Speculating "The Little Mermaid"

[Phee]

Lately I’ve been pondering what they could do with The Little Mermaid story a bit too much, got a whole jumble of “what ifs” rattling around in my head, so figured I’d toss some of them out there for discussion and crackpot speculation to see if any sense can be made of it all.

We don’t have any spoilery information regarding The Little Mermaid, ( other than the fact she’ll definitely be in S3, and I dunno if even spoilerphobes would have been able to avoid that news ), but we do have some things in the show that are likely foreshadowing for The Little Mermaid story’s role in the Onceiverse. A few of us have discussed potential storyline for Ariel and mermaids in general in various threads, but I figured maybe a thread just to ponder the overall story could be good.

So, The Little Mermaid hints in the show…

Skin Deep:

Evil Queen: I have a deal to discuss. A certain…mermaid.

In that scene, there’s a trident standing in a corner of the room:
http://screencapped.net/tv/onceuponatime/displayimage.php?album=27&pid=997759#top_display_media
(In the Disney movie, Ariel’s father, Triton the sea King, has a trident. In Greek mythology, Poseidon, god of the sea, and his son Triton, both carry tridents.)

Into The Deep:

Mr. Gold: And yet, it wasn’t the quill itself, but the ink that captured the Dark One – harvested from the rarest species of squid, from the bottom of a bottomless ocean. Impossible to find, unless, you’re a mermaid… Or me.

SSTTR

Wendy: It’s an island, where there are no grownups to tell you what to do, but there are mermaids, and fairies, and all sorts of mystical creatures.

ASOTM

Hook: A pirate saved your scrawny bones from the curse of the mermaids.

Hook: And anyone who disobeys, can walk the plank, and pray the mermaids take pity on his soul.

And I’m gonna also include here how Rumple took the Sheriff of Nottingham’s tongue and took away his voice, because the sea witch takes the mermaid’s voice, and in the Anderson version she actually cuts out her tongue, which is similar to Rumple’s trick.

Differences between the Hans Christian Anderson version and the Disney version:
http://beeminor.wordpress.com/2013/03/04/the-little-mermaid-disney-vs-hans-christian-andersen/

Also not in the Anderson version, but not mentioned on the page linked to above:

The next day, Ariel finds out that Eric will be married to the disguised Ursula. Scuttle discovers that Vanessa is actually Ursula in disguise, and informs Ariel who immediately goes after the wedding barge. Sebastian informs Triton, and Scuttle disrupts the wedding with the help of various animals. In the chaos, the nautilus shell around Ursula’s neck is broken, restoring Ariel’s voice and breaking Ursula’s enchantment over Eric. Realizing that Ariel had saved his life, Eric rushes to kiss her, but the sun sets and Ariel transforms back into a mermaid. Ursula reveals herself and kidnaps Ariel. Triton confronts Ursula and demands Ariel’s release, but the deal is inviolable. At Ursula’s urging, the king agrees to take Ariel’s place as Ursula’s prisoner. Ariel is released as Triton transforms into a polyp and loses his authority over Atlantica. Ursula declares herself the new ruler and a struggle ensues in which Ursula accidentally kills Flotsam and Jetsam. In her rage, Ursula uses the trident to grow into monstrous proportions.

Ariel and Eric reunite on the surface just before Ursula grows past and towers the two. She then gains full control of the entire ocean, creating a storm with a maelstrom and shipwrecks, one of which Eric commandeers. Just as Ursula attempts to destroy a trapped Ariel in the maelstrom, Eric runs Ursula through the abdomen with the ship’s splintered bowsprit, killing her.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Little_Mermaid_%281989_film%29

Hans Christian Anderson’s version can be read in full here:
http://hca.gilead.org.il/li_merma.html

So, some questions to ponder…

The great Ursula debate: Regina, Rumple, or her own new character?

If mermaids are in NL, and Regina was talking about a mermaid in FTL, how does that connect?

How will Ariel’s love story be woven in with all the other aspects of the story?

Is that Triton’s trident in Rumple’s castle and if so, how/when did he get it?

How does Rumple get magical squid ink that only mermaids can get to?

Which bits will they take from each version of the story and how will they twist it into their own version?

[Phee]

Regina as Ursula is a popular theory and something I’ve changed my mind about a frillion times. The other day I came across a tumblr post that included this:
http://ryzlin.tumblr.com/post/57057964777/i-have-a-deal-to-discuss-a-certain-mermaid

There has been speculations that ‘Skin Deep’ takes place a few months after ‘The Evil Queen’. You know, that episode where Rumpel tells Regina that transformation magic takes months to even change a lock of hair? Why do some wonderfully observant people (who I wish I remembered, but alas do not) think this? Simple, Regina is sporting a fresh new dye job in ‘Skin Deep’. She has a section of hair coloured bright red. I love the thought of Regina staring into her mirror and
getting excited that she managed to turn a strip of hair a different colour. But this would mean that she doesn’t have the ability to change her shape in a puff of purple, which means she definitively wouldn’t have the ability to change someone else’s looks, not yet anyway. That leaves us with a possible Ursula who can’t turn Ariel into a human, and now we’re right back at the beginning when Regina is asking to make a deal with Rumpel about her mermaid problem because he can turn Ariel human.

Makes me wonder if Ursula’s role might end up essentially being a combo of both Regina and Rumple? Regina’s the face of the witch that helps Ariel, but Rumple is the main magician behind it all?

Though part of me would love for Ursula to be her own, individual character instead. Someone who either is the squid with the magical ink, or keeps the magical squid as her pet.

Does the squid ink come to be in Rumple’s possession after the Skin Deep conversation, or did he already have it, perhaps in relation to whatever incident resulted in him getting the trident, (assuming that is actually Ariel’s father’s trident)? What incident could even result in Rumple getting that trident? In the Disney version, Triton swapped places with Ariel as Ursula’s prisoner, and as a result, Ursula got the trident. And now I’m back to thinking that Ursula’s role could end up being a Rumple/Regina combo deal.

As a general rule on this show, if someone needs magical help with something, they make a deal with Rumple. The Disney version shows Ariel signing a contract with Ursula, which is a trademark of our Rumple. No matter how they present the story, they can’t really avoid that “price” aspect of the magic, so introducing a new Ursula would mean introducing someone else who operates with the same business practices as Rumple, which would make him less unique, so would they go that route?

The fact that we’ve seen Rumple take someone’s tongue/voice makes me think that even if Ursula is a new character, she will likely know Rumple, and one of them learned that trick from the other. Again, I’m coming back to Regina filling the role, because we know for a fact that Rumple teaches her how to do magical stuff. So maybe Ariel goes to Regina for help with becoming human. Regina can’t do that, but she knows who can, so goes to Rumple for a potion. Rumple doesn’t give away anything for free, so he says if he gives her the potion, in return, he wants the mermaid’s lovely voice, then he teaches Regina to do that tongue taking trick if he hasn’t taught it to her already. Then Regina goes back to Ariel and completes the deal to give up her voice to get her legs.

Much as I’d like Ursula to be someone else, it could also be pretty cool if Regina gets to NL in present day and comes face to face with Ariel again, and Ariel’s pissed at her, and Regina is all, “Your plight isn’t all on me, come meet my buddy Rumple.” And if Rumple has a history of taking Triton’s trident, Ariel will already have a prejudice against him for that, in addition to the role he played in her own personal deal. Then because Ariel’s one of the goodies, she’d want to help save Henry if she could, but she wouldn’t want to work with Regina and/or Rumple again, and it could all be wonderfully dramatic. You wouldn’t get any of that if Ursula was a humanoid squid living at the bottom of the ocean.

I’m thinking that maybe the squid will just be a big old magical sea monster. Maybe not even directly involved with Ariel at all. Maybe the squid ink and the trident will be factors in a whole separate deal. Maybe it was Ariel’s mother who made a deal with Rumple at some point where she had to retrieve the ink for him, and something went wrong and Triton tried to make it right by making his own deal that saw him lose his trident. And whatever went down with that is how Ariel’s mother died. Perhaps?

BTW, there was a recent tumblr post saying that Alyssa Milano should play Ariel because she’s the person the animator based Ariel’s face on. I reckon she’d be too old to play Ariel, but she could be perfect as Ariel’s mother. FWIW, Alyssa is currently contracted to ABC.

[kfchimera]

I actually wouldn’t mind seeing Regina being Ursula.  Mainly because I feel we have had a lot of characters come and go, and we all feel “too many, too brief” about these bit players.   On the other hand, we do sort of need some real evil threats out there, and after Mally turned out so ho-hum, perhaps they could do better with Ursula.

Putting aside Hookriel crack, I am wondering if they would go into Ariel’s love story at all.  They didn’t do Mulan’s either, unless you squint and say they combined Shang with Phillip or something.  Or that they were going off traditional folk lore Mulan who has no love interest.  Or cute, sassy dragon sidekick.

If so, they may leave Eric out entirely or imply he married someone else.

But my crackiest idea for Ursula is she is an undead Milah, risen by zombie magical means. You cannot bring someone back but you could make a monster of their corpse.

 

 

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[Phee]

I actually wouldn’t mind seeing Regina being Ursula. Mainly because I feel we have had a lot of characters come and go, and we all feel “too many, too brief” about these bit players. On the other hand, we do sort of need some real evil threats out there, and after Mally turned out so ho-hum, perhaps they could do better with Ursula.

True on both counts. They could still potentially make the Squid its own terrifying character without it being Ursula. Maybe a similar scene to in the movie when Ursula gets huge and destructive? Though it wouldn’t have to be huge to be terrifying to me, because many things that live in the ocean freak me out, and I have special phobia for things with tentacles, chiefly the octopus, but also not a fan of squid or jellyfish. Anyway, they could make the Squid a being made purely of dark magic that can’t be controlled, making it uber dangerous. I’m thinking a Kracken: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kracken

Putting aside Hookriel crack, I am wondering if they would go into Ariel’s love story at all. They didn’t do Mulan’s either, unless you squint and say they combined Shang with Phillip or something. Or that they were going off traditional folk lore Mulan who has no love interest. Or cute, sassy dragon sidekick.

If so, they may leave Eric out entirely or imply he married someone else.

I was proud of myself for posting two long Little Mermaid related posts without mentioning Hookriel. 😛 Fair point about them not giving Mulan a (canon) love interest, (though she’s shipped with both Phillip and Aurora, and I would totally ship her with Lancelot if they brought him back), at least not from what we’ve seen so far. I confess to never having seen the movie Mulan, so dunno how central the romance is to the plot. It’s pretty much the whole plot of The Little Mermaid though, so I dunno if they could get away with eliminating it entirely.

Another direction they could potentially take would be to make Ariel their LGBT character, taking their lead from the suggestion that Anderson wrote the story about his frustrations over having feelings for another man, who had just got engaged around the time the story was written.
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_little_mermaid#Psychoanalytic_interpretations) Even that may be too much of a departure from the already known romance story though. Of course, I’m saying this as someone who would be fine with them ditching the Prince and making him a Pirate instead, and there are plenty of people who would have an issue with that too, (though some Hookriel fanon out there includes both Hook and Eric). But at the end of the day, I reckon they’d be likely to have the iconic characters keep their orientations the same as has been previously established, and I reckon if they do have a specific Eric, they’ll follow the Disney model and have them end up together, as opposed to the Anderson model where there Prince ends up marrying someone else.

But my crackiest idea for Ursula is she is an undead Milah, risen by zombie magical means. You cannot bring someone back but you could make a monster of their corpse.

That’s some sensational crack, right there!

[angiebelle]

I could see them having Rumple or Regina play the role of Ursula in Ariel’s story, but Ursula is one of my favorite Disney villains.  It would be a shame not to see her as her own unique character!  I’d love to see OuaT’s take on her.  But it’s true that the show tends to introduce way too many characters!

If they are indicating that we will see Ariel in Neverland, does that mean we will see her as a mermaid and that the story we know hasn’t actually happened yet so we’ll see it play out in present day?

I have been waiting for Ariel since we first heard Regina reference a mermaid in “Skin Deep”!

In the film of Mulan, she falls in love with Shang, captain of the guards.  The romance is not the main focus of the story, but it does play out in a satisfying way.  He initially dismisses her after discovering her secret, but later comes back and realizes that she is indispensable.  The film ends on a note of blossoming true love.

 

 

[RumplesGirl]

But my crackiest idea for Ursula is she is an undead Milah, risen by zombie magical means. You cannot bring someone back but you could make a monster of their corpse.

That is some cracky crack and I love it.

Re Ursula: I’m in camp “new character” not Regina or Rumple. I think adding another persona to those two is a bit much, though I know they would both kill it. I really want Ursula to be a major villain and not a one off which is why I think we won’t see her until at least the second part of S3. Maybe she works for PP and once they dispose of PP, Ursula seeks revenge.

Re Ariel: It is so hard for me now to not talk about Ariel without going into Hookriel (*cough* Phee’s fault *cough*) but because she is one of my very favorite Disney characters I *need* her to have a big roll, like as big as Belle who is my favorite Disney princess. I really want her to be the lone voice of reason among the merpeople concerning PP. Maybe her family made a deal with PP; he gets the island and they get the ocean and together they get to live forever because of the magic of NL, but Ariel has a weakness for humans and joins the JR6. I think she’ll be a mermaid when we meet her and that her story of becoming human hasn’t happened yet. I think she has admired Hook from a distance but now he is finally in a place emotionally to accept a new love.

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[angiebelle]

I have a friend who loves Ariel and would go ballistic if she ends up being paired up with Hook!  lol  She doesn’t want to see Hook with any of the princesses (including Emma) because she sees him as a womanizer and a sleaze.

Cracks me up that Hook is being shipped with a character that we haven’t even met yet.

I don’t know if I want to see Peter Pan actually disposed of.  I know they are playing him as the big bad, but still- he’s *Peter*!  Maybe they will just defuse him?

I also hope Ariel has a pretty big part.  It would be interesting if they go the route of having the story play out in present day- that would be a first for the show.

[Josephine]

I was proud of myself for posting two long Little Mermaid related posts without mentioning Hookriel.

I’m proud, and I admit a bit surprised, that you were able to do that. 🙂  Whilst Captain Swan dominates fandom, there are a few of us a bit obsessed about Hookriel.  A few months ago it was pointed out to me that I had shipped a character I hated with one that wasn’t even on the show yet.  Now that’s shipping.  😀

As for Ursula, I rewatched The Little Mermaid last week and I can definitely see that Lana has drawn inspiration from the character, like she’s said in the past.  The vocal cues are evident. But then like the others, I see Rumple having a role.  I don’t think they’re going to bring another character into the already bloated cast when Rumple and/or Regina can do the job.  They’ve had no problem in the past combining characters.

I really hope they pick up Ariel’s story post-The Little Mermaid tale.  I’m really hoping they follow the Anderson version where she doesn’t get her happy ending.  I’d love for her to be banished to Neverland instead of turning to sea foam, though. She doesn’t get her Prince, but she’s also banished for her punishment.  I want to see her sassy.  Part of that is my dislike as a tween/teen for the fickle Prince Eric and the other part is Anderson’s tale is much more interesting and fits into the Once-verse much better. 

I also, as we’ve been talking about on other threads, wonder if the mermaids can travel between worlds by water.  I posted this comment from August in another thread, but will post it again:

August: Water is a very powerful thing. Cultures as old as time have worshipped it. It flows throughout all lands, connecting the entire world. If anything had mystical properties – if anything had magic – well, I’d say it’d be water.

–1 x 13 “What Happened to Frederick”

If water is so magical and flows through everywhere, I can see it as a connector between Neverland and Storybrooke.  Interestingly, I’ve just read a book, non-Once related, about how the fae (fairies) get to our world through a portal in water and they can only cross over during a certain type of moon.  That would be an interesting twist.  Say the mermaids can travel, but only during certain times.  Kind of like how the souls of the dead only walk on All Hallow’s Eve.  That kind of thing.

Deep down I’m really hoping for Hookriel, although I’ll admit it’s a crackship and has probably no chance of happening.  But my number one request is for her to not be with Prince Eric and for her story to be post The Little Mermaid.  I don’t know why I’m so against her having a happy life with her prince, but I just am.  😀

Keeper of Rumplestiltskin's and Neal's spears and war paint and crystal ball.

[runaroundmacy]

Ursula’s one of my favorites, but I am slowly starting to warm to the idea of Regina taking that role (even with Rumple’s help). It would simplify the storyline and answer questions from previous seasons, as well as give some more Evil Queen moments. Plus, we all can admit that Lana Parilla would ROCK that role, and she has said that Ursula is one of her faves and she would love to play her.

 

A thought did just occur to me in regards to the original tale, versus the Disney version and then Once’s twist. I think it would be quite interesting if Prince Eric did exist in the tale *in flashbacks*. Ariel made a deal with Urusla/Rumple/Regina in order to become human, but Eric *does* fall in love and marry someone else, keeping with Anderson’s original story. Instead of turning into sea foam, there is some other consequence, ie. no voice, stay a human, return to being a mermaid, banished to Neverland, etc. And maybe she doesn’t like humans anymore. Maybe she’s not necessarily going to be the most helpful to our heroes at first. Maybe she’s a little bitter at the circumstances she was left with. Not to say that she’s evil mind you, just maybe not the kind, innocent girl we all know. She’s a little bit more grown up now, and she’s loved and lost. And maybe it takes someone to make her change her mind… a handsome, charming, swaggering pirate that has also loved before, and thought he would never love again?

Keeper of the Cheshire Cat’s smile, Baelfire’s sword, Snow’s backpack, Robin Hood’s bow, Ariel’s purse, Ariel’s smile, Henry’s heart, Belle’s shoe collection

[RumplesGirl]

A thought did just occur to me in regards to the original tale, versus the Disney version and then Once’s twist. I think it would be quite interesting if Prince Eric did exist in the tale *in flashbacks*. Ariel made a deal with Urusla/Rumple/Regina in order to become human, but Eric *does* fall in love and marry someone else, keeping with Anderson’s original story. Instead of turning into sea foam, there is some other consequence, ie. no voice, stay a human, return to being a mermaid, banished to Neverland, etc. And maybe she doesn’t like humans anymore. Maybe she’s not necessarily going to be the most helpful to our heroes at first. Maybe she’s a little bitter at the circumstances she was left with. Not to say that she’s evil mind you, just maybe not the kind, innocent girl we all know. She’s a little bit more grown up now, and she’s loved and lost. And maybe it takes someone to make her change her mind… a handsome, charming, swaggering pirate that has also loved before, and thought he would never love again?

Ooooh. Ooooooooooh. This I like.

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Author]

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