Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
I dislike the double standards this fandom has in relation to the atrocities of villains. I cannot bring myself to actually like Rumple or Regina due to the knowledge of their past (I do think they are interesting characters, but I’m just a bit apathetic towards them and the outcomes of any plights they may be facing). And although some people seem to accept that they have been ‘redeemed’, to me they have not been.
I actually liked Zelina as a character and felt for her due to her mother’s rejection of her as an infant, etc. This empathy for her, along with the fact that she never actually killed anyone on-screen (nor were we told of any past killings by her hands), made me feel like she was the best ‘redeemable’ true villain in the show to date.
I just don’t know what to say about the killing of Zelena tbh. I feel quite sorry for Rumple/Rumbelle fans, as his actions were that of a… well, I don’t know. He tricked Belle, yes, but that was just the tip of the iceberg; he had all the power when he teleported himself into a lone woman’s cell, knowing she couldn’t escape or fend him off, and stabbed her to death. She believed she had been given a second chance (how many have Rumple and Regina been given, again?), and this was one of the saddest parts about it. I don’t think it would irk me as much as it does if it weren’t for the fact that the same people who give Rumple a pass for all sorts of reasons (she was still a risk, she ‘killed’ Neal, she ‘deserved it’/’had it coming’, etc.) weren’t also the same people who root for Rumple and Regina, knowing full well that they’ve both been confirmed to have done 1000x worse than Zelina in their time.
I just… can’t seem to get my head around it; that scene where Rumple kills the mute girl has always kind of haunted me for some reason (in regards to the show, not real life, duh), and I cannot stand the idea of someone else in a helpless situation being brutally murdered by Rumple, only for him to get a free pass yet again!
[adrotate group="5"]"so there’s this new show….."
"there’s lesbians in it"Thanks Tabsicle! abcmouse.com sounds like the type of thing I’m looking for. Anything else you can think of would be great 🙂
"so there’s this new show….."
"there’s lesbians in it"Thanks Keb! Yeah, I’m looking specifically at ages birth-5 years.
"so there’s this new show….."
"there’s lesbians in it"I think Zelena’s spell might be the same spell, just with different ingredients. Jafar and Amara needed 3 genies and each other in order to cast the spell, Zelena is using three ingredients; heart, courage, brains (possibly 4 with the baby?), and is possibly going to use Rumple as the second sorcerer.
In other words I don’t think the spell calls for specific ingredients, just three powerful ingredients. As long as there is three powerful ingredients and two sorcerers to cast it, then the spell should work. Jafar only used the three genies because Amara told him that that was how the spell worked, and Amara had her own reasons for wanting the genies.
"so there’s this new show….."
"there’s lesbians in it"I must admit, I think I joined the fandom too late to hear any of the really mental theories. However, I think I heard somewhere that Cora is both Zelena’s mother and father… oh no wait! That was Cartman XD
"so there’s this new show….."
"there’s lesbians in it"The father is basically Tamara 2.0. She was never given any sort of explanation as to why she hated magic so much. She just *did*. But yes in a land like Oz, his distaste for magic is odd.
This show has an amazing premise (AMAZING PREMISE!!!!!!!!!!). It has so much material it can draw from and use as inspiration, or to outright incorporate, that it could potentially go on for 10+ extra seasons and still be fresh. The only thing letting the show down at the moment is shoddy writing. The inclusion of poorly conceived, shallowly scripted characters like Tamara, Malcolm, and last episode’s Oz characters will ultimately drive the casual viewer away, thus dropping the ratings down so low that it won’t be recommissioned past next season. Such a shame, this really could be the best fantasy show ever produced, if written by good writers.
"so there’s this new show….."
"there’s lesbians in it"Yeah I agree, especially about Zelena hating Regina. It came out of NOWHERE. Why not Cora??
It could’ve just been the first coherent thought that popped into her head after her sense of self had been shattered. The seed for her new identity. I think most people wouldn’t react that way, but the show depicts magic as like a drug, and Zelena has high levels of magic in her system all the time. Zelena’s subconscious is in control of the magic — her skin turning green, her comment after the handkerchief appeared — and her conscious mind can direct it somewhat but can’t really tame it. By hating Regina, Zelena can feel that she’s at least in control of something. I think Cora would be a difficult target for that rage because Zelena has positive associations with the notion of “mother”, since her adoptive mother was kind to her. Since she didn’t have any siblings in her Oz family, she never developed any empathy for the concept of “sister”.
You’re probably right, but most ouat viewers aren’t psychologists or people who care enough to think this deeply about the character’s psyche. Most viewers are casuals who want 45 minutes of escapism. If what you’re saying is true then we should have been given this information in order to establish context. To me, just going from what I saw in the episode, it seemed strange that Zelena went to the Wizard in order to find her family, only to turn into a jealous psycho the second she discovered she had a sister. If there had been some negative contact between her and Regina then her rage could have been believable, or had Cora told Zelena that she didn’t love her but did love Regina then her rage would have been somewhat justified. As it stands her whole story feels extremely shallow; like a half-arsed attempt to giving us a glimpse at what drives Zelena in her quest to destroy her sister.
"so there’s this new show….."
"there’s lesbians in it"Zelena’s father thought her wicked because he saw her use magic as a baby. He never liked it, he only took Zelena in because of his wife. He was probably always wary of her.
Yes, you’re right. All this information was given to us in the episode, but WHY was he wary of her magic? In a land like Oz (ruled by a wizard, good witches abound, etc.) why did he dislike magic? We weren’t given any context as to his thoughts, he ‘just was’ wary of her magical abilities. If they’d have mentioned that he was hurt by magic in the past or was a member of a religion that condemned magic as ‘evil’ then at least we would have known where he was coming from. As it stands we were just given the corner pieces of the puzzle and left to speculate what the rest of the pieces might look like for ourselves. This isn’t very good writing, in fact, it’s terrible writing.
"so there’s this new show….."
"there’s lesbians in it"I think their just always blaming the big bad villain for everything. If Emma would not, she’d have to blame either neal or herself. I think I would choose the witch!
If you’re right then that is one of the worst pieces of script writing I’ve seen in a long time.
I think your right @Felie . Right after I watched the episode I was like “finally there is something about Zelenas past”, but then I realized that there are still more unanswered questions than answered ones. And that there are lot of scenes that don’t really make sense, like how Zelenas father is thinking of her as wicked or why she was jealous of Regina just one moment after she gets to know about her. But I would’t call the episode bad or crap. Just the flashbacks! the realtime story in SB was good. I really enjoyed seeing Tink again… and the Regina scenes are awsome. She really trusted Robin with her heart, I think she’s really able to learn
There is HOPE! I think the episode’s only redeeming parts were Regina’s scenes with Hood. Zelena’s story should have had its own episode, while Neal’s wake and the witch-fight should have been in another episode. It just felt like they had tried to cram too much into one episode and every storyline except the Regina/Hood storyline suffered as a result. This is really disappointing considering the amount of potential there was in the story of Zelena’s past.
"so there’s this new show….."
"there’s lesbians in it"I’m not going to lie I thought this episode was crap.
First of all they gave no build up to the story of Zelena’s childhood, they just jumped from two Oz peasants finding a magical baby and deciding to keep it to, what… 18 years later? Was it a bad childhood? Abusive? Unhappy? We don’t know. One thing we do know is that, despite what everyone keep saying, Zelena actually did know love; her adoptive mother. From what her father said her mother had apparently loved her enough to treat her as her own child, to the point where she didn’t even want Zelena to know she was adopted. We have this huge gap where we are presumably supposed to just believe Zelena… suffered? I don’t know, you know why? Because there was absolutely no context given to anything the Oz characters did. It felt like everything that happened to Zelena to make her the Wicked Witch took place at her home, just a few seconds before leaving, and then with Rumple after he ‘dumped’ her. We weren’t shown any build up to her being bitter, she ‘just was’.
How are we supposed to see where Zelena is coming from if we didn’t even get to see how miserable her childhood was (or even if her childhood was miserable at all!)? Not only that, she actually seemed somewhat of a sweetheart before training with Rumple, only showing a bit of jealousy towards her sister when with the Wizard. She was all teary when she knew the Wizard was going to help her, and seemed genuinely happy about having a sister… for a few seconds at least. There was absolutely zero character development for any of the Oz characters during this episode, including Zelena imo.
As for her father’s constantly changing attitudes towards her; why, in a realm ruled by a wizard would he see Zelena as wicked? Again, there is no context whatsoever behind his attitude and behaviour. Was he hurt by someone magical in the past? Is he a member of a religion which sees magic as evil?
It seems that this episode is full of ‘just because’ –ness. Zelena’s mother decides to adopt her ‘just because’. Zelena’s father hates that his daughter is magic ‘just because’. Zelena is jealous of Regina ‘just because’. I can’t speak for other viewers, but I need CONTEXT in order to give a crap about characters and their behaviour.
P.S. Just a little something which confused me; during the wake when Emma and Hook were talking, how did they know the Witch was to ‘blame’ for Neal’s death? Did I miss something last episode where Rumple told Emma the Witch tricked Neal into killing himself?
"so there’s this new show….."
"there’s lesbians in it"
