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Gold, to me, has been an incredibly tragic figure…. I don’t know that they want him to be happy, whether that means he’s lost Belle or Bae……I don’t know. I always thought he might die. Maybe he still will or maybe this will just be a continuation of his life’s story, which is that he’s a Shakespearean tragedy on two legs. Of course if he died, the Belle would be denied her happy ending……If she dies, she doesn’t have one. Adam tweeted it tonight and he’s right: ”Fairy Tales have danger and consequences:”. I’m not happy about this, of course, ESPECIALLY if it’s Belle or Bae, but it doesn’t surprise me…….well Bae would. Belle? Nope.
I think Rumple will get his happy ending, precisely because he was willing to sacrifice himself to save Belle and and Baelfire. He told his son he wanted to give him a second chance to be happy (though Rumple believes just not with him). Rumple did the brave thing, overcame his cowardice, and willingly sacrificed himself in a hero’s end. He is no longer a villain. If either of them were to die now, then Rumple’s ‘undoing’ would be for naught. I don’t think Rumple is permanently dead (after all, Robert Carylyle was excluded form the list of candidates). That strongly suggests that Rumple’s “undoing” isn’t his final death; it might just be the undoing of his dark one curse.
[adrotate group="5"]"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
I mentioned this in the chatroom earlier, but it’s very possible the reasons people keep saying these characters can’t die is why they are going through with this death. Life is unpredictable, and tragedies of all sorts happen. Killing off one of the regulars would prove to the audience that nobody necessarily has a plot shield to prevent them from a possible death. Let’s face it, with the exception of Graham (who was only in 7 episodes anyway), the previous deaths on the show have been predictable, because they were only recurring characters such as Cora and Peter Pan. We saw those deaths coming from a mile away, and therefore they never really felt like a bombshell. Killing off one of the core characters, though, would undeniably rise the stakes. It’s also too early to claim it’s bad writing, because the key thing is seeing how the death is executed. Seriously, who knows what will even happen in the episodes leading up to this death. Some of those plot points people want mentioned may as well be covered during that timespan, for whatever character bites it. While it’s easy to play the “I’m going to be skeptical on what Adam says” game, we still can’t say for sure what they ultimately have planned. Our vision for the show doesn’t necessarily fall in line with their own vision. Yes it would be nice if all of the core cast survived and got their happy ending, but that very well might not be the case on the show itself. Personally, I think we’ve exhausted the speculation for this topic until we get more concrete information. I’m just going to take a breather and let things unfold.
Our vision for the show doesn’t necessarily fall in line with their own vision. Yes it would be nice if all of the core cast survived and got their happy ending, but that very well might not be the case on the show itself. Personally, I think we’ve exhausted the speculation for this topic until we get more concrete information. I’m just going to take a breather and let things unfold.
That is a really good point. Life happens, in fiction and in reality. Death is almost always unexpected and disruptive. I may just follow your lead and stop speculating. Better to wait and see, than to be anxious or worried over something none of us can control.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
Obviously people want to rule out certain characters or rule other ones in but we really cannot tell. Story-driven is Adam’s nicely vague could-mean-anything term, after all. Story could have driven the actor/actress away. It could have been “planned” since the actor said they’re fed up or planned since they hired the actor, or the last story camp when they got a new idea and new vision (just ask Red/Meghan Ory).
TVline poll would indicate that what fans expect is Neal despite that they just did a story about the effects on everyone if he were dead. I feel it is GOAT part 2, they’ll have some talking points about how they felt Neal’s death was “earned” in some way but really it was “have to please fans”. It seemed to me they scrapped plans with GOAT due to fans hissing about the taser, and it may have tied in to things for Neal they scrapped. Things to do with the Darlings, the home office and how he escaped that were just shunted to a coconut shaped plot hole.
Who knows but so many missed opportunities and I’m losing faith that the future dots we collect have anything to do with connecting back to the ones we already have.
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
I think Rumple will get his happy ending, precisely bedause he was willing to sacrifice himself to save Belle and and Baelfire. He told his son he wanted to give him a second chance to be happy (though Rumple believes just not with him). Rumple did the brave thing, overcame his cowardice, and willingly sacrificed himself in a hero’s end. He is no longer a villain. If either of them were to die now, then Rumple’s ‘undoing’ would be for naught.
His whole character journey would be for naught. His entire struggle to overcome his weaknesses and redeem himself, thinking he’s giving the ultimate sacrifice of his life, then having him blessed with surviving after all…I can’t see them building a character like that, having him come good and get a real second shot at life, and then not giving him his happy ending. They always say this show is about hope, and Rumple not eventually getting his happy ending would be the ultimate downer. All of the crap Rumple orchestrated, for the sake of finding his son, then he gave up his life for that son, if Neal then went and died, then it was all for nothing in the end. Again, that’s about as anti-hope as you can get. Having Belle’s belief in Rumple end with her dying and not getting to be with him, again, totally anti-hope. I really think the Floof Fam are gonna get their happy ending when all is said and done, because Rumple’s desperate search for family is what the show is based on, (if he didn’t need to find his son – a situation that had its roots in Rumple’s relationship with his own father – then we’d have no Curse and no show).
I’m just physically sick over all of this. If it’s actor related then they need come out and just say it but I’m inclined to believe that Adam is dodging this because he doesn’t want to deal with what I’m sure will be fan backlash and low ratings by trying to say it was story driven all along which to me is nothing more than a flagrant excuse because they caved to fan pressure over a certain pirate and pressure from ABC promo department
Keeper of Neal/BaelFire's Blood Magic, Neverland Crossbow, FTL Clothes,Room at Granny’s, Charming & Emma’s Father/Daughter Hugs, Henry's Neverland Crossbow, Rumplestlitskin/Mr.Gold's FTL Walking StickI’m just physically sick over all of this. If it’s actor related then they need come out and just say it but I’m inclined to believe that Adam is dodging this because he doesn’t want to deal with what I’m sure will be fan backlash and low ratings by trying to say it was story driven all along which to me is nothing more than a flagrant excuse because they caved to fan pressure over a certain pirate and pressure from ABC promo department
*sigh*
I don’t know. I think that’s not giving A and E enough credit. They aren’t limp noodles. It is *their* show. And while I agree that ABC is probably leaning on them to do a lot with Hook because he is very marketable, at the end of the day A and E choose what to write. So if they are feeling pressure over anything, it’s still their choice. And if they did cave to fan pressure then they are clearly in the wrong business.
They haven’t caved to fan pressure as of yet. If they had, Regina and Emma would be together and Belle and Rumple would be locked in a bedroom somewhere.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"Well to be fair Emma has also wished Neal was dead… so that’s not really something you can point in Hook’s direction and not the other.
I mean each of the cave confessions has come true.
Hook’s secret was that he didn’t think he’d be capable of letting go of his first love. Now he believes Emma is his true love.
Snow’s secret was she wanted to have another child. Now she’s pregnant.
Charming’s secret was that he couldn’t leave Neverland. He’s now left Neverland and is getting the second chance with Snow at a new child.
Emma’s secret was that she wished Neal was dead so that she wouldn’t have to deal with this pain.
… Nothing’s really happened to full circle Emma’s secret.
So this could potentially be an example of chekhov’s gun. Really eerie when you think about it.
betsypaige24 wrote: Gold, to me, has been an incredibly tragic figure…. I don’t know that they want him to be happy, whether that means he’s lost Belle or Bae……I don’t know. I always thought he might die. Maybe he still will or maybe this will just be a continuation of his life’s story, which is that he’s a Shakespearean tragedy on two legs. Of course if he died, the Belle would be denied her happy ending……If she dies, she doesn’t have one. Adam tweeted it tonight and he’s right: ”Fairy Tales have danger and consequences:”. I’m not happy about this, of course, ESPECIALLY if it’s Belle or Bae, but it doesn’t surprise me…….well Bae would. Belle? Nope.
I think Rumple will get his happy ending, precisely bedause he was willing to sacrifice himself to save Belle and and Baelfire. He told his son he wanted to give him a second chance to be happy (though Rumple believes just not with him). Rumple did the brave thing, overcame his cowardice, and willingly sacrificed himself in a hero’s end. He is no longer a villain. If either of them were to die now, then Rumple’s ‘undoing’ would be for naught. I don’t think Rumple is permanently dead (after all, Robert Carylyle was excluded form the list of candidates). That strongly suggests that Rumple’s “undoing” isn’t his final death; it might just be the undoing of his dark one curse.
I agree, and yes, I think his saving Belle and Bae only to have either one die not long after would be unbearably cruel……..but then again, that’s still been his life story, even when he wasn’t a “villain”.
I meant that I expected that Gold would die at the end of the series……..and he still might.
I’m guessing based on Adam’s quotes about Emilie’s performances that she’s getting meaty material. I have to imagine Belle is going to be shattered, bereft, distraught…….and ANGRY about Gold’s death. Perhaps she’ll even strike out at Hook and/or Regina for stealing precious time from she and Gold. I would imagine that that would be part of her story…….. Today she was filming on what appears to be a Kansas set (Gale farmhouse), so she’s involved there. With Belle, it appears that she will have pretty good story…….but the question is: assuming Rumbelle reunites, just WHAT will A/E do with them? If they are in SB, which I think they will be, then they actually NEED to NOT separate Rumbelle again and give them screen time. This means dealing with Gold being mortal and facing lifes ups and downs together. She also needs to open that damn library and make it a social center for the town. I LOVED seeing her in that environment.
It just makes no sense. If they brought her on as a regular based on her popularity, then they can’t possibly expect anything less than huge viewer loss if they got rid of her (both Belle and Rumbelle/Belle fans). ABC would be deluged with furious fans…..So I guess my point is: IF Adam and Eddy want to end Rumbelle and deny both Gold and Belle their happy endings, yeah they can kill her off…..IF they don’t, then they need to keep her on and actually use her
I can see then wanting to have Gold flip out and go off the deep end, but to me, that requires that Belle die, not Bae. In the S2 finale, once Belle was restored, he seemed to be handling Bae’s death fairly well. I think with Belle to support him and love him, he’d be ok……..and remember that he didn’t even know if his son would forgive him or if he still loved him. If Bae were to die now, at least he’d know he had both Bae’s love and forgiveness. I’m not saying that Gold would not flip out, but as a long term arc? To me, it would be Belle who’d have to go because Belle is the one who believed in him, who loved him and who never gave up on him. Bae would have his own personal life, but Gold’s life is tied up with Belle….and as Bobby has said repeatedly, she’s his moral compass, his emotional center. Without her, as we saw in Lacey, he’d have no anchor…….we saw that he was ready to just give in to his despair and darkness.Phee, I agree 100%…….. I mean, they could no longer claim that this show is about HOPE if Gold didn’t get his happy ending. If Belle were to die, god……that would be the worst. I posted about this earlier, but she IS hope……and she gave him hope. Her life would be a litany of tragedy; she would have lost 30 years thanks to Regina, would have lost weeks thanks to Hook……is going to lose at least a year thanks to Pan. For kind, compassionate and strong Belle to die after all that’s happened to her would be inexplicably tragic.
Matt’s right, we don’t know how the death fits into the story and what they had in mind in terms of a vision for the story to where it will fit and feel like a natural conclusion ….or not.
I get what you’re saying Matt, and said so too that they needed to raise emotional stakes after all the fake deaths–Henry, Archie,Blue, Neal, even sort of August, then Rumple, and came very close with Charming, Snow, Hook, Belle and Regina though they didn’t totally “die” …they need one about a character we are invested in emotionally to stick. Whatever “set-up” they need to make that happen can take place with the new storytelling they have in mind.
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
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