Rumple and the Snow Queen

[RumplesGirl]

Of course Rumple knows the Snow Queen!

But how? What are their past dealings? What did they get from each other?

[WickedRegal]

Another one of his exes…ladies and gentlemen, I give you….#IcyDearie

"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor

[RumplesGirl]

Another one of his exes…ladies and gentlemen, I give you….#IcyDearie

No. If they do there….then it means that they have absolutely no creative juice whatsoever.

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[koffeegirl]

If IceQueen is another one of Rumple’s exes that is ridiculous. We already have Milah, then Cora, I think after Cora Rumple shut himself off completely until he met Belle.

I really didn’t like the whole Zelena crushing on Rumple last season. Surely, they can think of a better background story that that?

[Keb]

I think DQ (I will forever call her this) has something that Rumple either desires, needs, or desperately wants to keep her from doing.

She obviously has a power over him, since he’s waiting for her to make a deal. I think, too, that might be part of why he’s lying through his teeth all over the place. Whatever she’s got that he wants, it’s big.

Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing

[Hook’s Girl]

Maybe DQ owns that mansion and she owns the fantasia hat. Maybe he wants the hat. Then he’ll trap her in it. :o)

Nothing is impossible on OUAT. Everything has a way of repeating itself. Keeper of the Keeper tread: https://oncepodcast.com/forums/topic/official-keeper-thread-3/#post-217924

[Keb]

But he could have simply taken the hat. I think the owner of the hat is inside. Anna, too.

Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing

[Hook’s Girl]

Here’s a crack theory: Yin Sid is Elsa & Anna’s grandfather, original owner of the hat. DQ inherited it from Yin Sid, and Rumple has wanted it ever since.

Nothing is impossible on OUAT. Everything has a way of repeating itself. Keeper of the Keeper tread: https://oncepodcast.com/forums/topic/official-keeper-thread-3/#post-217924

[conspiracytheoristunchained]

Just a theory on two things:

First off , Has anyone ever thought that the kiss didn’t work on Marion not because Robin loves another women but because Marion is really Elsa trapped in Marion’s dead body. So a kiss from Robin would mean nothing. Dead people usually stay dead and for some reason Marion was able to travel back with Emma.

Secondly , I believe Mr. Gold needs the dagger and hasn’t betrayed anyone he is actually protecting Storybrooke from the Snow Queen who has been in Storybrooke for sometime but only has awakened by the return of Elsa. He knows that in the near future he will need the dagger to save everyone. The dagger has saved everyone before too when he killed his father Peter Pan. The Snow Queen could be Anna’s mom although she says she is her Aunt it is possible that Anna’s parents Dad and step-mom trapped her in the Urn to save Arendelle from her wrath. Remember she was sending a note from the ship to tell them the truth which led Elsa to the enchanted forest in the first place so they obviously visited there once before in order to want to go back again. How could you tell someone of a place if you never got there at least once. And if Anna and Elsa’s parents made it to the enchanted forest once before the time they died at sea. I am sure they encountered Rumpelstiltskin and probably were on their way back to make another deal with him. Rumple knows Snow Queen , Anna, Elsa and their parents.

Lastly didn’t Anna also come to Storybrooke trapped in some sort of bottle that broke and then leaked a blue liquid all throughout the stone until she materialized. They spent a lot of time showing that at the end of season and was a focal point on start of season.

 

[Myril]

Just a theory on two things: First off , Has anyone ever thought that the kiss didn’t work on Marion not because Robin loves another women but because Marion is really Elsa trapped in Marion’s dead body. So a kiss from Robin would mean nothing. Dead people usually stay dead and for some reason Marion was able to travel back with Emma.

Secondly , I believe Mr. Gold needs the dagger and hasn’t betrayed anyone he is actually protecting Storybrooke from the Snow Queen who has been in Storybrooke for sometime but only has awakened by the return of Elsa. He knows that in the near future he will need the dagger to save everyone. The dagger has saved everyone before too when he killed his father Peter Pan. The Snow Queen could be Anna’s mom although she says she is her Aunt it is possible that Anna’s parents Dad and step-mom trapped her in the Urn to save Arendelle from her wrath. Remember she was sending a note from the ship to tell them the truth which led Elsa to the enchanted forest in the first place so they obviously visited there once before in order to want to go back again. How could you tell someone of a place if you never got there at least once. And if Anna and Elsa’s parents made it to the enchanted forest once before the time they died at sea. I am sure they encountered Rumpelstiltskin and probably were on their way back to make another deal with him. Rumple knows Snow Queen , Anna, Elsa and their parents.

Lastly didn’t Anna also come to Storybrooke trapped in some sort of bottle that broke and then leaked a blue liquid all throughout the stone until she materialized. They spent a lot of time showing that at the end of season and was a focal point on start of season.

Interesting, but a lot of bumps in your theory. Oh, and this is your first post, right? So welcome to the forums. New to the show? Have you watched the movie Frozen? I’m just curious.

To get the names straight: Anna (Elizabeth Lail) is the quirky red head, engaged to Kristoff, the guy with a reindeer as best buddy. We don’t know where Anna is in present time, she’s so far only shown in past time, in Arendelle and the Enchanted Forest. Elsa (Georgina Haig) is the younger blonde with the ice powers, who was trapped in the urn, in that urn came to Storybrooke, and who now is looking with the help of Emma, Hook and David for her sister Anna.

It is Elsa we see at the end of the final episode of season 3 spilling out that urn (you call it some kind of bottle), that Emma and Hook accidentally brought with them from their little time travel trip to the Enchanted Forest. The showrunners made such a big deal of it for marketing: Frozen is coming to town!

It was Anna who went to the Enchanted Forest, in Arendelle also known as Misthaven, following the parents. Anna and Elsa knew they went there because of the diary they found in the attic with the wedding dress of their mother and what the stone-troll Grand Pabbie told them. It didn’t say what or who they were looking for, just that it was about Elsa’s powers. Yes, the mother wrote a note and put it into a bottle, hoping it would reach them, but it was never shown, if the bottle message was found by anyone, we don’t know (yet) what happened to it. Guess you think the paper Anna had in hand talking to David in episode 2 was that note. Not impossible, and I was wondering too, what that paper was about, but took it then as some notes either Kristoff made for her or Anna took about what Kristoff and maybe others had told her of the Enchanted Forest. If Anna somehow got a hand on that bottle message the scene was either cut or out of whatever strange reason will come later. But that bottle message could be even just some MacGuffin for all we know, all forgotten after a while. But even without the note Anna knew, that the parents were on their way to the Enchanted Forest, and that it was about Elsa’s powers.

Possible the parents had contacts to the Enchanted Forest, were there even before, might have even crossed Rumple’s ways, but also possible some traveler told them of something or someone they hope could help. It’s not like you have to have been to a place to know about it. Just because they have no fancy internet and satellite phones in the magic lands we have seen so far, doesn’t mean they had no means to communicate, and sure people were travelling. Actually Pabbie tells Elsa and Anna, that the parents came to him asking a lot of questions about Misthaven (aka the Enchanted Forest), that’s why he could tell them, were they went (and I have no reason to think Pabbie was lying to the sisters), so it is more likely, they haven’t been there before, just heard of it and perhaps of Rumple or some powerful wizard.

I have little doubt, that in one thing the Snow Queen said the truth, she is the aunt (if she’s any related). There was no step-mom in the picture before and I see no merit in inserting one all of a sudden on the show now into the Frozen arc. I expect the Snow Queen story to mirror some of Elsa’s story, including sister(s), but things went differently for her. It makes sense to me considering that A&E like to emphasize, that evil isn’t born. Not to mention it would look even more as it already does as a Cora in Ice version, if they make the Snow Queen Elsa’s and Anna’s mother. They already are somewhat repetitive with motives for their villains.

Agree the parents might have known of the urn, that they or one of them might even have been the one trapping the Snow Queen in it, to protect Arendelle. Knowing that the urn was already inhabited, and by who, very likely would have kept them from using it on Elsa. Not to mention I doubt they would have liked to do something like that to their daughter, unless absolutely necessary. Maybe the knew the urn came though from the Enchanted Forest (maybe the Snow Queen’s and the mother’s parents had been there) and so had the thought, someone there might have something else to help.

Aside that I have been wondering for all of the past season, and even longer, what happened to Rumple’s visions of the future (did he lose that ability?), there is not much of a hint, that he is still having an idea of things to come. Rumple clings to the dagger because it’s quite simple power, control, even more so now that he has experienced someone else taking control of him via the dagger and with no good intentions (Zelena), there is no selfless motive to it (and if they make it that way I happily feed some sharks). Belle might have the talent to see the good in people’s heart, but otherwise she sucks at psychology, and if it comes to Rumple the phrase “love makes blind” rings quite true for her. Even if there would be some need for the dagger in the future, it is not a good enough explanation to let Belle believe she has the real dagger in her purse while she has a fake one. But that is more a side note here.

Important question about Rumple and the Snow Queen: Did they meet first before the Snow Queen was urned or after she got back out of it? Was Rumple maybe the one helping to urn the Snow Queen or had he no hand in that? Did the Snow Queen came to Rumple or he to her? It seems like she never made a deal with him, so guess he came to her. What did she have to offer that Rumple was after?

I didn’t get any sexual tensions from the two in the scene at the end of episode 3, different from Cora and Zelena (in whatever time period those were with Rumple, they always acted with some inuendo), so I don’t think the Snow Queen is another ex- or almost lover of Rumple.

We know she had a plan, whatever plan, and Rumple knows about it, and it at least didn’t seem to get in the way of his plans (otherwise he might have stopped her, if he could that is), or they had an alliance, trying to benefit in some ways from each other plans (for a while). If they had no deal, how come that Rumple had the urn in his vault. Leverage? Doubt he would have kept it there out of nicety.

We know the Snow Queen has a problem with non magical people, a mix of experience and arrogance I think. Was her plan about revenge? Or was it about something like creating a place for magical talented people without being hold back by some non-magical folks? Was her plan to get rid of all the muggles and other annoying beings not friendly to the idea, like some fairies, and have her own magical realm all to herself, with an elite of magical people around (and maybe some less powerful who could be servants)? The Dark Curse send some annoying people to a different world, was that something she thought to benefit from? Did she have a way to travel between worlds (water – snow-ice control connection), which might have been useful for Rumple to make sure some things would happen as he thought they had to happen. I know some wondered, if, why Rumple didn’t get that power himself, maybe he couldn’t, the Snow Queen too smart /powerful for that. And someone suggested elsewhere, that it was for Rumple never just about reuniting with his son but as much to not lose his magical powers doing so. Rumple wanted both, magic and his son back, so he created the curse, as the future visions showed him he would anyway.

Just a thought crossing my mind, if the Snow Queen was in our world during the first Dark Curse, knowing things, while everybody else was stuck without memory in Storybrooke for years: Was it perhaps the Snow Queen sending August to talk Neal into leaving Emma? Was it the Snow Queen who made sure, that Henry came to Maine, Pan just trying to butt in, his agents came too late, didn’t they.

¯\_(?????? ?)_/¯

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