Emma + Baelfire = Swanfire

[Phee]

Chip and Dale! 😆

They just happen to think Emma herself is still in love with Neal, but too afraid to let her guard down and be happy. Maybe they are really fairy-tale clueless about what would really make Emma happy or maybe they’re reading her better than she’s reading herself right now.

I just saw a thing on tumblr which is an excellent point that relates to this topic…

Emma (On the verge of tears): Yes, Neal just died, but I lost him years ago. All that time thinking that he didn’t love me only to find out that he did, and it was too late. I can’t even tell him how angry that makes me. Or how much it hurt when he left, or how terrified I was when he came back, because I knew the moment I saw him, I never—I never stopped loving him.

Now I don’t know but if my daughter said this to me and I found out the guy she was referring to was still alive, I’d probably move heaven and earth to get them back together.

http://glorifiedgleek.tumblr.com/post/69500202025/emma-on-the-verge-of-tears-yes-neal-just-died
Is it really any wonder that Snowing got it in their heads that it would be a good, healthy thing for Emma to go on a date with Neal?

I tend to think the latter because the show took the time to create sympathy for Neal by showing him alone in the booth.

Yes! CSers say, “What was the point of even showing Emma ask if something was going on with Tink and Hook when she should have been worried about the screaming person?” But really, you wanna talk about, “What was the point of showing that if…” let’s talk about how they took the time to show Neal taking the plunge and asking her out, then showing her parents’ encouragement, then showing him sitting alone, and having her parents notice and react. THAT is taking the time to setup something significant within the developing plot of the story to illicit an emotional reaction from the characters, and the audience.

We didn’t just cut to Hook’s reactions about the “date”. This was not a scene that played out to drive how Hook feels about Emma, and his jealousy. Nor was the one with Tink that way, or we would have just scene Tink and Hook standing together with him saying “perhaps” with nothing really having happened. Instead we saw Hook seriously proposition Tink. Tink is being friendly and sympathetic with Hook and turn to leave, and he puts his Hook on her shoulder to draw her back. The whole thing really had the Season 2 Hook vibe to it, as if the minute Emma’s back is turned his normal pirate self pops right back out.

Again with the, “Why bother showing that if…”. Why have the scene with Hook and Tink alone, if nothing would have potentially come of it, if she’d been up for it, (I’m thinking she was up for it in the past, and regrets it, which is why she didn’t wanna go there again). Like you said, they could have just had them both walk out together without the stuff that came before it, and they could have had Emma say the exact same thing, and they could have had Tink and Hook both reply in the same ways. But instead they showed him actually, seriously propositioning her. He would have seriously had a quickie with her right then and there if she’d been keen. That is not the action of a mature man whose heart is dedicated to another woman. And his reply to Emma was not the action of a mature man who has sincerely backed off to wait, because he honestly believes that his time will come if he does the honourable thing.

Something else I’ve seen mentioned around tumblr is how Hook’s attitude reflects on how he feels about Henry. “For the sake of the boy. To let his parents have a fair shot, without a devilishly handsome pirate standing in the way.” Then in the next breath he basically tells Neal that he’s gonna FAIL with Emma anyway. So, Hook knows that Henry would love to have his parents back together, so he’s stepping back for his sake, perhaps in some way to make up for having come between Neal’s parents. If it had been left at that, then that’s all well and good. But he knows for sure that Henry’s dream of having his parents back together is gonna end badly, even if they try, he’s certain that the family will fall apart again, which will upset Henry greatly, probably more so than if Emma and Neal had never tried again at all. Buuuut, Hook’s stepping back for Henry’s sake? Does. Not. Compute.

And it doesn’t show much residual affection for Neal either, because he’s basically just told him, “Have a go, but you’re gonna lose, and I’m gonna be there with a shoulder for her to cry on.” Which, ya know, isn’t exactly being friendly to someone who he’s claimed he considers to be an old friend.

I love both of them, though obviously I favor Swanfire over other options. Hook’s an amazing character, handsome and funny and enjoyable to watch when he’s being good or evil–and played by a talented, adorable actor to boot. But loving one character doesn’t mean you have to hate his rival

I haven’t given up on Hook, even though he acted like a jerk in the most recent ep, I prefer him doing so blatantly, instead of their seeming attempt to woobify him by falling in wuv with Emma. Show him being emotional, that’s fine and great, but he’d started to lose his edge. Captain Hook in love should be confident, firey and passionate, not a woobie. He’s trying to make like he’s working the confidence now, but it doesn’t really ring true IMO. He’s told Neal he’s gonna back off, but he’s really not letting the pursuit drop at all if he’s trying to make Emma jealous, and as far as we know, he hasn’t told Emma what he told Neal, so it’s not a fair playing field. If he’s truly confident that he’s the one Emma will want, then he should be willing to be honest with all involved. Instead, he’s playing games, (he did say that once they’d saved Henry, that’s when the games would begin). Which is very piratey of him, so I do appreciate that, even if I don’t appreciate his Emma fixation in and of itself.

I don’t like the triangle either! It’s so nice to be among people who are in agreement with me…I start to feel dumb because I don’t entirely disagree with the point of the opposing side, but want so much for Neal to end up with Emma that I get defensive! One woman I was talking to said she didn’t understand at all what people see in Neal and Emma.

Ah, you can always come here, Angie. I’ve totally been there, I’ve seen people diss Neal and it’s made me so mad I actually started physically shaking. Then I’m all, “He’s just a fictional character,” but then I’m all, “But that means he can’t defend himself, so when I see people being ignorant about him, someone has to stand up for his side, his views, his emotions.” I know that all characters have their detractors, and by no means should everyone like the same characters, it just seems sometimes like people go out of their way to put Neal down and even demonise him, and ignore actual canon facts in an effort to do so. Call a character out on what we actually see them do, but don’t go inventing stuff just so you can talk bad about them. And really, Neal hasn’t done a whole lotta evil stuff, and has done a fair bit of good stuff, so I really am just baffled sometimes by how people can dislike him so much, and/or not see the good in him. *sigh*

[Ozma]

I have been seeing many people loosing hope, i just say that are times i’m starting to loose it too, however i try to think that if the writers are setting up this from season 1 they should know what to do,  but at the same time the way emma is reacting towards neal is somehow strange, even on season 2 on the scenes they were together she used to show more simpaty for neal, and now is almost cold.

Of course that now there is no tamara, and she did told neal that she love him, so probably she is more afraid.

It mad me sad neal waiting in the dinner, and even more sad that when we see him, near blue’s Body, when he talk in my opinion, is in a cold voice and not even look at emma, so my guess he thinks she made her choice.

Now i hear jen saying that next episode is one of her favorites, and in ny city when she told that emma would be kissing someone, she said that when there were kisses the episodes were always her favorites, that made CS saying after they saw the promo, saying that would be a sort of goodbye Kiss between emma and hook, specially since the episode is written by Adam and eddie that always write great CS scenes( still trying to find an episode writers by them with great CS scenes, but ok), i just hope that is not true, although i didn’t like the promo, but i hope that if she is saying goodbye and somehow Kiss hook, that she say also goodbye to neal in the same way.

You know what is sad, besides waiting 3 months to know whats going to happen, i that if a new curse happens, and they find out that they will forget everything, that neal would be happy about forgetting the pain, although unhappy beacuse he will forget his son.

i know that this is a story, but even then i always defend the weaker ones, and know that emma had a hard life, but i mine opinion neal was the character that suffered the most in his life and he deserves a happy ending, so I hope that neal’ s happy ending is emma and although it hurts, i want to see him fight for her, and i must say that if they send hook to emma’s life like they did with tamara, she realizes that is wrong, and u know what i’m going to be a little evil and  say if this happens, i what to see emma fighting for neal  to having back.

sorry if somehow i ended talking about things that are not related to this tag, but is good to talk among SF.

p.s: i hope that abc redimes itself and finally release neal poster as oficial, and i must say that for a character that they try to forget that exists they been releasing for each episode a lot of pics of the epi with him.

also hope that since the jail issue is talked, i don’t think will be next epi, so 2 part of the season, i also hope milah issue will be also brought up.

[Phee]

even on season 2 on the scenes they were together she used to show more simpaty for neal, and now is almost cold.

I don’t think she’s been cold to him at all. She’s been honest, and he’s been understanding, and they may not be together (yet) but they’re in the process right now of re-evaluating and re-establishing their relationship and getting to know each other again. Just because they’re not currently a couple, that doesn’t mean that there isn’t a whole lot of emotional stuff going on between them, and that’s the exact opposite of “cold”. This look is NOT “cold”, not in the slightest…

Now i hear jen saying that next episode is one of her favorites, and in ny city when she told that emma would be kissing someone, she said that when there were kisses the episodes were always her favorites,

She joked around that it’s always a fun day at work when you get to kiss a hot guy. She didn’t say that every fave ep of hers involves her kissing someone. And if she, or any of the other actors, are raving about the next ep being awesome, it’s because they wanna talk up the mid-season finale to get people watching, because they want good LIVE ratings numbers, (the final total with the DVR numbers and everything added is great, but they’ll want to go into the mid-season hiatus with a good LIVE ratings number).

that made CS saying after they saw the promo, saying that would be a sort of goodbye Kiss between emma and hook,

Honestly, it’s a super short clip that lasts maybe 2 seconds if that, with no dialogue, that just has Hook and Emma looking at each other. Either one of them could have said anything, the situation and context could be anything, it’s not a guarantee that they’re gonna kiss. The way they’ve spoiled everything CS related in promo this season, if there was actually gonna be a kiss, I’d expect it to have been in the promo. The promo isn’t really worth stressing over IMO. If we see the ep, and they suck each other’s faces off, then yeah, we can rant about it, but there’s really no point in getting worked up about it to the point of dreading the episode before it’s even aired.

You know what is sad, besides waiting 3 months to know whats going to happen, i that if a new curse happens, and they find out that they will forget everything, that neal would be happy about forgetting the pain, although unhappy beacuse he will forget his son.

i know that this is a story, but even then i always defend the weaker ones, and know that emma had a hard life, but i mine opinion neal was the character that suffered the most in his life and he deserves a happy ending,

There are few characters in this show that are completely Adam and Eddy’s own original creations. The only main characters that fit that description are Emma, Neal, and Henry. Adam and Eddy love all their characters, but I’m sure those three have a special place in their hearts because they’re 100% THEIRS and the over arching plot of the whole show is built around those two displaced FTL kids and the kid they made together.

As such, they’re not gonna write their show to have Neal being miserable in the end. They have been writing him in S3 as unquestioningly being dedicated to Emma. He believes that Emma is his happy ending, his true love. I don’t believe that Adam and Eddy would be writing Neal this way if they were planning for him to not finally, after a couple hundred years of waiting for it, find his happy ending, with his family, his son, and the woman he loves. The only other relationship they’ve written for him was with a woman who ended up being evil, and the relationship was a lie, and despite that relationship, Neal never stopped loving Emma.

This is what they have written for Neal’s story. If his happy ending was intended to be with someone other than Emma, I really don’t think they’d have written him the way they have. They wouldn’t be writing scenes like the one of him waiting alone in the Diner to make viewers feel sympathy for him. They’d have written him as being open to a relationship in the future with someone other than Emma. And no matter if people try to insta-ship him with any female he comes into contact with who isn’t Emma, they haven’t actually written him to be considering a relationship with anyone other than Emma.

Whatever trials they put Neal through while the show lasts, I have no doubt that Adam and Eddy are gonna give him a happy ending, and they’ve been rather emphatically setting up Emma and Henry as that desired happy ending IMO.

[ems14]

I just saw a thing on tumblr which is an excellent point that relates to this topic…

Emma (On the verge of tears): Yes, Neal just died, but I lost him years ago. All that time thinking that he didn’t love me only to find out that he did, and it was too late. I can’t even tell him how angry that makes me. Or how much it hurt when he left, or how terrified I was when he came back, because I knew the moment I saw him, I never—I never stopped loving him. Now I don’t know but if my daughter said this to me and I found out the guy she was referring to was still alive, I’d probably move heaven and earth to get them back together.

http://glorifiedgleek.tumblr.com/post/69500202025/emma-on-the-verge-of-tears-yes-neal-just-died Is it really any wonder that Snowing got it in their heads that it would be a good, healthy thing for Emma to go on a date with Neal?

I think this perfectly explains the Snowing point of view on Emma and Neal.

angiebelle wrote: I don’t like the triangle either! It’s so nice to be among people who are in agreement with me…I start to feel dumb because I don’t entirely disagree with the point of the opposing side, but want so much for Neal to end up with Emma that I get defensive! One woman I was talking to said she didn’t understand at all what people see in Neal and Emma.

Ah, you can always come here, Angie. I’ve totally been there, I’ve seen people diss Neal and it’s made me so mad I actually started physically shaking. Then I’m all, “He’s just a fictional character,” but then I’m all, “But that means he can’t defend himself, so when I see people being ignorant about him, someone has to stand up for his side, his views, his emotions.” I know that all characters have their detractors, and by no means should everyone like the same characters, it just seems sometimes like people go out of their way to put Neal down and even demonise him, and ignore actual canon facts in an effort to do so. Call a character out on what we actually see them do, but don’t go inventing stuff just so you can talk bad about them. And really, Neal hasn’t done a whole lotta evil stuff, and has done a fair bit of good stuff, so I really am just baffled sometimes by how people can dislike him so much, and/or not see the good in him. *sigh*

It’s so tough not to get defensive. There’s a lot of irrational hatred for Neal out there which, obviously as a fan, is so hard to understand. I don’t think Neal is perfect but when people are twisting the facts/making stuff up as a reason to diss his character it becomes frustrating.

As for the promo, I won’t lie, I wasn’t happy to see the CS moment but it was like 1 second of 30 second promo which has been edited. The actual context of the scene might not be half as bad.

If this curse does separate people/wipe their memories I would actually venture that there’s a chance we’ll get a good, emotional Swanfire moment in the next ep,  if they think they are going to be ripped apart again (similarly to the portal scene).  Especially since it seems like 3×12 will be very CS heavy. I think it’s possible SF and CS will both get some kind of moment for fan to analyse over the hiatus

[RumplesGirl]

“For the sake of the boy. To let his parents have a fair shot, without a devilishly handsome pirate standing in the way.” Then in the next breath he basically tells Neal that he’s gonna FAIL with Emma anyway. So, Hook knows that Henry would love to have his parents back together, so he’s stepping back for his sake, perhaps in some way to make up for having come between Neal’s parents. If it had been left at that, then that’s all well and good. But he knows for sure that Henry’s dream of having his parents back together is gonna end badly, even if they try, he’s certain that the family will fall apart again, which will upset Henry greatly, probably more so than if Emma and Neal had never tried again at all. Buuuut, Hook’s stepping back for Henry’s sake? Does. Not. Compute.

Yup. And this is one more thing we can add to the list of reasons why I’m slowly liking Hook less and less. He’s using the name of Henry, a small child, to get what he wants. Just like I think that saving Henry was more about “how will this look to Emma!” as opposed to saving Henry for the sake of saving Henry.

 

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Phee]

Yup. And this is one more thing we can add to the list of reasons why I’m slowly liking Hook less and less. He’s using the name of Henry, a small child, to get what he wants. Just like I think that saving Henry was more about “how will this look to Emma!” as opposed to saving Henry for the sake of saving Henry.

I can accept that behaviour from him (for now) as long as Emma doesn’t fall for him. Because it’s a scummy thing to do, which means it’s in character for a pirate. And of course I wish this particular pirate had learned a bit from his past and was making an attempt at being a better man now, but apparently he hasn’t (yet) so this is what we have to judge him on, and it IS in character with the less than honourable man he was in The Crocodile flashbacks.

I think the fact that they’re writing him like this in present day must be because they’re trying to write him as someone who Emma could never actually, genuinely, completely fall for. Because Henry comes first with her, and she can tell when someone’s talking crap, so it would be way OOC for her to be OK with Hook in a romantic sense after he’s been acting like this.

If they’re gonna shut this triangle business down emphatically, they have to make it obvious why she doesn’t choose the guy who she doesn’t choose, and Hook’s actions are so seriously inapropriate, that I’m thinking (hoping) that’s what the writers are up to at the moment. Write him out of the running, then write Emma slowly but surely opening up to Neal again without the threat of Hook lurking over their shoulders, and have that losing out on Emma be Hook’s rock bottom that slowly but surely inspires some actual change and good form in him in the future. So with that in mind, I’m cautiously optimistic that there might be a method to the madness.

[RumplesGirl]

If they’re gonna shut this triangle business down emphatically, they have to make it obvious why she doesn’t choose the guy who she doesn’t choose, and Hook’s actions are so seriously inapropriate, that I’m thinking (hoping) that’s what the writers are up to at the moment. Write him out of the running, then write Emma slowly but surely opening up to Neal again without the threat of Hook lurking over their shoulders, and have that losing out on Emma be Hook’s rock bottom that slowly but surely inspires some actual change and good form in him in the future. So with that in mind, I’m cautiously optimistic that there might be a method to the madness.

I hope Emma brings up how this “perhaps” business is a mind trick, something Hook promised he wouldn’t do in order “to win her heart” back in 307. I need her to have that revelation.

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Phee]

I hope Emma brings up how this “perhaps” business is a mind trick, something Hook promised he wouldn’t do in order “to win her heart” back in 307. I need her to have that revelation.

If there’s a prayer circle for that, I wanna be in it, because he’s rather blatantly contradicting what he told her he’d do, and Emma Swan isn’t the type to just take that kinda crap and not call people on it.

[RumplesGirl]

RumplesGirl wrote: I hope Emma brings up how this “perhaps” business is a mind trick, something Hook promised he wouldn’t do in order “to win her heart” back in 307. I need her to have that revelation.

If there’s a prayer circle for that, I wanna be in it, because he’s rather blatantly contradicting what he told her he’d do, and Emma Swan isn’t the type to just take that kinda crap and not call people on it.

That’s true but they have a tendency as of late to sweep a lot of these things under the rug. She never brought up that less than a week ago, Hook was working with the people who kidnapped her son. Never mind all the other things. If Emma is a in crisis mode because of Panry then she just might let it slide and A and E can say “she was dealing with a lot of other things.”

 

on a different note, the promo pics for 311 make it look like just maybe CaptainFire is going to get some time together. God. Please let there be a conversation

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Slurpeez]

So, I have a theory about this new curse. I think this curse will be cast, that Emma will get an alter ego, and that Emma will be paired with Hook, who ultimately isn’t right for her. Part of how this new curse will be broken is for Emma and Neal to find each other again. Even if they’re cursed, they’ll discover they’re still in love, similar to how Mary Margaret and David found each other, despite being cursed. While Rumple said even Emma would be powerless to break this new curse, since her parents true love wasn’t written into this time, it could be that Emma is even more powerful than Rumple foresees. Emma embodies true love, and as such, when she allows herself to love someone for real, she can achieve great things (e.g. how Emma’s true love kiss awoke Henry and broke in the curse in S1 or how Emma’s true love magic meant her heart couldn’t be taken and protected her mother, Snow, from Cora). So, perhaps Emma falling in love with Neal again (a la “50 First Dates”) could be enough to break this new curse!

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

[Author]

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