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In order for True Love’s Kiss to work WickedRegal, it has to be reciprocated by both parties. They have to truly love each other. It’s why when Belle lost her memory in season two, true love’s kiss didn’t work because she didn’t remember that she loved Rumple. It has to go both ways.
The minute Snow and Charming stop loving each other, that’s when true love’s kiss will stop working for them as well. Because they wouldn’t truly love each other each other anymore.
[adrotate group="5"]An act of true love might not have to be mutual (as defined in Frozen) but TLK in Once does have to be mutual. Otherwise it would have been sufficient to break Snow’s forgetting curse when she took the potion to forget Charming–but it wasn’t. It would have been sufficient when Rumple tried it on Belle after she lost her memory–but it wasn’t, because she didn’t love him back in that state, at that time.
It’s mutual in every case we’ve seen it work, and not mutual in cases where it’s been tried and failed explicitly. (Which doesn’t mean love is not present, just that it’s not Mutual True Love in that moment.)
As for Marian sacrificing herself for her family, let’s go back to the CS Back to the Future Movie a moment:
Black Knights: (riding past Hook and Emma) Hyah. Hyah. (pushing villagers around) Get in line. Get in line. (The Evil Queen descends from her carriage.)
The Evil Queen: Listen to me very carefully. Whatever squalor and despair your pathetic little lives have been able to tolerate until this point is nothing compared to the pain and misery I can inflict if I leave here unhappy.
Emma: That’s Regina.
Hook: Not Regina, love. The Evil Queen.
The Evil Queen: You will help me.
Emma: She’s even worse without the sensible pantsuits.
Geppetto: Please, Your Majesty. We’re a peaceful village. What do you want from us?
Emma: That’s Marco.
The Evil Queen: Justice. If I find out, anyone in this village has helped the bandit Snow White they will suffer dearly. Here’s what helping Snow White looks like. (gestures to her guards. One guard removes a sackcloth hood from a prisoner’s head.)
Prisoner: Help me! She’s gonna kill me.
The Evil Queen: Who wants to be next?
Prisoner: Please. (The Evil Queen laughs. Emma moves in order to interfere. Hook stops her.)Woman: Are you alright?
Emma: Yeah, I think so. Thanks. I’m Leia.
Woman: I wish I could say, it was nice to meet you.
Emma: Yeah, but under the circumstances, I get it. What’s your name?
Woman: I dare not speak in here. The Queen doesn’t know who I am. My silence is the only thing keeping my family safe.
Emma: She’s pretty ruthless, huh? Here. (Through the bars Emma hands the prisoner a roll.) Are you hungry? I swiped it of a food tray on my way down. (The prisoner stands up and takes the roll. The woman notices Emma’s surprised look.)
Woman: What? What is it?
Emma: I saw you in the village. With the Queen. I wanted to help but-
Woman: It’s alright. If you had tried to free me you’d just ended up in here a day sooner.
Emma: What did she put you in here for?
Woman: I knew where Snow White was hiding. But I refused to tell the Queen.
Emma: You gave up your freedom to ensure Snow White’s?
Woman: (nods) Yeah. I believe her to be innocent.
Emma: How long are you in for?
Woman: Same as you. Just one more night.
Emma: Really? One night? Why? Is Regina going soft?
Woman: No. One night, because tomorrow everyone in here is to be executed.Woman: What’s that?
Emma: It’s my parents’. I guess you could call it their wedding ring.
Woman: And they entrusted you with it?
Emma: Sort of. I need to get it back to them.
Woman: Being away from family is a terrible, terrible thing.
Emma: Yeah, it is.
Woman: The longer I’m separated from them. the pain doesn’t dull. It worsens. Maybe, cause I know I’ll never see them again.
Emma: If my mom was here she would tell me to have hope. Maybe, you should, too. Who knows, maybe you will end up with them again.
Woman: I don’t think so. I’m fairly certain, they already think that I’m dead. And soon that’ ll be true. (Emma notices a spoon lying on the ground in her cell.)
Emma: Maybe not. Give me your spoon. (Emma entwines a wire around both spoons shaping it to a tool)
Woman: What are you doing?
Emma: It’s all about the tumblers. (Using the wire Emma opens her cell door.)
Woman: You did it. (Emma leaves her cell and hesitates for a moment.) What are you waiting for? Go! Get out of here! Go!
(transcripts from http://onceuponatime.wikia.com/wiki/Snow_Drifts/Transcript and http://onceuponatime.wikia.com/wiki/There%27s_No_Place_Like_Home/Transcript)This is not a woman who willingly left her family. She is protecting them, probably because she knows Robin would risk his own life to save hers if he knew where she was. She believes Snow is innocent, but she also knows what the alternative to Snow White is–The Evil Queen who threatens and kills entire villages (remember, this happens after the village massacre in The Evil Queen) because, in her own words, she isn’t happy. How could Marian not try to save Roland from living under that kind of ruler?
And honestly, twisting Marian’s actions into a rejection of her family so that it’s less horrible for Robin to want to leave her for Regina takes away from how Regina’s grown as a character. Marian never rejected her family. The clues we have (little as they are) suggest that she got into trouble doing a mission that Robin set for her–she was helping her beloved husband, protecting her son, and trying heroically to give her kingdom a chance. Marian is not a bad person, and completely deserves our sympathy–whether or not we want Robin with her.
Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
Emma: You gave up your freedom to ensure Snow White’s?
Woman: (nods) Yeah. I believe her to be innocent.
Yeah…see this gets me…as a mother and a wife…you’re willing to lay down your life for someone you don’t even really know, and barely considering the devastation it would cause to your family and friends. Martyrs are good and all, but there’s a line in every situation, and I feel Marian could have avoided this.
Marian didn’t even have to tell the truth to Regina….all she had to do was point in the opposite direction Snow ran in! Like…at least try to find a way out of this situation before you just throw your hands up and surrender.
This is not a woman who willingly left her family. She is protecting them, probably because she knows Robin would risk his own life to save hers if he knew where she was. She believes Snow is innocent, but she also knows what the alternative to Snow White is–The Evil Queen who threatens and kills entire villages (remember, this happens after the village massacre in The Evil Queen) because, in her own words, she isn’t happy. How could Marian not try to save Roland from living under that kind of ruler?
Yeah…here’s the kicker….the Locksley Family weren’t even under Regina’s reign…they were under King John’s. Two separate kingdoms…the Locksley Family just so happened to be in the Evil Queen’s territory. So Evil Queen’s rule wasn’t Marian’s issue, therefore Roland wouldn’t be living under it….they seemed to just be traveling through different kingdoms, and were just at the wrong place at the wrong time.
And again…she didn’t have to tell Regina the truth. Lie….you know you’re to die if you don’t say anything at all, so what’s the hurt in trying to lie to get out of it. I would have just had more respect if I saw her at least try anything instead of screaming “You’re A Monster! You’re A Monster!” Like that is gonna score you any good points….she had a family to get back to, she should have did whatever she had to do.
And honestly, twisting Marian’s actions into a rejection of her family so that it’s less horrible for Robin to want to leave her for Regina takes away from how Regina’s grown as a character. Marian never rejected her family. The clues we have (little as they are) suggest that she got into trouble doing a mission that Robin set for her–she was helping her beloved husband, protecting her son, and trying heroically to give her kingdom a chance. Marian is not a bad person, and completely deserves our sympathy–whether or not we want Robin with her.
I’m not twisting anything…I’m just saying the alternatives Marian could have taken rather than letting someone take her from her family. And who said anything about making anything less horrible for Robin to want to leave her….without a shadow of a doubt, he may have loved her, but he fell in love with Regina thirty years after Marian’s death. Death did them part, and he moved on…so there’s nothing horrible about Robin.
However….if the rumors that Robin had his wife, and the mother of his child out on a mission on him come true…I will say that it’s partly his fault as well because Marian already doesn’t really seem the type for that kind of action. Robin taught her a thing or two…but she’s just…I don’t know, she doesn’t seem cut out for that type of work. And Robin should know that! So if those rumors are true….I will cut him some of the blame….you don’t have your wife/baby mother on a mission for you.
Marian so far has my sympathy to an extent….really because Death is trying so badly to take her out, and being knocked upside the head, brought thirty years into the future to find your widow husband dating your murderess, who turns out to be his soul mate, aka, the woman he was destined to be with. And she earned my respect by seeing that Regina makes Robin happy, and was willing to step aside to let #OutlawQueen have their long overdue happy ending. So Marian’s in my good graces…I just wish some of her decisions were a bit different in the past. Then again…it may have been fate trying to unite OutlawQueen for the 1000000th time….so….I hope she does find her happy ending, but it won’t be with Robin Hood.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
The “rumors” come from what Robin told Regina during their date at the start of Snow Drifts (I think there’s more somewhere else too, but here:)
Robin: After I lost my wife, I felt like that for a long time. Her death was my fault.
Regina: I’m sorry.
Robin: I would have walked through hell to be with my Marian again. But, when I finally admitted to myself that she was gone and that she was never coming back, I had to let that guilt go.And you’re assuming that lying to the queen would have worked–and not made the situation worse for Marian. You’re also assuming that Marian didn’t lie at all (we don’t know that either–when we first see her with the queen, she’s already a captive and being paraded as an example to the other villagers). All we know for sure is that Regina intended to kill her for the crime of protecting an innocent woman from her wrath, and if Emma hadn’t saved Marian, Regina would have gone through with it.
No matter how much of a victim Regina was of circumstances, Rumple’s manipulations, and Cora’s abuse, (and though I don’t believe he was abusive beyond marrying a woman who didn’t love him, let’s throw in Leo for good measure, why not?), Regina made her own choices and DEFINITELY abused, tortured, and murdered a LOT of innocent people. I mean, at the point where a man like Rumple (who ENCOURAGES her to murder at times) is telling you that you’re murdering an awful lot lately (as he did in The Evil Queen), some people would reconsider some of their choices. Regina chose to accept that she was evil, and the murder spree continued.
To place the blame for Marian’s almost murder on Marian just doesn’t sit well with me in any way. She was being a hero, and sacrificing for others, including her family. (Also, while the lion tattoo hints at there being a King Richard, has Once ever stated that there was a King John anywhere? Or that Sherwood Forest was not part of Leo/Regina/Snow’s kingdom? Given the proximity to the Dark Castle and the fact that Marian was captured and paraded by Regina, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to assume it’s either in the same kingdom or bordering it–either way a risk to her family if the Evil Queen continues her rampaging.)
And to deny that Regina went as deep into the darkness as she did is to deny that she has had to work hard for redemption, and to deny her the full appreciation she deserves when she makes GOOD choices at last. Regina has done very evil things (though she’s not the only one). Conquering that is a battle well worth seeing.
Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
Okay….yeah…
Any right minded person would have tried lying to the Queen instead of just letting her say “Okay, off with your head!” Despite the horrible situation, Marian was left with a choice….to either fess up or die! Well…you’re gonna die anyway if you don’t say anything at all…so why not try pointing in the wrong direction, and taking a chance! Like…at least try to save yourself.
Once Upon A Time 3×21 Scene Dialogue:
Regina: Where is Snow White!
Marian: …..
Regina: She thinks silence is bravery…not stupidity.
Marian: ……
Regina: She dies tomorrow. Hurry her along, the stench of peasantry is overwhelming.
This scene clearly states Marian didn’t even try to hold a conversation, or even give an explanation. She was defiantly quiet….like lady, point in a direction and say “She went that way.” That’s all Regina wanted, and Regina would have spared her life and left in the wrong direction. That was it! And do some percentage of Marian’s own death goes to herself…heck yeah because she was left with a choice, and she didn’t take it, and if she had….she could have at least tried to lie. You’re going to die anyway, what’s the harm in trying??????????
Regina did accept that she was the Evil Queen…but only once she discovered that the people would never love her. Much like in Wicked, Elphaba only became truly wicked when she realized that “No Good Deed Went Unpunished.” It was her breaking point, and she descended into darkness. You could really see the disappointment and the sadness on Regina’s face when she walked into town and heard/saw all the crude things her people were saying about her, and after the Snow fiasco…she just said screw it, they want a monster, I’ll be their monster. And just like Marian….sad to say that the villagers also had a choice….and just like Marian, if you’re going to die, what’s the harm in trying to lie yourself out of that situation?????
Had Regina been completely Evil, Corrupt, & Dark as few people try to claim she is…there would have been no compassion enough to give them a choice rather than just saying “Oh you helped a fugitive…Off with your head!” The only woman who was ever like that was Cora, who didn’t even let Jefferson speak two words before she cut his head off.
Technically…the Lion Tattoo was a clear reference to King Richard. Regina reigned only over the Enchanted Forest, just as King Midas, King George, Prince Thomas, Prince Eric reigned over their own kingdoms. Sherwood Forest, just as Nottingham, I’m pretty sure are in a different kingdom, ala, King John’s kingdom. Robin and the Merry Men were known for traveling from kingdom to kingdom, and they just so happened to be in Regina’s during that time period where she was making her rounds. And Marian just so happened to want to harbor a fugitive, who innocent or not, was declared a fugitive by the current reigning monarch. But Regina had no power that extended into King John’s kingdom, therefore she was not the Merry Men’s problem.
Wait a minute…whose denying Regina didn’t descend into darkness????? And to twist her descent into darkness into being on level with her rising above it is quite unfair, given she’s done ten times over the level of goodness than she did bad. That includes nearly sacrificing her life many times, her and Rumple always having to defeat the bad guys while the good guys do absolutely nothing, and saving Storybrooke more times than I can count….and despite all of that, it would seem she ends up with the same miserable results whether she’s good or bad.
Yes Regina did descend into darkness, though she had several helpful pushes over the cliff by outside forces…(cough) Rumple, Cora, Snow, Jefferson, Whale, and Blue Fairy (cough). And yes…I’m very proud of the Queen’s triumphant redemption that took three seasons to bring forward, and I hope she can save Mal, Cruella, and Ursula from the same fates her mother, sister, and Peter Pan followed!
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
To place the blame for Marian’s almost murder on Marian just doesn’t sit well with me in any way. She was being a hero, and sacrificing for others, including her family.
I’ve always been uncomfortable with this as well. Traditionally speaking, Marian is not a bad person. She believes in the same things Robin believes in, in fact, we even learned from Robin that he learned his goodness from her! So she’s not definitely not an evil person. (I do wish we had more of Marian in 4A. Flashbacks even but maybe in 4B?)
Secondly, I agree with Keb, Marian is a hero and the reason why she didn’t lie to the Evil Queen was because it isn’t in her nature. She’s not a coward. It would be against her nature if she pointed the finger at another innocent. That’s not who she is. If she believes something is worth fighting for, she will fight for it because it’s a cause worth fighting for.
The difference between heroes and villains, they both think that they’re just in their actions but for villains, it’s mostly a skewed perception of what is just and right. We’ve seen this with almost every villain on Once who feels that they were unjustly wronged for something or other. But it doesn’t make their actions right by any means.
And if Regina was truly the hero from the beginning, seriously, the woman would not even need a redemption arc.
Lastly, there is such a thing as free will and choices.
True, Regina was manipulated a lot when she was younger but no one held a dagger to her throat when she decided to waste the town that hid Snow White in the Evil Queen (2×20). She did a lot of damage to pretty much the whole kingdom. I don’t think it mattered if she wasn’t the Queen of Robin’s realm or not. Most everyone was familiar with her and her reputation.
I agree with Keb and Obisgirl. Regina was at fault for her Evil Queen stage. To take away her culpability is to take away Regina’s need for redemption. Also painting Regina as a victim all her life is a major disservice to her character.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixI agree with Keb and Obisgirl. Regina was at fault for her Evil Queen stage. To take away her culpability is to take away Regina’s need for redemption. Also painting Regina as a victim all her life is a major disservice to her character.
Nah ah ah….I do agree that the moment Regina looked into that mirror and declared “Long Live The Evil Queen”…at least 75% of whatever she did afterwards goes to her, so that’s a lot of evil. However…I’m simply stating that we must look at not only the other 25% percent who are responsible for creating the Evil Queen in the first place.
And a Victim all her life you say? Oh I don’t have to paint it…they’ve shown it, she grew up with a physically, mentally, and emotionally abusive mother and a cowardly father who did nothing but stand aside. Her true love was killed, and she was forced to not only marry a man thrice her age, but raise the very girl who put her in that situation in the first place. Manipulated and polluted by Rumpelstilskin, whose been concocting this heinous plot to darken her heart even before the girl was born, all so that she could cast his curse. And even after all is said and done, she still lost her true love Daniel again, lost her mother, lost her sister, and now has lost her soul mate! The only reason she hasn’t lost Henry is because he’s the Savior’s son too perhaps!
So yeah….Regina’s more of a victim of life more than anyone else on the show, the only one who can come close to her level of pain and sorrow is perhaps either Emma Swan or Rumpelstilskin. And before anyone brings up the “Well Emma wouldn’t have had such a bad life had Regina not cast the curse?” Well, heck, Emma should really thank Regina for casting the dark curse because as she said “It got them their son!” Yes, Emma’s life sucked, but it’s paying off in the end….she gets to live in a modern day world, something we’ve seen she prefers than the Enchanted Forest.
To place the blame for Marian’s almost murder on Marian just doesn’t sit well with me in any way. She was being a hero, and sacrificing for others, including her family.
Marian is a hero and the reason why she didn’t lie to the Evil Queen was because it isn’t in her nature. She’s not a coward. It would be against her nature if she pointed the finger at another innocent. That’s not who she is. If she believes something is worth fighting for, she will fight for it because it’s a cause worth fighting for.
Here we go…Marian understood the choice well. Squeal or Die…she remained silent and chose death knowing she had a family to get back to. Every choice has it’s consequence…it all depends on whose paying the price. Marian had A LOT more to lose, and she let it be taken from her because she was a stubborn, prideful woman. It’s not about if it’s in her nature or not, and it sure as heck doesn’t make her a coward! It’s called survival…you do whatever it takes to survive. And if lying is what it takes to survive, then so be it.
Is Marian a survivor….given the woman’s cheated death more times than Rumple has said “Dearie” I’d say yes, but she’s always been saved by someone, whether it be Rumple, Robin, or Regina. If they want to paint the picture Regina killed this woman in cold blood, then Regina shouldn’t have given Marian a choice. And since she was going to die anyway, what would have been so bad with pointing in the wrong direction, and just saying “She went that way!” That might have just saved her life! I wonder what a certain 500 year old vampire whose spent her entire life running from her thousand enemies would have done…..
And if Regina was truly the hero from the beginning, seriously, the woman would not even need a redemption arc. Lastly, there is such a thing as free will and choices. True, Regina was manipulated a lot when she was younger but no one held a dagger to her throat when she decided to waste the town that hid Snow White in the Evil Queen (2×20). She did a lot of damage to pretty much the whole kingdom. I don’t think it mattered if she wasn’t the Queen of Robin’s realm or not. Most everyone was familiar with her and her reputation.Truthfully….it was probably never Regina’s fate to be dark….that was probably supposed to be Zelena’s, the first born. Hence Zelena’s natural ability for dark magic, and Regina’s natural ability for light magic, which might I add Glinda declared “Only the strongest purveyor of light magic” could defeat the highest dark magic Zelena possessed. But Rumple realized that Zelena could never do, and decided to stay with the one he’s already corrupted. Couldn’t let good corruption go to waste now could he?Of course no one would have to hold a dagger to Regina’s throat to do the evil things she did…the damage was already done to her, and the darkness had already seeped in and taken root in her heart. Cora & Snow planted the seeds, and Rumple harvested.Most everyone was familiar with her and her reputation? Then Robin and the Merry Men should not have been traveling through an Evil Queen’s realm. Much like everyone in the Enchanted Forest, if you knew you wouldn’t survive under Regina’s reign, pack up and move to Cinderella’s kingdom or Prince Eric’s kingdom. Unless Regina had some spell that trapped all her subjects in her land.And to answer the question…of course Regina takes most responsibility for Marian’s death, but the left over responsibility does go to Marian for not even trying to get herself out of the situation."If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
And a Victim all her life you say? Oh I don’t have to paint it…they’ve shown it, she grew up with a physically, mentally, and emotionally abusive mother and a cowardly father who did nothing but stand aside. Her true love was killed, and she was forced to not only marry a man thrice her age, but raise the very girl who put her in that situation in the first place. Manipulated and polluted by Rumpelstilskin, whose been concocting this heinous plot to darken her heart even before the girl was born, all so that she could cast his curse. And even after all is said and done, she still lost her true love Daniel again, lost her mother, lost her sister, and now has lost her soul mate! The only reason she hasn’t lost Henry is because he’s the Savior’s son too perhaps!
I don’t think Regina has been shown as a victim, at least from the point where she got out from under Cora’s thumb. Regina is not helpless, she is not easily taken advantage of, she is not weak, she is not blameless, etc. What you are saying is that everything Regina has done in her life is not her fault, she’s not capable of making her own choices, she can’t think for herself, she’s just a pawn that lets other people use her because she can’t stand up for herself.
That is not Regina. Rumple may have had plans for Regina but he didn’t hold a gun to her head and say “you will learn magic whether you like it or not”. Regina CHOSE to learn magic from him. It could be argued that Regina’s evil queen phase was her way of fighting back and standing up for herself after being oppressed by Cora for so long. Regina learnt from Cora that “magic is power” and “power is freedom” therefore magic=power=freedom. It was a bad choice of Regina’s but she has grown so much and has overcome her past to the point where she can look back and say “you know, being the evil queen wasn’t my best idea”. To take away Regina’s culpability for her actions is to take away her character growth as she would constantly be stuck in the “not my fault” frame of mind, and if she can’t accept responsibility for her actions then she can’t learn from her mistakes.
So yeah….Regina’s more of a victim of life more than anyone else on the show, the only one who can come close to her level of pain and sorrow is perhaps either Emma Swan or Rumpelstilskin. And before anyone brings up the “Well Emma wouldn’t have had such a bad life had Regina not cast the curse?” Well, heck, Emma should really thank Regina for casting the dark curse because as she said “It got them their son!” Yes, Emma’s life sucked, but it’s paying off in the end….she gets to live in a modern day world, something we’ve seen she prefers than the Enchanted Forest.
Emma prefers the modern day world to the EF because she grew up in the modern world and knows how to navigate it. Had she grown up in the EF, she probably would’ve preferred that as she didn’t know any better. That’s like someone just taking you out of your normal life and dropping you in the wilderness and asking which environment you prefer. So no. Emma shouldn’t “thank” Regina for the dark curse, if anything, Regina should “thank” Emma for not making a bigger deal out of it and hold it against her.
Here we go…Marian understood the choice well. Squeal or Die…she remained silent and chose death knowing she had a family to get back to. Every choice has it’s consequence…it all depends on whose paying the price. Marian had A LOT more to lose, and she let it be taken from her because she was a stubborn, prideful woman. It’s not about if it’s in her nature or not, and it sure as heck doesn’t make her a coward! It’s called survival…you do whatever it takes to survive. And if lying is what it takes to survive, then so be it.
Here’s the thing. Do you really think Marian could’ve just pointed in any old direction and Regina would have thanked her and just gone on her merry way, or do you think Regina would’ve held on to Marian until her information proved true and Snow had been apprehended? If it was so easy to fob Regina off, she would be on endless goose chases as the peasants sent her all over the place claiming Snow had gone “that way”.
If they want to paint the picture Regina killed this woman in cold blood, then Regina shouldn’t have given Marian a choice. And since she was going to die anyway, what would have been so bad with pointing in the wrong direction, and just saying “She went that way!” That might have just saved her life!
See above. MArian wasn’t going anywhere until Regina had Snow in chains.
Most everyone was familiar with her and her reputation? Then Robin and the Merry Men should not have been traveling through an Evil Queen’s realm. Much like everyone in the Enchanted Forest, if you knew you wouldn’t survive under Regina’s reign, pack up and move to Cinderella’s kingdom or Prince Eric’s kingdom. Unless Regina had some spell that trapped all her subjects in her land.
Firstly, kingdoms tend to be vast. Unless Robin and crew wanted to add months/years onto their trip, their quickest route would’ve been to go through Regina’s kingdom and it might’ve been their only route if they were travelling from one kingdom to another which were separated by Regina’s kingdom in the middle. Also, the peasants could hardly just up sticks and move, they couldn’t afford it and other kingdoms wouldn’t survive a massive influx of peasants from another kingdom. And there was always the possibility a new monarch could be even worse than Regina. Better the devil you know.
And to answer the question…of course Regina takes most responsibility for Marian’s death, but the left over responsibility does go to Marian for not even trying to get herself out of the situation.
Again how do you know she didn’t? She could’ve pointed Regina in the wrong direction, Regina kept hold of her and when the information turned out fruitless, Regina asked again, THEN Marian went silent. Regina had a reputation as the EVIL Queen for a reason.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixWR, I disagree with you about Zelena being fated to cast the curse. If fate was actually driving things at that point, then it went exactly as fate wished.
But remember why Rumple chose Regina? Zelena had become infatuated with him. She convinced herself that he was the only person who saw promise instead of wickedness in her (perhaps after her mother), and she loved how he taught her to use her powers instead of holding them in. She fell for the teacher, and needed him to reciprocate that love–that’s part of why she tried to kill Regina. She was afraid of competition, because she had no confidence in herself. And Rumple realized that–and realized also that since she had become obsessed with him, the only way she could cast his Curse was to kill HIM. That made her a threat.
Also, the slippers suggest this is before Rumple pulled the whole Frankenstein trick on Regina to convince her that she wasn’t going to get Daniel back with magic and get her back on track to learning what he wanted her to. So his corruption of Regina was still in its infancy at that point.
As to that: Regina called for his help the first time. He didn’t push her–he just waited for Cora’s abuse to do its job (and probably foresaw that waiting would work). He did not force her to do that, and while he encouraged her to use the mirror and magic for the first time, he didn’t force that either.
And she loved it, even if it scared her.
And the next scene is her riding for freedom, escaping the marriage she didn’t want; Rumple stops her and she gives him back the magic book. He doesn’t stop her, he doesn’t force her to turn back; he just asks (granted, manipulative) questions about her feelings on magic now that she’s used it. And when she voices her fear that magic will turn her into Cora, Rumple promises that it’s entirely up to her whether it will or not. Despite his recent turn to lying, Rumple generally tells some version of the truth. Regina then chooses to go back to Leo (and this is never really explained, though Cora did tell her how to run things before she went to Wonderland–and we notice Regina eventually does just what Cora suggested with the private guard etc), and chooses to learn more magic from Rumple. When she learns that there is no way to bring back Daniel, she chooses to go back to Rumple, kill someone, and prove she’s ready for more. He manipulates, but never forces her to make any of those choices. And all that is LONG before she is in the Evil Queen mode.
The moment that Cora killed Daniel, Regina’s heart hardened; the very next day she was wishing a ten-year-old had died. That was before Rumple was even in the picture as far as she knew.
Regina’s a complex character and definitely a victim of Cora’s abuse and Rumple’s manipulations, but she is also a woman who chose to embrace her inner darkness to the fullest extent at one point in her life. She got there by gradual steps and we seem to be seeing her escape it by gradual steps as well. Her crimes, however, are her own doing. It’s not okay to abuse someone else just because you were abused; it’s merely more understandable (and statistically more likely, as I understand it). Nor does the fault of your crimes fall upon your abusers’ heads.
If Once weren’t a fantasy, the violence and crime we’ve seen from our favorite characters would be the sort of thing that would have Regina locked up, at minimum, for the rest of her life (Rumple, too, and Hook, and even possibly the Charmings depending on how good of lawyers they got). We’re rooting for people who are not good to become good, in a world where good and evil are set at extremes and it’s okay for a character to dabble in both ends of the spectrum and still be likable. That means that, to a degree, we have to accept what the show tells us about the world to work out where the characters are in their arcs–and the show has told us that Marian’s action was brave, good, selfless, heroic, and that she wanted to protect her family. It’s shown us that Regina was wrong in context to condemn Marian to death. And yes…it’s shown us that Regina is constantly losing, and it’s not always her fault (but mostly so far, the actions of the characters HAVE driven their downfalls–Rumple’s lies about the dagger led to his banishment etc…so we’ll see where they’re going with Operation Mongoose).
Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
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