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You can’t say there is bias on one side and not on the other.
Sure. I’m not saying there isn’t. It’s not fair to say that everyone who hates hook is just bitter over ship related issues (as Michael said earlier), just as its not to say everyone who hated Neal hated him because he was in opposition to Hook being with Emma. But we can have a discussion about the character of Neal that wouldn’t always rewound itself to “He’s Emma’s boyfriend”. That gets very hard with Hook.
Why? Because he’s so heavily tied to the ship with not much else outside of it. I’m really trying to level here and not be snarky or anything, so I was not calling it a bias or saying that CS fans are “blind to the truth” or anything like that. But it’s just a matter of perspective or logic or whatever you want to call it. If you loved the character, wanted him to get with Emma from the jump, and are invested in their relationship, you probably don’t see much wrong with anything going on because the show is playing into what you are interested in.
My whole point was that other characters on this show get more passes, or at least their actions don’t get dwelled on as much as Hook’s, it seems.
I disagree. Just look at Rumpel.
I think the show is much more willing to address when other characters clearly do something bad, as opposed to Hook where it just often gets swept under the rug and we are to act as if it never happened. Regina did rape Graham. She killed countless people. She and Cora were actively trying to hurt the main characters in season 2. But the thing is by the latter half of season 2, Regina had put down her role of a villain and from that point on was actively trying to do better. She was trying to escape her evilness (this is the 6th season and shes still trying to do it, despite having used light magic and even used TLK to break the curse in season 3 like Emma did in season 1) and the image that came with it. Regina isn’t perfect, but her character was and still is going through a constant journey. She’s not turning around and hurting people, lying, or doing bad things when no one is looking or when it suits her needs, and when she does it gets addressed. Rumpel is doing that, and the show is treating him like what he is. A bad guy. And almost all of us are looking at Rumpel for what he is. A villain.
Regina had a richer, better written arc given to her. Hook just went from villain to “hero” quite easily. He’s done bad or at least questionable things since that never got addressed, which I already spoke on. And that’s not fair. Excuses are made for any negative thing said about Hook.
One example was when Hook took the book out this season and reminded Emma of who she was and that she can do anything she puts her mind to. Many fans were annoyed bc they felt it was just Hook being Emma’s lapdog again and only serving to act as her supportive boyfriend, when in fact, the scene was actually really sweet and continued to put Hook in a great light this year
But Hook’s constantly doing that. Pretty much everything about Hook is putting him in a good light. He’s her cheerleader, all the time. That’s nothing new, nothing special. It’s incredibly typical for those two. I said that pages ago. She says she cant do something, he tells her to believe in herself.
Robin was just as boring as Hook but people on this thread loved Robin and hate Hook
Okay, this is an interesting though. I think Hook is way more prominent than RH is, which makes him a little more unbearable to those who aren’t invested in him. Everyone here wasn’t a huge fan of OutlawQueen and a lot still aren’t. I agree that it’d be nice if both of them were given better storylines, and RH has been a bit bleh at points. But the show isn’t constantly trying to force RH down our throats, so to speak, or make him look like hes the greatest thing since sliced bananas. RH has a family, RH had the conflict with Marian and Regina because of the time travel thing, then he was raped by Zelena a season or whatever ago, and has a child by her, and RH was a good heroic guy. He was vastly more interesting than Hook. In my opinion. I’m very interested in what is going to happen with him….Hence why there was no reason RH needed to die at all because the writers clearly have or had some sort of plan for him (including Page 23 and his dark past thing). To kill him is sort of out of left field. It served no purpose.
Same thing with Neal. Their deaths just doesn’t seem as if they were supposed to happen all along, and I think Sean said as much (I vaguely recall an interview where he said he just got a phone call one day telling him Robin was going to die).
Hook is boosted up in the story as this major character but doesn’t do anything outside of his ship, mainly. He has no relevance, very little story. He is boring to a lot of us. And the arc where he should have been featured front and center (Neverland) he was downgraded to nothing more than a point in a love triangle between Emma and Neal. I guess its comparable for some who aren’t impressed with either. I personally grew to love OQ and want to see them succeed because their story was relatively interesting. Moved a bit quickly, was contrived, but I think its much better now than what it was when it began, or has the potential to be. Hook and Emma are in a constant loop. It doesn’t even seem like Emma is growing as a character.
And if you think that Robin getting a pass and Hook getting more scrutiny has nothing to do with inherent bias within the SF fan club who simply don’t care for Hook bc he’s not Neal, then I think we aren’t being honest with ourselves
I think anyone can have opinions of characters that are not centered around who they are sleeping with.
[adrotate group="5"]"I could have the giant duck as my steed!" --Daniel Radcliffe
Keeper Of Tamara's Taser , Jafar's Staff, Kitsis’s Glasses , Ariel’s Tail, Dopey's Hat , Peter Pan’s Shadow, Outfit, & Pied Cloak,Red Queen's Castle, White Rabbit's Power To World Hop, Zelena's BroomStick, & ALL MAGICHere is a better idea instead of going back and forth.
With all of Hook’s development thus far, what do you all think should come next for his character (assuming Once goes on for a few more seasons).
What do you want to see?
What do you NOT want to see?
"I could have the giant duck as my steed!" --Daniel Radcliffe
Keeper Of Tamara's Taser , Jafar's Staff, Kitsis’s Glasses , Ariel’s Tail, Dopey's Hat , Peter Pan’s Shadow, Outfit, & Pied Cloak,Red Queen's Castle, White Rabbit's Power To World Hop, Zelena's BroomStick, & ALL MAGICWell for me Hook just needs to not be on the show. I realize this is never going to happen, but him being on the show has pretty much killed Emma’s character. I want Emma to be a character again and change and grown and care about her parents and her son. I want her to be able to talk to other characters more instead of to Hook. Since he has no real story, whenever something happens to Emma, Hook is interjected into it because otherwise he would not be doing anything at all.
Pretty much, i just want Emma to be the center of the story again, instead of being off to the side having to talk to Hook so that he has screen time. I want her to instead be part of all the action again in a more real way. Like i said, it isn’t going to happen. But Emma is my favorite character and the only way to fix the problems with her character is for her to stop wasting so much time going in circles with Hook, having pointless conversations that never change anything and are illogical.
Here is a better idea instead of going back and forth.
With all of Hook’s development thus far, what do you all think should come next for his character (assuming Once goes on for a few more seasons).
What do you want to see?
What do you NOT want to see?
I’d like Emma and Hook to break up (at least temporarily) so that both characters can get a story that doesn’t exist around CS. We could actually get Hook interacting with the townsfolk alongside Emma who actually does some sheriffing. The show needs to get that small town feel back. Storybrooke itself is just as much a character as the actual characters themselves.CS would probably get back together but it just gives both characters time to exist outside the other.
I don’t want to see another “Emma has walls, Hook breaks them down” storyline. That’s been going round on a loop for several seasons.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixI would like to see Hook have some sort of motivation that isn’t directly tied to Emma. For example, Charming looking for his father’s potential murderer. That has nothing to do with Snow but it could tie him to a villain they just introduced…..my cookies are on black fairy being the murderer. I’m also sticking to my theory of Hook’s mother also being Black Fairy, making Rumple and Hook brothers. That would tie Hook to the main villain in the second half, and it literally pins everyone against this woman which could lead to the final battle. You have Rumple and Hook hating their mother for abandoning them, Charming hating her for killing his father, and Emma trying to fight for her life against Gideon who was raised by the black fairy to be evil. Sounds like a final battle to me. I could even see a rehash of the finale of 3A instead this time, Hook and Rumple sacrifice themselves together as brothers to save the town.
<p style=”box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 1.5em; font-family: Helvetica, Arial, serif; background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0.74902);”>I’d like Emma and Hook to break up (at least temporarily)</p>
That’s never gonna happen. No matter how much some people will want it, it will never happen.
I would like to see Hook have some sort of motivation that isn’t directly tied to Emma. For example, Charming looking for his father’s potential murderer. That has nothing to do with Snow but it could tie him to a villain they just introduced…..my cookies are on black fairy being the murderer. I’m also sticking to my theory of Hook’s mother also being Black Fairy, making Rumple and Hook brothers. That would tie Hook to the main villain in the second half, and it literally pins everyone against this woman which could lead to the final battle. You have Rumple and Hook hating their mother for abandoning them, Charming hating her for killing his father, and Emma trying to fight for her life against Gideon who was raised by the black fairy to be evil. Sounds like a final battle to me. I could even see a rehash of the finale of 3A instead this time, Hook and Rumple sacrifice themselves together as brothers to save the town.
If anyone is sacrificing themselves it would be Rumple. I don’t see Hook having to make the ultimate sacrifice. He already made it last season. Rumple has been a piece of crap ever since his sacrifice in 3A. Rumple should be the one to make the sacrifice, nobody else.
I don’t see Hook and Emma not getting a happy ending on this show. At all. They’ve clearly been built as “endgame” and they’re gonna get a happy ending. Otherwise what was the point of the entire S5 season?
Personally in my opinion either Regina or Rumple will die before the show wraps. I’m leaning more towards Regina cause she’ll leave nothing behind whereas Rumple would be leaving a baby boy. The only way Regina will not die is if Zelena dies in her place and she will take full costody of Robyn.
As for the murderer I say King George.
(Wow, so I typed up a reply and it didn’t post -____- RG If u see double post, feel free to delete one)
Anyway:
– I don’t thin Hook is Black Fairy’s son all because it makes the already crazy fmily tree even crazier. Plus I don’t see what gain there would be. Its not like Hook and Rump are going to be buddy, buddy.
– @Michael, Hook very well could die or split from Emma. Unless you know what the writers have planned. Afterall, other characters who had relevance in the story and were built up died with absolutely no payoff at all.
– Michael, outside of Hook living and being with Emma, I’m asking what more do you want from his character? Or is that just enough for you?
– Um, Regina would be leaving behind something. She has a son, Henry. And she has Roland. And she has her entire family. She has more to lose than Rumpel does. Her dying is incredibly unlikely, but Rumpel dying is probably going to happen. I want it to at least.
– I want Hook to have a story outside of emma, and here is the thing, this season has perfectly set it up. HIS BROTHER IS IN STORYBROOKE! Let the guy go on some kind of seafaring adventure or something!!!!! Let them bond. Let them fight. There is so much potential that could be created with that.
"I could have the giant duck as my steed!" --Daniel Radcliffe
Keeper Of Tamara's Taser , Jafar's Staff, Kitsis’s Glasses , Ariel’s Tail, Dopey's Hat , Peter Pan’s Shadow, Outfit, & Pied Cloak,Red Queen's Castle, White Rabbit's Power To World Hop, Zelena's BroomStick, & ALL MAGICIf anyone is sacrificing themselves it would be Rumple. I don’t see Hook having to make the ultimate sacrifice. He already made it last season. Rumple has been a piece of crap ever since his sacrifice in 3A. Rumple should be the one to make the sacrifice, nobody else.
Your contradicting yourself. You’re saying Hook shouldn’t make the sacrifice because he did it last season, yet you’re say Rumple should make the sacrifice even though he already did it in 3A. Also, Hook’s sacrifice was to rectify the situation he created, Rumple’s sacrifice was to protect everyone from Pan. If you want to go on whose sacrifice was more noble, Rumple wins. Now that’s not to say Rumple wouldn’t be killed off, but you can’t discount one character from dying because they “already did it” yet include another character despite that same reason.
I don’t see Hook and Emma not getting a happy ending on this show. At all. They’ve clearly been built as “endgame” and they’re gonna get a happy ending. Otherwise what was the point of the entire S5 season?
“Built” is such a subjective word. CS are probably going to be endgame, it’s too late to change that at this point especially if season 6 or 7 is the last, but CS didn’t come about naturally. It was forced by the writers because certain vocal fans demanded it. A flashing neon sign would’ve been more subtle.
Personally in my opinion either Regina or Rumple will die before the show wraps. I’m leaning more towards Regina cause she’ll leave nothing behind whereas Rumple would be leaving a baby boy. The only way Regina will not die is if Zelena dies in her place and she will take full costody of Robyn.
If the show is looking for a death before it ends, it needs to be a big one. Zelena won’t cut it. We are easily looking at one of the big 3 (Emma, Regina or Rumple). Snowing are possible but less likely. Henry could die which would unite everyone but that could be considered a bit grim for a show supposedly about “hope”.
As for the murderer I say King George.
It won’t be King George. George is dead. He starved to death off-screen in the mines where Charming dumped him before jetting off to Neverland for a week without telling anyone about George being in the mines. What’s worse is both of George’s hands were tied so he wouldn’t have been able to do anything for himself.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixIn my estimation, the main reason that Hook is so divisive is because he embodies great contradictions. On the one hand, he’s clearly a handsome bad boy who has broken all the rules, yet he also can be gallant. Hook has a very shady past as a womanizing, dangerous and vengeful pirate, but he’s also capable of love, as his relationships with Milha and Emma have revealed. Hook repels a great many people with his tendency to be vengeful, womanizing and murderous, but he also endears himself to others by his romantic gestures like surrendering his ship in favor of fetching Emma. Some people will also be swayed by the actor’s good looks and foreign British accent (this is called the halo effect). I was kind of excited for Hook very early in S2, but only up until he betrayed Emma, called her dried up and useless, and then left her and her mother for dead in the magically-fortified prison. There really was no coming back from that for me. Still, it’s not a mystery why he appeals to some women (who want to date him) and men (who want to be like him). He’s a heart-throb anti-hero who’s been “tamed by love” — and there are many people who imagine that they would like to date the dashing rogue and turn him into a handsome prince. However, when I look at CS, I don’t see a great romantic story. Instead, I see a cautionary story. Still, people see what they will.
Otherwise what was the point of the entire S5 season?
Perhaps the point was to show how unsuited Hook is for Emma and she for him. Emma defied his dying wish not to be turned into another dark one — which is exactly what she did. The darkness brought out Emma’s and Hook’s worst traits: Emma’s selfish insecurity and Hook’s vengeful nature. Hook saw it as the worst thing she could have done to him, the worst form of betrayal. In revenge, Hook murdered Merlin to cast the dark curse and then tried to mass murder Emma’s entire family by unleashing Nimue and all of the dark ones who’d ever existed. Hook did literally fall on his sword at the last moment (thanks to Regina), but only after he tried to kill Emma’s son and parents. That does not make for a healthy long-term relationship. In fact, the theme of S5 was “love is a weapon,” — and while I don’t doubt Emma and Hook love each other, I see their love as being a selfish kind of love, not the kind of sacrificial love that Snow and Charming have. In fact, I’d go so far as to propose that Emma and Hook were definitively revealed not to have true love in season five whenever their kiss failed to break Emma’s dark one curse (on multiple occasions) or when Emma failed to share her heart with Hook in season 5b. I know CS fans will point at the “true love shove” as “evidence” that Emma and Hook share real love, but in my estimation, all it revealed was that Emma’s heart has true love because she is the product of true love. It was just ambiguously written enough that people will interpret it according to their prior assumptions. While I don’t think A&E are especially gifted writers, I think they’re just talented enough to keep people guessing and debating it.
– I want Hook to have a story outside of emma, and here is the thing, this season has perfectly set it up. HIS BROTHER IS IN STORYBROOKE! Let the guy go on some kind of seafaring adventure or something!!!!! Let them bond. Let them fight. There is so much potential that could be created with that.
That is exactly what I was considering when I saw Dark Waters. When you think about it, Captain Nemo was offering Hook a chance to be the kind of man Hook always wanted to be but never was: a man of honor. I would bet that the reason Hook’s brother, Liam II, and Captain Nemo were even introduced this late into the story would be to give Hook another potentially different happy ending. (I’ve always thought Hook’s real happy ending isn’t so much a woman as much as it is his ship or being a sailor at sea). I think he’s too popular a character to be killed off (plus he’s already died and been resurrected), and I don’t think he’ll sacrifice himself again. So, if Emma and Hook ever did break up (not saying they necessarily would), then I could potentially see Hook joining Nemo’s crew aboard the Nautilus and having a family with his little brother. Nemo represents the kind of sea captain that Hook wanted to be like but just wasn’t: forgiving and compassionate. Also, Nemo offered Hook a chance to join him and to put revenge aside, but Hook was too bent on killing Rumple at the time. To me, that is what Hook has really always wanted but hasn’t quite achieved yet: to be a real man of honor who does the noble thing just because it’s the right thing to do (and not just to get something out of it for himself). Why else have Captain Nemo survive his wounds and reintroduce Liam II if not to have them play more of a role in Hook’s story later on? I think there were spoilers that the actor playing Nemo had been filming again, though I might not be remembering that correctly.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
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