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*sigh* I hear you. What I guess I’m feeling grumpy about is the way Zelena’s presence is so obviously for PLOT and for cheap thrills, that it fails to help develop the other characters beyond already preexisting dramas. It almost feels like recycled script, except on the same show, in other words, the TV equivalent of being given a piece of pre-chewed petrified gum, on the pretext that, clearly, you appeared to enjoy it the first time around.
It’s also “tweetable”
Gosh, let me quote myself…
This whole episode–and this whole show now–are designed for one thing: the shock value. They don’t care about heart and emotion and treating their characters like human beings; they care about buzzworthy moments that you can tweet about with clever hashtags.
It doesn’t matter if you’ve “heard it all before.” You’ll still talk about it and that’s what the money-hungry people care about. *le sigh*
[adrotate group="5"]"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"Zelarian was planned before Season 4, a week after Zelena’s death according to Adam. So…it had always been planned for Marian to end up being Zelena because Adam and Eddy love the character and Rebecca Mader.
Ok. That’s some impressively advanced planning. So why so many plot holes?
Because Regina is A and E’s favorite. It’s literally just that.
*sigh* I hear you. What I guess I’m feeling grumpy about is the way Zelena’s presence is so obviously for PLOT and for cheap thrills, that it fails to help develop the other characters beyond already preexisting dramas.
Well…the sister dynamic between the Evil Queen and the Wicked Witch of the West…c’mon…that’s too much gold to pass up. Just as everyone has blood relatives living…at last Regina can have her own, though she’s going to have to kick her witch (beep) first, but after that and a few more fights…I’m sure we’re going to see these two work at trying to build the sisterly bond they were denied…
(Still believes that WickedSisters should have been happening around the FrozenSisters time period, but oh well….the things Elsa and Anna could have taught Regina and Zelena.)
And speaking of Elsa….the crack ship FrozenFire was SO CLOSE!!!!!
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
at last Regina can have her own
And that’s all that matters right? That REGINA get her family. never mind the fact that three seasons ago, HENRY was enough for her. Her CHILD. the child that healed the hole in her heart. Oh no. Let’s give her her sister and her son and her love and her lovers son!
But GOD FORBID that Henry get his FATHER.
They KILLED NEAL OKAY.
It’s not all about Regina. This is not the Regina show.
Let’s bring back a woman who tried to kill a baby and gave zero craps about anyone. But not the kindest man on the entire show?!
Sure. MORALS.
I get it. You’re favorite is Regina and all good things must happen to her. But that doesn’t make it a good story. The amount of mind twisting, problematic plot that came out this week was incredibly un-well executed. I don’t care how in advance it was. Do you *honestly* think Zelena is staying? Or that her appearance on this show will be in any way satisfactory? No. It’s just SHINY PLOT to get everyone to buzz and talk.
And speaking of Elsa….the crack ship FrozenFire was SO CLOSE!!!!!
No. It wasn’t. I don’t ship Neal with any random female. I would have hated Frozen FIre becuase it would be just stupid putting him with someone just for the sake of putting him with someone. It also would have been underdevloped, poorly written and poorly conceived. It would have just been shiny shiny shiny relationship drama and that’s all this show cares about/. Can we stop proposing alternate Neal ships in the SWANFIRE thread?
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"#HappeningLive
Ranisha is making us all cry
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"But GOD FORBID that Henry get his FATHER. They KILLED NEAL OKAY.Let’s bring back a woman who tried to kill a baby and gave zero craps about anyone. But not the kindest man on the entire show?! Sure. MORALS.
THAT! ALL OF THAT!
I can’t stand Zelena for killing Neal (or more accurately, I hate that the writers killed off Neal in the stupidest possible way). Even Regina said her sister killed Neal. Maybe Zelena didn’t literally force Neal’s hand, but she did set him up and prey upon his desperate soul. Neal was desperate to get back to Henry, because he didn’t want his son to grow up fatherless the way he did. Was Neal’s death the worst written ever on the show? Yes –even Cora got a much better send-off than Neal, and she Cora got to say goodbye to her daughter. But Neal? No, he didn’t even get to say goodbye to his son. I hold Zelena responsible for premeditating the plot to kill Neal. And so does Regina hold her sister responsible for killing the father of her child; she even said as much.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
I hold Zelena responsible for premeditating the plot to kill Neal. And so does Regina hold her sister responsible for killing the father of her child; she even said as much.
Zelena holds herself responsible. That’s all I need. She gleefully gloats over killing Neal. I don’t care what tortured or tired metaphor people come up wit about guns and handing them off. Zelena openly admits, over and over, that she killed Neal and was happy to do it and would do it again.
That’s all I need to know.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"at last Regina can have her own
And that’s all that matters right? That REGINA get her family. never mind the fact that three seasons ago, HENRY was enough for her. Her CHILD. the child that healed the hole in her heart. Oh no. Let’s give her her sister and her son and her love and her lovers son! But GOD FORBID that Henry get his FATHER. They KILLED NEAL OKAY. It’s not all about Regina. This is not the Regina show. Let’s bring back a woman who tried to kill a baby and gave zero craps about anyone. But not the kindest man on the entire show?! Sure. MORALS. I get it. You’re favorite is Regina and all good things must happen to her. But that doesn’t make it a good story. The amount of mind twisting, problematic plot that came out this week was incredibly un-well executed. I don’t care how in advance it was. Do you *honestly* think Zelena is staying? Or that her appearance on this show will be in any way satisfactory? No. It’s just SHINY PLOT to get everyone to buzz and talk.
And speaking of Elsa….the crack ship FrozenFire was SO CLOSE!!!!!
No. It wasn’t. I don’t ship Neal with any random female. I would have hated Frozen FIre becuase it would be just stupid putting him with someone just for the sake of putting him with someone. It also would have been underdevloped, poorly written and poorly conceived. It would have just been shiny shiny shiny relationship drama and that’s all this show cares about/. Can we stop proposing alternate Neal ships in the SWANFIRE thread?
Woah….woah…woah….sorry darling! Didn’t mean to strike a nerve or ruffle anyone’s feathers.
First of all, please do not bring up the old Henry was enough for Regina because he was all about EMMA, and even manipulated Regina’s emotions to save EMMA! Regina had to fight like hell, get turned on by the heroes, backtrack on her redemption, get back on track, save the day multiple times, and even more just to gain her son’s attention, let alone his love.
As for them killing Neal, look, if it was Michael Raymond James decision to leave, I’ll respect that, but if it’s Adam and Eddy doing just to make CaptainSwan happen like we all suspect, then yes I agree with you completely. But I’m trying to not really rile myself up about it if it was MRJ’s decision, which I wonder now would be a good time to tweet him and ask him whether he left or if he was really fired.
As for whether or not this is the Regina show…well…Evil Regals do make up nearly majority of viewings so…never mind, we’re getting off topic.
The reason Adam and Eddy could bring back Zelena was because Rebecca Mader is available…Michael Raymond James as of this moment isn’t, though even if he was, I don’t really know if he’d come back given how many SwanQueeners & CaptainSwans were treating him….Sean has it bad, but Michael had it double bad from this fandom.
Yes my favorite is Regina Mills, and yes all good things must come to her because apparently it was the sacrifice of her not getting her happy ending that led to EVERYONE ELSE’S getting theirs.
And to be honest…not everyone hated this episode, though it could have been written better, and probably should have taken back before Robin met Marian when he was a thief with no honor. Don’t get me wrong, there were many many who didn’t like it, mostly SwanQueens and nearly everyone in the forums included, but there were also a lot of people who did like it.
As for Zelena staying…well, no sense in going through all that trouble in bringing her back, not to mention Adam and Eddy like both Zelena and Rebecca Mader. Chances of her staying, I’d say half and half…and the reason it won’t be satisfactory to people is because so many hate her for what occurred in 3×15, and probably also because her backstory wasn’t as good as we all thought it originally would be.
Zelena comes across to many, even myself, as a whiny brat who wants it all, but will have to realize that everything she didn’t get may have been the best thing for her. Is she wicked and done much much wrong? Heck yeah! Is she irredeemable? Heck no!
Sorry about the #FrozenFire talk too, I blame @PriceofMagic for getting me attached to that crackship! 🙂 Lol
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
As for whether or not this is the Regina show…well…Evil Regals do make up nearly majority of viewings so…never mind, we’re getting off topic.
As the forum’s resident ratings expert…this is straight up wrong. Ratings are not broken down into fandoms. Come on! you know that. You’re projecting your feelings of what you want to be true. Ratings are numbers. They do not show subjective feelings on characters or ship. But I will say this…the lowest rated episode ever before 417? A Mills family family episode (Bleeding Through). The lowest episode to date now? A Mills family/OQ episode (Heart of Gold). So no. There is literally no way for any fandom to claim they are in the majority of viewership. You’re talking about being vocal. ER’s are *vocal* But guess who is more vocal? SQers. Do SQers now make a majority of the viewership? Is that your argument?
No one knows who is the majority of the viewership.
The reason Adam and Eddy could bring back Zelena was because Rebecca Mader is available
Obviously. But it’s not like Bex called and said “hey! I’m available!” The writers come up with the story first. They should have come up with a better one.
Yes my favorite is Regina Mills, and yes all good things must come to her because apparently it was the sacrifice of her not getting her happy ending that led to EVERYONE ELSE’S getting theirs.
Because that’s EXACTLY what she was thinking in 101 when she cast the dark curse! “I’m doing it all for you guys! You’ll thank me later!”
Wow. Victim blaming, much? The peasants and the poor people and baby Emma and everyone else were Regina’s victims and you just hand wiped that away because “oh poor Regina”. Regina being a victim doesn’t mean that she didn’t do horrible things. Goodness. Do you get that in order for you to cheer her character development you first have to acknowledge that her character had to do things for which she should be redeemed. You don’t get to white wash your favorite’s actions! Own them! Like Regina does. Guess what? She wanted to murder a baby! A new born! That’s disgusting! And now she and that newborn are trying to save a town! That’s great! But you don’t get to try and change the past.
Omg. It’s like I just told you what the entire theme of this season is!
And to be honest…not everyone hated this episode,
And to be honest…I never said everyone did.
As for Zelena staying…well, no sense in going through all that trouble in bringing her back, not to mention Adam and Eddy like both Zelena and Rebecca Mader.
Because this show has a history of bringing in characters and keeping them around….?
See, for example, Neal. We ALL know why he’s gone. Let’s not sugar coat this. He’s gone for CS. MRJ might have left without a fuss because this fandom is a cesspool of stupid and the writers suffer from Shiny Toy Syndrome, but it was for CS.
And guess what? They liked MRJ too! They literally brought him in, hand picked, sat him down and told them everything. He didn’t want anyone else but MRJ. So…it’s not like Bex is immune here just because she’s Bex.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"You know what?
I’m not doing this.
This isn’t a Regina debate thread. Yes, we go off topic quite frequently here, but the fact is this isn’t a thread for debating Regina’s qualities, villainy, or heroism. It’s simply not because so many people have wildly different perspectives on her, on this show, and what has happened in the years since 101 aired.
Neither is this an OQ debate thread, a Zelena debate thread, or anything else. There is a difference between debating morality and the concept of this show vs character defense in a thread where that character isn’t the focus.
We’re not doing it.
The topic is dropped. Move on.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"
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