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Male, for sure. And very “basic”–something a little boy would play with long ago. Looks like something a parent or other relative made of a child out of whatever was around, not having a lot of money. Rumple’s father gambled so I’m betting he grew up pretty poor. Rumple and Bae weren’t well off, but they did sell their wool at market.
Both theories are totally possible at this point, but my gut still tells me it’s Rumple’s doll. Whether that means he’s PP’s little brother or not I don’t know.
[adrotate group="5"]"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"Just posted my thoughts on the doll being Rumple’s over in the D23 thread. Maybe it’d be better suited to discussion in this thread though? I’ll copy and paste…
Taking the whole context of the scene, Rumple’s reaction, and Felix’s, and dialogue from a previous ep, it made me think even more that the doll was Rumple’s.
Felix: “Isn’t it funny, the things we haven’t thought about in years…still have the ability to make us cry.”
Wendy: “When night fell, that’s when all the children started to miss their parents, and they cried through the night.”
They had Rumple fall to his knees, bringing him down to a child’s height, (they could have just had him bend down to pick it up). Then they had Felix crouch down, the way an adult often will when speaking directly to a child. In that scene, Rumple was a child again IMO, and the doll was his, the only remaining thing that was a reminder of his lost parents, and it made him cry just like all the Lost Boys cry over missing their parents. The way Felix spoke about it, sounded like this particular brand of crying that Rumple was doing is something he witnesses all the time.
Rumple was putting on such a show for Felix though. He did the gestures like he was mocking himself (I think Neal really got through to him), but he was being The Dark One for Felix’s benefit. That suggests that he was in Neverland as an adult, as the Dark One.
I’m convinced now that the doll was Bae’s while Bae was in Neverland, and that Rumple came there but Pan kept him from taking Bae back. And that might flow into the whole “my son has been running for a long time” concept from Manhattan. Maybe the doll is the catalyst that kept them apart back then?
Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
It does suggest that Rumple has been in NL as the Dark One but that doesn’t negate him being in NL as a child. Both could be true; it’s not mutually exclusive. And Pan seems to be perfectly fine with Rumple being in NL, so long as it’s not for Henry, which would indicate a sort of bond between them. Even if Rumple doesn’t want one.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"It’s been indicated that Rumple and Pan were great enemies in the past…I just can’t imagine that being the case in his pre-Dark One days. I will be surprised if their relationship goes as far back as Rumple’s own childhood. Not impossible, certainly, but I’m not convinced at this point. I think that would be overkill on the back story and would introduce an unnecessary new concept at a time when we have enough going on as it is- it would feel out of the blue. I think the doll is related to Bae and the crying was that of a grieving parent.
It’s been indicated that Rumple and Pan were great enemies in the past…I just can’t imagine that being the case in his pre-Dark One days. I will be surprised if their relationship goes as far back as Rumple’s own childhood. Not impossible, certainly, but I’m not convinced at this point. I think that would be overkill on the back story and would introduce an unnecessary new concept at a time when we have enough going on as it is- it would feel out of the blue. I think the doll is related to Bae and the crying was that of a grieving parent.
Enemies sure, but perhaps it’s one sided. Pan isn’t freaking out that Rumple is in NL. He sends Felix almost as a welcome party, without going himself. Rumple fears Peter Pan but that could stem from being emotionally scared as a kid, being taken to NL or losing his brother or a friend, ect. As the Dark One, Rumple even says in 108 “I’m not afraid of anything.” So the fear of Pan must stem from sometimes before being the Dark One.
I think it’s very possible that Rumple went back to NL after he became the Dark One, especially if he got wind of Bae being there. I don’t know if it’s “out of the blue” from what we know about Rumple’s past, he was a “lost” boy in that he was orphaned and miserable and possibly unloved."He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"Well, Rumple and Felix both say that Pan has the ability to kill Rumple. “We both know that I won’t [survive].”
That means Pan has some power over the Dark One.
Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
Well, very little of what we know about Rumple’s childhood was actually addressed on the show since that one scene was deleted. The only thing that was said on the show itself was that his father was a coward and he was raised by spinsters- we’ve been filling in a lot of the blanks ourselves.
It does suggest that Rumple has been in NL as the Dark One but that doesn’t negate him being in NL as a child. Both could be true; it’s not mutually exclusive. And Pan seems to be perfectly fine with Rumple being in NL, so long as it’s not for Henry, which would indicate a sort of bond between them. Even if Rumple doesn’t want one.
All of this! I agree, the half hearted hand flourish does suggest that Felix has seen Rumple in Dark One mode before. If the Curse originated in NL, that could be why Rumple had been there. But I still really think he was also there as a child.
If we go with the idea that he went there to get the Curse, (or part thereof), how would he have even known that such a thing might exist there, unless he had prior knowledge of the place? Knowledge he could have gained when he was there as a child, and his brother PP had eagerly told him all about the wonderful, magical properties of that world, maybe even how it came into being. If PP had wanted his brother to live there ever since way back then, it’d make sense that he’s cool with Rumple staying now, as long as he doesn’t plan to make trouble. Rumple finally conceding to stay in NL would be a victory for PP.
Another possible way they could go is if he and PP had a disagreement when Rumple was a powerless child, and PP had the upper hand back then, you know that Rumple would wanna go back with a mind to turning the tables once he was the Dark One. It’d be the “kiss my boot” situation all over again. “You made me bow down to you, well now I have the power.”
I think it makes it more compelling if Rumple and PP have tangled on more than one previous occasion, and giving them that sibling connection would be an amazing twist.
angiebelle wrote:
It’s been indicated that Rumple and Pan were great enemies in the past…I just can’t imagine that being the case in his pre-Dark One days. I will be surprised if their relationship goes as far back as Rumple’s own childhood. Not impossible, certainly, but I’m not convinced at this point. I think that would be overkill on the back story and would introduce an unnecessary new concept at a time when we have enough going on as it is- it would feel out of the blue. I think the doll is related to Bae and the crying was that of a grieving parent.
Enemies sure, but perhaps it’s one sided. Pan isn’t freaking out that Rumple is in NL. He sends Felix almost as a welcome party, without going himself.
One thing I’m pretty sure of though is Felix was sent by Pan not to welcome Rumple but to threaten him. Pan uses psychological torture to strike fear into people to control them. Hence, the doll.
Rumple fears Peter Pan but that could stem from being emotionally scared as a kid, being taken to NL or losing his brother or a friend, ect. As the Dark One, Rumple even says in 108 “I’m not afraid of anything.” So the fear of Pan must stem from sometimes before being the Dark One.
I think it’s very possible that Rumple went back to NL after he became the Dark One, especially if he got wind of Bae being there. I don’t know if it’s “out of the blue” from what we know about Rumple’s past, he was a “lost” boy in that he was orphaned and miserable and possibly unloved.True. I’m now uncertain whose doll it is. Phee made some excellent points just now as to why the doll could be Rumple’s, and Angiebell also made some excellent remarks, too. It could be as you said, RG. It doesn’t have to be a mutually exclusive case. While I definitely think Rumple was in NL before as the Dark One post-losing Bae, he might’ve been there as a boy, too.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
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