait to see everyone do the “Time Warp”.
😆I think the Frank N. Furter was a clue about Dr. Whale’s promiscuity also leading to his identify being that of Dr. Frankenstein, though I’m not sure that he’ll be Frank. N. Furter. Maybe his world will be Transylvania though.
Keeper of Pandora's Box & The Yellow Brick Road.
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