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And really who can say Emma and Neal don’t need to talk. A lot of stuff about their feelings and past came up in Neverland and even if they never moved forward again romantically, conversations need to be had so they can move forward them a way that allows them to get along and be co-parents to Henry.
OMG they SO need to talk, about SO much!
It’s nice to see that Emma’s parents view Neal as a source of happiness for her. And the best part Emma was going to meet Neal. She was going to go on the ‘date’. When the SF conversation first happened I really didn’t expect Emma to show so the fact that in the end she did intend to come was huge for me.
Notice how when Charming came up to her, she was messing around with her phone. She was probably feeling bad about not having gone, and worried about him being hurt and angry with her, so maybe she should txt him, but what’s she gonna say in a txt, that’s so impersonal, no, she should call him, call him and explain, but really, what would she even say, isn’t that just like going there in person, so what if he gets the wrong idea, and what if he doesn’t understand exactly why she’s not ready, but that doesn’t mean she’ll never be ready, and she’s just scared and confused and doesn’t know how to handle it. So she’s sitting there thinking, “OMG universe please give me a sign of how to handle this,” and then up walks DaddyCharming to boost her confidence.
Also RIP to CaptainFire. They could have had it all. But in all seriousness it’s sad that such a complex relationship has been reduced to having all their interactions centred around Emma. I’m starting to feel that the past, Milah and all that may never come up in the present with these two.
*sigh* For real. Part of me wants to keep the hope alive that a time will come when they are able to address all that stuff, but the more time passes, and the more juvenile Hook acts, the less likely I think it is. I might appreciate that they seem to be writing Hook as a poor option for Emma, but I dislike that in turn, that’s having a detrimental affect on the CaptainFire potential.
PS. Welcome to the thread! 😀
[adrotate group="5"]I agree. And it goes against what he said in 307 about winning her heart without any tricks.
Yes. “A tree is known by its fruits” and in my estimation, a man who claims to behave one way but acts another is a hypocrite. The sad part is that Hook really seems to think his actions are in some way honorable. I think Phee is correct in her assessment that Hook has been a pirate for so long that he doesn’t even fully realize how far off the mark he is. Or if he does, then all the more shame since that would mean he’s not just acting out of a need for attention but would be intentionally trying to play women off of each other for the sick enjoyment of it. It’s such a pity, since Hook had the potential to re-establish the “bro code” with Nealfire and salvage their father-son dynamic, but instead chose to follow his insistent need to be affirmed by a woman (any woman it would seem), over a potentially great friendship with Nealfire.
As for Hook, sigh. Actually it was enjoyable to see a glimpse of the old Hook, since the handling of Neverland Hook was mostly a fail, IMO. I’m sure Hook’s action in the episode will try and be defended it but spin it how you want he did not come out well of this episode. Saying he’ll back off but doing the opposite in reality, trying to make Emma jealous by using Tink. He may say he’s in it for the long haul but I don’t think he knows how to do that. A quickie in the bathroom with Tink is certainly not the best way to go about it (although they do have great chemistry).
Welcome to the SF forum! And I agree about Hook saying one thing but doing another, since that is the epitome of hypocrisy. He’s so used to getting a woman’s attention that he’s not sure quite what to do now that both Emma AND Tink have given him the brush-off. New flash, women don’t liked to be played off of one another or used to arouse jealousy in another woman!
On a happier note, here is a pretty SF fan-video:
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
Here is a precious thing, a smile from Emma for Neal:
Are you trying to ask me on a date?
Emma and Neal’s dynamic is so cute, and it reminds me of the shyness of young love that Neal and Emma had when they first met.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
I’ve just caught up on the last few posts and I agree with all the things you’ve guys have posted.
I won’t lie but last night’s episode left me feeling very deflated and the promo for next week didn’t make feel much better. But I’m still holding onto the belief that better things will come our way. There is always hope right?
Anyway I want to share a conversation I had with my boyfriend about the whole love triangle. He is very much the casual viewer and he’s not emotional attached to any ship. (I don’t think he even knows what the term ‘shipping’ means)
So when I got really annoyed over the episode he asked me why, because it was obvious to him that Emma will have a relationship with Hook. As he put it ‘everyone knows the main couple can’t just get back together straight away, where is fun it that? It’s a TV show after all.’
We all know Hook isn’t the right guy for her but in any love story there has to be an obstacle in the way and in this case it’s Hook. He’s the added drama and will probably be the reason why Neal will fight for Emma and not walk away this time. He said to me that Emma and Neal will end up together the whole Hook thing is just part of the story of how they get there.
He then went onto say the show to him is about Emma’s journey. Season one was about her relationship with Henry and ended with him being her true love. Season two was about her parents and ended with her accepting them by calling them Mom and Dad.
So it wouldn’t surprise him at all if season three will be about her finally letting her walls down and accepting Neal back in her life romantically. The love triangle for him is more about Emma decided what she wants rather than two guys fighting over her. He said I just have to hang tight. enjoy the ride and hope it goes the way I want it to go.
I’m not saying he is right and I’m not sure if anything I have said above makes any sense. But I thought it was interesting to hear an objective view. Sometimes I find it hard to watch the show without my shipper goggles on lol.
BTW- Thank you all so much for the lovely comments about my new video! It really means a lot that you all enjoyed watching it! 😀
"The little guy saved us." - Neal Cassidy
I won’t lie but last night’s episode left me feeling very deflated and the promo for next week didn’t make feel much better. But I’m still holding onto the belief that better things will come our way. There is always hope right?
Interesting, because last night’s episode left me feeling cautiously optimistic for the future of SF, and probably for the reasons your boyfriend so astutely pointed out. Hook is only a temporary obstacle for Emma and Neal to overcome, in a way that is similar to how Tamara was one in season 2. Keep the hope alive, since we know that Emma and Neal love each other and probably always will.
As he put it ‘everyone knows the main couple can’t just get back together straight away, where is fun it that? It’s a TV show after all.’
Exactly! Hook is Emma’s Tamara in the sense that she’s taking the easy way out by pursuing things with Hook instead of Neal, the man she really loves but is afraid of losing again. Just as Neal chose to let his fear of rejection stand in the way of pursuing his true love, Emma, so is Emma letting fear of tragically losing Neal again stand in the way of her love for Neal. She even said to her parents that she’s the savior, and that she doesn’t get the luxury of a happy ending, and I think if and when she decides to date Hook (as it looks increasingly likely she will) then I think it’s merely as a diversion from letting herself become vulnerable with Neal, since she’s scared that if she does open her heart to him again, she might get hurt like last time, only worse. She’s lost Neal so many times, that she said it’d be easier not to face that past again. Right now, I believe Emma is wrestling with following her heart’s desire with Neal on the one hand but weighing up those positives with the huge negative of possibly being hurt. Choosing Hook is the EASY way out, just as it was for Neal to pursue Tamara instead of pursuing Emma after she broke the curse. Yet, it turned out to be the biggest regret of Neal’s life. I’m betting that Hook might just turn into one of Emma’s biggest regrets if it ends up costing her another chance with Neal. However, I expect Neal would always be waiting in the wings for Emma, so that when she realizes Hook isn’t’ the one for her, she’ll see all the more clearly the true love that Neal gives to her freely, no questions asked.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
Thanks everyone for the welcome!
Notice how when Charming came up to her, she was messing around with her phone. She was probably feeling bad about not having gone, and worried about him being hurt and angry with her, so maybe she should txt him, but what’s she gonna say in a txt, that’s so impersonal, no, she should call him, call him and explain, but really, what would she even say, isn’t that just like going there in person, so what if he gets the wrong idea, and what if he doesn’t understand exactly why she’s not ready, but that doesn’t mean she’ll never be ready, and she’s just scared and confused and doesn’t know how to handle it. So she’s sitting there thinking, “OMG universe please give me a sign of how to handle this,” and then up walks DaddyCharming to boost her confidence.
Yes she was messing about with her phone. I love that it wasn’t as if she was just going to blow him off completely. It’s not that she didn’t want to go on the date but like you said she just confused and terrified about the whole situation.
I must say – Charming for all the awards in that episode, both with Emma in present day and Snow in the past. He was able to understand and be there for both of them.
*sigh* For real. Part of me wants to keep the hope alive that a time will come when they are able to address all that stuff, but the more time passes, and the more juvenile Hook acts, the less likely I think it is. I might appreciate that they seem to be writing Hook as a poor option for Emma, but I dislike that in turn, that’s having a detrimental affect on the CaptainFire potential. PS. Welcome to the thread!
Yes I was so sure all this stuff would come have to come up after Neverland but I feel like the action is going to take over again and the issue ignored again. It’s such a shame because I watch Neal/Hook scenes and it’s like they barely know one another, let alone have such a complex history. It would serve Hook’s character well too to start establishing relationships other than his one with Emma. Because I have no worry for Neal’s storylines/relationships outside of Emma but I do wonder how Hook fits into the story, especially now that he has developed Emma Swan tunnel vision.
BTW- Thank you all so much for the lovely comments about my new video! It really means a lot that you all enjoyed watching it!
The video is great, as are all of yours. Perfect song choice too, I love Lifehouse.
Argh, earlier today I couldn’t stay logged in to post anything here which was beyond frustrating but YAY, it all seems fixed now! Weird bug on the site today and I seriously thought someone was pulling a prank on me since this was the one thread I wanted to post in and I couldn’t until now! LOL 😆
BTW-Welcome Ems!!! Nice to have you here!! 😀
Of course, anything I wanted to add to this thread earlier has now been talked about by everyone else (yay for all your great posts!) but I’m glad to know that some of the vibes and things I picked up or thought about last night’s episode were shared by not only you guys but some other folks online too. I actually stopped reading comments for most of the OUAT online reviews because the people were annoying but I saw a few last night that expressed sadness for Emma & Neal not getting their chance to talk so maybe the tide is changing and the Neal hate is going to die down. I can hope, right?! 😀
#MoreBOOMLessGloomI actually stopped reading comments for most of the OUAT online reviews because the people were annoying but I saw a few last night that expressed sadness for Emma & Neal not getting their chance to talk so maybe the tide is changing and the Neal hate is going to die down. I can hope, right?!
Yes, SwanFire is all about HOPE! Hope for home, family, and true love to be a reality in Emma and Neal’s lives! SF is bigger than just romantic love, since it’s about them finding the home they were always seeking in one another. Two lost children finding their way to their parents, to their son and to each other.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
Hi all, I’m Ems. I’ve been lurking reading all your wonderful thoughts and decided to post and join in the Swanfire discussion.
Welcome! Always awesome to get another point of view and perspective and you said a lot of things that I definitely think are worth repeating.
But the reality of how things actually happened wasn’t as bad for SF as I had been anticipating. I knew the second that Neal approached Emma that it could be seeing as him being too full on. But Neal came just asking to talk, it was Emma that jokingly brought up the date part. And really who can say Emma and Neal don’t need to talk. A lot of stuff about their feelings and past came up in Neverland and even if they never moved forward again romantically, conversations need to be had so they can move forward them a way that allows them to get along and be co-parents to Henry. I liked how casual Neal was about it and didn’t pressure Emma into it. Emma’s smile was adorable too, like she didn’t want to smile but couldn’t help herself.
I bolded the part that especially struck me, as I did not catch that before. You are right! She did the same with August actually back when she was giving him flirty looks. Whatever the writers want to say about how August and Emma felt like siblings, that is not the way it came off on their well “date”. Neal really is in a tough spot. Emma wants to feel wanted of course but at the same time, she protects herself and puts up walls. They do need to talk, even if it is just about mundane things like his moving to SB and being in her life more, or even how he survived and met Aurora and Mulan and they say “hi”.
Neal gets a lot of hate for leaving Emma/not fighting for her etc etc. But as a certain point he can’t continue to force his romantic feelings on to Emma. …Right now Emma doesn’t believe she’ll ever have happiness without something lurking to ruin it all but when she accepts the idea of enjoying the moment, I think she will have to take the lead with Neal.
I think that is fitting really with the strong female character who is not the damsel or prize to be won–she should fight for her man just as much as he is willing to fight for her. If the audience is to buy the love story, then it has to bewant Emma wants. It cannot be Hook or Neal “winning” her heart–it has to be Emma discovering what she wants and going for it, taking the chance for happiness.I really do not feel her scenes with Hook have been about Emma taking that chance for happiness but rather, returning to her roots of one night unhealthy relationships not based on mutual trust but just physical attraction. Hook may want more, may think he does anyway with his long haul statements, but he is not emotionally mature enough to offer that to Emma. The truth is, Hook is very juvenile in his approach as shown by his claims of friendship to Bae but inability to express that. Even when Hook appears to be doing a decent thing like “backing off” he says it is for the boy, implying the only reason Neal and Emma should get a chance is they have a child, then further implying that Neal does not have much of a chance since he left Emma once. That is very similar to what Pan said to Emma about Henry–and we saw that real Henry did not have doubts, still knew that the reason Emma could connect to him was when he could understand why she gave him up.I feel that is foreshadowing what has to happen with Neal and Emma. They can only really reconnect when Emma can understand fully what happened in the past, when Neal left (and the audience needs to see it too). That he really was trying to give her the best chance he could–and while he did not come back the instant the curse broke, he did that frm a very human place of doubting himself more than lack of faith or love for her. Emma is going through that now, with her doubt that she can be allowed to be happy, that it is not her fate.I agree RIP captainfire, and also I think CaptainFairy–I was not on board it but it is harder for me at this time to see Hook with anyone. Even Regina does not work in the “they are both villains” way because her emotional growth, while still far from over, is leaps and bounds ahead of his. She still puts up walls and assumes the worst of others but we saw her have a moment of real friendship for Tink–something Hook did not. Hook treated Tink like something to use to make himself feel better. Tink wants to be a fairy again. She cares about believing in herself but also the good opinion of Blue and others and Hook cared more about his own romance than consideration for her. Whether that was making Emma jealous or even if you spin his words outside the Inn as his way of showing Emma he had backed off, the fact is he did not consider Tink. I hope Emma picked up on that. It was Jello part two, but worse since he actually knew Tink considered a tryst with him beneath her dignity.
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
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