What if Bae jumps from world to world with many identities

[fairy dust]

What if the Mystery Man is Neal Cassady and Baelfire and Jack and the Beanstalk and Peter Pan and the Wizard of Oz…and…and…and???

I’m going to throw something out there that I think is a possibility…it may or may not prove true…but if it does it could make for an incredibly layered, complex and interesting story.

I think that it is very possible that the Mystery Man whose assumed name is Neal Cassady, who I believe is Baelfire, and Peter Pan…could also be the Wizard of Oz. as well as multiple other characters.

We do not know how many worlds Baelfire passed through before he ended up in New York City with the identity of Neal Cassady (assuming this is Baelfire). He could very well have passed through multiple worlds…thus having taken on multiple identities. We have a very long time period to work with that would be conducive to this. In one of my posts I mentioned some of the Wizard of Oz nods related to the Mystery Man…these may or may not lead to anything…they could be coincidence. But if they are accurate nods, I think they lead to the possibility of Baelfire going through multiple worlds…”following the bean” wherever it leads, from world to world to world. (did anyone else notice that strange wall hanging at the orphanage…it looked like multiple boxes of different size and shapes connected with lines)

Here is what we already know. This theory is assuming that the Mystery Man is Baelfire.

1. Beginning of Journey – identity is known – Baelfire

2. After going through the Green Portal

Possible hinted identity – Jack and the Beanstalk because of the Magic Bean

Possible hinted identity -There are nods to the Wizard of Oz in the opening segment of Broken featuring the Mystery Man/Neal Cassady (remember that in the movie the Wizard of Oz played multiple parts so this fits with the Baelfire multiple storybook character theory)

Possible hinted identity – he is the White Rabbit from Alice in Wonderland (there is a hot air balloon in the scene where Jackson is wanting to buy his daughter the white rabbit and Baelfire did go down a hole into another world. There are items in the MM/Neal Cassady’s apartment that also point to white rabbit)

Confident of this identity – Peter Pan (very obvious connections to Neal Cassady and the clue trail left in the apartment)

3. Real World identity – Present Day time period – assumed name know – real name unknown but everything points to Baelfire
Known – Neal Cassady (although we know this must be an assumed identity)

Baelfire – Many Worlds
https://oncepodcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1462&start=20#p21922

One of the clues in the Mystery Man scene leads to a place on the upper West Side of Central Park called The Radio Foundation – who produced Firesign Theater (remember the fire at the City Hall that houses the theater the one with the sign in front that they were putting flyers on). Firesign Theater (that ties in with the Beat Generation) was highly praised for their comedy albums…here is a quote from a review by Rolling Stone: http://www.benway.com/firesign/fst-reviews/wftelec.htm

The Firesign Theatre leans heavily on sound effects, using stereo to create a sense of space just like these old Sports Cars in Hi-Fi Stereo records, and using over dubbing and electronic effects to create a galaxy of character voices and background sounds. Layer upon layer of dialog and sound effects are present throughout most of the productions. One listen is hardly enough to begin to grasp what is going on, and six or seven tries later you’re still unearthing juicy tidbits. Their timing is dynamite, their dialog kaleidoscopic, and their satire is, so to speak, acidic.

I think this is going to be Baelfire’s story….layer upon layer, galaxy of character voices, Imagine the possibilities. I think we are going to go on an adventure with Baelfire that leads us to many places…ending in New York City where he learns the curse is broken and then his journey will hopefully take him to Emma and a little boy named Henry who needs a daddy as much as he needs his mom. The story of Peter Pan tells us there are many Never Lands…each is different for each child. I think that is what we are going to see…Baelfire and other “lost” boys/girls…we are going to see their worlds…hear their stories…I think it will be wonderfully entertaining and insightful.

The Mystery Man has taken an assumed name, Neal Cassady. The real Neal Cassady was the bus driver for a journey that has been called the Magic Trip. If the Mystery Man/Neal Cassady is Baelfire…what a description of Baelfire’s journey. He began in a world with magic, was pulled into a magical portal and then began his journey to a land without magic.

Could this wall hanging (on the orphanage wall behind Emma’s crib) be a map (whether real or symbolic) of Baelfire’s journey…from place to place…through time and space? I think maybe it is.

(see picture at end of post)

Getting to this conclusion has been a journey spread over several threads. I’m going to try to pull them together here.

My journey to understand the mystery man is broken into three main parts.

1. The Mystery Man clues in the first few minutes of Broken lead to Baelfire
2. The Mystery Man’s name – Neal Cassady
3. Neal Cassady who is Baelfire is also Peter Pan

So here goes 😀 This is my thought process, in chronological order, oldest post first.

1. The Mystery Man clues in the first few minutes of Broken lead to Baelfire
– https://oncepodcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=1514&start=110#p21041

I haven’t had time to gel all of my thoughts and observations together so I’m just going to throw them down and see where they land. If I had to pick a storybook character that some of the items in the Mystery Man’s apartment point to it would be the Wizard of Oz. If I had to pick a person the items point to it would be Baelfire.

ITEMS IN THE APARTMENT
1. As it has already been pointed out, the red hand on the wall is an Aesthetic Apparatus poster. This particular poster was created for the Communication Arts Magazine May 2008 issue. Here is a description of the Magazine and also what comes with a subscription:

Communication Arts is the largest international trade journal of visual communications. Founded in 1959 by Richard Coyne and Robert Blanchard, the magazine’s coverage includes graphic design, advertising, photography, illustration and interactive media. The magazine continues to be edited and published under the guidance of Coyne’s wife Jean and their son Patrick Coyne. Currently, Communication Arts (CA) publishes six issues a year and hosts six creative competitions in graphic design, advertising, photography, illustration, typography and interactive media and two Web sites, commarts.com and creativehotlist.com.

A one year subscription to Communication Arts magazine consists of six issues including the Design, Advertising, Illustration, Photography, Interactive, and Typography annuals.

link to contents of magazine http://www.commerce.commarts.com/shop/detail.asp?prod=ISS200805
link to magazine site (scroll down to find cover) – http://blaawg.aestheticapparatus.com/
link to cover of magazine – http://blaawg.aestheticapparatus.com/?attachment_id=636
link to resource for cover of magazine (actual catalog photo of the glove used ) http://blaawg.aestheticapparatus.com/?attachment_id=637

Red Hand with eye is called a Hamsa and is used to ward off the evil eye. Don’t know if they had this in mind but thought it was interesting. Red Hand is also associated with Irish.

thoughts: Glove appears on a catalog page advertising asbestos gloves. Asbestos gloves can withstand fire – possible nod to Baelfire. Communication Arts Theme fits many of the items that are found in the apartment, photo, recording, microphone etc.

2. John Guliak – 7 Stories & 13 Songs album hanging by window – picture of a heart surrounded by fire – lots of possibilities including nod to Baelfire.

3. I’ve been trying to figure out what the sign was peeking out of the corner and I found it on TVLine – “Just after the Mysterious Man arrives home, the camera angle changes to peer down at the bookcase with the radios. Sticking out from behind it is a sign (inset, letter F) bearing the logo for the progressive punk rock band NoMeansNo — specifically, the logo used on the album The Day Everything Became Isolated and Destroyed. I’m just spit-balling here, but if you wish to risk being spoiled, check out the fourth track.” http://tvline.com/2012/09/30/once-upon-a-time-season-2-who-is-nyc-mystery-man/ And yes, the fourth track, Beauty and the Beast sure does point to Baelfire, especially when we remember that his father refers to him as his beautiful boy.

Here is the title track: The Day Everything Became Nothing

The day everything became nothing, I was standing
underneath a streetlight, wishing I had a
cigarette. I can’t recall anything unusual about
it. If there was something in the air, if the
skies had clouded over, I wasn’t aware, I was too
bored to care. No thunder roared. No lightning
cracked. No missiles rained from the sky. This was
no sneak attack. There was just suddenly this
awful lack. Things had changed, that’s for sure.
The day everything became nothing, you couldn’t
put your finger on what had gone wrong. The alleys
were still dirty; the garbage still smelled; there
was no panic in the streets; just a lot of
grief–in people’s faces, in their eyes–a mixture
of horror and total surprise. This was no
apocalypse. No one heard a voice from the sky,
there were no miracles at the 7-Eleven, no one
screamed, no one even asked why. It was just like
everything had somehow, quietly died. So let it
die! I can’t recall much of what happened next. I
was on my way to visit this woman I knew. All we
had in common was good sex, and now I couldn’t
even remember her address. A group of us, just
strangers, got together and we formed a committee
to discuss the problem. We talked about things
like assured mutual destruction and emotional
responsibility. I couldn’t remember my name, so I
called myself Bob. It’s weird being a Bob, but
I’ll get used to it. I have to.

4. Many OUAT sites have the Mysterious Man living on Grand Street across from Piemonte Ravioli company. His apartment is across from Piemonte but not the storefront on Grand Street, rather the Piemonte storefront on Mulberry St. He lives in an apartment building that is on Mulberry St, in the area known as Little Italy. I won’t take time to list all the history of Mulberry St. but it is ALOT. Mulberry St. has a long history that includes the mafia. Farther down Mulberry was the notorious Five Points area.

5. Billy Joel sings a song, “Big Man on Mulberry Street” here are the lyrics: Sure sounds like it could be talking about Baelfire.

Why can’t I lay low
Why can’t I say what I mean
Why don’t I stay home
And get myself into some boring routine

Why can’t I calm down
Why is it always a fight
I can’t get unwound
Why do I throw myself into the night

I’m on the outside
I don’t fit into the groove
Now I ain’t a bad guy
So tell me what am I trying to prove

Why can’t I cool out
Why don’t I button my lip
Why do I lash out
Why is it I always shoot from the hip
I cruise from Houston to canal street
A misfit and a rebel
I see the winds talking to themselves
And I can understand
Why is it everytime I go out
I always seem to get in trouble
I guess I made an impression on somebody
North of Hester and south of Grand

And so in my small way
I’m a big man on Mulberry street
I don’t mean all day
Only at night when I’m light on my feet

What else have I got
That I’d be trying to hide
Maybe a blind spot
I haven’t seen from the sensitive side

But you know in my own heart
I’m a big man on Mulberry street
I play the whole part
I leave a big tip with every receipt

I’m so romantic
I’m such a passionate man
Sometimes I panic
What if nobody finds out who I am

6. All the radios, and desk microphones, and records…etc. When I took a look at the route that MM walks it is almost certain that he works on the West Side. I saw something interesting up on the West Side (89th st) of Central Park. It is called The Radio Foundation. http://www.radioart.org/ Wonder if that is where our MM works?

I’ll let you read up on it but these guys are famous and have that sort of artsy history that makes for great stories. One of the things this group put out was Firesign Theater. And one of their albums was titled, “In the Next World, You’re on Your Own.” It is a hodgpodge of the bizzare but the title sure is interesting. Again…we run into that word, “fire” a possible nod to Baelfire.

Also check out Peter Bergman’s Radio Free Oz – http://www.radiofreeoz.com/ possible nod to the Baelfire going to Oz theory

7. MM drops his phone/? down the “fire escape“. Again…that word fire keeps creeping up. Also, the Wizard of Oz was the first to suggest a portable phone. Again…another possible nod to the land of Oz???

8. The logo on the horse at the beginning of the MM scene is called a Horse Brass. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horse_brass There are many myths about it possibly warding off evil.

9. We see MM crossing the street at E. 47th and Madison Ave. (interesting link to history of 47th st – http://www.nysonglines.com/47st.htm ) An interesting path to take to get to the 5th Ave Station. When he is walking he looks over his shoulder a lot….looks worried and looks tired. There is an interesting statue at the very end of E 47th Street.

The Statue is called, “Good Defeats Evil” It is St. George, on a horse slaying the dragon.

A nod to Oz
https://oncepodcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=1514&start=120#p21104

It does seem that Mystery Man (if he is Baelfire) is going to be a lot like Emma…both thrust into a world without parents…and probably both have been on both sides of the law. I did wonder if his strange route home was to keep someone from following him or knowing where he lived…or he could have taken a detour to see something. Then there is the HUGE mafia connection with Mulberry street. That right there could indicate that he might have changed a little since he fell into that green portal…it will be interesting to see where the writers take it and how much they tie into this.

And I keep looking at those microphones…the only person I can think of that used a microphone was the Wizard of Oz. I read the books years ago and can’t remember much about them but I do remember that he is different than in the movie in that he appears (all illusions) in different forms. I don’t know if this ties in at all with Oz but I guess we will know all in time.

2. The Mystery Man’s name – Neal Cassady
Rumple sacrifices his son – A mourner’s Kaddish
https://oncepodcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=1712#p21672

I believe Allan Ginsberg’s poetry is the key to understanding the Neal Cassady character…and I do believe that it all points to Baelfire.

I don’t have time to pull out every line (maybe I can do that later on) but here is a portion of Allan Ginsberg’s Kaddish, his mourner’s poem for his mother. Neal Cassady is not mentioned in this portion…but is referred to later on as N.C. This portion of the poem describes almost perfectly the path that Neal Cassady/Mystery Man walked through New York City, exiting Central Park at 7th Street, ending up on the lower East Side, even looking over his shoulder, the reference to horses from Emily Dickenson’s poem…the horses in the poem drive the carriage that is death…the last lines of Adonis fit Baelfire exactly. I could go on and on but I don’t have time. Kaddish and Howl are Ginsberg’s two most famous poems and they both are based on his early experiences.

The second section of Ginsberg’s Howl could also be speaking of Baelfire/Neal Cassady/Mystery Man. It is entitled Molech. Molech was a stone god whose belly contained fire. Little babies/children were sacrificed to Molech…they were laid in his sloping arms where they rolled into the fire. Rumple sacrificed his son, Baelfire, to save his Magic. It is also very possible that the name Baelfire was chosen with this synmbolism…as Molech and Baal(Bael) both trace back to the same Pagan god. And Bae was allowed to slip into the “fire”.

If these nods turn out to be correct I think the picture we are getting from Ginsberg, who was a beat poet and friend of Neal Cassady, is that Neal/Baelfire was a child sacrificed by his father and that child was thrust into a world where he is totally alone. The world, nothing like what he knew…and unlike August Booth, his father did not lovingly put him in a magic wardrobe and send him away with love….rather his father dug his rumple blade into the dirt to keep himself from following his son…and let go of his hand, sacrificing Bae for his own greed/fear/magic.

This brings me to another thought. Bae’s world is totally lost. There is multiple mentions of people jumping off of fire escapes in Beat Poetry…and Mystery Man/Neal Cassady/Baelfire dropping his communication could have been setting a scene where we are supposed to see the despair of the people that were at that hopeless place. I totally believe he is mourning…but then just like in the story of Noah and the Ark, where Noah’s world is completely lost, everyone gone…a dove flies to the window. And like Noah’s dove who bears an olive leaf…Neal/Baelfire’s dove bears a message of hope. The curse has been broken.

Strange now to think of you, gone without corsets & eyes, while I walk on
the sunny pavement of Greenwich Village.
downtown Manhattan, clear winter noon, and I’ve been up all night, talking,
talking, reading the Kaddish aloud, listening to Ray Charles blues
shout blind on the phonograph
the rhythm the rhythm–and your memory in my head three years after–
And read Adonais’ last triumphant stanzas aloud–wept, realizing
how we suffer–
And how Death is that remedy all singers dream of, sing, remember,
prophesy as in the Hebrew Anthem, or the Buddhist Book of An-
swers–and my own imagination of a withered leaf–at dawn–
Dreaming back thru life, Your time–and mine accelerating toward Apoca-
lypse,
the final moment–the flower burning in the Day–and what comes after,
looking back on the mind itself that saw an American city
a flash away, and the great dream of Me or China, or you and a phantom
Russia, or a crumpled bed that never existed–
like a poem in the dark–escaped back to Oblivion-–
No more to say, and nothing to weep for but the Beings in the Dream,
trapped in its disappearance,
sighing, screaming with it, buying and selling pieces of phantom, worship-
ping each other,
worshipping the God included in it all–longing or inevitability?–while it
lasts, a Vision–anything more?
It leaps about me, as I go out and walk the street, look back over my shoulder,
Seventh Avenue, the battlements of window office buildings shoul-
dering each other high, under a cloud, tall as the sky an instant–and
the sky above–an old blue place.
or down the Avenue to the south, to–as I walk toward the Lower East Side
–where you walked 50 years ago, little girl–from Russia, eating the
first poisonous tomatoes of America frightened on the dock
then struggling in the crowds of Orchard Street toward what?–toward
Newark–
toward candy store, first home-made sodas of the century, hand-churned ice
cream in backroom on musty brownfloor boards–
Toward education marriage nervous breakdown, operation, teaching school,
and learning to be mad, in a dream–what is this life?
Toward the Key in the window–and the great Key lays its head of light
on top of Manhattan, and over the floor, and lays down on the
sidewalk–in a single vast beam, moving, as I walk down First toward
the Yiddish Theater–and the place of poverty
you knew, and I know, but without caring now–Strange to have moved
thru Paterson, and the West, and Europe and here again,
with the cries of Spaniards now in the doorstops doors and dark boys on
the street, fire escapes old as you
–Tho you’re not old now, that’s left here with me–
Myself, anyhow, maybe as old as the universe–and I guess that dies with
us–enough to cancel all that comes–What came is gone forever
every time-–

Here is a link to the entire Kaddish – http://www.poets.org/viewmedia.php/prmMID/15307

Here is a link to the post I wrote describing the Mystery Man’s path. It was written before the character was revealed as Neal Cassady whom I believe is Baelfire. Most of the items are very understandable now as they reflect the communication arts culture. https://oncepodcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=1514&start=110#p21041

Even the color green that Baelfire fell into ties in with the Beat Generation. Robert Stone’s — Prime Green: Remembering the Sixties mentions Neal Cassady.

[3.Neal Cassady who is Baelfire is also Peter Pan
https://oncepodcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1462&start=10#p21887

Neal Cassady is Baelfire…who became Peter Pan when he was lost through the portal.

I found numerous books written about the Beat Generation and Neal Cassady, where the Beat Generation was referred to as the “Lost Boys” and Neal Cassady was called “Peter Pan”. That makes me feel really good about the Mystery Man/Neal Cassady/ Baelfire…..being Peter Pan. It fits so well. On top of that we have Peter Pan first appearing in Barrie’s book, The Little White Bird (the dove at the window), we have a disembodied red hand on the wall (Hook’s hand or red-handed), we have a cell-phone going out the window, like grown up Peter Pan on Hook, in the official sequel to Peter Pan it talks about Peter looking at a silver trophy (like the silver trophy on his desk?), in Hook Peter Pan gave a pocket watch to his son,..the crocodile swallows the alarm clock (like the alarm clock on the shelf?)…there are probably more but don’t have time to think about it all right now. This is looking VERY promising! Even the songs on the NoMeansNo album all could point to Peter Pan.

Documentation – References from multiple books and reviews that refer to Neal Cassady as Peter Pan
https://oncepodcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1462&start=20#p21922

Here are some of the references I found: I’m pretty darn sure now that our Mystery Man/Neal Cassady IS Peter Pan

Back to the Miracle Factory: Rock Etc. 1990’s By Paul Williams

Layers of irony interweave the layers of music, and you are free to hear whatever you need to. For example, is there something in the way she says his voice that suggests that she – the narrator – is still a food for this Peter Pan/Neal Cassady rip-off artist?

The American Book of the Dead by Oliver Trager

The second verse, which materializes out of the plastic elastic instrumental, references both the Merry Pranksters’ magic bus and its hipster-shaman driver, “Cowboy NEAL” Cassady, who permanently takes the singer away through the looking glass. It is with these Peter Pan-like allusions that the son’g timeless mood is forever set.

The Complete Annotated Grateful Dead Lyrics annotations by David Dodd
Skippin through the lily fields I came across an empty space,
It trembled and exploded, left a bus stop in it’s place.
The bus came by and I got on, that’s when it all began,
There was cowboy Neal at the wheel of the bus to never ever land.

(The notes below, 7 and 8 are actual quotes from the book)
7 Neal – “ A reference to Neal Cassady………”
8 A more-or-less direct reference to Never-Never-Land from Sir James Matthew Barrie’s 1901 play, Peter Pan, or the Boy Who Wouldn’t Grow Up. Peter Pan, who says he ran away on the day he was born, and who never ages, takes visitors to Never-Never-Land (also called Neverland).

Promised Land: Thirteen Books that Changed America by Jay Parini

Exactaly what he thinks of Dean (Neal Cassady) we shall never know. But the fun has gone out of the game for him. The road no longer beckons with quite the same urgency. Perhaps Peter Pan has to grow up now?

Kansas City Public Library Classic Review: On the Road by Jack Kerouac – Book Reviews

Kerouac began work on the book in 1951; the novel tells the story of three years (1947-1950) in the life of Sal Paradise, the story’s narrator, and his sometimes stormy, but always interesting, relationship with Dean Moriarty(Neal Cassady), a rambling free spirit – something of a beat Peter Pan.

The novel is semi-autobiographical. Sal is a thinly veiled rendition of Kerouac himself, while Dean is based, a little more loosely, on Neal Cassady…. If Dean is somewhat like Peter Pan, then Sal is perhaps more like Wendy, enjoying the journey, but very much aware that the journey must end, and that each of us has some responsibilities to which we must tend.

Review of On the Road –

And Dean Moriarty (Neal Cassady) is an amazing character – spontaneous, charming, absolutely unhinged and absolutely resistant to responsibility, maturity and probably also good sense. Peter Pan for the age of drugs and casual sex.

From Movie review: Scene a lot of Films – On the Road

Garrett Hedlund’s performance as Dean provides the bedrock; his exuberance engages the audience just as Dean’s affects his fellow travellers. They are fascinated by his Peter Pan-like nature; however, the boy who will not grow up ultimately burns out instead.

From blogs –

Generation Y-er’s are considered a transient generation. Not subject to inscription, homeland wars, famine, or any great depression bar the financial meltdown of 2008, Generation Y has generally been regarded as freer and less responsible than generations before. Perhaps a path paved by the parents who came of age in the ’60s in the wake of Sal Paradise and Dean Moriarty, this generation has been raised by the ideology of freedom from responsibility. This position is inherently derogatory and it refrains from considering the social context of this Peter Pan-labeled generation, and the pressures placed upon it by an aging society.

It may be stupid, but Dean is sort of like a grown up, drugged out Peter Pan who just doesn’t want to act like he has grown up.

I still like to refer to Neal Cassady as the Mystery Man as his name is an assumed name and not a his own. He is a mystery..and I believe that in many ways, even when we find out who he is that he will remain a mystery until we hear, see, experience his whole story.

If the Mystery Man isn’t Baelfire I will be surprised…everything points to Baelfire…especially the lyrics of the songs on John Guliak’s album 7 stories and 13 songs. I wish I had time to write all the lyrics down…but they point the lostness…and relocation. I think he relocated a lot and we are going to meet many “Baelfires”… This is going to be one FUN story to watch.

One more thought: When I think of the term baelfire….bonfire….I think of campfire. And when I think of campfire and stories, my mind can’t help but go to Ray Bradbury and his illustrated man. First came the rose tattoo on his palm…and then came the lion…the lions of the veldt. I’ll never forget when, as a young teen I first read The Veldt. When I finished I sat there…still…thinking…thinking…almost feeling the heat…and hearing the roar. Then…the last line… “A cup of tea?” asked Wendy in the silence.” I remember how I felt when I got to those words…haunting, uncomfortable…just like I felt when Snow told Red that Peter wasn’t the wolf. And that is amazing…and that is why I watch.

Just as the vagrant man, who, sitting by the fire tells the story of each of his 18 tattoos is the frame for Bradbury’s Illustrated Man…I feel that Baelfire will be the frame for Once Upon a Time. I’m gonna pull up a chair and warm my hands by that fire.

[gypsy]

Interesting about the the Aethetic Apparatus poster (red hand)…..it looks almost exactly like ‘Mojo Hand’…which, in VooDoo, is a small bag with various things in it…including graveyared dirt….Mojo Hand is refered to in the Grateful Dead song “Ramble on Rose”…..the lyrics and connections are in one of my posts that you quoted in another one of your threads as well as TheGoldenKey’s Frankenstein thread….you said you needed help with the Grateful Dead connections :)….which, I think are important, simply because of the significance of The Dead in relation to Neal Cassady…not to mention the Geronimo Jackson tie in (sticker/CD in the finale)…….FYI – that same song heas lyrics that include Mary Shelley and Frankenstein.

[lilred]

Really like this idea (ideas more like! 😀 ). It allows for so many future plots and seasons. It explains why this guy was firstly labeled the Mystery Man – and not an alias of Jack or Neal Cassady to start. Could even see him thinking of himself as ‘the Mystery Man’ – since he’s had so many different identities/lives and has been other ‘characters’ longer than he was Baelfire.

I think, if Bae/Mystery Man is a portal jumper who has assisted characters in other lands (in other well-known stories) there would be a very interesting parallel between him and Rumple. Also, between Mystery Man and Henry- who could have been essential learning and piecing together the stories that his grandfather and father brought about.

That being said, my only issue is Bae using magic. Even before his father abandoned him for magic/power, Bae resisted using it. Can’t see an adultBaelfire really utilizing magic or making it part of his persona. I can see him instead looking down on overuse of magic and the people desperate enough to want it. Then again, if he is partly the Wizard of Oz – he wouldn’t be ‘using’ magic just tricking people into thinking he is while using his gadgets and intelligence. Again, another interesting parallel between him and Rumple – if it’s true.

Great work Fairy Dust! Really love reading your posts!

[fairy dust]

@Lil’Red wrote:

Really like this idea (ideas more like! 😀 ). It allows for so many future plots and seasons. It explains why this guy was firstly labeled the Mystery Man – and not an alias of Jack or Neal Cassady to start. (that’s a great point Lil’ Red) Could even see him thinking of himself as ‘the Mystery Man’ – since he’s had so many different identities/lives and has been other ‘characters’ longer than he was Baelfire.

I think, if Bae/Mystery Man is a portal jumper who has assisted characters in other lands (in other well-known stories) there would be a very interesting parallel between him and Rumple. Also, between Mystery Man and Henry- who could have been essential learning and piecing together the stories that his grandfather and father brought about.

That being said, my only issue is Bae using magic. Even before his father abandoned him for magic/power, Bae resisted using it. Can’t see an adultBaelfire really utilizing magic or making it part of his persona. I can see him instead looking down on overuse of magic and the people desperate enough to want it. Then again, if he is partly the Wizard of Oz – he wouldn’t be ‘using’ magic just tricking people into thinking he is while using his gadgets and intelligence. Again, another interesting parallel between him and Rumple – if it’s true.

Great work Fairy Dust! Really love reading your posts!

That is a great point regarding the magic Lil’ Red. I hadn’t really thought about him using magic but that really brings in some interesting possibilities for story development. I had imagined his journey, him not using magic…simply following the bean as the Blue Fairy instructed…whatever that means. Perhaps the beanstalk leads him from one world to another…kind of like the lines that connect the squares on the orphanage wall hanging…the lines being the beanstalk…the squares being the worlds. (picture at the end of post)

Your mention of magic intrigues me….not only would there be the struggle of being lost, betrayed, sacrificed so to speak…but there could also be a struggle with the temptation to use magic. I had not even thought of this…thanks so much, Lil’ Red for introducing this dynamic into the discussion.

If the Mystery Man is Baelfire…for him to choose the name Neal Cassady…it would appear there has been a big change in character.from the time he went into the green portal. What you have me wondering is perhaps somewhere on his journey from world to world his character begins to change because of the betrayal of his father. Perhaps he does just follows the bean, or others assist him to new worlds (like the Beamstalk, or the Hot Air Balloon or a tornado like Dorothy) as he makes his journey to New York City…or maybe along the way he begins to become cynical and because of his pain ends up making some of the same mistakes his father made. I could see the writers exploring something like that. That is something that happens all too frequently in the real world…children vow to never follow in their parents footsteps…and the next thing they know they are on the other side of the fence wondering how they got there.

In my real world we work with many fatherless children and many adults who were either raised fatherless or were in the CPS system until they graduated. I think that is why this show so resonates with me. This IS their show. I know many people like Emma….maybe not as fashionable…or skinny…or surface beauty…but that look in the eye…that mistrust…that WALL.

I had an experience onetime where one of the women (she was about 30 at the time) wanted me to try to find her father. While we were at the computer she began telling me about a particular foster family…they had decorated her room with Star Wars. She was moved from that family to another family and had to leave all the things they gave her. I suggested we get on ebay and see if we could find some of the items in her room. You should have seen her face. Literally looking at things for the first time since she had seen them as a kid. Then she started remembering other things…a Strawberry Shortcake record player…I found it…she just stared…quiet…still. She has three children by three different men, she’s been abused, she’s tough…but when she is in pain she doesn’t fight…she runs.

Once Upon A Time tells the story of the adult CPS child better than anything I’ve ever seen. They get it right.

[attachment=0:26pooqri]map of worlds.jpg[/attachment:26pooqri]

[fairy dust]

Continuing from the post above:

The idea of Baelfire moving through portals from world to world IS the story of many CPS children. Like the woman I mentioned in the above post…many of them move from home to home to home. They are in their room…in a setting that they have somewhat become accustomed to and then the portal arrives…they get in put on their seat belt and are transported to the next world…bringing very little along with them…but like Emma they each will usually have something from their former life. For far to many… this carries over to adulthood. As circumstances and resources become difficult and depleted, they find a portal, if they are lucky an automobile, or a friend, or a bus and they move to a new world. Whatever they have accumulated in the way of possessions…well…almost all of it is left behind because there is not money for a rental truck, or a trailer…it is whatever fits into a bag or in trunk of a car, or under the kids feet. Every move is starting over from scratch. We see that when Emma pulls into town…little car..and she knows how to travel light because that was her life. If they take the Baelfire story the direction I think they will, it is going to a fascinating journey.

[gypsy]

Bae used magic already – first by calling on the Blue Fairy for help in the first place and then by using the magic bean. The BF said to Bae, “There is good magic and dark magic…”. Bae didn’t seem to have a problem using, what he considered, good magic.

[sacrlc]

If Bae was portal jumping to several destinations, he could have run across Jefferson, a portal jumper himself. Probably became friends and shared his story with Jefferson.

As for Magic, Jefferson said he can’t do magic, he only is a portal jumper, which, if Bae also portal jumps to various destinations (to find his father??), he would not be using magic, he would be only using the tool (magic bean) he was given by the Blue Fairy.

This begs the question: Are magic beans one-time-use or can they be used many times??

Don't grow up. It's a trap.

[TheGoldenKey]

@sacrlc wrote:

This begs the question: Are magic beans one-time-use or can they be used many times??

I believe the bean crosses through many worlds prior to reaching it’s final resting spot. That’s why Blue told Bae to follow the bean “wherever” it led him.

Keeper of Pandora's Box & The Yellow Brick Road.

[PriceofMagic]

I think the magic bean is a one time use thing. Kind of like the portal grows out of the bean.

All magic comes with a price!

Keeper of Felix

[PriceofMagic]

Hook’s bean portal looked to be blue instead of the green that was Baelfire’s. Is it possible that each bean is different from one another so may take you different places or does the user of the bean have control over its destination such as Hook going to neverland because he needed not to age.

All magic comes with a price!

Keeper of Felix

[Author]

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