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GrumpyWolf!!!!!! Yes! I’m not really a Whale fan so I’m eh about FrankenWolf, but GrumpyWolf would be awesome! I need more Red and Grumpy needs true love.
TinkerHook is my pirate backup ship, has been since their scene in NL.
And…thanks to @Gaultheria, I will not be happy until I see GeorgeLucas, just ’cause it’s George Lucas! 🙂
[adrotate group="5"]It is more Emma than Neal. But it still given Neal more color and flavor because it’s about his own definition of home and how at the same time Emma is leaning about home and coming to recognize it in Neal, he’s coming to recognize it in her. It’s about their mutual understanding of home being each other, for however long it might last.
I did like getting to see their first date. Leave it to Neal to make it something completely…SF! I always really liked his small scale thievery. He does things that are ‘bad/wrong’ or maybe not socially acceptable(?) but in the grand scheme of OUAT, his petty theft doesn’t hold a candle to the things many of the others have done. (It drove me nuts that her hair was wavy though when her flashbacks in Tallahassee all showed her with very straight hair. Forget the giant plotholes, these are the things that drive me nuts!)
I don’t think Neal would/should have been able to free Rumple from the curse of the Dark One had he lived. I think Rumple will only be completely free of the curse when he learns for himself that he doesn’t need to be a slave to it (but that’s for a different character thread!)
I have difficulty seeing why the need to highlight Bae when he is dead, they should have done all that while he was living. Neverland should have been showed when they were in Neverland. the Ferris wheel scene should been in 3A or season 2. Why fleshed out a dead character….
I don’t think the flashback scene in the finale was meant to flesh out Neal, just Emma. It’s showing the audience where she got her definition of home.
I agree @Obisgirl! I don’t want a sequel if they’re just going to ruin it! I love Enchanted…and watching it again after binging on OUAT made it especially hilarious.
There have been some good conversations in the character threads! And I think even though a lot of the posters would consider themselves part of one ‘ship or another – or gasp! opposing ships! 🙂 – the conversations really have stayed away from that particular topic.
Agreed @RP! Neal’s death was just…to put it mildly…awkward and ill timed. Not that I would’ve been happy if he did die at the end of S2 (too much of his story to tell still!) but it would have fit into the storyline at least. But they bring him back, have him do very little while in NL, then kill him off. It just doesn’t make sense.
It drives me insane that they incorporated Neal into so many characters’ storylines, and then bam! gone.
Ok, and you know what else has been driving me up a wall? Why didn’t he sign his ‘get Emma there’s a curse coming….AGAIN’ letter? Like, a lil ‘XOXO, Neal’ would’ve really helped, buddy. 🙂
Here’s a question: Pan referred to Hook as a “one-handed pirate with a drinking problem” and we have seen Hook drinking from his flask several times throughout season 3. Do you think that comment was just a throwaway line or a hint of a potential future storyline involving Hook dealing with self-image issues and alcohol addiction?
I guess it could be. I always just looked at it as the writers’ way of giving Hook a very ‘piratey’ crutch, as opposed to the intimation that Hook is an alcoholic/relies on alcohol. Rum/drinking is something easily associated with being a pirate, and I think that it’s more to show what bad behaviors the pirate leans on to escape. I do think if something comes along to threaten him/his loved ones he could fall back on using alcohol as a means of escape but I think if they do bring it up, it’ll be that he didn’t turn to his flask; instead he dealt with it head on. Or, it could be one of the things that ‘go’ as Killian takes Hook’s place.
I do hope we get Killian out of the pirate garb (but keep the coat!) and visually look like everyone else, but when threatened/when loved ones are threatened, we see a vicious Hook come back out, but this time instead of his motivations being the loss of a loved one or revenge, the Hook ‘persona’ is used to protect others against a big bad. I think that would be fun, and a good way to show that Hook is still alive in Killian. I also think that would be an interesting way to revisit the villain Hook without having yet another character with a redemption arc simply revert or struggle with the good vs bad in them. In S4, I wouldn’t be surprised if we see Regina show she really has been redeemed while we see Rumple having to deal with the consequences of his backslide, so showing Killian be able to draw on his “Hook” persona as opposed to actually revert could be interesting.
They are all both good and bad; it’s one of the bigger points they’re trying to convey (hence Snow, possibly one of the most ‘good’ characters, killing Cora storyline and Red is the Wolf characterization). So yes, even though Neal probably leans more toaward the side of good, he hasn’t always been an angel – far from it. I don’t feel the writers ever intended for his character to ‘symbolize’ good; rather he provided Rumple’s motivation for pretty much all of his actions, regardless of whether Neal was ‘good’ or ‘bad’.
The writers almost made Neal too complex a character to serve their needs or intent. If he were purely Rumple’s motivation, he didn’t need to be so fleshed out. But by creating a character that also has their own motivations – Emma and Henry – that storyline became just as important to viewers. And his death, which may have actually been more powerful (to Rumple/Rumple’s story) had Neal been less defined, came across as being far less ‘bold’ and ‘necessary’ because they did make him a more complex, and therefore more endearing to the audience.
My pirate! (And speaking of when we get to secondary characters, might I suggest Milah? I’d love to hear people’s thoughts about her…they’re surprisingly varied when we discussed it in the CS thread…anyway back to topic)
1) Has Hook let go of the Captain Hook persona? Can he ever? And if he hasn’t, what does that mean for the future of his character?
In a way, yes, he has let go of Hook. But I don’t see a problem with that, because a persona was exactly what Captain Hook was. Killian Jones adopted it after his first huge loss, the death of his brother. It was his first act of rebellion. The character of Hook was fine tuned over the years, and then he met Milah. I suspect Milah wouldn’t have thought much of Killian Jones and probably hero worshipped Hook a bit, which only served to encourage the character, and her death – and Hook’s new obsession with revenge, made the character completely take the place of Killian Jones.
I think the real ‘person’ is a combination of the villainous Captain Hook and the naive Lieutenant Killian Jones, and we’re seeing him work on trying to figure out who, exactly, he is. I think we’ll see him focusing on establishing lasting relationships with a number of characters, in addition to Emma, and trying to be the man of honor he once percieved himself to be. If he does backslide – and I think he’s completely capable of it, like all of our characters, especially the ‘redeemed villains’, it’ll because a threat presents itself. I imagine if something/someone were to threaten the people he loves and the life he’s trying to establish with them, it will be easy for him to channel Hook and become quite fierce in attempting to protect them.
2) What is Hook’s fatal flaw?
I think his fatal flaw is not really understanding who he is and who he wants to be. And because of it, he can make and then devote himself to incredibly rash decisions. He also tends to live on the ends of the spectrum, and spend very little time in the middle and can be very black or white. He loses his brother – so he does a total 180 and becomes a pirate. He loses Milah and spends 300 years in search of revenge. Living, and making decisions like is what made him so utterly selfish and unable to make real connections with others when we first met him.
3) Hook often talks about living with “good form.” How does Hook define good form and do you agree with it? And has Hook lived by good form, do you think?
Haha, I don’t know how to describe it! I think ‘good form’ is at it’s most basic, a set of rules taught to him while training as an officer. I think of books about etiquette and morals that existed circa late-1700s in some ways…it’s ok to challenge another to a duel, but it has to be a fair fight – at least weapons-wise. Goals must be met by honest, not deceitful methods…and so on. Has he always lived with ‘good form’? Yeah, no. It was a bunch of talk. Is he trying to truly understand that concept and live with ‘good form’ now? Yes.I feel that some ‘happys’ (‘happies’?) are in order!
What I love about this part is that everyone behind them is doing the royal ball dance thing, but they are not. He brings her closer, takes her hand, he wants to dance with her and forget about everything. It’s like if they were the only people in the place. They are looking at each other and nothing else matters but them in that moment.
I just love her face in this moment. The first time Emma was in the Enchanted Forest with Snow (and even at the beginning of this adventure), she felt like a fish out of water; she felt unsure of herself and like she didn’t belong in that world. That had to make her feel like a failure on some level; she was an actual fairytale princess who couldn’t adapt to life in a fairytale world.
But here she is in the arms of someone who just told her she was a natural in this world, someone who called her “your highness,” someone who acknowledged the part of herself she had the most trouble believing in. She could see herself as a mother, daughter, and even a savior, but she could never see herself as a princess because the last time she was in the world that would have been her kingdom, she felt like she would never fit in there.
Hook is doing what he does best in this scene—encouraging Emma to feel good about herself, empowering her to embrace every part of who she is. And that makes her feel good. It makes her feel confident. It makes her feel happy. And she looks into his eyes, using that superpower he believes in as much as she does, and she can tell he’s not lying to her; she is a natural at being a princess—at least to him.
Emma’s smile says it all—she can finally find joy in this role that she was uncomfortable with for so long, and she’s done that with someone by her side who truly believes in her. And Hook’s smile is equally wonderful because it’s simply a reflection of his joy at making her feel good about herself.
He makes her happy; she makes him happy. He helps her embrace the beauty and truth behind parts of herself she could never believe in before. That’s it. That’s why I love them so much, and it’s all right here
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I don’t mean to alarm you guys……but you DO realize that by this time exactly two weeks from now, our babies will be filming coupley scenes together and more kisses, right?
