Home › Forums › Once Upon a Time › Character discussion › Emma + Baelfire = Swanfire
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July 25, 2014 at 6:15 pm #278446SlurpeezParticipant
I don’t blame Rumple for drinking the potion since he has to in order to maintain the timeline and make everything happen as it should
I don’t blame Rumple; I blame the writers for making him so quick to do something so out of character, as surely as I blame the writers for making Neal do something so stupid as to dismiss the consequences of dark magic (which is something Baelfire knew better than anyone on the show).
As for maintaing the timeline, as I wrote above, there were ways Rumple and Emma could’ve carefully changed just some of recent history without disrupting earlier events. Emma grew up in our world and would’ve seen “Back to the Future” so she could’ve grasped there was a way of saving Neal the way Marty saved the Doc. All she had to do was write a letter, being sure to include all the details about Neverland, Rumple’s sacrifice, the Wicked Witch and Neal leaving it well alone, and then sealed it, telling Rumple not to read it. Rumple, knowing he’d be reunited with his son, yet knowing also that it would result in his son’s death, would’ve passed along the letter. Emma could’ve told Rumple not to open the letter but just to give it to Neal after they were reunited. Emma could’ve written on the envelop “to be opened on such and such a date.” That way, Rumple wouldn’t have known the details but still would’ve known enough to prevent his boy’s untimely death.
If Emma had gone back in time and stopped Neal meeting Tamara then Neverland and those events forward wouldn’t have happened.
And that would be bad why? Yes, history would’ve been changed, but it would’ve been changed for the better. If Tamara had never entered the picture, then Henry wouldn’t have been kidnapped, and we’d have been spared the entire journey into the Heart of Darkness that was Neverland, Peter Pan, and the like. Neal would still be alive, and Emma and Henry would’ve found him, brought him to SB, where he’d still be living and perhaps even reconciling with his dad, Emma and his son.
We miss you. So strange having a summer without you and Phee around. Especially with tomorrow being comic-con
I miss you all, too, but oddly, I don’t really miss the show all that much. I’m not invested in its future either. But I wish you all the best!
[adrotate group="5"]"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
July 25, 2014 at 8:01 pm #278456RumplesGirlKeymasterI miss you all, too, but oddly, I don’t really miss the show all that much. I’m not invested in its future either. But I wish you all the best!
Totally understandable! Just stop by every now and then to say hi. 🙂
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"July 25, 2014 at 8:17 pm #278459Ranisha PittsParticipantTo be perfectly honest and not to try all deep with it. Rumple Drink the potion and the Emma didn’t try to save Neal because the writers wanted the viewers to see why Neal can’t be brought back. They wanted to kill the hope of the viewer who thought they are going to bring Neal back with the bttf stuff. And all that Don’t let his sacrifice be in vain mumbo jumbo. Its not that deep. Its nothing more then the writers explaining why Neal ain’t coming back but its okay look at the shiny stuff Rumbelle wedding, CS kiss, Snowing baby named Prince Neal, oh and look at this juicy stuff A NEW OUTLAW QUEEN TRIANGLE, and the best, the best of all FROZEN. Arn’t we just super highschool pep rally cool.
I would love to see those who love Neal remember him. I fully believe part of Rumple’s arch is to come to terms with his son death and then move towards the Future with Belle. And I think he will be connected the most with Neal. Henry may mention his father and might be tied with Rumple at least one episode as part of the whole Rumple moving forward with Belle and distantly looking after Henry in the background sort of way.
Emma is through living in the past a conclusion she came to two days after the funeral. So if she is shown connected to Neal, its either going to reinforce the whole he died a hero/sacrifice line or to show how bad Neal was compared to the totally super terrific awesome perfect groovy irresistible Hook.
And I think that what upset some of us Neal fans the most, that they may only mention Neal to sully his name or solidify that he is dead because dead is dead while at the same time they are bringing someone else back from the dead.
I don’t mind genuine heartfelt tangible written scenes of characters remembering him but the fear amongst some of us is that’s not what we are going to get. We are going to get the former stuff mentioned above. So some rather Neal be forgotten then to have them spit on his grave.
"I will be kind but I will speak my mind."
July 25, 2014 at 9:21 pm #278463TheWatcherParticipantTo be perfectly honest and not to try all deep with it. Rumple Drink the potion and the Emma didn’t try to save Neal because the writers wanted the viewers to see why Neal can’t be brought back. They wanted to kill the hope of the viewer who thought they are going to bring Neal back with the bttf stuff. And all that Don’t let his sacrifice be in vain mumbo jumbo. Its not that deep. Its nothing more then the writers explaining why Neal ain’t coming back but its okay look at the shiny stuff Rumbelle wedding, CS kiss, Snowing baby named Prince Neal, oh and look at this juicy stuff A NEW OUTLAW QUEEN TRIANGLE, and the best, the best of all FROZEN. Arn’t we just super highschool pep rally cool. I would love to see those who love Neal remember him. I fully believe part of Rumple’s arch is to come to terms with his son death and then move towards the Future with Belle. And I think he will be connected the most with Neal. Henry may mention his father and might be tied with Rumple at least one episode as part of the whole Rumple moving forward with Belle and distantly looking after Henry in the background sort of way. Emma is through living in the past a conclusion she came to two days after the funeral. So if she is shown connected to Neal, its either going to reinforce the whole he died a hero/sacrifice line or to show how bad Neal was compared to the totally super terrific awesome perfect groovy irresistible Hook. And I think that what upset some of us Neal fans the most, that they may only mention Neal to sully his name or solidify that he is dead because dead is dead while at the same time they are bringing someone else back from the dead. I don’t mind genuine heartfelt tangible written scenes of characters remembering him but the fear amongst some of us is that’s not what we are going to get. We are going to get the former stuff mentioned above. So some rather Neal be forgotten then to have them spit on his grave.
*sigh* All of this :/ to be honest, the only people who would even care are Henry and Rumpel. Like Ranisha said, Emma is done with that past and when it comes down to Henry, that could be 50/50. For all we know, the writers may choose to completely have Henry ready to accept his fathers passing and welcome Hook with open arms like Bae was just…a non-factor….. *sigh*
"I could have the giant duck as my steed!" --Daniel Radcliffe
Keeper Of Tamara's Taser , Jafar's Staff, Kitsis’s Glasses , Ariel’s Tail, Dopey's Hat , Peter Pan’s Shadow, Outfit, & Pied Cloak,Red Queen's Castle, White Rabbit's Power To World Hop, Zelena's BroomStick, & ALL MAGICJuly 25, 2014 at 9:32 pm #278464RumplesGirlKeymaster*sigh* All of this :/ to be honest, the only people who would even care are Henry and Rumpel. Like Ranisha said, Emma is done with that past so and when it comes down to Henry, that could be 50/50. For all we know, the writers may choose to completely have Henry read to accept his fathers passing and welcome Hook with open arms like Bae was just…a non-factor….. *sigh*
The fact that all they had was Henry putting a rose on a tombstone without really talking about any of his feelings speaks VOLUMES about what they are going to do with Henry this season in regards to Neal’s death.
As someone who lost their father, I find it beyond offensive that they are denying this child a chance to properly grieve and mourn. Instead it will be PLOT! MAGIC! MYTH! LOOK OVER HERE!
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"July 26, 2014 at 3:26 am #278515OnyxParticipantAnd I think that what upset some of us Neal fans the most, that they may only mention Neal to sully his name or solidify that he is dead because dead is dead while at the same time they are bringing someone else back from the dead.
Ugh if they even dare to bring back anyone, ANYONE, from the dead NOW. I’m gonna throw a fit and then tear someone a new one. The only way their so-called newfound rule of dead is dead might hold any water in the future, is if they keep the next person who dies, actually dead. Or rather, don’t have anymore fake deaths (because the next death will most likely be Maid Marian and the audience isn’t invested in her enough to really be bothered if she was gone). So don’t have any more characters fake die please. I found it incredibly astounding that not even 2 seconds after Neal died, Charming died and then was brought BACK. Really?? Dead is dead was it?
As someone who lost their father, I find it beyond offensive that they are denying this child a chance to properly grieve and mourn. Instead it will be PLOT! MAGIC! MYTH! LOOK OVER HERE!
And this! The first year after losing someone is the hardest to get through. All the firsts happen in that year. You have to do all sorts of things without them for the first time in your life. It’s tough and draining and that’s where the show’s failed to portray the loss of Neal in a realistic way. Emma, Henry and Rumple’s reactions were infinitely more believable the first time Neal “died”. But then they brought him back and all that grief was anulled. What we got the second time was: yeah yeah been there done that, on to defeating the big bad.
Co-Mayor of Sad Town | Twin of Co-Mayor of Sad Town
July 26, 2014 at 8:53 am #278526RainbowParticipantHappy Saturday
This is my motto for today
"I offended you with my opinion? Ha, you should hear the ones I keep to myself".
July 26, 2014 at 9:13 am #278530RumplesGirlKeymasterLOL Good motto Rainbow.
Happy Saturday everyone.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"July 26, 2014 at 9:15 am #278532PriceofMagicParticipantI don’t blame Rumple for drinking the potion since he has to in order to maintain the timeline and make everything happen as it should.
Rumple does not HAVE to do anything. I agree with Slurpeez. Drinking the potion was one of the most OOC moments I have ever seen on this show.
I disagree. The events in the past had to be preserved otherwise the whole future could’ve been changed for the worse. The events needed to stay the same so that Emma would break the curse hence why the ring was so important.
Genuine question here: Since Neal is dead and doesn’t look to be coming back anytime soon (But you never know with this show), would you prefer to have a scene that shows Neal is remembered by the other characters or would you prefer Neal to never be mentioned again?
I want him remembered by people who actually care about him (which is nobody anymore) and did not dishonor him in one of the horrifying ways I’ve seen. Rumple and Neal’s reunion and forgiveness was for NOTHING after what Rumple did. Rumple doesn’t get to murder Zelena, marry Belle, and think everything is a-ok.
And I’m having a really hard time understanding why you’re coming in here, a CSer, to try and change our minds about how we feel about Neal’s death and actions that are taken on this show moving forward. You think he was always going to die. You think that the writers deserve some modicum of sympathy because “oh poor writers, they can’t win!”. Fine. You’re entitled to your opinion.
What I’m struggling with here is that you see Rainbow and I upset over soemething in our own shipping thread and feel the need to try and step in and make it out like we’re over reacting or that we don’t have the right to feel this way.
At any point have I said that you’re over reacting or that you don’t have the right to feel the way you do? No.
I was asking a genuine question, there’s no harm in that. I’m not trying to change your mind on how you feel about Neal’s death. You’re entitled to your opinion and that’s fine but don’t presume to tell me what I am doing and state it as fact when it’s only your opinion of what I’m doing. I was asking a genuine question. The writers have written themselves into a corner over Neal’s death so I was genuinely interested in whether Neal fans would prefer to have Neal remembered even though it may come across as “sticking the knife in” to some or would they prefer Neal to not be remembered at all.
Why even bring up the label “a CSer” when Hook hadn’t even entered the conversation at all? It feels like you are trying to mark me as the proverbial enemy just because I have a differing opinion to you. Or am I not allowed to set foot in this thread now at all just because I’m okay with CS? Maybe you should put a sign on the thread saying “NO CSers ALLOWED!” because how dare I, a CSer, come in to this thread and ask a genuine question, completely unrelated to Hook, based on a fact (Neal’s death) about whether or not you’d want a scene of Neal being remembered by other characters.
If Emma had gone back in time and stopped Neal meeting Tamara then Neverland and those events forward wouldn’t have happened.
And that would be bad why? Yes, history would’ve been changed, but it would’ve been changed for the better. If Tamara had never entered the picture, then Henry wouldn’t have been kidnapped, and we’d have been spared the entire journey into the Heart of Darkness that was Neverland, Peter Pan, and the like. Neal would still be alive, and Emma and Henry would’ve found him, brought him to SB, where he’d still be living and perhaps even reconciling with his dad, Emma and his son.
That’s exactly what I’m saying so I think you may have misinterpreted the original context. The pre-curse events were too important to change, hence why Rumple had to drink the potion, however if Emma had stopped Neal meeting Tamara, then all the important events would’ve still happened (The curse, Henry bringing Emma to Storybrooke, Emma breaking the curse, etc) but Neverland never would’ve happened meaning Neal would never have been shot and sent down the portal, Rolandgate wouldn’t have happened, Pan would never have got to Storybrooke, etc. Neal would’ve still ended up in Storybrooke and he would’ve been alive.
My original statement “If Emma had gone back in time and stopped Neal meeting Tamara then Neverland and those events forward wouldn’t have happened.” was meant in a that would’ve been a good thing kind of way and basically wouldn’t have almost screwed with anyone’s existence. Emma and Henry would have both been born by that point in time, Neal and Tamara didn’t have a kid so nobody would be erased from existence. Emma stopping Neal and Tamara meeting would have had a positive outcome and would be far less risky than Emma travelling back in time to when her parents first met.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixJuly 26, 2014 at 9:19 am #278533PriceofMagicParticipant@Rainbow, Doctor Who’s coming back in August, how soon does it air in America after the British airing?
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of Felix -
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