Pot Holes Questions

[RumplesGirl]

@PriceofMaigc wrote:

Also, and this is just IMO, PP didn’t seem to know where Henry was, in time or location. It seemed like he was just picking random boys from the world, taking them to Neverland and getting Felix and the others to hold up the picture of Henry and go “Is this the boy?” “No”,”Is this the boy?” “No”,”Is this the boy?” “No”. PP doesn’t seem to have a clue when Henry will come into existence, just that he is special for some reason. If PP was controlling everything, he wouldn’t have needed to steal boys until the early 2000s

That’s true but I think he needs boys shadows for some reason. In my own theory, the shadows of the boys PP is taking are used to “fuel” NL’s magic to keep anyone from aging. Henry’s shadow is more powerful than the rest and will ensure that NL is always magical and PP will never age nor have to take any other boys shadows. So, that’s why he needs boys in NL until he get to Henry. We know time runs parallel in the worlds (according to Adam) so PP has to bide his time until Henry comes. They check each boy to make sure it isn’t Henry, and when it isn’t they take his shadow, except Bae because PP knew that Bae would be Henry’s father and therefore he couldn’t take his shadow.

@Jospehine wrote:

I’m confused on the whole Home Office thing. They’re an “anti-magic” organization that is probably ultimately headed by some boy sitting in a tree-house hideout in Neverland like an adolescent Dr. Evil, who instead of petting his cat has Tinkerbelle at his side. Why would an anti-magic league work in concert with a magic mastermind? If Wendy is behind the formation of THO after Bae was taken, why should her organization work for the same people she’s trying to fight?

I thik THO can be whatever its recruits need it to be. So, for example, GOAT really hate magic so THO presents itself as an anti-magic establishment, determined to wipe out magic. But that’s not really what they are about. They are a front for PP (who is NOT a boy, but at least 18-20) in NL. They are his “arm” in this world. I wouldn’t be surprised if they have agencies in every world, the BF for example in FTL.

Also, if time runs concurrently between worlds then Rumple and Bae’s initial story happened 300 years ago. That puts us in the early 1700s. That doesn’t fit with Bae being dumped in Victorian England, which was the latter part of the 1800s. It’s so confusing. 😕

I’m not going to lie: this is exactly why we’ve all stopped saying “timeline” around here and now just call it “the t-word” because this gave everyone headaches for weeks.

I do wonder if all of our suppositions are way off. :geek:

Of course they are. I think I’ve been right 5% of the time.

[HappyEndings]

@PriceofMagic wrote:

I don’t think PP has controlled and manipulated everything from Rumple being the Dark One to Henry ending up in Storybrooke. Not only does it make PP seem so bad that his actual defeat could be a letdown if the heroes defeat him quite easily but also there’s no sense of escalation for season 4 if PP is the baddest big bad of them all.

Also, and this is just IMO, PP didn’t seem to know where Henry was, in time or location. It seemed like he was just picking random boys from the world, taking them to Neverland and getting Felix and the others to hold up the picture of Henry and go “Is this the boy?” “No”,”Is this the boy?” “No”,”Is this the boy?” “No”. PP doesn’t seem to have a clue when Henry will come into existence, just that he is special for some reason. If PP was controlling everything, he wouldn’t have needed to steal boys until the early 2000s.

I totally agree with this especially the last paragraph 😛

[Josephine]

What if the shadow isn’t just PP’s? What if he uses all the shadows he collects as his henchmen, his scouts. He sends them out on his missions because they can move between worlds. The more shadows he collects that will do his bidding, the closer he is to finding Henry. So if he picks up some boys who aren’t the one he wants, he can still use them for his purpose. The more people working for him, the faster the job is done.

I still have no idea why Henry is his ultimate goal. I keep thinking even Peter Pan is working for someone else. It’s season three. I don’t think they’d want to unveil the ultimate mastermind at the end of season two-beginning of season three. But maybe that is just my own prejudice coming through because in the end I still stand by the Blue Fairy controlling everything. 😎

Keeper of Rumplestiltskin's and Neal's spears and war paint and crystal ball.

[Phee]

@PriceofMagic wrote:

Also, and this is just IMO, PP didn’t seem to know where Henry was, in time or location. It seemed like he was just picking random boys from the world, taking them to Neverland and getting Felix and the others to hold up the picture of Henry and go “Is this the boy?” “No”,”Is this the boy?” “No”,”Is this the boy?” “No”. PP doesn’t seem to have a clue when Henry will come into existence, just that he is special for some reason. If PP was controlling everything, he wouldn’t have needed to steal boys until the early 2000s.

I think PP has the gift of foresight, (or at the very least, access to a seer), but as we’ve seen with that gift, things aren’t always crystal clear. So yes, I think that he’s doing a bit of a random search, but once he got Bae, he was able to sense that even though he wasn’t the right boy, he was the right bloodline, (and I’ve also wondered if the same thing happened previously when Rumple was a boy too). We don’t know yet if PP continued to have boys brought to NL after Bae. Maybe after that, he stopped having new boys brought to him, and he just kept Bae on hold until the time was right to release him into our world so he could father Henry.

@RumplesGirl wrote:

@Jospehine wrote:

I’m confused on the whole Home Office thing. They’re an “anti-magic” organization that is probably ultimately headed by some boy sitting in a tree-house hideout in Neverland like an adolescent Dr. Evil, who instead of petting his cat has Tinkerbelle at his side. Why would an anti-magic league work in concert with a magic mastermind? If Wendy is behind the formation of THO after Bae was taken, why should her organization work for the same people she’s trying to fight?

I thik THO can be whatever its recruits need it to be. So, for example, GOAT really hate magic so THO presents itself as an anti-magic establishment, determined to wipe out magic. But that’s not really what they are about. They are a front for PP (who is NOT a boy, but at least 18-20) in NL. They are his “arm” in this world. I wouldn’t be surprised if they have agencies in every world, the BF for example in FTL.

What RG said. 🙂

Also, if time runs concurrently between worlds then Rumple and Bae’s initial story happened 300 years ago. That puts us in the early 1700s. That doesn’t fit with Bae being dumped in Victorian England, which was the latter part of the 1800s. It’s so confusing. 😕

I’m not going to lie: this is exactly why we’ve all stopped saying “timeline” around here and now just call it “the t-word” because this gave everyone headaches for weeks.

WAAAHHHH!
*twitching*
*rocking*
*weeping*
*only half joking*

I do wonder if all of our suppositions are way off. :geek:

I don’t just wonder it, I assume it. 😆

[RumplesGirl]

@Josephine wrote:

What if the shadow isn’t just PP’s? What if he uses all the shadows he collects as his henchmen, his scouts. He sends them out on his missions because they can move between worlds. The more shadows he collects that will do his bidding, the closer he is to finding Henry. So if he picks up some boys who aren’t the one he wants, he can still use them for his purpose. The more people working for him, the faster the job is done.

I still have no idea why Henry is his ultimate goal. I keep thinking even Peter Pan is working for someone else. It’s season three. I don’t think they’d want to unveil the ultimate mastermind at the end of season two-beginning of season three. But maybe that is just my own prejudice coming through because in the end I still stand by the Blue Fairy controlling everything. 😎

Re: your last bit. I’ve said this a few times in various places but I think S3 will be about wrapping up the biggest pieces of the currently mythology: Henry’s adoption, a puppet master, Blue’s true colors/loyalty, ect. And then S4 and 5 will build on the answers of S1-3 but will almost be a new mythology. H and K learned a lot from LOST, and while having an huge myth is one thing, I think they learned that people need answers soon rather than later.

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[HappyEndings]

@Josephine wrote:

What if the shadow isn’t just PP’s? What if he uses all the shadows he collects as his henchmen, his scouts. He sends them out on his missions because they can move between worlds. The more shadows he collects that will do his bidding, the closer he is to finding Henry. So if he picks up some boys who aren’t the one he wants, he can still use them for his purpose. The more people working for him, the faster the job is done.

I still have no idea why Henry is his ultimate goal. I keep thinking even Peter Pan is working for someone else. It’s season three. I don’t think they’d want to unveil the ultimate mastermind at the end of season two-beginning of season three. But maybe that is just my own prejudice coming through because in the end I still stand by the Blue Fairy controlling everything. 😎

This is what I thought too

[chianna]

@Josephine wrote:

I’m confused on the whole Home Office thing. They’re an “anti-magic” organization that is probably ultimately headed by some boy sitting in a tree-house hideout in Neverland like an adolescent Dr. Evil, who instead of petting his cat has Tinkerbelle at his side. Why would an anti-magic league work in concert with a magic mastermind? If Wendy is behind the formation of THO after Bae was taken, why should her organization work for the same people she’s trying to fight?

Perhaps she/they don’t know that PP is pulling the strings. I like the idea of PP sending some Lost Boys back to the world. Letting them grow up but still controlling them possibly via their shadows which remain in NL. Wendy sets up the HO (grandma) and a well connected man offers her further financing and the use of his connections in the US. So Wendy’s anti-magic brigade goes international. The American branch is controlled by a Lost Boy and by extension PP.

Emma and Henry’s adoption/lack of is suspicious. Gold can’t leave Storybrook so how did he get hold of Henry? How did Henry even get to SB? Gold can’t leave and no-one can get in. Little Emma would be snapped up even at three years old, if the story’s true about her first family. Third party involvment makes sense even if it’s not THO.

Very good point about Henry’s picture, if PP has future knowledge he should know when and where to find Henry but he plainly doesn’t.

ETA: Page 36 where did you come from 😕

[Phee]

@chianna wrote:

Perhaps she/they don’t know that PP is pulling the strings. I like the idea of PP sending some Lost Boys back to the world. Letting them grow up but still controlling them possibly via their shadows which remain in NL. Wendy sets up the HO (grandma) and a well connected man offers her further financing and the use of his connections in the US. So Wendy’s anti-magic brigade goes international. The American branch is controlled by a Lost Boy and by extension PP.

I do still really like the idea that THO was originally set up by Wendy, and its purpose has been mutated somewhat. I’ve gotta believe that we’ll see Wendy again, because she’s so iconic in the traditional PP story. The fact that they cast a 19 year old means that they can have her working long hours shooting if they expand her role a bit, (which they couldn’t have done if they’d cast someone as young as she looked in SSTTR), and it also means they can age her up a bit if need be. I can imagine an 18 year old Wendy being motivated to set up THO to try and find Bae. I can imagine PP getting wind of this, and interfering, leading to what THO has become in present day. I can even imagine Wendy making it back to NL at some point in the past, where she’s still being held prisoner.

Emma and Henry’s adoption/lack of is suspicious. Gold can’t leave Storybrook so how did he get hold of Henry? How did Henry even get to SB? Gold can’t leave and no-one can get in. Little Emma would be snapped up even at three years old, if the story’s true about her first family. Third party involvment makes sense even if it’s not THO.

I’d been completely convinced that Blue had set it all up. Until Adam tweeted that she didn’t have her memories during the cursed years, and all my theories came crashing down. *sigh*

THO would have had Owen in their clutches long before Henry was born, and Owen knew the location of SB, even if he couldn’t see it, so THO also knew the location of SB, and someone from outside SB had to arrange for Henry to go there. If THO has devices like Tamara’s taser that can suck the magic out of beings and kill them, then I wouldn’t be surprised if they were also able to see and gain access to SB to be able to deliver Henry there.

Rumple must have been pondering the adoption dilemma since he got his memories back and Regina straight up asked him where he got Henry from. Even though he hasn’t let on to Regina, he was probably thinking, “Dang, where did I get Henry from if he’s from out of town and no one from outside was supposed to be able to get in, or even know that this place existed?”

If he had records of who he’d contacted back then, he probably went and googled any names he had, to try and figure it all out. And now that GOAT have kidnapped Henry, the pieces are falling into place in his mind that whoever they work for in this world is who brought Henry there in the first place, meaning that whoever they work for has a whole lotta knowledge and power.

We’ve all been assuming that he has personal experience with PP, but maybe it’s just the fact that all of the other pieces surrounding how he, as Mr Gold, had been played and used by THO in our world, are coming together for him now and he’s realising they’re up against something huge. Even if he doesn’t know the specifics about PP, the other stuff could still be enough to make him look like 😯 when they’re on the boat.

[HappyEndings]

So the curse/prophesy about Emma says she’ll return to save everyone on her 28th birthday, and we see Emma blowing out the candle on her cupcake and all, but Emma was found abandoned on the side of the highway or in the forest or whatever, so how does she even know exactly when her birthday is? Could the police maybe tell she was a newborn and just designated the day she was found as her official birthday?

[Keb]

Well, Pinocchio was there with her, and he knew she’d been born earlier that day. But yeah, they probably could tell anyway–things like the state of the umbilical cord would have told them stuff.

Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing

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