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Love all your captions, PriceofMagic. 😆
@Phee wrote:
I’m guessing this is after “Archie” assuming he’s the death is found to be alive.
Hmmm, dunno. The fact that Red is also in that scene with him and Regina, makes me think that it’s before anything allegedly happens to him, so that when something does happen to him, Red is all, “I saw him arguing with Regina,” which is why everyone assumes she’s responsible. The scene at Granny’s where they’re all smiling seems like it probably comes towards the end of the ep though, so everything will work out fine and no one will actually be dead. That’s my guess anyway. Wonder who or what they’re toasting to in that scene.[/QUOTE]
Yes, when I looked at more pictures and studied the other ones, that made more sense than what I previously said because of the way Red is running towards the docks like she’s upset. If Archie were alive, she probably would be elated.
I still say that it might not be Archie at the end at the party especially since there’s one shot of him by himself, and while he doesn’t look suspicious exactly, he looks a little bit off.
Love that they’re gonna have a swan of all birds, floating past like that. Wonder if Snow speaks swan as well as she speaks crow? Maybe the bird will end up being a spy.
Yes, that’s what I was thinking that maybe the bird could end up being a spy since in the pilot episode, the animals knew that something was going down with the Curse. Plus, unlike the raven that Cora used to tell Snow and the Princesses about the deal she was offering them, the swan should be a symbol, obviously, for Emma and the “good” side, so I would expect it to be helpful in thwarting Cora’s and Hook’s plans.
Looking at some of the use of birds and their connections with characters on the show:
Raven-Cora
Dove – Rumpelstiltskin
Dove – Snow
Pigeon – Neal
Swan – Emma[adrotate group="5"]@The Fairest wrote:
^Yes, thank you guys. These spoilers have made my entire week. God I hope the world doesn’t end tomorrow. I need to survive to see this episode! 😆
lol, I know I’ve been reblogging apocalypse jokes all day on Tumbrl. The world really better not end tomorrow now. 😆
OMG!!! I just got sent a message about this and was dying to find out where this spoiler was. Thank you! Thank you!
This is such a great Christmas present!!!
I knew that Nealfire wasn’t running away from Emma. 😆
@PriceofMagic wrote:
Isn’t Neverland meant to make you forget about home so that you never want to leave? Neverland wouldn’t have made Hook forget about his revenge.
I think Bae would have wanted to forget about his past. He saw his father turn from a kind man into a monster who thought nothiing of cold blooded murder. Bae would have found himself in a new land where he could be whoever he wanted to be and not the dark one’s son. Given enough time, Bae could have created his own backstory and believed it to be true. His true past coming back to him in the form of nightmares.
In season 1, Emma’s denial was so strong it caused her not to see August’s wooden leg even though it was right in front of her. What if Neal’s denial of his past is just as strong?
I don’t know about Neverland, but I do think that Nealfire’s past was so traumatic that he could have repressed his memories and created new ones. Plus, it might not just about those memories being so traumatic, it could have been a matter of survival in Nealfire’s mind too because I’m sure he either realized that people would brand him as crazy if he told them the truth. Maybe he did tell some people the truth, and of course they probably thought he was crazy and eventually convinced him that he created these fake memories to deal with the stress of losing his family. Or maybe he kept silent, but observed how “different” people were treated by those around them, and convinced himself over time that it was all just fake memories that he made up. (Of course, this is actually if he did have his memories when he first arrived in this world because it’s possible that he has amnesia depending on how he landed. He wasn’t worldy or mature nor did he have a ship like Hook did, so maybe he landed on his head and really did lose his memories except they come back to him when he’s dreaming.)
Now with August who was also sent here as a young boy, I think the reason he didn’t repress his memories, at least not that we know of, is because he was young enough that people around him could write off his stories due to his age, and eventually, he’d learn not to talk about his past to people. He would know that he was actually telling the truth, but to fit in, he would just learn to hold his tongue about it, but not repress his memories like Nealfire may have. Plus, while his life was traumatic in many ways, I think his life was generally all around better, especially because his father sent him away to keep him alive, unlike Nealfire’s father who let Nealfire come here on his own because he’d rather have power over him.
Further, if Nealfire is repressing his memories, for me that doesn’t mean, that he won’t be angry at his father, because I’m sure if he is repressing his memories, once he starts accepting those memories are real, he will be very angry with his father not only for choosing power over him in the first place, but also for everything that his father did to be reunited with Nealfire.
@Josephine wrote:
I wrote this in another thread, but what I’m most looking forward to is seeing Emma, Neal and Henry going to Storybrooke in the yellow bug. I wonder what conversations that would bring up…or just a complete and awkward silence. 😉
Yes, I really didn’t think of that when I saw the pictures of Emma and Neal together that she would likely bring Neal with her to Storybrooke in the yellow bug. I've seen several SwanThief/SwanFire shippers who are on the ball and brought that up that the whole family is going to be together in Emma's bug!!! I know it's going to be a very awkward trip to Storybrooke, but in the long run, it's to be fantastic for them coming together eventually as a real family if that happens because of what the bug represents.
I thought they would have Nealfire come to Storybrooke on his own while Emma was gone so that he could bond with Henry without Emma being there to interfere, but this way makes more sense because of the symbolism of the bug being used.
Oh and for those that have seen Mallrats here, am I the only one that thinks of that movie whenever I think about Neal and Emma in her VW Bug?
Here’s a link to the quote, http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0113749/quotes?qt=qt0341978 for anyone that wonders what I’m talking about. Beware, it’s not safe for work.
Speaking of the winter hiatus, there’s another marathon planned, and maybe I’m just seeing a pattern with the episodes they choose because I want to, not that one really exists. I think it makes sense though that they’re highlighting Nealfire episodes since I expect that he’ll be featured a lot when the truth finally comes out this season, and that made a regular next season because he’s the gift of angst that keeps on giving to Rumple. Rumple maybe overjoyed that his son is alive and is finally in the same town that he is, but he’ll also have to live forever with the knowledge that his son probably won’t want anything to do with him at all. (Oh man, I can’t wait to see Robert Carlyle handle this type of material.)
Anyhow, they’re showing these episodes on the Saturday, January 5th, before OUaT returns,
Broken (Episode 2.1)
The Crocodile (Episode 2.4)
Tallahassee (Episode 2.6)As cinnamonhummingbird pointed out on her Tumblr, http://cinnamonhummingbird.tumblr.com/post/38177441480/full-of-obvious-joy-literally, and hopefully she doesn’t mind me posting this information here, if Neal is really Baelfire, then all of those episodes feature him in some way.
“Broken” – There’s the obvious parallel between the pilot of last year where we first met Emma outside of Storybrooke in a large metropolis located on the east coast of the United States. (Also, kudos to those posters that speculated that he probably would be Henry’s father based on that parallel.) The Mysterious Man as he was known in “Broken” was also a very lonely like Emma was in the pilot.
“The Crocodile” – We see Nealfire as a very young child in the beginning, and then at the end, we see a picture that his mother or father, possibly, has drawn, of him, that is kept by Rumple where he does his dark magic as motivation as to why he’s doing everything. We also learn that not only did his Nealfire’s choose something over being with him, his mother chose someone else over him.
So there’s another parallel between Emma and Nealfire except that her parents wanted her to have a better life, so they sent her to our world alone whereas Nealfire’s parents chose their own selfish needs over their child.
We also learn that Rumple murdered Nealfire’s mother by ripping out her heart mostly because of the self-loathing that Rumple felt that he was no better than Milah because he had also failed his son. So far that’s the earliest instance on the show of a villain doing that, but we’ll see tons of this happening on the show this season with Rumple passing down his knowledge to Cora and Regina, and then Regina passes it down to Hook in a way. The only time that this trick didn’t work with someone who actually had his/her heart was with Emma.
“Tallahassee” – We get to see how Emma and Neal met. It was very similar to how Emma’s own parents ended up meeting, so there’s another parallel in their love story. We also see that Neal was like Snow in that he left Emma for her own good just like Snow left Charming for his own good.
For good measure, there’s also a Dreamy and Nova parallel because of August helping to separate Neal and Emma just like the Blue Fairy did with Dreamy and Nova.
@PriceofMagic wrote:
Neal initially thought August was a cop then I think he thought August was a nutjob. The idea that Bae may have repressed his memories of fairytale land could be quite interesting. It could lead to a nice contrast between August claiming to be Bae in season one and Neal denying being Bae.
Yes, I like this theory a lot because I could see Nealfire repressing his memories of the magical world because the memories were too painful to deal with and because once he landed here, I’m sure he learned quickly that no one would ever believe him if he told them the truth. So I think over time, those memories have become so repressed in him that he thinks that those things never really happened, he just created memories of a magical world to deal with his father and mother abandoning him.
I’m sure the writers could fill in the holes in some way if the go this route too.
I don’t think they’re going to have Neal (Bae) be schizophrenic.
I don’t think they would go that far either, but I think it could work since denial is pretty powerful. Although he would have the missing money and car as proof that he met up with this guy that showed him a mysterious magical box, Neal could have just convinced himself later on that something else happened instead like he got robbed and blacked out and someone took his money and keys, or something along those lines.
Further, 10 years is a long time, so maybe he’s been seeing a therapist in NYC and is on medication now for his “delusions”, and maybe this is why he runs off when he sees Emma because either he's not ready to deal with the possibility that his “delusions” were real, and/or he thinks he's unworthy to be with her now because of his “delusions”.
This would be a great reason, imo, as to why he didn’t go to Storybrooke right away. I could just imagine him trying to explain everything to a therapist. “Well, this guy had a magical box, and he said that he’d send me a postcard when the Curse was broken so that Emma and I could be together, and yesterday I just got this postcard from a pigeon.” The therapist would be like, “Neal, I’m very concerned. See there’s not even a Storybrooke, Maine on this map, and there’s nothing on the Internet about a town of that name ever existing. Maybe we need to up your meds.”
So staying in NYC equals not being insane in Neal’s mind, but going to search out Storybrooke would equal him being insane.
It would definitely be an interesting twist, imo, if they had Neal being very reluctant to accept that his memories were real, and I think it would be different enough from Emma not believing in season 1. She didn’t accept it mostly because she felt unworthy of being the Savior. However, in Neal’s case, if he believes, not only does it might mean that he’s given in to being crazy, but then he also gets even more guilt that not only did he not help save his father from the curse of being the Dark One, but because he got separated from his father due to the magical bean, his father destroyed their whole world just to be reunited with him.
I think it would be really juicy material that MRJ, Jennifer Morrison, and Robert Carlyle could knock out of the park.
@Phee wrote:
This thread should probably be in a spoiler section. 😉 Hopefully anyone who sees the title and doesn’t read spoilers won’t click on it.
lol, yes, it’s very spoilery. 😆
Now I don’t know whether to include actual spoiler bars or just follow the flow since the rest of the thread isn’t in spoiler bars.
Which wouldn’t be that far removed from how they chose Whale’s name.
Yes, his name does look like Barrie, and he does look more like what I think an adult version of Peter Pan would look like more than MRJ does. Robin Williams, aside, I usually think of Peter Pan, even as an adult, being spry and lightweight.
I’m just not sure about the description that was given about Barrett’s character would fit Peter Pan.
He’s in his 30s, kind and smart, but also has a very dark side and has beliefs and a way of life that he will fight fiercely to defend.
It could I suppose, but it seems like a very ominous description. They could make Peter Pan more darker, but I don’t really see them making him an all out villain which is what I think Barrett will eventually turn into given his character description. Like Lil’ Red, I think he’ll start out as a “good” guy that helps the “good” characters and Rumple and Regina fight Cora and Hook in some way, but they’re also going to lay the groundwork for him to be one of the villains that the “good” guys will have to battle next season. However, I think that he’s going to be the Sandman or a character like that instead of Merlin because of the Netherworld having to do with this season so much, and I feel like that the Netherworld will pop up again this season in an important way.
One thing I can’t seem to shake about his character is that I’m sure that Barrett will have a connection to Neal, who I’m now pretty positive has to be Bae.
Yes, I could see that being possible that Barrett and/or the character of Katrina might be connected to Neal somehow.
A couple of those points could still stand if Bae didn’t necessarily become Peter Pan, but did become one of the Lost Boys. The major sacrifice of my theory would be that it would no longer be the Crocodile’s son who became Hook’s Neverland nemesis, which is a bit of a bummer, because I think that would be fun for them to do.
Yes, I think it would be weird if Nealfire and Barrett did know each other, but Barrett was Peter Pan and Nealfire was just a Lost Boy because it should be Nealfire because of the back story that they gave Hook.
If Barrett was Peter, and he and at least one of the Lost Boys (Bae) got stuck in our world, remained friends as they grew up, but always with Peter being the one in charge in the relationship, that could explain why Barrett would come to SB first, while Neal hasn’t come anywhere near town yet. Perhaps it’s a case of the “big brother” coming to suss things out, instead of letting his “little brother” go walking unprepared, straight into a firestorm of angst that is the town with his former lover and his cursed father.
I could get behind this idea though, and it might not just be that Nealfire doesn’t want to go to Storybrooke, perhaps he tried, but can’t get into Storybrooke because of the Curse, and so Barrett went there to try to help him.
@PriceofMagic wrote:
I never thought about Gepetto betraying them. Interesting theory TheGoldenKey.
I still think Blue Fairy is going to betray them. Gepetto hasn’t really been important this season. If betraying the Charmings was going to be a big deal, you would think that the betrayer would be shown a lot around the Charmings. Gepetto has rarely been shown at all. Blue Fairy on the other hand…..
Yes, I could see Geppetto doing that unfortunately because while I think he’s a “good” characters, he can be tempted to make poor decisions like the other “good” characters. However, I agree that the Blue Fairy seems more likely just because she’s been shown more often this season than Geppetto, and she’s been shown in a suspicious way too like when she warns Charming not to let anything happen to Jefferson’s hat, and then King George finds out about it and then gets a hold of it to burn it. I guess it could be that he snuck into Charming’s apartment, but I think there must have been a spy that had to tell King George what Charming was up to in the first place, and don’t see it being any of the Dwarves. Plus, she was wrong about the wardrobe being able to work only one time. If Cora could return the water to the lake, I’m sure that they could have found someone powerful enough to do so to get the wardrobe to work again. Or about the Blue Fairy tells Rumple about the wardrobe a long time ago, so he can find Bae and prevent the Curse from ever needing to take place.
Pongo being alone on the title card and the episode title certainly suggest that Archie is a dead man.
Yes, I’m just not sure if they’ll actually kill Archie or just make everyone think that he’s dead.
On one hand, I think it would be a great way to make Cora look even more evil if they really have her kill him. Plus, it would trim the cast which unfortunately seems really bloated now which is odd because just last season, it seemed relatively small with only focusing on 6 core characters, and now there’s so many more new characters that they’re trying to give time to that unfortunately they can’t unless they do get rid of some of the older characters first. We know that the 6 core characters are staying on the show for a long time probably until the show finally ends, so that leaves characters like August, the Blue Fairy, Ruby, Granny, the Dwarves, Archie, and Geppetto that they might kill off or get rid of somehow to make room for new characters this season and next season.
However, if they do actually kill him, then Regina doesn’t have anyone to turn to at all. I think she really does need this if they want her to slowly change. Plus, they could have other messed up characters, of which there are a lot, go to him for help.
@PriceofMagic wrote:
Neither Hook nor Rumple are the type to forget and forgive. Hook has spent too long focused on his quest for revenge to let Rumple get away with what he did. The two characters can’t coexist peacefully in the same town. Either one has to kill the other or Hook has to leave Storybrooke.
Yes, I agree. I don’t know if they’ll kill him off because he does seem to be a fan favorite now, but they could potentially just banish/send him off to somewhere else to pop in whenever he’s needed.
I don’t think he’ll get his revenge because Rumple is connected to so many people’s stories, and he still has a lot of growing to do before they’ll potentially kill him off. So if Hook doesn’t get his revenge this time, I just can’t see him staying on the show and redeeming himself because his whole life for almost 300 years has just been for that one purpose.
In some ways, it’s like Rumple’s drive in reuniting with Bae being behind everything he’s done for almost the same amount of time, but we know that will eventually have a payoff for Rumple in finding Bae again, not the one he probably wants, but a payoff nonetheless that will most likely lead to Rumple really changing instead of saying he will like he does with Belle and then doing something behind her back again. They could redeem Hook, but I think he’s more like a learning lesson for mostly Rumple but other characters on the show to look at and know that they could turn out like he did if they only focus on getting revenge.
I’m assuming he plans to kill Rumple by stabbing him with the dagger. I speculated recently that Hook would in fact stab him, but it wouldn’t kill him, and Belle’s love would somehow save him, and then the Dark One curse will cease to exist because it can’t go back into Rumple, and if Rumple’s not dead, then it can’t move on to someone new either. If something like that happened, Hook would inadvertantly save Rumple’s soul whilst attempting to kill him, which would be sort of poetic…and would piss Hook right off…the moment he’s been plotting for almost 300 years, and it all goes completely wrong…talk about unsatisfying revenge.
Yes, it would be like Disney’s Beauty and the Beast with Hook in the Gaston role, and it would change the direction of the show with Rumple not being the Dark One anymore and struggling with maybe feeling powerless and wanting to do dark magic again so he doesn’t feel like that, but also struggling with how much damage he’s done to Nealfire’s life and of those that Neal loves and cares about. Plus, it would fit in with how the villains’ plans backfire on them and end up helping their enemies in the end. Regina wants to get rid of Emma, so she tries to poison her which leads to Henry dying, which results in Emma finally believing and the Curse breaking. Regina wants to be the one to keep Snow and Charming apart, so she helps save Charming’s life from King George. Regina wants to keep Belle as a chess piece, so she helps save Belle’s life from Hook.
