Mr. Gold/Rumpelstiltskin Character Analysis

[spinninggold]

@PriceofMagic wrote:

[ “I wonder if Zozo (the previous Dark One) chose Rumple because he saw The Full Monty.”

Yes! He saw Rumpel’s rear of the year and thought: “That would look great, clad in skin thight leather.” 😆

But on a more serious note, I don’t think Zoso considered Rumpel’s intelligence. He saw a desperate man that would go to any length to save his son.
I think it is interesting to see how Robert Carlyle plays these parts of a self-sacrificing father, seeing his own background where his mom left him as a small kid (I keep forgetting if it is 4 or 6) and he has being raised by his dad. There seems to be such despair and yet fight in him. It is beautiful to watch, also because he conveys such an enormous love in it. It is conveyed through every action, which makes himsuch a wonderful actor. I think Carlyle himself would have followed his son through the portal though… but then there would have been no story.

[gypsy]

Rumplestiltskin – on the word of an old begggar, a stranger (who, unbeknown to him, was The Dark One) – made a plan, set the Duke’s castle on fire, scaled the wall, enterd the ‘foyer’ that held the dagger, stole it right out from under the Duke’s nose, all while running the risk of coming into contact with Hordor and the knights at any given moment, knowing that his actions would ultimately summon The Dark One – a terrifying, menacing being.
He actually summoned The Dark One and proceeded to kill him, assuming his powers.

Those just don’t seem like the actions of a true coward to me.

To depict Rumplestiltskin as such a coward, then to show him risking his life doing what he did….he was less of a coward at that moment than when he had his Dark One powers and let Bae go into the vortex alone.

I don’t know if there’s more to it, or that’s just how they chose to move the story forward, but, it made me stop and think, because that was out of character for Rumplestiltskin, imo.

If Zoso was controlled by the owner of the dagger, how was he able to get to Rumple in the first place?

And the fact that Rumple pulled it off flawlessly, without a hitch???

[spinninggold]

@Gypsy wrote:

To depict Rumplestiltskin as such a coward, then to show him risking his life doing what he did….he was less of a coward at that moment than when he had his Dark One powers and let Bae go into the vortex alone.

Well, I don’t think Rumpelstiltskin is a coward, at all, but it is how the world sees him and how he sees himself (after being told long enough, you start believing). The chance to redeem himself, and save his son in the proces was one he could not pass up. He was truly a desperate soul, so easy for Zoso to exploit. Not a coward, he would sacrifice himself for his son, no doubt.

However when his son goes down the vortex, the curse grabs hold of him, kinda like in Lordof the Rings, when Frodo wants to cast the ring in the Mount Doom. He can’t do it the power of the curse is to big. Just like with the Ring , we see Rumpel’s eyes become bigger as the curse consumes him. I think Rumpel eventually would have made the right choice, but he is too late, and the portal closes.

Zoso was able to pull it off because he only needs to do what he is summoned for when someone has the knife. If they have no mission for him, he is “free” to do what he wants.

[mich7]

@SpinningGold wrote:

@PriceofMagic wrote:

[ “I wonder if Zozo (the previous Dark One) chose Rumple because he saw The Full Monty.”

Yes! He saw Rumpel’s rear of the year and thought: “That would look great, clad in skin thight leather.” 😆

But on a more serious note, I don’t think Zoso considered Rumpel’s intelligence. He saw a desperate man that would go to any length to save his son.
I think it is interesting to see how Robert Carlyle plays these parts of a self-sacrificing father, seeing his own background where his mom left him as a small kid (I keep forgetting if it is 4 or 6) and he has being raised by his dad. There seems to be such despair and yet fight in him. It is beautiful to watch, also because he conveys such an enormous love in it. It is conveyed through every action, which makes himsuch a wonderful actor. I think Carlyle himself would have followed his son through the portal though… but then there would have been no story.

True there would have been no story but there is always a chance that there may be more to it…with this prophecy thing coming up I’m wondering just how much Rumple may have known. On the surface it looks like Rumple let go of Bae because he didn’t want to give up his power but what if he knew Bae had to go and had to go alone. Not saying they will do something like that but they have been known to go back to previous scenes and add a few things that were intentionally left out and the whole perspective of what happened changes.

Also I think that Rumple’s out of character bravery in stealing that dagger had to do with his motivation…anything for Bae. I think it was Zoso’s goading Rumple about Bae when they were talking that finally pushed Rumple to the point where he could actually kill Zoso. His fear for what might happen to Bae overwhelmed any fear (and cowardice) he might have had for Zoso.

Really Rumple can be brave when he wants to be…I thought it was brave to even approach Hook when he took Milah…Rumple didn’t have the experience fighting that Hook did. He’s brave in going out of Storybrook…possibly risking losing his memory if something unforeseen happens(and facing a son that might not forgive him). The only time I’ve really seen any true cowardice is when he was with Belle and wouldn’t tell her the truth for fear of losing her…Rumple’s motivation for whatever he does(whether brave or cowardly) is always tied to the people he loves imo.

[gypsy]

Zoso was able to pull it off because he only needs to do what he is summoned for when someone has the knife. If they have no mission for him, he is “free” to do what he wants.

I don’t think that’s the case, but, if that were true, if Cora and/or Hook get ahold of the dagger, and are not holding it to summon Rumple to do their bidding at any given moment, then Rumple would still have an opportunity to kill either one or both of them, get the dagger back and he’d be right back where he was before they took it.

Same with Zoso, if he ‘s free to do what he wants when the dagger is not being put to use, why not kill the holder of the dagger, and take it back? If Zoso was in possion of dagger when he was the Dark One, he would’ve had freedom to weild his power the way he wanted, like Rumplestiltskin did.

[spinninggold]

@Mich7 wrote:

The only time I’ve really seen any true cowardice is when he was with Belle and wouldn’t tell her the truth for fear of losing her…Rumple’s motivation for whatever he does(whether brave or cowardly) is always tied to the people he loves imo.

I think that might not be cowardness after all. More like sacrifice. Think of it for a moment: He has done everything to keep the promise to his son the past 300 year. But he needs his magic for that (or at least is convinced he does) If Belle “cures” him of that, it’s gone.So he gets mad. Now let’s go a step further. Maybe Rumpelstiltskin knows the ingredients he need for the curse: True love and the heart of what he loves most. Both can be found in Belle. So he would need to sacrifice her for his son. And part of him would, certainly. He has placed his son above everything. But he loves Belle too. He probably knows himself enough to know he can’t trust himself with such a temptation. So he makes the only decision he can: to send her away.

And actually with Robert Carlyle would have followed his son, I meant he acted it too well. Like he portrayed the love for his son, there is no way there would be a doubt in his mind, once the time came. He’s a lovely dad. I do think it fits with Rumpel though.

To Gypsy: I agree, it is a bit strange. Usually genies can’t turn against their owner unless they trick them, but if the knife was out in the open like that he should be able to grab it back… Unless he already had the order he could not.

[gypsy]

Well, I definitely don’t consider The Dark One a genie 🙂

And if he can be ordered not to take the dagger, couldn’t he just as easily be ordered not to use his free will for anything?

I don’t think The Dark One is free to do as he pleases when he’s not on a ‘mission’.
It was never alluded to in any way.

So, the question still remains, how was he able to get to Rumple in the first place?

[mich7]

@SpinningGold wrote:

@Mich7 wrote:

The only time I’ve really seen any true cowardice is when he was with Belle and wouldn’t tell her the truth for fear of losing her…Rumple’s motivation for whatever he does(whether brave or cowardly) is always tied to the people he loves imo.

I think that might not be cowardness after all. More like sacrifice. Think of it for a moment: He has done everything to keep the promise to his son the past 300 year. But he needs his magic for that (or at least is convinced he does) If Belle “cures” him of that, it’s gone.So he gets mad. Now let’s go a step further. Maybe Rumpelstiltskin knows the ingredients he need for the curse: True love and the heart of what he loves most. Both can be found in Belle. So he would need to sacrifice her for his son. And part of him would, certainly. He has placed his son above everything. But he loves Belle too. He probably knows himself enough to know he can’t trust himself with such a temptation. So he makes the only decision he can: to send her away.

I actually wasn’t even thinking about when he sent Belle away when I posted that (and I do agree with you on that) but I was thinking more of when he didn’t tell her that he killed Milah because he was afraid of losing her. I think that is a trait that is pretty common in most of us.

[spinninggold]

Gypsy: Remember, Rumpelstiltskin is the master of loopholes and plotting, it only figures that the previous Dark One is similar. Plus, Zoso wants to die. He has had enough of life, and wants someone to kill him so he is put out of his misery. It figures, because the Dark One is immortal, Zoso probably has seen all his loved ones die. He probably can’t kill himself, just like Rumpel couldn’t make himself go through the portal. The curse posseses you at such a moment, keeping you back. Therefor having the knife himself would be useless. He needed a poor schmuck that was desperate to do so: Rumpel.

Mich7: I haven’t seen that episode yet, but I agree with you. Rumpelstiltskin, even without the curse, is a flawed man, like we all are. That’s why as much as I like Belle, I’m coming to wonder if they are right for each other. Yes, he loves her, and he would change for her best he can. But she loves the man she thinks he should be, not the man he is. When she is with him, it is out of a romantic notion that she is his saviour instead of accepting his flaws and loving him flaws and all. That’s why she is threatening to leave him, at least once an episode.(from what I gathered so far, still have to SEE the episodes, so I could be wrong)

[ser_dragon]

@SpinningGold wrote:

That’s why as much as I like Belle, I’m coming to wonder if they are right for each other. Yes, he loves her, and he would change for her best he can. But she loves the man she thinks he should be, not the man he is. When she is with him, it is out of a romantic notion that she is his saviour instead of accepting his flaws and loving him flaws and all. That’s why she is threatening to leave him, at least once an episode.(from what I gathered so far, still have to SEE the episodes, so I could be wrong)

This. I wondered why Belle couldn’t accept him as he is/was. I mean of course if he can change a little, become better, it’s all good, but why some women want to change the man they ‘love’ at all coast? After all maybe Belle loosing her memory isn’t that bad… 🙄 Maybe she’s not really the “one only for him”?

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