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1. The children were given clear instructions by Regina: TOUCH NOTHING!
You have children. How often does that work? Especially when there is candy involved and they are starving
Okay…@RumplesGirl got me on that one. Give me a day to get a come back on that one… đ
[adrotate group="5"]"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
1. The children were given clear instructions by Regina: TOUCH NOTHING! AgainâŠRegina probably kidnapped Hansel and Gretelâs father after they agreed to work for her, and probably would have reunited them had they not been so rude and disrespectful to her. Again, Regina didnât push those children into the Witchâs HouseâŠ.Regina didnât kill children! We have no proof that Regina ever killed a childâŠ.and knowing her character who had a very soft spot for children, the most sheâd probably punish them is a week in the dungeons. But againâŠthe children had a choice that they couldâve said no to, but instead they willingly accepted Reginaâs offer.
Firstly…what RG said. She knew full well that the odds were slim that they’d succeed because she had sent so many other children in there before! She clearly didn’t care. Secondly, you should rewatch True North–she abducted their father in order to capture them and force them to get the apple. We know that because (a)Â we heard their father cry out just before the children couldn’t find him and (b) we see him at the end talking to Regina; he didn’t abandon his children so she had to have abducted him before forcing the children to do her bidding.
Are you really going to claim that there were no children in that entire village that she had murdered? That makes no sense. And here’s a screenshot of the village before she did that, and there are at least two (older) children:
Also, we know full well that she intended to kill Emma as a newborn.
And what about all of the other terrible things she’s done to children? Orphaning them, abusing them, tearing apart their families? No way does she have a “soft spot” for children.
2.Regina has taken responsibility for her past which is why sheâs constantly reminding herself that sheâs a villain. She knows what she did, she was there! Sheâs owned up to it, but the more she tries to move on and redeem herself, everyone keeps pushing her back into the Villain category! Regina and Rumple are two people who are being drowned by their past, because the people around them wonât let them up for air.
What evidence is there that she’s taken responsibility? She complains about other people seeing her as a villain, but has she ever sincerely apologized or expressed remorse? No, she tells Snow that she was a brat and calls her fat when she’s pregnant.
3. And once againâŠhow much work will it take for Regina to redeem herself? Where does the road end! Where is the finish line! Because after all sheâs doneâŠsheâs redeemed herself and more. 4. The people of Storybrooke will always wave the villain sign, and talk about her and Rumple behind their backs. Many people will cheer at their persistence, but secretly pray for their decline! Storybrooke isnât Anti-Hero friendlyâŠyouâre either 100% goody two shoe like those sneaky Charmings, or youâre nothing but dirt beneath their feet. Thatâs how Storybrooke feels! 5. Regina or Rumple could sacrifice their lives again for Storybrooke, and die the next day, and only be remembered in light heart by their fans and the Charmings, however those who are against them(such as Storybrooke and other Oncers) will dismiss any good deed theyâve done, and sayâŠâthey got what they deservedâ. They are not given a fair chance if people keep throwing the past in their faces. And if Regina and Henry succeeds, God I hope they do, Regina can write herself a new story with a much happier ending. And not just herâŠshe can give the villains their own happy endingâŠ.all Rumple was his son and love, all Cora used to want is money, but before she died she realized love is more important. And I think deep downâŠall Zelena wanted was Coraâs love. Chances of this happening is zero to none, but the point isâŠ.if Regina rewrites history and gives every villain what they wantedâŠ.everyone ends up happening. Because so many lives could have been spared had Bae not encountered the Blue Fairy, Johnathan not lied to Cora, and Snow not telling Reginaâs secret.
There is no “finish line”. I personally would say that expressing remorse and apologizing is probably a good first step.
And if Regina and Henry succeeds, God I hope they do, Regina can write herself a new story with a much happier ending. And not just herâŠshe can give the villains their own happy endingâŠ.all Rumple was his son and love, all Cora used to want is money, but before she died she realized love is more important. And I think deep downâŠall Zelena wanted was Coraâs love. Chances of this happening is zero to none, but the point isâŠ.if Regina rewrites history and gives every villain what they wantedâŠ.everyone ends up happening. Because so many lives could have been spared had Bae not encountered the Blue Fairy, Johnathan not lied to Cora, and Snow not telling Reginaâs secret.
Question isn’t whether Regina can write herself a happier ending, but whether she should write herself a happier ending. The thing you are not understanding is the fact life isn’t suppose to be easy. We are defined not only by the good time, but by the bad times. Let me give you an example of a story my teacher told me
“Once a little boy was playing outdoors and found a fascinating caterpillar. He carefully picked it up and took it home to show his mother. He asked his mother if he could keep it, and she said he could if he would take good care of it.
The little boy got a large jar from his mother and put plants to eat, and a stick to climb on, in the jar. Every day he watched the caterpillar and brought it new plants to eat.
One day the caterpillar climbed up the stick and started acting strangely. The boy worriedly called his mother who came and understood that the caterpillar was creating a cocoon. The mother explained to the boy how the caterpillar was going to go through a metamorphosis and become a butterfly.
The little boy was thrilled to hear about the changes his caterpillar would go through. He watched every day, waiting for the butterfly to emerge. One day it happened, a small hole appeared in the cocoon and the butterfly started to struggle to come out.
At first the boy was excited, but soon he became concerned. The butterfly was struggling so hard to get out! It looked like it couldnât break free! It looked desperate! It looked like it was making no progress!
The boy was so concerned he decided to help. He ran to get scissors, and then walked back (because he had learned not to run with scissorsâŠ). He snipped the cocoon to make the hole bigger and the butterfly quickly emerged!
As the butterfly came out the boy was surprised. It had a swollen body and small, shriveled wings. He continued to watch the butterfly expecting that, at any moment, the wings would dry out, enlarge and expand to support the swollen body. He knew that in time the body would shrink and the butterflyâs wings would expand.
But neither happened!
The butterfly spent the rest of its life crawling around with a swollen body and shriveled wings.
It never was able to flyâŠ
As the boy tried to figure out what had gone wrong his mother took him to talk to a scientist from a local college. He learned that the butterfly was SUPPOSED to struggle. In fact, the butterflyâs struggle to push its way through the tiny opening of the cocoon pushes the fluid out of its body and into its wings. Without the struggle, the butterfly would never, ever fly. The boyâs good intentions hurt the butterfly.
As you go through school, and life, keep in mind that struggling is an important part of any growth experience. In fact, it is the struggle that causes you to develop your ability to fly. ”
The fact remains that sometimes the best of intentions can cause someone else harm. Heck, Emma good intention of saving Marion, caused Regina harm. Who knows what kind of harm Regina intention to give villain happy ending would do. Redemption is never suppose to be easy, if you don’t believe me that look at Xena Warrior Princess. (I can’t believe I am using Xena as an example, but here we go.) When Xena was first introduced she was considered to a villain in Hercules the Legendary Journeys. Over time she had proved herself to be hero, by trying to make the best choices. Was it easy? No. Did she struggle? Yes. Through hard work and dedication in the good times and bad she did achieve redemption. If she can do it, so can Regina. It wouldn’t be achieved , if she tries to find shortcuts like trying to change the past, but by living in the present and trying to do their best. I respect your opinion, and I hope that your can respect mine as well.
We didn’t see their bodies, point out their bodies then I’ll believe there were children involved in the massacre! But even still…those children look too old to be considered children. And the people of that village had the same option Marian had…..you can either save yourself and tell Regina where Snow was, or die! Regina made it law to not help outlaws, Snow was back then an outlaw, whether she was right or wrong, those villagers were accessories to crime, thus preventing justice, which got them killed. Whether it’s right or wrong….it was law, and they broke it!
EVERYONE ASK YOURSELVES THIS: Had you been Marian, or one of those villagers….would you put your family at risk to harbor a fugitive, or would you have sold Snow White out to save your family? What would you have done? Because to be honest…if I knew my family lives were at stake….I’d have sold Snow White out the first time Regina asked. Because It came down to you or me.
And there was no evidence that Regina would kill Baby Emma…she may have just taken her in as vengeance to Snow. You’re raising your worst enemies daughter….opportunity of a lifetime!
And Regina called Snow “fat” in a more playful manner than insulting. Kinda like how family mess with each other…and it was Snow who called herself a brat. Regina is rebuilding a mother/daughter relationship with Snow White, which is good for S4 I think.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
I said this over the summer when we were doing our character analysis, so I’m just going to repeat it, since it fits here now.
I guess what Iâm trying to say, over all, is that when we cover up our favoriteâs actions we actually reduce their character and take something away from them. We should acknowledge the horrible nature of Reginaâs past actions because they show us how far sheâs come. If you simply white wash her away with âsheâs a victim and I can see the bright side of everything sheâs ever doneâ then I think you do a disservice to her character. You arenât called Evil Regals for nothing. You feel in love with Regina, the Evil Queen, the woman in all black who dared to walk into a wedding and curse everyone. We celebrate her snarkiness and her cunning but we canât go so far as to white wash away her crimes in order to, subconsciously I think, make her into someone we should like.
So many of us like the villains, but we are guilty (all of us! for every villain!) of trying to take away their villiany because then itâs more acceptable to like them. They become flawed anti-heroes, or victims of fate, or lonely broken misunderstood creatures. And while I will acknowledge that all of our âvillainsâ are anti-heroes it doesnât change the fact that there is an anti in front of the word hero.
I have zero issue with Regina getting a happy ending (this is ONCE, they are all getting them). I have LOTS of issues with Regina’s “forcing fate” to give her a happy ending. You want a happy ending? Then you work for it, with every curve ball thrown at you; this is the easy was to get a happy ending, and happy endings aren’t supposed to be easy. And the same goes for Rumple. I am horrified, again, that to cover up his lying he does more decietful things like freezing Belle (his WIFE), replacing the dagger instead of honesty, and then using the dagger a mere 24 hours later to get what he wants (hat).
and if the spoilers are right that Hook blackmails Rumple to get his hand back just before his date with Emma, then that’s trying force your version of happy ending too.
A lot of this comes down to the writers not knowing how to write (at least not well) “good” characters. Snow and Charming have become comic relief wonder duo who say and do stupid things. Many people were frustrated with Emma last season because of her NY! SB! NY! SB! attitude and the way she was treating Snow and Charming and Regina in regards to Henry. In other words, they made their Savior more gray. And Belle…Belle is, at best, really ignorant and unintentionally blind and at best, deliberately looking the other way at her husband’s crimes.
The villains are more interesting and more fun to write so they get these kinds of story lines (ie: Snow’s dark heart went no where whereas this is the 2…3rd? time Regina has flip flopped.) But it’s wearing on me because the back and forth is just…TIRING. Rumple made a bold heroic sacrifice in 311 and then they ripped it all back when he killed Zelena because they don’t know how to just write Rumple, the man and burgeoning hero. Regina made great strides in 3B and now they’ll take it all back with this love triangle (twitch) cause THAT TOTES DRAMAZ GUYZ.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"We didnât see their bodies, point out their bodies then Iâll believe there were children involved in the massacre
They can’t on network TV at 8pm. The children are shown in the screen shot Epona provided to indicate that they will be killed later, but on a network 8pm show, they can’t show dead children like that.
But even stillâŠthose children look too old to be considered children.
Nonsense. They look at be Henry’s current age if only slightly older. They are at most 15 or 16.
And there was no evidence that Regina would kill Baby EmmaâŠshe may have just taken her in as vengeance to Snow. Youâre raising your worst enemies daughterâŠ.opportunity of a lifetime!
Um. Yes there was. She says so in Save Henry and in the Pilot. And there was another confirmation via Twitter or an interview.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"Boy we keep going back and forthâŠ.
But thatâs alright! This is a little fun! I agree! I like debates and I’m genuinely curious about how others see things like this.
6. If Regina regrets any decisions sheâs madeâŠthen she regrets Henry. And thatâs something she does not regret! Thatâs why she doesnât regret anything! Had Regina not done what she had doneâŠEmma would have never met Neal, and Henry would never be born! Nine times out of ten, Zelena would have came along and destroyed everything, and actually win because Regina would have no love to pull from to defeat her. And Emma would have been more than likely the baby Zelena would have sacrificed. So in a way, itâs a good thing Regina doesnât regret anything because itâs how her and her family has survived this long. I know it sounds strange and weird but itâs the truthâŠit was her having no regrets that helped Regina defeat Pan who wouldâve surely killed them all.
First of all, I have no idea what you’re saying with Emma being the baby Zelena would’ve sacrificed…?
Mainly though, what about what she’s done since getting Henry? She’s done some awful things since then too–how about gaslighting and alienating Henry and trying to murder people he loved? How about murdering Graham? How about conspiring to have Kathryn Nolan murdered (she thought) and framing Mary Margaret for her murder? Separating Hansel and Gretel for no reason, and sending them and Emma out of town knowing full well that the curse would hurt them if they tried that? Helping her mother murder Johanna? Helping her mother almost get Rumple’s dagger so she’d become the Dark One? And that’s only a few things off the top of my head…Why doesn’t she regret any of that?! If she wanted to take any of those things back, she’d still have Henry. (And you don’t have to want to take things back to be sorry for having done them and hurt people.)
7. The death of Leopold, you all know how I feel about that, and Regina should NOT have to apologize for killing the man who imprisoned her in a castle, and showed her off as only a trophy wife before locking her back away. Regina could not step foot outside the kingdom unless she was with him, and Leopold knowingly married his ex-fiancĂ©eâs daughter, who was three times younger than him, and accepted his ex-fiancĂ©eâs answer instead of the woman he was proposing to. Leopold sought out a trophy wife/mother and babysitter for Snow/bed partner. Yes, it may not have been shown, but Iâm quite sure by Leopoldâs jealousy in the Forbidden Fruit that he didnât want NO other man after his young, fairest of them all, wife. Leopold may have been a good king, but he was a terrible husband with some sick problems!
First of all, from what we see of Leopold, he’s always been a very good and fair guy. When he came across the genie, he didn’t even wish for anything other than happiness and prosperity for his people! I bet if she had spoken to Leopold alone, without Cora, and explained that she didn’t want to marry him, he’d have understood. Or she could have simply refused to say the vows and stand up to Cora afterward. It’s not Leopold’s fault she gave in to her mother and decided to marry for money and power instead of love. And how do we know she wasn’t lying to the genie about being locked up? We’ve never seen him be unjustifiably mean to anyone, but we’ve seen Regina lie many times. Also, as icky as it is, older men–especially wealthy, royal ones–often married younger women. It wouldn’t have been that unusual or scandalous.
8. And another thing,âŠ..it should be the Charmings who are happy Regina was in a good place, and trying to be good. Because she could have killed them all and been done with the entire situation, and forced Henry to love her with that curse, but Regina decided against it. Regina willingly let Henry go to give him his best chance with the Charming Family, but I can guarantee, all Henry had to do was say he was ready to come homeâŠ.No Charming or Ally in SB could have held Regina back from her son. And because of Snow WhiteâŠ.Regina missed out on her first love which she did not deserve, and actually showed some form of mercy because if Regina really wanted Snow to suffer back in the EFâŠ.she couldâve just swiftly killed David and showed Snow the pain she caused her. And for killing Reginaâs motherâŠ.Snow really deserves another death in her own family if weâre discussing who deserves what, but Regina left it at that, and is moving on. Right nowâŠ.what Regina deserves, has earned, and long since been denied is a Happily Ever After.
And they could’ve killed her multiple times but they didn’t. The fact that she ended up changing her mind and not murdering an entire town doesn’t say much for her. And she only let Henry go because he wanted to go–her first impulse was to keep him there.
Also, Snow did not kill Daniel! She was a child, and Cora was awfully convincing about not wanting Regina to lose her mother, especially since she had just lost her own mother (to Cora). She honestly thought she was helping Regina. Also, do you really think they would’ve gotten away if it hadn’t been for Snow? Didn’t Cora have border spells set up to grab Regina with tree branches and stuff? Or she could’ve used a locator spell the next day, killed Daniel then, and done the same thing. Blaming that on Snow is completely ridiculous, and Regina only did that because she was afraid of the real culprit.
And how on earth does Snow “deserve another death in her family?” Regina killed one of Snow’s parents (for personal gain) and Snow killed one of Regina’s (who she was more than willing to kill a few weeks prior and in order to defend her family and people).
@Epona: We didnât see their bodies, point out their bodies then Iâll believe there were children involved in the massacre! But even stillâŠWhether itâs right or wrongâŠ.it was law, and they broke it! Â
It wasn’t legitimate law though–Snow was the rightful ruler at the time. Also, in that case, Regina didn’t say she’d kill them all if they didn’t give up Snow, she just offered them money and got angry when they refused, THEN just had them killed without giving them a chance to reconsider.
And there was no evidence that Regina would kill Baby EmmaâŠshe may have just taken her in as vengeance to Snow. Youâre raising your worst enemies daughterâŠ.opportunity of a lifetime!
She said she was planning on “getting rid of a baby”, not just “getting” her or something. That absolutely means kill her.
And Regina called Snow âfatâ in a more playful manner than insulting. Kinda like how family mess with each otherâŠand it was Snow who called herself a brat. Regina is rebuilding a mother/daughter relationship with Snow White, which is good for S4 I think.
It didn’t seem all that playful to me, although I agree that Snow didn’t seem to be hurt by it. And yes, Snow called herself a brat, but Regina agreed instead of, you know, taking the opportunity to apologize.
(Typing this as fast as I can because I’m watching the cake that’s in the oven.)
9. @RumplesGirl
I agree with almost everything you said, the only thing is….I guess I can understand Regina’s frustration in wanting to change her history. She’s tired…she’s exhausted….personally I think a long break out of Storybrooke would do her a lot of good, something I predict happening in the winter finale. Regina just leaving Storybrooke all together, and it’s actually gonna be Henry to rewrite History.
10. @Epona
I’m talking about, had Regina just given up and not cast the Dark Curse. Sooner or later, Zelena would have popped up in the Enchanted Forest with her change the past agenda, and more than likely would have used Emma(who would have been a baby, thus the Innocent) as her curse. And Zelena would have more than likely succeeded.
11. Regina was telling the truth about her feeling like a prisoner, as she told the same thing to Tinkerbelle in Quite A Common Fairy 3×03.
12. When we take it all the way back to the beginning….who had the first chance to kill who…Regina. She could have easily killed Snow White right after Leopold, but instead she sent Graham to do it. And when we bring it down to who had the last chance…Regina again, when she put Snow White’s heart back in her chest. Between sparing….Regina’s spared the Charmings more so than they have her, and the main reason Regina didn’t succeed was because she’d rather put on a show such as burning Snow at the stake and beheading Charming rather than just flicking her wrist and snapping their neck.
13. No matter how anyone wants to say it…Snow White is the cause of Daniel’s death. Do I think Daniel’s death was inevitable, yes it was whether Snow told or not, because Cora would have eventually found Regina unless Regina and Daniel went to another realm. But Snow White sure did speed up the inevitable by snitching on Regina. Cora was manipulative, but a secret is a secret, and Snow White knew what a secret was! I’ve got friends whose secrets I’m still keeping from their parents till this day….Snow White was just too gullible and naĂŻve. So Daniel’s death is Snow White’s fault, and Cora’s death is definitely Snow’s fault…both of which I’m glad she acknowledged. Snow White never thinks of consequences, and the apple didn’t fall too far from the tree with Emma…but Emma is at least a lot brighter than her parents thank god.
14. I’m sorry, but when the crown is on Regina’s head…she’s the Queen! She makes the rules! The Villagers broke them! The villagers helped a fugitive, and thus they had to pay the price. NO one spoke up…had one person spoke up, Regina probably would have left. But no….they chose to go down for Snow White! Even when Regina gave the order to kill, any person in their right mind would have immediately spoke up to sell out Snow! And for poor villagers, heck, they needed the money to feed their families! They should have spoke up, and the same goes for Marian.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
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