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***Always in search of a good flock***
Obviously, we definitely do have different perspectives 🙂
And I am quite comfortable and at peace with embracing mine and standing by it wholeheartedly regarding Emma’s journey. Backward and forward and in the “now”.
I view “sentimental” journeys as essential to knowing yourself. Always will. Being “sentimental ” does not negate anything. It further educates your soul. One has free choice to do what they like with that education.
And, you are correct…we disagree about Hook. I don’t question at all the writers’ choice to send Hook with her. Never will. 🙂 I applaud it.
The cycle of female empowerment has not been harmed by the presence of a male- lover, father, son, friend or otherwise. It has been enhanced and strengthened. In my eyes and mind what makes females so strong is the acceptance, recognition, support and celebration of their own and other women’s worth ~without discounting the worth and celebration of what males bring to that cycle.
The totality of one’s life is made fuller and richer by respectfully embracing experiences involving both females and males. To me, from my perspective, and I very willingly own it (smile)~ that is the way to true personal empowerment.
Show wise, specifically for Emma, because she now has had the immense advantage and privilege of knowing her parents and breathing in their actual history, what they all build together from here on out is the very human adventure and challenge of season 4.
***Always in search of a good flock***
Myril said:
Was it? (Emma developing a relationship with herself)
Yeah. 🙂 I obviously think so.
I posted on another thread that it was a deeply meaningful transition for Emma to see her mother specifically in the past, in action, as a woman, of her own age~ not her mother. It made an obvious impression on Emma’s current, and seemingly selfish behavior about returning to New York. She saw that it wasn’t all about Emma. It was about how her mother (and father) struggled and lived as genuine people with emotions and love and fears of their own. Kind of like the ones she had but wasn’t facing. It was one thing for her to read about it in the picture book…that made it easier for her to distance herself from it. Seeing it play out in person, though at first she marveled at it, she soon realized it was a deep part of her soul, indeed her very existence. She WAS the result of who they had been and she had been denying it. She was finally creating a relationship with THAT Emma.
When she finally owned it, she could accept, understand and want her part in it 🙂 Same as with the magic, once she allowed the magic into her heart, she embraced that part of her. Not as a momentary trick, but as a powerful gift. Something that was never really gone but once she found the way to accept it, there it was all the time. She accepted her relationship with magic.
I would say that the entire trip into the past was much more powerful than any modern *therapy* because she lived it with them for the short time she was there, it wasn’t a mental trip of her imagining how things were, or delving into her own background and memories…it was their physical life… and she was breathing it. And that is the most special kind of magic much more potent and immediate than modern therapy.
Oh, and lastly, yes, Hook needed to be there ( he wasn’t just there for Emma, he was there for David and his own realizations as well. But in regards to Emma)…he was needed…not necessarily for rescuing her, but for walking though the journey by her side and offering her the support, love, comfort and protection she MAY need, or in this case, want. So she was NOT alone. That is not a trivial thing. And it was another part of her relationship with herself she had to come to grips with. She was NOT alone.
***Always in search of a good flock***
Actually, I read that when it first came out, and sadly, I don’t think it makes one bit of difference how many times the creators and writers say it or it is seen in print. There are those fans who aren’t interested in proof or reason. Those who want to will ignore any proof of Neal’s death being pre-planned and played out script-wise months before viewers knew anything about relationship plans for Emma with anybody, monkey wings or leather clad physique. And they will continue the rallying “pandering” cry.
Those particular fans want to ignore it and prefer living in denial about it because, apparently, it is more important to them to be nasty. They prefer repeating the empty “fan service” accusations, while ironically they think polls, demands and uncivil and classless comments to the writers about bringing Neal back wouldn’t be a case of A&E serving THEIR fandom or pandering to their wishes~ if they were given any credence.
There are always groups of people who blame someone else for what they are guilty of, themselves. (Politicians ring a bell???)
I felt badly for those in grief over the loss of their favorite character. I’ve been there, felt that at moments about other shows. It is a helpless and horrid place to go. But the purposeful, blatant meanness and classless behavior of some who have become champions of vulgar posts and disgusting comments on Tumble and Twitter has cast a very ugly shadow on their attitudes. They’ve become more than pesky. Their ugliness has attempted to become more important than the actual show.
Every storyline is rushed in OUAT. No one gets an over abundance of air time with so many points to be made and story lines to tell. It is a genuine problem working with such a large ensemble cast with so many interesting stories to tell. Plot holes can be gaping. A&E often fall into that pit. And yet I felt there were some very special moments regarding Neal’s death. Some brutal, but still emotional.
I didn’t want Neal to die at all and have repeatedly said it was a cop out from taking the time to tell a much more compelling story about Baelfire. But the way they actually portrayed the death was, I felt, credibly attached to the real story of Baelfire/Neal…his relationship with Rumple and the struggle against predetermined hard wiring to be like his father and grandfather.
It turns out he was quite obsessive impulsive about avoiding the abandonment personality trait they all had and it lead to his death. In “saving” the town to expose Zelena, and using resurrection of the dead Dark One to serve his personal needs about Henry, he fatally and quite sadly condemned himself to the ultimate price of magic of his life.
If he lives through flashbacks or anything other than the new baby’s name or not, his death was planned well before anything hit the TV screen, and viewers’ perusal.
***Always in search of a good flock***
It isn’t enough about Henry? OK, fine by me. 🙂
Emma made the trip to *herself* in the second half of the season. She can’t be defined as a mother/savior/ independent kick butt warrior until she defines and accepts herself as a woman. She dealt with bitterness, anger, disgust, sadness, doubt, grief, fear, failure, loss, impotency/weakness, denial, and finally, realization.
And she never ignored Henry or his safety in the process of finding herself. He was surrounded by family and caring adults every moment. Especially his mother. And this was her journey and her story, this time. And about time.
This was Emma’s season to find herself and recognize exactly WHO she was…her mother’s daughter, her son’s mother, her father’s daughter, her soul’s magic, her partner’s lover, fate’s survivor, the total package finally combining all of that to stop her from once again running away from who she was…and who she was capable of being. If it took walking through ten thousand miles of woods, and three hundred years, so be it. She finally let her heart mold with her brain. Good. She will handle all those roles much better now that she loves herself and accepts herself for who she truly is.
This was about Emma, creating a relationship with EMMA.
In regard to the dance…
Sometimes, you just have to wear a gorgeous dress, smile adoringly and simply enjoy being held in the arms of someone who loves you and take the joyous whirl. Just because it feels so darned good.
🙂
***Always in search of a good flock***
And thus, you, and Colin have said some of the things explaining why I have a very fond affection ~beyond the obviously pleasing visual~ for El Capitano.
I would also like to add that he simply loves her. He wants to be around her, he wants to protect her and share adventures and life’s wonderfully simple pleasures (such as dancing) whether she “needs” saved or not.
he loves her and sometimes, it is just as simple as that
***Always in search of a good flock***
The *I will win it* quote is one of my favorites of Hook to Emma. 🙂 Hands down deliciously positive and yet romantically gallant. No trickery, just pure heart felt need~ after what I am see was a very telling, more-than-a-quick-simple-gratification-flirty-smooch-of-a- kiss for both of them. (and she gave it the added OOOOMMPPPH, if I recall~ wink)
It was a softly spoken *heart skips a beat* moment of his confident and sincere devotion to her.
He knew it, and my guess is she knew it, too. Stubborn denial is deep in Emma, but not totally hidden from a man with a heart like Hook.
***Always in search of a good flock***
I love the Dark One! (Real Husbands is the best thing to happen to the fandom EVAHHHH !)
Humor. Wit. A gigantic part of what makes Once appealing and the fandom great…a terrific sense of wit and humor.
It is quite sad that some of the most vocal fans don’t seem to have one.
As it often does, PoM, elements of what you post ring true in my overview of things as well.
The oft used rantings of “OOC” are too easy and empty a Battle Cry of the disappointed viewers when things in A&E ‘s heads don’t gel with theirs.
First off, people change and develop due to life’s experiences, and while elements of who we are at birth are hard wired into us for life, external factors DO have a huge effect.
Secondly this show is escapism fantasy and putting psychological “rules” of our reality into play isn’t going to make much sense.
Considering everyone is running around dealing with at least two separate Alternate Universes spanning hundreds of years and countless family trees knotted inside them at the roots, and oh yeah, your parents are your age, I think the writers do a damn fine job of creating a very entertaining story.
I’ve been intrigued with Emma’s progression over this season. She has been quite humanized from the stoic woman camped ferociously behind her cement walls that she has been since day one. She still remains a strong woman. And a very believable one. Stronger even, because she has allowed herself to let strong emotions ( and equally as strong characters) into her life.
Putting aside the portions of my own personality that show a symmetry to hers (slow grin), her obsession with returning to New York was based on fear not selfishness. She was scared. And when strong women get scared, they can get very stubborn and often cruel…especially to the people who mean the most to them. She didn’t want to risk the hurt. As a viewer I got annoyed sometimes with the “cruelty” part but I understood it.
(Rumple and Hook and Regina suffer with the same struggle, different circumstances. That is what makes them all so compelling)
Moments in life CAN change you instantly. Even (especially?) those in fantasy.
Emma’s trip back in time to view her mother as a woman and not a parent is something every daughter should experience. For reasons too deep to dive into here, when you view your mother as a peer, struggling and facing life as a young woman, it changes you instantly and forever and pretty much evaporates any “selfish” based personality traits.
It immediately redefines you.
Emma sees Snow in a totally different light, now, too. It does change your life when you genuinely realize your mother had one if her own.
With regards to Henry, while being a mother is an instant, eternal and ultimately ferocious thing, a woman must know herself and embrace who she is before she can be that complete and ferocious maternal warrior.
In regards to Hook, he was just a few steps ahead of her in the “fighting hurt” and “self-oriented” struggle and could afford the patience he offered her.
He was determined and patient enough to know that when SHE made the realizations she had to make regarding her fears, it would open her soul (as it had opened his) …and he wanted to be there.
He has an old soul. A because of his own struggles, a wise one.
Having a patient, loyal, strong man (friend or lover) walking through life beside you does not diminish your strength (or independence)as a woman. It enhances it incredibly.
The fact that he sensually oozes dashing rapscallion charm and possesses a gorgeous face that would make Aphrodite’s toes curl is just a pleasant side effect (grinnnn)
***Always in search of a good flock***
It absolutely does NOT disqualify you, Rumplesgirl, or me, or anyone who participates in this forum who also happens to post in anything labeled as a shipping thread, blatantly or otherwise.
Any suggestions otherwise are erroneous… at best.
***Always in search of a good flock***
In very non-specific (and long winded!) terms…
If someone is going to separate things by labels, then simply respect the “Internet rights” of freedom of expression of ALL the labelled parties to post in their comfort zones and styles.
Anyone can go on any board and lurk/read the existing posts to see where they might best gel.
If you can sit down and watch the show on Sundays as a momentary escape and entertainment it doesn’t make any difference how you label yourself or how anyone else labels you. TV viewing is a one on one event.
However, The Internet obviously exists for communication. All kinds. If you can or need to find a dwelling place on the Internet where you find like minded people with whom to share your appreciation, that is icing on the cake.
Not everyone likes the same cake flavors and no one should aggressively or belligerently tell them they should/shouldn’t ~but it happens and there is little you can do to stop them. You can always point blank ignore/block them at the very least if there is not an active, hands on moderating team. But moderators can’t be everywhere all the time. And they shouldn’t have to be forums “parents”, ever.
On most message boards, even ones with stringent guidelines, a poster can lurk around for a while and figure out who all posts where and what is the style of posting. Then join in or not.
When a thread clearly labels what goes on there and you enter it, talking and not just reading, you have made that choice and shouldn’t act surprised with whatever you experience.
If someone needs to express themselves differently or on a different level, one can find an existing thread or if one isn’t available, create one and enjoy the discourse
Shippers, non-shippers, antis, pros, whatever you classify yourself, or others, just post in whatever thread you chose with personal accountability and a semblance of common sense. There is space for all of it. 🙂
If you are the only one feeling or thinking a certain way, you will find out soon enough by a deafening silence or a torrent of opinion (grin)!
***Always in search of a good flock***
