Out in Storybrooke: Who should have a Queery Tale romance?

[Crystal Princess]

Also I don’t mind making this a general gay pairing thread or whatever if that’s what people want to do. I feel like it needs to be talked about because all too often queer people are a little shunned in this fandom because they fall under the somewhat maligned SWEN banner.

[Phee]

As far as SQ goes, I’m one of the people who doesn’t believe that it has the basis to be a canon romantic relationship. I do agree that in the real world, sexuality can be a fluid thing, and for some people that absolutely means they’re bi. I don’t deny that sexuality is open to all sorts of different definitions, and over a person’s lifetime, that can evolve, and people can be gay, straight, bi, transgender, whatever, and there are people who maybe wouldn’t classify themselves as one thing rather than another, they’re just somewhere along the sectrum. And all of that is 100% fine. Honestly, as long as a person is happy in who they are and is having healthy relationships that don’t involve any kind of abuse, people can be with whoever they please because being happy and finding love is really all that matters at the end of the day.

But if any show were to tell a story of two women who have only ever been with men, (and I feel like this far into the show, if either of them had been with women before, it would have at least been hinted at by now if it was an aspect of their personality they were planning to explore more at some point in future, as opposed to them being repeatedly portrayed as being with men), both realising at the same point in their lives that they were actually bi and wanted to be together, that’s a story that would demand a level of writing that I wouldn’t trust this particular show with. There’s only one writer on staff that I’d be prepared to say could handle such a thing, but this show is, on the whole, a collaborative effort by many writers, so there’s no way that Jane could be given exclusive control over writing everything to do with that relationship. This show so often brushes over the personal, emotional moments, unless they’re necessary to advance the big, twisty PLOT, and a storyline like this, with two people redefining their sexualities and coming to terms with the emotional stakes involved, just wouldn’t be done justice on this show. And because it’d be a halfhearted job, it wouldn’t come across as being believable for a huge chunk of the fanbase. And then we’re back to how people who are already against same sex relationships would have a foothold to nit pick and diss the storyline, which wouldn’t be productive.

As far as SleepingWarrior goes, I’ve never seen it as being reciprocal from Aurora’s standpoint because they’d already established who her true love was. I wouldn’t have believed her being interested in another guy any more than I’d have believed her being interrested in Mulan. I never once thought that Mulan had a thing for Philip, or vice versa. I wasn’t necessarily convinced that Mulan was head over heels for Aurora, but I could see where the SW shippers got the idea, and they hadn’t established any other true love for Mulan, so I wasn’t surprised in the least when it turned out she DID love Aurora, and I was baffled that people thought that Philip was the one she’d been about to confess her love for. I do think it was a cop out if that’s the extent of their same sex relationship storyline for the whole show, but I like to think they’ll do something else and have an actual, open, reciprocated, TL, same sex relationship at some point. I dunno how Jamie’s other show has been doing and if it’s gonna hang around, but I’m sure I read an interview where she said she’d be thrilled to come back and play Mulan again if it were possible. They’ve established now that she’s not straight, so it’d be easy for them to bring her back and give her a girlfriend and a TL story line and just have it be a natural progression of her already existing story line.

If they had the intent and the actor availability to use Glinda and Mulan again in the future in a significant way, and if they did want to tap into apparent Wicked subtext, perhaps THEY would make a good couple. They could explain Mulan’s absence in 3B as her having been off on a mission that was beyond the reach of the Curse. So one day she comes back, finds the Merry Men gone, and on her way to or from the Dark Castle (which was one of their hangouts so she’s looking for them there) she stumbles on Glinda’s door. Mulan’s pure of heart, so she can walk through. She vows to find a way to free Glinda from her banishment, and it ends up being their TLK that breaks that curse, but that can’t happen unless and until Mulan has the guts to take another chance, despite what happened with Aurora, (a callback to her comment to Neal about having faith in love and not letting your fear override that). That’s a fairy tale romance right there, (you could even possibly say it was a metaphor for coming out of the closet, considering Glinda’s been trapped behind a door for so long), and Glinda and Mulan with their strengths combined would have legit power couple potential. (And now I’m sitting here wishing they’d bring both characters back, but I’m relatively confident they don’t actually have immediate future plans for either of them.)

[RumplesGirl]

Also I don’t mind making this a general gay pairing thread or whatever if that’s what people want to do. I feel like it needs to be talked about because all too often queer people are a little shunned in this fandom because they fall under the somewhat maligned SWEN banner

Great!

So after 320, just a heads up, I’m going to move this thread out of spoilers and into general discussion and you can think up a new title so that way people know it’s about all gay possibilities, not just Zelena and Glinda.

If they had the intent and the actor availability to use Glinda and Mulan again in the future in a significant way, and if they did want to tap into apparent Wicked subtext, perhaps THEY would make a good couple. They could explain Mulan’s absence in 3B as her having been off on a mission that was beyond the reach of the Curse. So one day she comes back, finds the Merry Men gone, and on her way to or from the Dark Castle (which was one of their hangouts so she’s looking for them there) she stumbles on Glinda’s door. Mulan’s pure of heart, so she can walk through. She vows to find a way to free Glinda from her banishment, and it ends up being their TLK that breaks that curse, but that can’t happen unless and until Mulan has the guts to take another chance, despite what happened with Aurora, (a callback to her comment to Neal about having faith in love and not letting your fear override that). That’s a fairy tale romance right there, (you could even possibly say it was a metaphor for coming out of the closet, considering Glinda’s been trapped behind a door for so long), and Glinda and Mulan with their strengths combined would have legit power couple potential. (And now I’m sitting here wishing they’d bring both characters back, but I’m relatively confident they don’t actually have immediate future plans for either of them.)

Interesting theory. Mine has always been that Mulan goes back to her village one day and meets Shang, who is a nobleman’s daughter. It’s be the kind of ONCE twist I like seeing–swapping of race, gender, ect.

As for SleepingWarrior itself…I look back and have to wonder how much fan pandering there was going on with that scene. I do think Mulan had feelings for Aurora (I think that’ pretty obvious actually) but the scene doesn’t sit right with me because it was the last time we’d ever see those ladies together and so it felt like, “we know the fanbase for SW is quite large, we should give them a little something to appease them before we never see these characters again.” Aurora has yet even make a passing mention of her best friend, Mulan. (RH hasn’t either…which makes me cringe. Mulan is getting the Ruby treatment)

And this is why I like the idea of breaking up a Disney canon couple; Adam and Eddy can do pretty much anything and as much as I love Disney, I do think they try to stay in the Disney canon too much. I LOVE Ariel and TLM is one of my favorite Disney classics, but it feels like they disregarded HCA original story for the sake of Disney. A and E could be insanely creative if they weren’t worried about angering Disney fans. And when they do *try* it’s for a one off character who is almost totally devoid of personality, ie: Rapunzel. They cast an African-American lady because they know how much criticism they get over their non representation of POC (who aren’t evil and/or die); I liked Metz but she had no connection to the overall story, just a one time really filler-y character that we’ll never see again, most likely. It came across as, “we hired an African-American to shut people up.” And that’s what I’m worried about with a queer paring–it would be done to assuage people who question this and thus would end up being some sort of side character you only see once. It deserves good representation, not filler “for the sake of fans” type.

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Gaultheria]

RumplesGirl wrote:

A and E could be insanely creative if they weren’t worried about angering Disney fans.

I think they have to be very careful about messing with people’s (especially children’s) sense of identity.

Gaultheria's fanvids: http://youtube.com/sagethrasher

[RumplesGirl]

I think they have to be very careful about messing with people’s (especially children’s) sense of identity.

While I think that’s a good point, I have to wonder how many children are actually watching this show. From what I remember, our main demographic is women between 18-35/40. I’m not sure children are watching ONCE anymore.

And wasn’t the point of the show to give the “real” version of those stories (meaning ONCE”s take on them?) Thus why the Evil Queen from Snow White is fleshed out and we have Regina. ONCE’s take shouldn’t just be Disney because ONCE isn’t the Disney live action show.

And if they are going to be rigid in sticking to Disney canon, then we might *never* get a gay pairing since Disney is dragging their heels on that front.

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Gaultheria]

Oh, I like that OUAT is doing “real” versions of the stories, with the characters dealing with more issues than they do in the Disney films. But though I like the show a lot, I don’t really have favourite characters, and so I thankfully haven’t had to deal with any emotional fallout when Stuff has happened. (Although I do know what that’s like; I remember when they killed Spock.)

Gaultheria's fanvids: http://youtube.com/sagethrasher

[PriceofMagic]

I don’t think they should break up Disney established couples. In RumBelle’s case, Rumple is Once’s version of the beast therefore Belle is still part of her Disney couple. What they could do however is maybe change the gender of one half of a Disney couple to make it a same-sex relationship.

Disney has been a staple of many people’s childhoods so to mess with certain aspects of that will only put people’s backs up to the changes you’ve made. For example, when Ariel’s character was announced, how many of us wanted her to be a red head? How many of us would’ve been disappointed if she was anything other than a red head? Splitting up a Disney canon pairing just to make a point is not the way to get people to accept things.

Also, fan preferred couples can’t be forced. You can throw in a same-sex couple on the show, and there’s no guarantee that the audience will actually like them (and it’s not because they’re the same sex). So messing with a Disney canon couple just to promote an LGBT pairing is not the way to go as it would instantly create a ship war between fans who want the proper Disney couple and fans who want the new couple. Making the Disney couple same-sex would make people more accepting of it.

In Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Willow dated Oz (a man) before falling in love with Tara (a woman). Willow/Tara is one of the top 3 relationships on the show. People liked it because it developed naturally and wasn’t forced. In season 7, there was a Willow/Kennedy pairing but people didn’t like it because it was forced on the audience. Both Willow/Tara and Willow/Kennedy were same-sex pairings.

In the case of SwanQueen, it’s not going to happen ever. Ignoring the fact that not only are Regina and Emma related but Regina has tried to kill Emma’s family a lot, both women are heterosexual and have shown no inclination whatsoever for people of the same sex. If there was any plan to make either Regina or Emma homosexual or bi, there would’ve been some hint in the last 2.5 seasons to trigger the transition. To make either character suddenly homosexual would not only be poor writing but a plot device.

If they do plan to introduce a same-sex couple, then there should be more to them than just their sexuality. We shouldn’t have to be constantly reminded that this couple is in a same-sex relationship because their sexuality shouldn’t define them.

There are several characters on the show that are clearly heterosexual and that isn’t going to change such as: Emma, Regina, Belle, Rumple, Charming, Snow, Neal, Hook, and Robin. However, there are other characters on the show whose sexuality is more ambiguous such as: Archie, Red, Henry, the dwarves plus others.

There are plenty of characters they could use to explore same-sex relationship in a natural development without forcing it upon the audience.

All magic comes with a price!

Keeper of Felix

[RumplesGirl]

I don’t think they should break up Disney established couples. In RumBelle’s case, Rumple is Once’s version of the beast therefore Belle is still part of her Disney couple. What they could do however is maybe change the gender of one half of a Disney couple to make it a same-sex relationship.

Disney has been a staple of many people’s childhoods so to mess with certain aspects of that will only put people’s backs up to the changes you’ve made. For example, when Ariel’s character was announced, how many of us wanted her to be a red head? How many of us would’ve been disappointed if she was anything other than a red head? Splitting up a Disney canon pairing just to make a point is not the way to get people to accept things.

 

And yet Robin Hood is dating the Evil Queen.

Snow was Bandit

Rumple was a humble spinner cursed by Dark Magic, with a son

Hook was named Killian Jones and had a brother

Peter Pan was Rumple’s father

Snow White and Ariel were friends

Rapunzel was African-American with dark hair

Prince Charming was a farmer

There was an 8th dwarf

Philip did not kill Maleficent

Mulan was in love with Aurora

Lumeire was working with the Wicked Witch of the West

I could go on. I don’t see how we can argue that Disney is a mainstay of people’s lives and that the show shouldn’t break with Disney expectations–be it coupling or appearances– when the entire show was based on “this is what really happened” and not based on “this is Disney brought to real life”

I do agree that the same-sex couple shouldn’t be solely defined by their sexuality. It should be as natural as Snow and Charming because it’s not any different. I think Crystal and I talked about this once, but Adam and Eddy shouldn’t need vast amounts of time to sit down and carefully plot and plan a same-sex relationship. It should just *be*

But I maintain that they can do whatever they want when it comes to breaking Disney canon because it’s what they’ve been trying to do all along.

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[PriceofMagic]

I still think there’s some elements of Disney canon that shouldn’t be broken whilst others are more negotiable.

All magic comes with a price!

Keeper of Felix

[RumplesGirl]

I still think there’s some elements of Disney canon that shouldn’t be broken whilst others are more negotiable.

But what elements are those? Like, why is it okay to change Rapunzel’s race (she said to have golden hair in the original and she was Caucasian in Tangled) but maybe putting Disney Character X with non-Disney character Y is not? And if we’re trying to say “well the fans will get angry” find me one instance where fans aren’t angry anymore. And even if they are, should the writers be listening to them to the extent that they change their vision?

Everybody wanted Ariel to be a red head cause TLM. Ok, fine. But there is nothing that says she has to be outside of Disney. Everyone wanted her to be with Prince Eric because of TLM. Ok, but at what point are you forsaking creativity for general appeasement.

And what about people in other countries for whom Disney is NOT a staple? Some countries are not enamored of the Mouse like Americans and the nations closet to us. I remember talking once to @Girlhitscar and she said that she had only seen a handful of Disney films because it wasn’t that big of a deal where she lived. So why are American (for the most part) preferences dictating the show? Why haven’t we seen legends and stories that exist outside of Disney or even just western culture? I get that they are the most well known (from our biased perspective) but there *tons* of myths in other parts of the world that could easily be brought in because of the overall nature of the show.

And you can keep to Disney canon and still make it a same sex pairing. Like my idea of Mulan and Shang, where Shang is a nobleman’s daughter. Technically, still Disney canon but they’ve gone and done a classic ONCE twist. They’ve gender swapped before, Jack for instance.

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Author]

Posts