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the end of season 2 really bothered me. they worked for 2 seasons straight telling us that Rumpel turned worlds over to find his child, right? meanwhile, we got to know Rumpel pretty well (or so we thought) until the scene where he almost kills Henry. this was extremely out of character of him to do. I could see him killing a lot of people, but his child’s son? totally OOC and made no sense and really REALLY bothered me. for someone who’s family is so important it was just shabby writing in my opinion, and I didn’t start watching season 3 until it was already airing episode 8 or so.
the main reason episode 22 bothered me so much is because Rumpel had a swing from killing Henry to sacrificing his life for the same kid. REALLY? what happened, he suddenly became Regina?? this is the stuff SHE is good at. every time she has a tantrum, she kills a whole town, but one look at Henry and she is willing to die so that same town is saved and Henry is not alone. THIS IS WHY I LOVE REGINA this is NOT why I love Rumpel. he is NOT like that at all. he is a lot more thorough, and deliberate. he never does anything on a whim. he would never walk over to his grandson and try to kill him just because his cursed girlfriend said to. this is the stuff Regina does, not him.
he even said to Regina once that murder here was worse than in the enchanted forest (which is why he didn’t kill Katherine)
OK so Here is my theory: He saw in the prophecy that Henry will be Pan or will be just like Pan or Henry will be evil and somehow a danger to the family.
this is why I think so:
on the airplane and in the airport he looked so terrified, that a viewer can assume that he was fully expecting to die after he found his son. meaning that he wasn’t planning on killing Henry at all. (besides, he was always so nice to Henry, and the way they interacted it looked like he genuinely liked the kid and Rumpel’s way is not to chat up the people he’s about to kill) suddenly, when he finds out that Henry is his own grandson – his attitude towards Henry changed completely. he was colder to Henry, I mean REALLY COLD to henry and he blamed him when he was hit with Hook’s hook. then he goes home, gets cured and has nightmares about killing Henry.
but wait
look at the nightmares… Henry chooses a WAND for his birthday present. and we all know what Rumpel thinks about wands – that they’re evil. does it mean that Rumpel saw in a vision that Henry will be an evil pan? and only once he found out that Henry was actually his own blood, which makes him Pan’s blood as well that he believed the prophecy to be true?after Henry comes out of the box in pan’s body, Gold tells him “I’m sorry I doubted you Henry” does this mean that he finally realized what that prophecy meant? HENRY won’t be the evil pan, but PAN HIMSELF will be evil, just inside Henry’s body. maybe when he saw Henry growing up in SB he couldn’t believe the prophecy because he saw how good natured Henry was, but when he found out he’s family, he realized that it IS possible and he doubted Henry’s good nature?
another thing that was very annoying to me was Nasty Habits. he tells Vision Belle that he has nothing to live for. Really? Belle is not motivation enough to stay alive? I think Belle would be better motivation to stay alive. after all, parents have to let go of their children, but Belle would be his forever! so maybe “nothing to live for” has another meaning. maybe he needed to live so that he could protect Bae from evil people like Pan and maybe also Henry. now that Bae is dead anyway, Henry might as well live since he is the son of Emma who is powerful because of GOOD magic so there is a chance that Henry will not become Pan, but Pan is already definitely evil, so it’s worth dying and killing Pan so that Henry would have a chance to decide if he’ll become good or evil when he’s grown up.
so my crack theory is basically that Henry was supposed to be EVIL!PAN according to a vision Rumpel had, but as visions or prophecies go, it wasn’t clear so this is why he was conflicted about killing him now and nipping the evil in the bud or waiting to see what he will become
except waiting to see was not really an option, since his own death was near. this would explain his conflicts. (it’s like if someone went back in time and had the ability to kill Hitler when he was a kid, would he do it?)
but then he saw that Panry was the evil one it calmed him down and he realized that Henry will not become evil so he stopped worrying.
[adrotate group="5"]the end of season 3 really bothered me. they worked for 2 seasons straight telling us that Rumpel turned worlds over to find his child, right? meanwhile, we got to know Rumpel pretty well (or so we thought) until the scene where he almost kills Henry. this was extremely out of character of him to do. I could see him killing a lot of people, but his child’s son? totally OOC and made no sense and really REALLY bothered me. for someone who’s family is so important it was just shabby writing in my opinion, and I didn’t start watching season 3 until it was already airing episode 8 or so.
To quote Vision!Belle in 304 (who is really Rumple’s inner self): he has a “nasty habit of self preservation”
It’s not wholly OOC. Rumple protects himself and his power first. That has always been his greatest mistake. The power became so important that he even let go of his son in order to keep it. Killing Henry is just another way of keeping his power.
OK so Here is my theory: He saw in the prophecy that Henry will be Pan or will be just like Pan or Henry will be evil and somehow a danger to the family.
I see what you’re saying but I think we need to remember that Adam and Eddy didn’t even know that PP was going to Rumple’s father until the S3 “camp” they have toward the end of S2. So when they wrote Manhattan they didn’t have the PP/Rumple connection planned–hence why there is a deleted scene of Rumple’s father leaving him in the middle of the night. Rumple can’t forsee what A and E haven’t developed.
on the airplane and in the airport he looked so terrified,
He has been living in a cursed town for 28 years, never once out in the real world.
The security system scared him too. Everything scared him. He was overwhelmed by a sense of Otherness. Hence beating up a bathroom stall.
another thing that was very annoying to me was Nasty Habits. he tells Vision Belle that he has nothing to live for. Really? Belle is not motivation enough to stay alive?
I think you need to remember that Rumple has never once believed that Belle would choose to stay with him. No one stay with Rumple because in his head he is wholly unloved. He thinks, deep down, that someday Belle will leave.
so my crack theory is basically that Henry was supposed to be EVIL!PAN according to a vision Rumpel had, but as visions or prophecies go, it wasn’t clear so this is why he was conflicted about killing him now and nipping the evil in the bud or waiting to see what he will become
Again, the biggest problem is that a lot of his was planned out after S2 ended and the writers were gearing up to write 301-311. It’s overly easy to say “Rumple saw everything” but that’s not true because A and E didn’t know everything that we eventually say.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"no, he beat up the bathroom stall because he wanted to see if he can cure his wound with magic, which he couldn’t. hey, maybe the future showed him that he would be without magic, utterly powerless, before he dies?
sometimes the writers don’t know the story because the story unfolds by itself. in other words, a good story tells itself. so even tough the writers didn’t see the future, Rumpel could see the future anyway only not in neverland cause time stands stll, and not in the land without magic, which is why he didn’t know about emma and neal
no, he beat up the bathroom stall because he wanted to see if he can cure his wound with magi, which he couldn’t. hey, maybe the future showed him that he woul be without magic, utterly powerless before he dies?
I disagree. Rumple was highly agitated. He was nervous and scared and on edge–pacing back and forth, as he naturally would be. He was taking his frustration and rage out on the stall (which he does for several mins, not just a few seconds if all he wanted to do was test his magic)
sometimes the writers don’t know the story because the story unfolds by itself. in other words, a good story tells itself.
Well yes a good story tells itself, but the idea for Rumple/PP connection was pitched after 222 and well after 214 (Manhattan). It was something they came up with before S3. So it wasn’t something they were were putting into S2 like a trail of bread crumbs.
In other words, even if Rumple saw what your suggesting, the writers didn’t And if they claim Rumple did see this, then it’s them saying it light on S3A. But you can’t take S2 and find evidence for it.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"no, he beat up the bathroom stall because he wanted to see if he can cure his wound with magi, which he couldn’t. hey, maybe the future showed him that he woul be without magic, utterly powerless before he dies?
I disagree. Rumple was highly agitated. He was nervous and scared and on edge–pacing back and forth, as he naturally would be. He was taking his frustration and rage out on the stall (which he does for several mins, not just a few seconds if all he wanted to do was test his magic)
I agree RG. When Rumple is out of his comfort zone, he tends to lash out. When he was punching the stall, he was doing it out of frustration and a general fear of not being in control. Rumple tried to fix his injury with magic, and was then reminded that he had no magic. He was terrified because he didn’t have his magic to use as a crutch.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of Felixthe main reason episode 22 bothered me so much is because Rumpel had a swing from killing Henry to sacrificing his life for the same kid. REALLY? what happened, he suddenly became Regina?? this is the stuff SHE is good at. every time she has a tantrum, she kills a whole town, but one look at Henry and she is willing to die so that same town is saved and Henry is not alone. THIS IS WHY I LOVE REGINA this is NOT why I love Rumpel. he is NOT like that at all. he is a lot more thorough, and deliberate. he never does anything on a whim. he would never walk over to his grandson and try to kill him just because his cursed girlfriend said to. this is the stuff Regina does, not him.
Rumple was very conflicted over whether or not to kill Henry the moment he knew Henry was the boy from the prophesy. If Rumple truly wanted Henry dead, Henry would’ve been dead. When Rumple feels conflicted about something, he often looks to Belle for the right thing to do. Unfortunately for him, Belle was Lacey at this time. Interestingly, Rumple didn’t tell Lacey Henry was going to be his undoing, so Lacey told him what would seem like the most logical solution without having all the facts.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of Felixabout this main theory: sure why not? Rumple could have seen Henry be pan and hte body switch and been acting consciously to thwart that. It does not matter that was not what was written but Henry being Pan was definitely a big part of his undoing. i can accept it for the crack theory that it is because in a world where the character sees the jigsaw of the future he can see things that have not been written for the audience to view. In fact, Adam and Eddie regularly travel to Storybrooke to get the next pieces of the puzzle from Rumplestiltskin.
On my own need: Now that we know Rumple has the power of prophesy (and yes I have been saying this since Manhattan) we need to see an episode wherein we see a vision with a bunch of jumbled pieces of the future puzzle, (maybe like a whole 1 minute scene with flashes from the future) and then see Rumplestiltskin piecing it together for the next part of that season. i think it would be interesting to see the world through a seers eyes.
For instance: in this vision, Rumple sees Emma with Hook in an embrace. Rumple being a Swan Fire shipper, works in the next scene to make his former vision impossible. (lol i am sure if the show did something like what i was suggesting they would not use that example)
Magic always comes with a price, so I pay with visa.
Maybe now that Emma raised him, Henry WILL be some sort of a problem child. Maybe because Emma is such a softie, she allowed him too much independence or something… Who knows.
maybe he is really misbehaving driving that car and putting charming’s life in danger
Once dude, I dont think rumpel is a shipper at all. U.less you count that Graham/Swan shipping episode
But yeah itd be cool to see some of his visions, like the future is a puzzle and all thatBut,POM, he already KNEW that Henry was the boy in the prophacy when he was babysitting him. As emma was chasing Neal, he told him what a remarkable boy he was and etc. He knew. But he was still nice to him and warm. But the second he found out Henry was his grandson, he was so mean to him.
And RG, I realize that the writers didnt think of daddy pan yet, but it was obvious from before that Rumpels father was not a good person, and Gold WAS the dark one, so either way, being his grandson was a genetic set back. Suddenly he isnt only Emma_the_great_product_of_love child, now he has darkness tooNo. the fear they made us feel while he was on the plane was not just a fear of no magic or a place that is “not his comfort zone”. no, this look, and music and the tangible fear that was displayed was fear of death.
Gold has been without magic for 28 years, and if you want to argue that he didn’t remember, well when he first heard Emma’s name, he DID remember, and did not look scared in the least bit. and THERE he was at a disadvantage, because Regina had SOME magic in her vault so he was with even less power…. OTOH, in Manhattan, he was JUST LIKE EVERYBODY ELSE. he had no magic, big deal…
the prophecy said he will find his son, and then he will die.
That’s why he was so scared. he never planned on killing Henry to avoid death, or he wouldn’t talk so nicely to him. It was RIGHT AFTER HE FOUND OUT he’s pan’s great grandson that he started having nightmares about killing henry, and acted so cold to him, and etc
the prophecy also said that the boy will be more than he seems. if he delved deeper into that puzzle while having the future-telling sight he might have seen a sign that this boy will be “another Peter Pan” or something like that.
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