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You know when it really comes down to it, i just can’t hope for anything for this show anymore. That there might be some intricate long con plot thing going on. I just have no hope. My only hope is that it just doesn’t get any worse at this point. Even that seems impossible most of the time.
That’s it. That’s it right there.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"Mmkay. I need to have a bit of a rant.
So I spent most of today going through the S5 DVD for the podcast review and there’s one really great deleted scene between Regina and Emma. In it, Emma and Regina are talking about Daniel and Regina insists she’s moved on (with Robin) and Emma gives the really telltale line, “moving on and getting over someone aren’t the same things” which is more of less what a lot of people here have been saying for a really long time. It was a great moment that emphasized how much Emma loved Neal (she then told Regina about her Neal-vision in the 100th) and it was actually a pretty moving scene.
Now, for the ranty bit. I know some will disagree with me about what is canon exactly but logistically, Adam has said for years (and even said yesterday—yes, YESTERDAY) that scenes included on the DVD are canon. That’s been the policy for awhile now. If it’s on the DVD, they consider it canon and they try to only include scenes on the DVD that they want considered canon.
So tonight, imagine my shock and surprise when Adam tweets out that none of the scenes on the DVDs–not just S5 but ALL of them–are not canon because they’ve “reclassified” and decided this is what is best.
So. The aforementioned scene? Not canon. That scene of Emma giving Henry the necklace? Not canon. That scene of Neal telling Henry about Neverland? Not canon. That scene of Neal teaching Henry to steer the ship? Not canon. Even their beloved Hook and Jello scene? Not canon. Even those little scenes that help explain the timeline and magical issues….? Not canon.
It angers me not only as a ride-or-die Neal fan and Swanfire shipper but also as someone who loves TV/narrative. Like, how on god’s green earth am I supposed to trust ANYTHING these guys write or say when they change their mind at the drop of a hat, whatever the reason? How do they expect us to have a dialogue (and all media is a dialogue) if they don’t stick to certain statements, rules and are constantly backtracking for reasons that we aren’t privy whenever it’s convenient for them!
Yeah, a lot of deleted scenes are cut because of time but a lot of them are also really endearing and sweet and are the much missed character moments! And even if they weren’t, can we pick a policy and STICK to it, please and thank you!?
Ugh. That is all.
You know what? Why don’t we just decide for ourselves which deleted scenes are canon? You know, personal canon. Screw what Adam and Eddy say (which technically violates the definition of canon, but whatever).
Also, here’s the one tiny problem with Slurpeez’ analysis:
Slurpeez:
Us (the only people actually reading it):
Mmkay. I need to have a bit of a rant. So I spent most of today going through the S5 DVD for the podcast review and there’s one really great deleted scene between Regina and Emma. In it, Emma and Regina are talking about Daniel and Regina insists she’s moved on (with Robin) and Emma gives the really telltale line, “moving on and getting over someone aren’t the same things” which is more of less what a lot of people here have been saying for a really long time. It was a great moment that emphasized how much Emma loved Neal (she then told Regina about her Neal-vision in the 100th) and it was actually a pretty moving scene. Now, for the ranty bit. I know some will disagree with me about what is canon exactly but logistically, Adam has said for years (and even said yesterday—yes, YESTERDAY) that scenes included on the DVD are canon. That’s been the policy for awhile now. If it’s on the DVD, they consider it canon and they try to only include scenes on the DVD that they want considered canon. So tonight, imagine my shock and surprise when Adam tweets out that none of the scenes on the DVDs–not just S5 but ALL of them–are not canon because they’ve “reclassified” and decided this is what is best. So. The aforementioned scene? Not canon. That scene of Emma giving Henry the necklace? Not canon. That scene of Neal telling Henry about Neverland? Not canon. That scene of Neal teaching Henry to steer the ship? Not canon. Even their beloved Hook and Jello scene? Not canon. Even those little scenes that help explain the timeline and magical issues….? Not canon. It angers me not only as a ride-or-die Neal fan and Swanfire shipper but also as someone who loves TV/narrative. Like, how on god’s green earth am I supposed to trust ANYTHING these guys write or say when they change their mind at the drop of a hat, whatever the reason? How do they expect us to have a dialogue (and all media is a dialogue) if they don’t stick to certain statements, rules and are constantly backtracking for reasons that we aren’t privy whenever it’s convenient for them! Yeah, a lot of deleted scenes are cut because of time but a lot of them are also really endearing and sweet and are the much missed character moments! And even if they weren’t, can we pick a policy and STICK to it, please and thank you!? Ugh. That is all.
You know what? Why don’t we just decide for ourselves which deleted scenes are canon? You know, personal canon. Screw what Adam and Eddy say (which technically violates the definition of canon, but whatever). Also, here’s the one tiny problem with Slurpeez’ analysis: Slurpeez:
Us (the only people actually reading it): That’s what I have been doing. Seasons 1-3A are canon. Everything else is poorly written fanfic.
"All your questions are pointless"
Speaking of deleted scenes being non-canon:
I was looking into what number episode “Manhattan” was to see how long Neal was really on the show in the present day. It was 214, meaning he was pretty much only there for a year from “Manhattan” through “Quiet Minds” (315).
Anyway, I found out that there was a scene (apparently filmed) involving (an unnamed) Malcolm abandoning Rumpel then being killed by two guys, who decide to take the latter to the spinsters.
I guess A/E said they deleted it, because it didn’t fit the episode, but I’m wondering if it was deleted because of the Neverland arc. Wasn’t this also the same episode that first suggested Bae was in Neverland? This might suggest that he was INDEED originally meant to be Peter Pan…
More pink-flower-of-doom parallels:
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
4) Since I know DSB and Macy won’t pop around to give a theory, I’ll do it for them (and I think Slurpeez knows this one. I think she and DSB talked about it once before): when Hook restored Emma’s memories in 3B (312) the potion was laced with the Sands of Avalon, the same roofie Arthur gave Gwen, which explain Emma’s behavior S3B-present, especially when it comes to Hook.
THAT is an untold story I would very much like to see! Yes, I’ve long thought it could be a real possibility, ever since S3b when DSB proposed the memory potion was laced. After S5a aired, I added the bit about Hook adding the Sands of Avalon to it. He must’ve acquired it when he was sailing all over fairy-tale land during the missing year.
I know this theory about Emma being cursed with Sands of Avalon has always been crack-pot. As I’ve mentioned, we’ve still yet to see the story with Lancelot and Gwen resolved, which I think was left open ended on purpose and paralleled to Emma and Regina, what with the dark-one curse vortex. Emma and Hook were paralleled to Arthur and Gwen, who was bewitched to act in love with her horrible husband. We’ve also yet to see the untold story of Lancelot’s mother, the Lady of the Lake, who was last mentioned in Season 5, Episode 10 when Merlin told Lancelot to find Lancelot’s mother. Merlin also said she had great power (yet another hint since I think that was foreshadowing). We’ve yet to meet the Lady of the Lake and she’s been mentioned ever since 2×3. Season 5a would have been the perfect time to introduce her, but maybe she hasn’t been seen yet for a reason (e.g. she could also be the black fairy whom the Blue Fairy banished).
Next, I watched another deleted scene between Snow and Gwen from season 5a, and it got the wheels turning (warning crack-pot theory to follow).
From that deleted scene:
Guinevere: These are good people, really. I just imagine with all the changes…
Snow: Of course they are. I so hope you aren’t going to have to be away from home for much longer.
Gwen: I just wish I could remember what happened.
Snow: It’s unsettling, isn’t it? I’ve been through this so many times I’m amazed I know my own name. Actually, Mary Margaret is the name the curse gave me when it took my memories a way, so in a way, I guess…
Gwen: Experiences make us who we are. Just suddenly, they’re gone. It’s the cruelest stuff I can think of.
Snow: Sorry about that. If Emma did this, I’m just …
Gwen: Oh, I don’t mean to blame you. In fact, I can’t imagine how you feel, to see someone you love doing this, using you.
Snow: I’m sure Emma had a reason for taking away our memories. Maybe it was a good one, but just don’t worry. Like I’ve said, I’ve been through this before. The one thing I’ve learned from all the times I’ve been cursed is that the important things remain. They bleed through.
Gwen: Perhaps, but I’m more concerned about why this is happening. If you’re right, then your Emma had good reason to take our memories. I wonder if that’s because they were too horrible to live with because deep down inside, that’s how I feel–like something went very, very wrong.You have to watch the scene to really get a full appreciation of the acting choices, but the script is still rather telling. What if this deleted scene is more than just an indication that Gwen’s gut feelings were right? Maybe it’s foreshadowing of more to come. Gwen has a gut feeling deep down that something is amiss. Her memory was taken away by Emma, but it could also be from when Arthur cursed her with the Sands of Avalon. I tend to think the latter explanation about Gwen’s gut feeling might make more sense given that Gwen also said, ” In fact, I can’t imagine how you feel, to see someone you love doing this, using you.” Wouldn’t it be ironic if later on Gwen does wake up from the Sands of Avalon curse only to discover that it was Arthur who was using her all of that time, forcing her to play the role of his devoted and loving wife? As Rumple has said, there is irony everywhere when you can see the future. Gwen seems to be speaking prophetically if she ends up having the Sands-of-Avalon curse lifted only to discover that she was used by her horrid husband. Maybe Lancelot’s mother, the Lady of the Lake, will free Gwen of her curse.
Also, the other thing that was revealing was Snow’s rather large rationalization that Emma must have had a good reason to take away everyone’s memories, and yet even Snow seems to be speaking with doubt (that’s where watching the scene makes more sense). Gwen senses that Emma did so because something so bad must have happened in Camelot that the memories were too horrible to live with.
Snow so wants to stand by her daughter, but even she cannot help but wonder along with Gwen that maybe Emma gave into her deepest darkest impulses. Little did Snow know that the “darkest path Emma could have taken” (Merlin’s words from 5×10) was Emma’s choice to save Hook by making him into another dark one. This deleted scene was probably written before 5×7, so it’s unclear exactly what event the deleted scene between Gwen and Snow alludes to, but I found it pretty intriguing. It seems that deep down Snow doesn’t want to believe Emma would choose to embrace the darkness (which Emma did do by saving Hook, per Merlin’s words). She still doesn’t want to accept that Emma could possibly be paired with such a dark force as Hook.
That takes me back to the scene from 5×10 (which I linked to above). Snow again rationalizes that Emma chose to save Hook out of love rather than out of darkness as Merlin indicated.
David: We were so close, Mary Margaret. Emma was seconds away from destroying the darkness and ending this.
Snow: And Hook would have been dead. She chose love, David. And we would have done the same thing. We’d share one heart because we took the same kind of risk that Emma took. We save each other. That is what our family does. So have some faith in her.
David: I do. I just hope her faith in Hook is justified.Snow chastises her husband just for expressing any kind of doubt about Hook. She is totally blinded by her and David’s own experience with true love–the truest love of all. Theirs is the kind of real love that lets them literally share a heart. Snow is ever the optimist and only ever wants to see the good in people, especially Emma. After all, Snow was the one who convinced David in season four to exorcise their unborn daughter just because of the prophesy that Emma would have the heart with the darkest potential. Snow wants to believe that Emma is the perfect savior and her daughter is in love with the same kind of good, honorable man that Snow White is. (That is Snow’s biggest character flaw: she has to have the perfect family with the perfect husband and perfect children. That is why Emma relates more to Regina than to her own mother). Yet, as an honorable man himself, David has his quiet doubts and misgivings about Hook’s true character, as he expressed in 5×10 and going all the way back to 3×5 when David recognized that Hook wasn’t in NL out of a sense of nobility but just to get Emma. David has since tried to accept Hook for Emma’s sake, but he still didn’t like it when Hook had two hands (David didn’t want Hook putting the moves on Emma).
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
Love the new chapter of this story, is hilarious:
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/11664406/6/What-the-Hell-5B-Speculation-Parody
love this part: “…So you are a pirate captain who`s no longer a pirate and she is a savior that doesnt save” So true this quote.
Slurpeez, I actually noticed something interesting in “Nimue:”
This was when Arthur was making his acid to use against the heroes. It got me wondering if the Sands could be wearing off. I ended up writing it into my own alternate ending to 5A. I also made the Siren from Lake Nostos the LotL.
It couldn’t be any more obvious just how wrong Hook is for Emma if the writers flashed a giant red sign. Oh wait, they already did that.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
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