So, are the Laws of Magic broken?

[MatthewPaul]

I don’t think using the Well of Wonders plot device as a loophole for reviving Neal or any other dead characters on the parent show is a good idea. Anastasia was an exception, not the norm, and even then it comes off as “way to break the dead is dead rule.” Not to mention it wouldn’t make sense or be fair to randomly bring a concept that one needs to watch WL to understand over to the parent show. Hypothetically, had the laws of magic remained broken, Once viewers would need to watch WL to understand how that happened and they’ve stated before that they want the two shows to remain their own things. And once you break those rules for good, that throws away so much of the stakes right out of the window. “Oh we don’t need to worry about a character dying now. They can just be resurrected.” Yes death for characters can be tough to deal with, but it is a very natural risk these characters have to face. You take away much of the danger if you offer all of these ways for character resurrection. It is also messing with fate, which was something Nyx brought up. Nyx stated that Amara’s time was up and she wasn’t supposed to remain alive. Neal’s death was a price for bringing back Rumple, and therefore Nyx would likely argue that his fate has been sealed. You need to have deaths that stick for a variety of reasons.

[obisgirl]

Poor Ana will have died three times when it’s all done. And she wears red. How very Star Trek.

Lol!

I agree @matthewpaul

[Phee]

One of the problems is that while her name is Nyx, they never established her (maybe) as THE Nyx–goddess of night in Greek myth. So, for example, we had the Grendel in episode 3 “Forget Me Knot” but he was NOT the Grendel of Beowulf legend–and we have no idea how he got that name or if he is even related in any way to the legend. Nyx, the Greek goddess, was the mother of Death (Thanatos). Thanatos himself was a more minor god in literature and cult worship, and was rather indiscriminate toward victims.

In some myths Nyx is the mother of the fates (The Morai) and in others…she’s not. But even if in this version she is the mother of the Fates, the gods were still subject to them (complicated…).

What I’m saying here..is that we simply have no idea who Nyx really is. She might be a goddess but strictly speaking the gods shouldn’t be able to over ride death/fate in that matter.

Fate is a thing that definitely exists in the Onceiverse, so it would fit that their Nyx is tied to the Fates. It’s the task of the Fates to decide how long each person’s life is, and exactly how and when they die. They wrote Nyx as having the power to dictate whether or not someone’s time was really up. So I’d be surprised if she wasn’t based on THE Nyx.

For me, it’s not so much the fact that there exists a being who can give back life that’s the issue really, it’s that SO many people surely die unfairly before their time should have been up, so where do you draw the line. Even if Nyx can break that rule, she’s still gotta have her own clearly defined rules, otherwise it’s a case of, “So why can’t she bring back the lives of everyone in that village that Regina slaughtered, because surely all those innocent people didn’t deserve for their time to be up.” That’s where the dead-isn’t-necessarily-dead thing gets frustrating for me, because it should apply to all, and if it doesn’t, then it’s just a glaring inconsistency and comes off as a plot device when they need one.

I don’t think using the Well of Wonders plot device as a loophole for reviving Neal or any other dead characters on the parent show is a good idea.

Whether or not it’s used to bring back Neal (or anyone else), I’ll be surprised if it isn’t used for something on the parent show. They established the FTL location of a Well of Wonders in 312. You don’t use that exact same prop just with the well part boarded up, unless it’s a thing you’re setting up for future reference, (considering it was seen at the start of the first ep of S3B, it would be a nice bookend for the season to show it again towards the end of the season finale). People wouldn’t necessarily have had to watch WL in order to get it, because I’m sure they’d still explain what it is on the parent show, but for those who did watch both, it would be a bonus fun connection between the different worlds/shows.

[RumplesGirl]

I don’t think using the Well of Wonders plot device as a loophole for reviving Neal or any other dead characters on the parent show is a good idea. Anastasia was an exception, not the norm, and even then it comes off as “way to break the dead is dead rule.

Well I don’t think it’s a good idea either. But I disagree with Ana being an exception, not a norm. There is a reason why it is becoming a joke for people who watch ONCE–because it keeps happening.

Henry (TLK from Emma);

Daniel (new heart from Frankenstein)

Blue Fairy (throw a coconut into a fire);

Rumple (dark magic at the vault of eternal goo);

Ana, the first time (break the laws of magic);

Ana, the second time (freely given water from the Well of Wonders as thanks for returning Amara’s waters and because it wasn’t Ana’s time to go).

Now there are about an equal number or slightly higher number of people who have died and stayed dead (if we don’t count soldiers in battle) : Graham, Cora, Gus, GOAT (though Greg is open to interpretation with Adam’s interview comments), Pan, Neal.

But that doesn’t change the fact that they keep breaking their own rules when dead is supposed to be dead, except in the case of breaking the laws of magic

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[MatthewPaul]

Well I don’t think it’s a good idea either. But I disagree with Ana being an exception, not a norm. There is a reason why it is becoming a joke for people who watch ONCE–because it keeps happening.

Henry (TLK from Emma);

Daniel (new heart from Frankenstein)

Blue Fairy (throw a coconut into a fire);

Rumple (dark magic at the vault of eternal goo);

Ana, the first time (break the laws of magic);

Ana, the second time (freely given water from the Well of Wonders as thanks for returning Amara’s waters and because it wasn’t Ana’s time to go).

Now there are about an equal number or slightly higher number of people who have died and stayed dead (if we don’t count soldiers in battle) : Graham, Cora, Gus, GOAT (though Greg is open to interpretation with Adam’s interview comments), Pan, Neal.

But that doesn’t change the fact that they keep breaking their own rules when dead is supposed to be dead, except in the case of breaking the laws of magic

I would argue that Henry, Blue Fairy, and Rumple were near-death experiences. Henry was under a sleeping curse, Blue just had her shadow ripped, and with Rumple it was established that the only way he could really be killed was if someone else stabbed him with the dagger. Rumple sacrificed himself, with nobody to pass on his dark one curse too. Therefore, I feel that’s why his essence was transported to the vault. Daniel being resurrected was to show how wrong it is to do so, hence why he wasn’t acting like himself. Ana, though, I completely agree was breaking the rule.

It’s also not uncommon to recycle previous props and redress them as something else, in regards to Phee’s post. It’s an efficient way of saving time and money.

[Phee]

I would argue that Henry, Blue Fairy, and Rumple were near-death experiences.

Henry was hooked up to machines in a hospital and he flatlined. He was clinically dead.

It’s also not uncommon to recycle previous props and redress them as something else, in regards to Phee’s post. It’s an efficient way of saving time and money.

The episodes aired within a week of each other, (both shows have tended to mirror each other with things here and there in the eps airing within a week of each other), it was established on WL that there’s a WoW in every land, and they used the same prop to show the exact same structure in the EF, as was in Agrabah and WL. IMO there’s no way that this was just the case of prop re-use to save a few bucks. It was deliberate.

[RumplesGirl]

I would argue that Henry, Blue Fairy, and Rumple were near-death experiences.

I will never understand what happened with Blue because it was magical handwaving randomness. I am willing to say near death experience for her but not Rumple and Henry.

Eddy and Adam said in many interviews, he is dead. He died. We don’t know where he went, but he died. And honestly, if he was only mostly dead, that lessens Neal’s sacrifice even more if Rumple wasn’t really dead.

Henry flat lined. There was no heartbeat. Clinically, dead. And if you’re looking at the idea of Savior as archetype, then I’d argue that he HAS to be dead because of Savior-induced resurrection through love.

 

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Phee]

And if you’re looking at the idea of Savior as archetype, then I’d argue that he HAS to be dead because of Savior-induced resurrection through love.

True. The label “Saviour” that they gave to Emma instantly makes you think of Jesus, the most famous Saviour who ever did save a whole lot of people by making them believe, and he raised *googling to find the number* three people from the dead, (one of them was even a 12 year old child). Summary of people in the Bible brought back to life.

[MatthewPaul]

You don’t die for good from a sleeping curse, though. Henry flat lining was the sleeping curse taking full effect. That’s how I took it at least. So yes he was in a state of death, but he was essentially in limbo

[The Swan Princess]

MatthewPaul wrote:

I don’t think using the Well of Wonders plot device as a loophole for reviving Neal or any other dead characters on the parent show is a good idea. Anastasia was an exception, not the norm, and even then it comes off as “way to break the dead is dead rule.

Well I don’t think it’s a good idea either. But I disagree with Ana being an exception, not a norm. There is a reason why it is becoming a joke for people who watch ONCE–because it keeps happening. Henry (TLK from Emma); Daniel (new heart from Frankenstein) Blue Fairy (throw a coconut into a fire); Rumple (dark magic at the vault of eternal goo); Ana, the first time (break the laws of magic); Ana, the second time (freely given water from the Well of Wonders as thanks for returning Amara’s waters and because it wasn’t Ana’s time to go). Now there are about an equal number or slightly higher number of people who have died and stayed dead (if we don’t count soldiers in battle) : Graham, Cora, Gus, GOAT (though Greg is open to interpretation with Adam’s interview comments), Pan, Neal. But that doesn’t change the fact that they keep breaking their own rules when dead is supposed to be dead, except in the case of breaking the laws of magic

That’s funny, I just added a list of these to my signature today XD. I forgot about the TLK one, I’ll add it.

You know what I can't continue with the dead people brought back to life list I'm out of space in the signature and now we have an underworld arc this is to much I quit why do you bring so many people back to life OUAT WHHHYYYY

[Author]

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