Emma + Baelfire = Swanfire

[RumplesGirl]

I think Neal really does understand these parts of her, and her hesitation and need for assurance. Hook’s parting words were about how he would think about her every day, echoing how Neal thought of her with regret when separated, but this time Neal is not regretful but hopeful. He knew he would see Emma and Henry again. Emma needed to hear that.

It’s like that confession a few pages back, everyone was making it out that they’d never see Emma or Henry again, except Neal. He had hope and belief. Which was the entire theme of the episode.

When magic comes in, these painful things are going to happen, and Neal crossed worlds to be with Emma. I have no idea why he is not the one to go find her in NY but the writers better have a GOOD explanation why. He jumped on a shadow, at the slight risk to a small child (and I feel any danger from Shadow-gate is now sort of too remote since the shadow is dead). He was DESPERATE to see them, and I cannot imagine, even with the sadness that maybe Emma does not want him as a romantic partner that he would not still feel intensely motivated to see his son. That makes zero sense for his character.

we have those 312 set pics where Charming looks to be holding Nealfire back. As if Neal is trying to go with Hook or trying to rush to meet Hook on his horse. I think there is going to be a non-ship non-TL reason for why it’s Hook alone

 

[Phee]

She will have ALL that pain and emotion rush back, conflicting realities in her head and it is hard to say if the writers are just going to ignore the opportunity for her to truly address the fact that Neal only left her because of what he felt was his duty, just as she only left everyone pre-2nd-curse as her duty, because Henry would be left alone if she didn’t. She would choose Henry, absolutely every time, but it is not that she wanted to make that choice anymore than Neal or anyone else wanted to leave her.

Oh I hope they do address that. Curse related situations involving family being together, forcing each of them to make an impossible, heartbreaking choice, when they really don’t have a choice at all. Even if they do drop that point on the show, at least we know that it’s yet another thing they’ll have in common, which will deepen their understanding of each other. Actually, that’s probably part of the reason why he was able to keep calm during the goodbye, because he’s been in her shoes, and knows how hard it is for her to do what she knows she has to, and didn’t wanna make it any harder for her, so instead he stayed as strong as he could for her.

When magic comes in, these painful things are going to happen, and Neal crossed worlds to be with Emma. I have no idea why he is not the one to go find her in NY but the writers better have a GOOD explanation why. He jumped on a shadow, at the slight risk to a small child (and I feel any danger from Shadow-gate is now sort of too remote since the shadow is dead). He was DESPERATE to see them, and I cannot imagine, even with the sadness that maybe Emma does not want him as a romantic partner that he would not still feel intensely motivated to see his son. That makes zero sense for his character.

Well, consider how she reacted to him in Manhattan. She was pissed and ranting at him because of what she believed he’d done to her. Those memories of what he did are still in her head, even with the altered memories, so it’s reasonable to assume that if Neal was the one who’d showed up at her door, she’d have been pissed, and ranted, and with Henry right there, if she once again hasn’t told him the truth about who his father was, then that’s gonna make her even more pissed if he’s standing in her doorway.

Basically, it’s pretty good odds that Neal wouldn’t be able to get through to her. I’m sure he’d have loved to be the one who went, because he’d be desperate to see her and Henry again, (those spoiler pics showed him seeming upset over something, and this may well be it) but if the aim is to get her to listen, he’s not the best bet.

And if she doesn’t listen to whoever gets sent, then Emma never believes again, and she’ll never make it back to her family. It’s history repeating, Neal doing something that hurt him personally, (in the first instance leaving her, and in the second instance not going to her and sending someone else, Hook no less, in his place), to ensure that the end result will be that she can get back to her family.

If the writers want to develop CS,

I’m really not convinced that that’s their plan. Since the NL kiss we’ve seen her play it down as “just a kiss” to both Snow and Hook himself, we’ve seen her not show any interest in kissing him again, meanwhile she’s repeatedly talked about still being in love with Neal, we didn’t get any indication that she sought Hook out right after they got baack to SB, but she did eventually decide to go meet Neal for lunch, we saw her make a conscious effort to say goodbye to Neal, but didn’t approach Hook at all, she responded with the bland reaction of “good” when Hook said he’d think about her every day, and when he attempted to kiss her again, there was no TL magic, and she kneed him in the nuts, and he actually admitted defeat.

To me, it seems like they’ve been consistently writing CS as being very one sided, while exploring the fact that Emma does have deep (if conflicted) emotions (including love) for Neal. That means that it would be a complete and random 180 if Emma now decided to be in a relationship with Hook, and I like to think that they wouldn’t write something so unbelievable and out of character for their heroine, considering the opposite storyline they have actually put effort into constructing.

It absolutely annoys me that Hook has been reduced to fawning over and pining for Emma, because there are far more interesting things they could have him be doing. But at the same time, he’s got an obsessive nature, so I may be bugged by how he’s latched onto Emma, but latching onto a new whatever, (Milah, piracy, revenge, Emma), and devoting himself entirely to it is in character for him, so I’m not really surprised that he’s neck deep in the Emma thing, and was still hoping for a TLK a mere year later. Dude clung to his love for Milah and the revenge for a couple centuries, so 12 months is nothin’.

As long as the resolution of his Emma fixation is him finally realising, “Maybe being so obsessive isn’t exactly good form, and I’d be happier and maybe find an actual fulfilling relationship if I took a step back and adjusted my attitude,” then I’ll be able to look back and say that at least the decline in his storyline served a purpose. Of course, I don’t know if that IS what they’re planning for his story, but I’m holding onto that hope for a bit longer.

[RumplesGirl]

Yet, by bringing Hook to NYC instead of Neal, the writers are making Hook a fish out of water, making it painfully obvious that Hook doesn’t belong in this world. Hook is running around the big city dressed as a pirate waving his hook around making him look like an escaped convict from a mental institution. No wonder Emma probably calls the cops on him! Hook doesn’t belong in Emma’s world of NYC with her. Instead, he’s been sent to call her back to the world of fantasy and make-believe. Hook might represent adventure to Emma, but he also represents danger to the life she’s built for herself and Henry.

This is a really good point

Actually, that’s probably part of the reason why he was able to keep calm during the goodbye, because he’s been in her shoes, and knows how hard it is for her to do what she knows she has to, and didn’t wanna make it any harder for her, so instead he stayed as strong as he could for her.

Agreed. This moment was about Emma and their son. This wasn’t a time to become overly emotional. He has faith that they found each other once, they can do it again

t absolutely annoys me that Hook has been reduced to fawning over and pining for Emma, because there are far more interesting things they could have him be doing

Agreed. his whole character has been reduced to Emma (which I admit worries me sometimes). He has history with Rumple and with Neal. He helped GOAT kidnap Regina. Why aren’t these things being addressed? (I loved REgina’s “I still haven’t forgotten about that” in 311. I cheered and yelled “well at least someone hasn’t!)

 

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[heatherc1275]

Slurpeez108 wrote: Yet, by bringing Hook to NYC instead of Neal, the writers are making Hook a fish out of water, making it painfully obvious that Hook doesn’t belong in this world. Hook is running around the big city dressed as a pirate waving his hook around making him look like an escaped convict from a mental institution. No wonder Emma probably calls the cops on him! Hook doesn’t belong in Emma’s world of NYC with her. Instead, he’s been sent to call her back to the world of fantasy and make-believe. Hook might represent adventure to Emma, but he also represents danger to the life she’s built for herself and Henry.

This is a really good point

Phee wrote: Actually, that’s probably part of the reason why he was able to keep calm during the goodbye, because he’s been in her shoes, and knows how hard it is for her to do what she knows she has to, and didn’t wanna make it any harder for her, so instead he stayed as strong as he could for her.

Agreed. This moment was about Emma and their son. This wasn’t a time to become overly emotional. He has faith that they found each other once, they can do it again

Phee wrote: t absolutely annoys me that Hook has been reduced to fawning over and pining for Emma, because there are far more interesting things they could have him be doing

Agreed. his whole character has been reduced to Emma (which I admit worries me sometimes). He has history with Rumple and with Neal. He helped GOAT kidnap Regina. Why aren’t these things being addressed? (I loved Regina’s “I still haven’t forgotten about that” in 311. I cheered and yelled “well at least someone hasn’t!)

Regina was speaking for a LOT of fans when she said she hadn’t forgotten about that and I REALLY need them to step up and make Hook pay for the stuff he’s done to everyone. Seriously. 🙁

I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again even though I know it sounds horrible….this show could absolutely go on just fine story wise if they got rid of Hook but they’ve all ready shown how many characters would be affected negatively if Neal’s gone. Hook is always on the outside; he’s is a much more interesting character when he’s not fawning over someone who clearly isn’t as into him as he is into her and it’s sad that he’s come to that right now. Triangles of Doom….destroying characters one by one since the dawn of television, and if this triangle does anything like that to Emma or Neal, which it hasn’t yet, then I’m leading the fan revolt to Adam & Eddy’s houses and they will know for sure how annoyed we are by the writing.

Neal and Emma are definitely going to have one more thing to bond over when they reunite…she’s going to understand way better what it feels like to give up everything you love because it’s part of something much bigger that saves everyone else. The only difference for her is that she’s with Henry. That type of sacrifice and their past history isn’t something she’s been able to talk to him about yet but she will for sure be able to see his perspective a lot better after this experience. I will rage and storm Vancouver if they don’t cover this with Emma & Neal at some point in this second half of S3. Seriously, there are all ready SO MANY ISSUES between these two people….why did we need the Triangle of Doom??! 🙁

#HopeforSwanFire

 

#MoreBOOMLessGloom

[RumplesGirl]

Triangles of Doom….destroying characters one by one since the dawn of television, and if this triangle does anything like that to Emma or Neal, which it hasn’t yet, then I’m leading the fan revolt to Adam & Eddy’s houses and they will know for sure how annoyed we are by the writing

Which is why, in the back of my mind, I’ve always wondered if the triangle was a thing they always planned for.

Neal and Emma are definitely going to have one more thing to bond over when they reunite…she’s going to understand way better what it feels like to give up everything you love because it’s part of something much bigger that saves everyone else. The only difference for her is that she’s with Henry. That type of sacrifice and their past history isn’t something she’s been able to talk to him about yet but she will for sure be able to see his perspective a lot better after this experience.

This!

#HopeForSwanFire

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Slurpeez]

Neal and Emma are definitely going to have one more thing to bond over when they reunite…she’s going to understand way better what it feels like to give up everything you love because it’s part of something much bigger that saves everyone else. The only difference for her is that she’s with Henry. That type of sacrifice and their past history isn’t something she’s been able to talk to him about yet but she will for sure be able to see his perspective a lot better after this experience. I will rage and storm Vancouver if they don’t cover this with Emma & Neal at some point in this second half of S3.

That’s an excellent point which I hadn’t even considered! Emma walking away from her parents for the sake of Henry very much mirrors Neal walking away from Emma for the sake of her parents! I think the writers are clearly going to give Emma and Neal even more empathy and understanding for one another in the future knowing what it means to make huge self-sacrifices of the people they love. Emma had to do right by Henry when this new curse came just as Neal had to do right by Emma when the first curse hit so she could save her parents. The only difference is that Emma got to have Henry at least, whereas Neal had to struggle on alone after the first curse hit.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

[RumplesGirl]

heatherc1275 wrote: Neal and Emma are definitely going to have one more thing to bond over when they reunite…she’s going to understand way better what it feels like to give up everything you love because it’s part of something much bigger that saves everyone else. The only difference for her is that she’s with Henry. That type of sacrifice and their past history isn’t something she’s been able to talk to him about yet but she will for sure be able to see his perspective a lot better after this experience. I will rage and storm Vancouver if they don’t cover this with Emma & Neal at some point in this second half of S3.

That’s an excellent point which I hadn’t even considered! Emma walking away from her parents for the sake of Henry very much mirrors Neal walking away from Emma for the sake of her parents! I think the writers are clearly going to give Emma and Neal even more empathy and understanding for one another in the future knowing what it means to make huge self-sacrifices of the people they love. Emma had to do right by Henry when this new curse came just as Neal had to do right by Emma when the first curse hit so she could save her parents. The only difference is that Emma got to have Henry at least, whereas Neal had to struggle on alone after the first curse hit.

Great points! And it demonstrates what we’ve been saying for awhile: even though they’re apart, they just *get* each other. Like Emma knowing about the hatch marks or the coconut.

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Phee]

I think the writers are clearly going to give Emma and Neal even more empathy and understanding for one another in the future knowing what it means to make huge self-sacrifices of the people they love.

It’s sort of an unavoidable consequence, given the situation they’ve set up now. This NewCurse sucks for SF because they’re separated and she doesn’t remember him, but it’s beneficial for SF because she’ll ultimately be able to understand him on a whole other level. Like, there’s really no way around it, she’s been in almost the exact same situation he was, so if she was still holding onto any sort of animosity over how he’d left her, after this experience, she’ll get it, and that animosity will evaporate, and they’ll bond over their shared experience, and it will bring them closer together.

[Slurpeez]

Basically, it’s pretty good odds that Neal wouldn’t be able to get through to her. I’m sure he’d have loved to be the one who went, because he’d be desperate to see her and Henry again, (those spoiler pics showed him seeming upset over something, and this may well be it) but if the aim is to get her to listen, he’s not the best bet.

And if she doesn’t listen to whoever gets sent, then Emma never believes again, and she’ll never make it back to her family. It’s history repeating, Neal doing something that hurt him personally, (in the first instance leaving her, and in the second instance not going to her and sending someone else, Hook no less, in his place), to ensure that the end result will be that she can get back to her family.

Once again, Neal makes the selfless decision with regards to Emma, putting her happiness in the hands of another, a rival no less, for the sake of her family no less!

I’m really not convinced that that’s their plan. Since the NL kiss we’ve seen her play it down as “just a kiss” to both Snow and Hook himself, we’ve seen her not show any interest in kissing him again, meanwhile she’s repeatedly talked about still being in love with Neal, we didn’t get any indication that she sought Hook out right after they got baack to SB, but she did eventually decide to go meet Neal for lunch, we saw her make a conscious effort to say goodbye to Neal, but didn’t approach Hook at all, she responded with the bland reaction of “good” when Hook said he’d think about her every day, and when he attempted to kiss her again, there was no TL magic, and she kneed him in the nuts, and he actually admitted defeat.

All great points! I love how CS is already declaring victory, despite the fact that Neal said, “This isn’t over. I’ll see you both again.” I must be watching a completely different show than CS fans, because it seems like we read things so differently. I realize it’s a matter of subjectivity to a certain point, but the fact still remains that Neal and Emma are going to see each other again. It’s not over! It’s pretty evident from where I sit that Emma is still unclear on Hook but that Emma and Neal have unfinished business!

To me, it seems like they’ve been consistently writing CS as being very one sided, while exploring the fact that Emma does have deep (if conflicted) emotions (including love) for Neal. That means that it would be a complete and random 180 if Emma now decided to be in a relationship with Hook, and I like to think that they wouldn’t write something so unbelievable and out of character for their heroine, considering the opposite storyline they have actually put effort into constructing.

While I think CS will still be explore more, I think that if anything, Emma spending time with Hook will show her just how unsuited he is for her. He’s still in love with the idea of Emma, the image of the woman he’s built up in his mind. Every time Emma and Hook have spent any significant amount of time together, it’s always been under distress in a far off land where adventure and danger lurk behind every corner. And guess what? Danger can be exciting and cause the adrenaline to rush, which many people confuse with feelings of “being in love.” Hook’s experience tells him that love means sailing off together on a ship without any cares or responsibilities. Yet, Emma and Hook have never really even really spent a “normal” day together on dry land. In fact, I think if Hook actually were to spend a good portion of time in SB or NYC without any pressing danger to face he’d eventually grow bored out of his mind! By contrast, Emma’s idea of a happy ending clearly is just having a normal life with her son doing normal thing like making him breakfast. Those little family things are the kind of thing Emma and Neal both want and partially why I think they’ll get their everyday “happily ever after” real-life fairytale together.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

[RumplesGirl]

Slurpeez108 wrote: I think the writers are clearly going to give Emma and Neal even more empathy and understanding for one another in the future knowing what it means to make huge self-sacrifices of the people they love.

It’s sort of an unavoidable consequence, given the situation they’ve set up now. This NewCurse sucks for SF because they’re separated and she doesn’t remember him, but it’s beneficial for SF because she’ll ultimately be able to understand him on a whole other level. Like, there’s really no way around it, she’s been in almost the exact same situation he was, so if she was still holding onto any sort of animosity over how he’d left her, after this experience, she’ll get it, and that animosity will evaporate, and they’ll bond over their shared experience, and it will bring them closer together.

It is unavoidable and if the writers DO avoid it, I am going to be irate. It HAS to come up. Put aside shippy end-game-ness. This is a huge step in the character development of Emma. She is walking in Neal’s shoes. She has to be able to see that and then at least TALK to him about it.

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Author]

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