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When coming to the forums … I always love this thread . . . What were your FAVORITE AND LEAST FAVORITE MOMENTS from this episode 5 x20 “FIREBIRD”
INCLUDE ANY favorite dialogue too.
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.[adrotate group="5"]The first 40 minutes or so of this episode were pretty good. I liked what they did with Zades and Hades himself is just outstanding (though I’m bummed with the reversal, we knew it was coming). But the final 20-25 mins were just hard to watch. Given what happened, no one can honestly expect me to be in love with this episode. I’m never going to approve of *that* ‘ship and I’ll forever think it’s a giant mistake for the writers to try and push it the way they are because it’s not…good. In my eyes, at least. Emma only having a heart full of TL with Hook doesn’t make a lick of sense and it’s disheartening given how Emma was conceived.
LIKED
–LOVED that they recreated the pilot but with Emma and Cleo
–“Ex pirate with a rum habit”
–Hades ripping up the contract for Zelena without hesistation
–Zades!!! True Love!! Yay! (what is happening to me…?) “When will you believe, I’ll do anything for you?”
–Orpheus and Eurydice shout out!! Yay #Goodmythology
–Heart judgement = Egyptian mythology with Anubis and Ma’at (weigh heart against a feather) so semi-good mythology still gets my nod of approval
–LOL at Cruella and the Blind Witch
–Rumple getting the better of Pan with “villains never get happy endings”
–Bye Bye Robbie Kay; he’s been excellent. He will be missed as well.
MIXED
–So Hades’ heart was frozen AND he was banished to the Underworld for all of time? Mmkay. #BadMythology (but at this point I’m just relieved when they get ANY myth right)
–So now Henry can control his power enough to write everyone their unfinished business? That’s just nonsense. But at least they followed through with Operation Firebird even if it’s a literal handwave and isn’t what the Author’s power is.
–Hook staying down below. Yeah, he should and I’m glad he recognizes. He’s dead and at some point dead is dead has to mean something (y’know, besides for Neal and Graham) but it doesn’t matter. He’ll come back and have his happy ending, never having to actually atone fully for his crimes (like all the murder!) The writers want their cake and to eat it too.
–Henry gets bored halfway through writing people’s unfinished business and decides “people will find them”?
DISLIKED
–How does Emma even know about the contract between Rumple and Hades?
–The heart split won’t work because Hook’s been down there too long? And his soul has left his body? So does the soul know when to leave? When is too long? When is just right? Why does the world building on this show make no flipping sense?
–TLK doesn’t work on Rumbelle because Belle doesn’t accept Rumple as he is?! Malarkey
–Cleo’s coat inspires Emma’s coat, not Neal’s coat from “Tallahassee” There goes that headcanon.
–The royal navy taught Hook Ancient Greek, a language native to this world??? LOL, no.
–Emma’s heart is the heart of True Love Incarnate. She should pass the test, pirate or not. The fact that the writers made it all about HIM is so….anger inducing. Emma was always True Love Incarnate and even if not, Henry is her Canon True Love. This isn’t new information. But now she can only have a heart full of True Love if it’s about Hook. Bull. Just bull. Stop making Emma’s only relevancy about her boyfriend.
–Hook and Emma being true love in any way, shape, or form. Nope.
–I’m bummed Hades turned on everyone. I think his love for Zelena is pure and real but it’s clouded by his need to outsmart them. I really wanted him to be around for longer but that seems unlikely.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"Okay, so I did a running thing while I was watching, so it’s more…reactions.
Overall, though, I think this was not my favorite episode. Some stuff didn’t make a lot of sense (the box was needed why?) and yeah, my favorites weren’t getting quite enough spotlight.
–Well…ten minutes in and that was a quick turn of events…wow.
–Yay for Emma getting to Rumple as fast as she did for once. She actually feels like Emma right now.
–So, does TLK not work because Rumple’s not ready to let go of the power, or because Belle can’t trust him anymore?
–Also, they’ve had so many almosts, that when the Real TLK really does come for them (and I’m confident it will), it’s going to have to be truly brilliant…and somehow they’re going to have to redeem Rumple completely in the bargain for all the S4 nonsense…
–So confused about the why pandora’s box is even relevant. All Rumple has to do is get Belle to the portal. He has magic. Not hard.
–Well, YEAH Robin is not okay with your putting his baby, who he’s been protecting all this time, into the arms of his rapist just because YOU trust her now. (Also the irony of Hook not trusting people to change that quickly echoes here…)
–NO RUMPLE NO. YOU PUT THAT HEART BACK RIGHT NOW.
–OMG Henry helping Stealthy is the happiest thing ever.
–Wait just how is Cruella supposed to have a claim on the Underworld? She’s not a god. She’s not even very magical.
–Okay, I’m loving that the Blind Witch is helping her though. New broship.
–Emma is True Love Incarnate. She shouldn’t need a final test to prove she loves Killian…though it does seem fair that it was a) sacrificial and b) filled with love in that moment. (Rumbeller in me hoping it’s a bit of foreshadowing?)
–Oh wait, I’m angry at Rumple; WHY is he torturing Robin again? Also what about not leaving children fatherless? Robin’s got as many as any of them.
–I knew the lady was toast as soon as I saw that jacket…but still ouch.
–I’d be a lot more moved by Hook’s being left behind if I believed it could stick…I just don’t anymore.
–Also, wait, Rumple escaped the Underworld, too. Special case perhaps, but…there were THREE souls at least who did.
–Yay armour!
–Wait, what? Rumple you…wow. I’m glad you didn’t actually hurt Robin but Lost Soulsing your father, that’s harsh. Really harsh.
–Okay, so you can put a Belle in a Box.
–Rumple, why you no check your grandson is okay? (I’m going with the headcanon that he assumed everyone else was already through, but I dunno.)
–Hades, darling, you covered all the heroes but didn’t think to distract Rumple further?
–Still convinced we’ve not seen the last of Hook (and not because of spoilers but because of the way this show seems to go). Which is actually tragic cuz that sense takes away from his farewell’s power, and Emma’s choice to protect the rest of her family instead.Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
It was enlightening and entertaining! I give it a 8/10.
Liked:
The perfect parallel of Bondswoman Emma & Bondswoman Fox….we finally learned who basically taught Emma everything she knows.
Origin Story of the Red Jacket.
I actually kind of like Zades & their true love!
Cruella being Ruler of the Underworld and working with the Blind Witch….I love this new friendship!
Henry helping everyone finish their unfinished business!
Regina’s snark is always loved!
Regina and Zelena’s sisterly moment, and Regina convincing Robin to give Zelena a chance!
The Family moments in the beginning of the episode!
Rumple beating Pan at his own game!
Mixed:
Rumple and Belle true love not working…I’m not really surprised because he loves his power more than he loves his wife.
Dislike:
Just when I start rooting for Hades, he goes and pulls that stunt.
Hook insulting Regina’s intelligence and trying to point out why they shouldn’t trust Zelena, Hades, etc when everyone’s in Hell trying to save him because he was originally going to send them to Hell in the first place.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
–TLK doesn’t work on Rumbelle because Belle doesn’t accept Rumple as he is?! Malarkey
Yeah, I think it’s because Rumple’s not willing to sacrifice his power for her yet, but it was…a frustrating moment.
Also I’m still stuck on how in 5A they told us TLK didn’t work because Rumple wanted the DO Curse enough that it stopped being a curse. I’m still trying to puzzle out how he couldn’t wake her if the issue is breaking a curse he wants so it’s not a curse anymore… round and round in my head.
So I’m going with for TLK to work you have to be in a sacrifice-anything-for-the-other kind of moment. He’s not willing to sacrifice his power, so it won’t work for him.
Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
I liked this one more than I thought I would. But that’s mainly because of one specific thing and if that gets reversed in future episodes, it will change my opinion of this episode.
LIKED
– They FINALLY left the underworld. Here’s to no more red tint!
– Hook is still dead. Personally I like sticking to “dead is dead” and “whatever happened, happened”, even in fantasy. It keeps things meaningful. I just hope it stays that way, although I have serious doubts.
– Hook and Emma’s goodbye. This was a moving scene, which will lose all meaning if Hook returns.
– Cleo and the flashbacks. It was nice spending time with pre-Storybrooke Emma. I liked Cleo as a character and also the message she was trying to impart.
– Pan is gone. I half-thought he’d make a comeback and I’m glad that’s not the case. He was great but he’s had his time, let’s move on.
– Rumple returning Robin’s heart. How surprisingly compassionate.
– Hades remaining a manipulative, deceitful jerk. He’s the Lord of the Underworld. Let’s not try to reform everyone.
MIXED
– Rumple’s kiss not being a TLK. I’m so confused about what constitutes TL at this point that I don’t know what to say about this.
– Everything was a bit rushed. But I liked that things moved along, so I’m not really complaining.
DISLIKED
– Portals appearing without explanation, like trains at a train station. All we needed was a voiceover – “Next portal from Underbrooke, nonstop to Storybrooke will depart from the clocktower in 1 min. Passengers for this service please pass through now.”
– Operation Firebird. The underworld has existed since the dawn of time (I think) and yet Henry thinks it’s up to him to help because people might not know what their unfinished business is? Talk about having a hero complex.
– How easy it is to rip out Emma’s heart these days. ‘Queen of Hearts’ never happened.
– Emma’s heart being filled with ‘true love’ for her boyfriend. No. Emma is the product of True Love. Hook has nothing to do with it.
– Zades TLK. She trusts him, he’s lying to her, so how can this be true love? I guess that it can be love, since he obviously cares about her, but calling it the highest form of love is an honour the relationship doesn’t deserve IMO.
– Emma’s goodbye with Henry at the elevator door. She was potentially going to her death!! Henry used to be Emma’s TL and this goodbye had all the emotion of a documentary on drainage systems.
– Regina’s treatment of Robin. She was pressuring him to hand his baby over to his rapist!!! It’s great that she trusts Zelena, but Robin doesn’t, and he has every right not to. I mean, he doesn’t have a television in the woods, so he couldn’t tune in to ‘Sisters’ last week. Regina should have been more understanding. Also, we see that Robin was right. Zelena didn’t reform Hades and they almost got trapped in the underworld while Zelena left with Hades, taking the baby with her.
Pan is dead, and I am sad.
Also, Emma’s heart should not be removable!
Flashbacks were good, though.
Thought I was going to dislike this episode but didn’t
Liked:
Rumple bests Pan again that is how it should be
Loved the flashbacks and the history of the red jacket
Actually liked Hook’s staying behind and Emma letting him stay behind. Dead is dead but I know it won’t stay this way
“Stiltskins”
Mixed:
Regina telling Robin to give the baby to Zalena. Why should he trust his baby girl with Hades and Zalena just on Regina’s suggestion. Bad move on Regina for telling him to and Robin for doing what she said.
OK, so now Emma needs to protect Zalena because she is part of the family. If I am not mistaken she killed Emma’s sons dad. Should not be able to come back from that.
TLK not working for Rumple and Belle. I put this in the mix because I am hopeful that it will work by the end of the season and should be a much bigger moment for the couple.
Disliked:
Emma’s heart being taken out, I don’t think this should be able to happen.
Emma and Hook’s true love test, I don’t know I believe it wouldn’t matter who was in danger Emma would have tried to rescue them.
Ok, so I also enjoyed most of the episode mainly because there were things in it I did not see coming and I can appreciate it when this predictable show still surprises me occasionally. 8/10
Liked:
– Hook staying in UW and their plan not working. I really just did not expect this and I like it, even though I’m sure they will find a way to get him back eventually, but it wasn’t a magical maguffin of ambrosia…yet.
– Hades playing them the whole time. I thought he was the whole time until recently and so it still fooled me. He really does love Zelena but he’s still not a great person and he still clearly has plans for his brother Zeus. I just think the fact that he truly does love Zelena, and yet still is a villain just adds more depth to the character.
– Rumple attempting true love’s kiss. I wanted him to at least try it and he did. And it didn’t work, as it shouldn’t have. He needs to change in order to wake her up. Maybe it will be her father after all. I’m just glad he tried and verified that this relationship is very broken at the moment.
– Rumple getting the best of Pan. I really thought he ripped out Robin’s heart and was going to go through with it. Which would have pissed me off bc we know Rumple hates his father. So the fact that he tricked and sent Pan to a watery grave was perfect, and just shows that Rumple only cares about three things in this world: himself, Belle (and baby), and his power.
– Cruella and blind witch. I mean they were great.
– Regina and Zelena trust moments. These two have come quite a long way. It’s going to crush Zelena to know what Hades tried to do. I expect she will be in denial.
– Hook and Emma’s goodbye scene with the world’s slowest moving elevator. I just thought their chemistry was strong in this episode and I do feel for Emma. They all failed at the one task they were trying to accomplish and it was definitely something I didn’t see coming.
Mixed:
– The whole Emma true love thing. I mean I thought it was cool that Hook went up in flames and she was basically dying herself from not having her heart and she had to choose and “proved” that she loves Hook. It’s just, a little much, but unlike some people on here, I do believe she loves him and it was quite the test for this couple. And I think their chemistry was actually quite strong in this episode. There were quite a few moments where no one said anything, but they just looked at each other and you knew what they were feeling.
– So Hades has TLK and that opens up a portal? How exactly? Is this something Zeus set up?
– Flashbacks were cool but predictable. Still nice to get some answers. I did love the first scene mirroring the pilot.
– I’m going to accept that Emma’s heart can be taken if she allows it. But this is a fine line and I don’t love it.
Disliked:
– Henry can write people’s unfinished business. Huh?
– The whole thing with Hook’s body being down there too long I guess works, since the only time we saw the heart split work was with Charming who was dead for like a couple minutes. But still, it’s a stretch.
– How exactly does Belle being in Pandora’s box help anything? I guess it makes it easier for Rumple to move her, but idk.
I’m more excited for what’s to come. What is Hades’ backstory that makes him still feel this much hatred and desire for revenge? What’s his plan? Is it still to go back in time and change things? He has true love now and he’s not trapped anymore in the UW so shouldn’t he be fine now? What does he want and why did he not want the heroes to come to storybrooke with him? And is Hook really gone? How are they going to bring him back? Neal said this wouldn’t end the way she thinks it will. So what is next?
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