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A&E mentioned having written the ending of 311 before other parts of the season, so stands to reason they could have done the same here, whether it is filmed or not. They have on occasion been sneaky even if we outsmart them sometimes. Ultimately though, we can only guess at so much because we don’t know the scripts, and this is a show with magic, dream sequences, and sometimes very nuanced writing where even for scenes we all see, sometimes we don’t agree on what just happened in them.
So when it comes to spoilers, there are many people in between us and that information. Some of whom aren’t motivated to be all that truthful or complete about what they report because they want more hits or they have a certain bias to what they see or think they see. All I know is, VCF had that Emma and Walsh video for ages and didn’t leak the scoop about the romance until after it was known from other sources, plus already known its likely a doomed romance (can’t see Emma monkeying around for long anyway!).
I think a lot of fans would feel as I do that a character who’s already been off-screen like Frankenstein or Ruby would be easier to take, and I would feel more relieved at that then annoyed/disappointed that a more central character was spared despite the hype. I don’t see Mittovich lying on purpose but at the same time, A&E choose words very carefully and are at times so coy about things that it would be easy for them to let people have the wrong impression because that’s what they want. They were giddy with everyone thinking Killipan and Nealfirepan–when it was Papa Pan (and who knows when they really decided on that plot anyway in full, having shot and discarded a scene where Papa Pan 1.0 dies).
As fans we like to think of things in certain ways, but ultimately I come back to the fact Adam isn’t just a writer but is a producer working in Hollywood. He has certain constraints to deal with and we’ll never really know everything unless they tell us in an interview, and even then, maybe not. Looking back at LOST, it seems like there are a lot of things they were forced to do by outside forces, including fan and actor demands, not really a creative decision, and its just as likely to be true for this show. The dirt’s out there for a lot of things that happened on LOST because it was long enough ago. OUAT is still ongoing.
[adrotate group="5"]“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
Here’s what makes me nervous. Someone said, on another thread (SF??) that there are pics of Emma with her necklace again. While some are excited about that and think it’s because she’s reunited with Neal, I think it might be pointing to the opposite. She wears a shoelace of Graham’s on her write to remember him by. If Neal’s the one who gets smoked, maybe she recovered the necklace and is wearing it out of remembrance for what they had. Makes me nervous.
Keeper of Pandora's Box & The Yellow Brick Road.
I mean it’s completely possible that they write things out of order they move lines and all that I just think it seems odd for them to decide on a character death before the story arc began then write in the middle to fill in the gaps and lead up to that.
They mentioned in one of the interviews that this death has been planned since the end of S2. So it stands to reason they had fleshed out some sort of outline/plot points/very rough draft of that scene.
So when it comes to spoilers, there are many people in between us and that information
Adam keeps calling it a game of telephone
Here’s what makes me nervous. Someone said, on another thread (SF??) that there are pics of Emma with her necklace again. While some are excited about that and think it’s because she’s reunited with Neal, I think it might be pointing to the opposite. She wears a shoelace of Graham’s on her write to remember him by. If Neal’s the one who gets smoked, maybe she recovered the necklace and is wearing it out of remembrance for what they had. Makes me nervous.
It could absolutely mean that.
It could also mean that Neal gave it back to her and now she’s wearing it because it was a favorite piece of jewlery. It could be a random continuity error.
For all we know, that pic of JMo could be 2 seasons old!
See what I’m getting at here? We could keep looking for the tiniest little clues and all we’ll do is drive ourselves insane.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"Adam has tweeted multiple times in the past few days that they are currently writing the last ep or two/haven’t gotten to the finale yet. I’ll find them and post them back here. But he said something along the lines, “how do you know what is happening in the finale? I haven’t even written it yet!” Not to say he doesn’t know what will happen, but it has yet to be on paper.
Keeper Nealfire's/Bae's scarf, Henry and Neal's bribery ice cream sundae, Baelfire's sword, the coconut map, and more.
Going to be honestly blunt here. I am leaning towards the death being sooner, not later. If the death wasn’t planned till the Season finale, then why would Rose have read a script knowing who it is? As of late she has only filmed for 316, which happens to be the speculated episode for the death. Somebody also mentioned that one reason it would make sense for it to be earlier was so the actor would be able to go out and film for pilot season. While Ruby wasn’t killed off, Meghan did however went and filmed for the Intelligence pilot before Season 2 of Once finished filming, and that was also around the time that she just disappeared for the remainder of the Season. To make things more complicated, actors can always return to set to film pickup shots for previously filmed episodes, record ADR, or even film a flashback since they would still be contracted as a regular for the Season. Hypothetically if it is Neal that’s toast as early as 316, MRJ could have been on set last week for any of those reasons rather than necessarily filming present day scenes. It is a good way to throw people off, because of course some of us view his citing as “He can’t die in this episode, because we know he filmed for 319”, when we honestly don’t even know what his purpose was last week.
I think we also have to ask why the death spoiler was given at precisely that point back in January? I still think it had to do with those PA’s tweets from BEFORE TVLine posted their article. If the PA was telling the truth, and she didn’t sound like she was randomly lying either, than that very well could have been what led to TVLine’s article. Maybe they did want to keep it a complete surprise, which honestly would have been the best move since then nobody would be even speculating about it based on who’s filming and who’s not, but the cat was out of the bag and they had no choice but to make an official statement. We know 316 will be a big episode, as it gives us a chunk of Zelena’s backstory and we know there’s a big showdown. It’s a mid-conflict in similar vein to “The Miller’s Daughter” episode from Season 2. Andrew Chambliss has also written for big episodes such as “Second Star to the Right”, and I’d argue he’s up there with Jane in terms of non Adam and Eddy writers.
You can argue what you think in terms of what makes sense for the story and character development all you want, but this is just my personal take based on what we’ve witnessed. It’s true we haven’t always gotten the full picture from spoilers, but honestly they’ve been careless plenty of times where we did get spoiled from on set witnesses. The curse breaking in Season 1, Emma and Snow returning from FTL in “Queen of Hearts”, August turning back into a kid, Greg and Tamara kidnapping Henry, and Rumple killing Pan as he reverts back into Malcolm (it spoiled both Pan’s death and his true identity all in one go). Who’s to say this death won’t be spoiled too thanks to people paying too close attention to what’s being filmed?
Anyway, point is this is all my interpretation and I’ll admit if I happen to be completely wrong. However, don’t say I didn’t warn you if things do go in the direction I implied. All I can suggest is that everyone should prepare for any outcome, no matter how hard it might be to grasp that we could be losing our personal favorite characters. We all have our own views for how we see the series continuing, and it is virtually impossible for all of those views to line up with what Adam and Eddy have in mind.
They mentioned in one of the interviews that this death has been planned since the end of S2. So it stands to reason they had fleshed out some sort of outline/plot points/very rough draft of that scene.
Really? They’ve been wanting to kill off this character for that long? Still the way it sounded from how Adam described it being emotional to write I think that lends itself to being something more complete. I agree what MP said to I think this is something they didn’t want to leak out and the PA’s tweets forced them to tip their hand.
Going to be honestly blunt here. I am leaning towards the death being sooner, not later. If the death wasn’t planned till the Season finale, then why would Rose have read a script knowing who it is? As of late she has only filmed for 316, which happens to be the speculated episode for the death. Somebody also mentioned that one reason it would make sense for it to be earlier was so the actor would be able to go out and film for pilot season. While Ruby wasn’t killed off, Meghan did however went and filmed for the Intelligence pilot before Season 2 of Once finished filming, and that was also around the time that she just disappeared for the remainder of the Season. To make things more complicated, actors can always return to set to film pickup shots for previously filmed episodes, record ADR, or even film a flashback since they would still be contracted as a regular for the Season. Hypothetically if it is Neal that’s toast as early as 316, MRJ could have been on set last week for any of those reasons rather than necessarily filming present day scenes. It is a good way to throw people off, because of course some of us view his citing as “He can’t die in this episode, because we know he filmed for 319″, when we honestly don’t even know what his purpose was last week. I think we also have to ask why the death spoiler was given at precisely that point back in January? I still think it had to do with those PA’s tweets from BEFORE TVLine posted their article. If the PA was telling the truth, and she didn’t sound like she was randomly lying either, than that very well could have been what led to TVLine’s article. Maybe they did want to keep it a complete surprise, which honestly would have been the best move since then nobody would be even speculating about it based on who’s filming and who’s not, but the cat was out of the bag and they had no choice but to make an official statement. We know 316 will be a big episode, as it gives us a chunk of Zelena’s backstory and we know there’s a big showdown. It’s a mid-conflict in similar vein to “The Miller’s Daughter” episode from Season 2. Andrew Chambliss has also written for big episodes such as “Second Star to the Right”, and I’d argue he’s up there with Jane in terms of non Adam and Eddy writers. You can argue what you think in terms of what makes sense for the story and character development all you want, but this is just my personal take based on what we’ve witnessed. It’s true we haven’t always gotten the full picture from spoilers, but honestly they’ve been careless plenty of times where we did get spoiled from on set witnesses. The curse breaking in Season 1, Emma and Snow returning from FTL in “Queen of Hearts”, August turning back into a kid, Greg and Tamara kidnapping Henry, and Rumple killing Pan as he reverts back into Malcolm (it spoiled both Pan’s death and his true identity all in one go). Who’s to say this death won’t be spoiled too thanks to people paying too close attention to what’s being filmed? Anyway, point is this is all my interpretation and I’ll admit if I happen to be completely wrong. However, don’t say I didn’t warn you if things do go in the direction I implied. All I can suggest is that everyone should prepare for any outcome, no matter how hard it might be to grasp that we could be losing our personal favorite characters. We all have our own views for how we see the series continuing, and it is virtually impossible for all of those views to line up with what Adam and Eddy have in mind.
This is a great post, and you make a lot of good points! To support what you said about back-filming, it’s interesting you mention that. On 2/27, @OUATFRSource tweeted (and I think @Katmtan did, too) that Ginnifer Goodwin and Jennifer Morrison were shooting a scene for 3×16. Could MRJ have been back-filming, as well? It’s quite possible!
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If the death wasn’t planned till the Season finale, then why would Rose have read a script knowing who it is?
It’s been ages since I watched the interview where Rose mentioned it, but did she actually say she’d seen the script, or did she just say that she knew who it was? Because if it’s the latter, well it wouldn’t surprise me at all if the goss that one of the main cast will be leaving had spread through everyone involved in production, even if they wouldn’t be leaving until the end of the season.
They mentioned in one of the interviews that this death has been planned since the end of S2. So it stands to reason they had fleshed out some sort of outline/plot points/very rough draft of that scene.
Really? They’ve been wanting to kill off this character for that long? Still the way it sounded from how Adam described it being emotional to write I think that lends itself to being something more complete.
Can’t remember where but Adam and/or Eddy said recently that pre-S3 they pitched the ENTIRE season to ABC before production began. They were asked something like did they only have to pitch the first 11, or the whole season at once, and they said the whole thing, (which makes sense if ABC wanna keep things in check a bit more and not have another S2 where they unexpectedly changed course part way through). So it would have been before production for the season began that they’d have told ABC about this death. Maybe they even wrote a first draft of the death at that point, so they could include it in their pitch, (because if you’re gonna tell TPTB that you’re gonna kill off a main character, you need to go in there with sufficient evidence documenting why it’s a good/necessary plan). ABC knew the scope of the ENTIRE season when they came up with those promo posters with the catchy tag lines, (so someone in promo has a sick sense of humour if they knew Neal was gonna die and gave him a tag line about believing in second chances).
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