[ms. pixie]

@Midnight Dreary wrote:

Ms. Pixie, I understand what you’re saying, I just simply disagree. 😉

Perfect! =]
Let’s admit it: if we all had the same opinions it would be a very boring forum!

Sooo, let me bring another thing to the discussion:
I love Rumple’s character mostly because he seems to be ahead of everyone, or behind everything… whenever I’m really into the story, cheering for Emma to find out something, or happy ’cause something that I wanted to happen, happens, I always have this feeling that Rumple will show up and reveal he was behind it all along. So, it gives me this perpetual doubt about everyone else, if they are really getting somewhere, or if they’re just being puppets (and if I am being fooled, lead to believe on the motion of things!)

So, I can’t decide if Rumple is:

1. the master of the game – he planned everything and is always playing people to get where/what he wants, and so, is even more powerful then we know.

2. just always ahead, since he lived trough so many years and have the magic, he just understand how people work and is extremely good at seeing where things are going to.

3. can actually predict the future.

what do you guys think???

[ms. pixie]

I can really understand An Empty Heart, *The Looking Glass* and Beauty & the Beast‘s point of view. I think you might be right that giving August the knife was a sign of bravery and that he’s willing to lose his power. But I’m afraid I don’t share that point of view.

Like Pandora’s Imp, I think the scene in the woods showed he learned something, indeed, but I didn’t feel he got everything. =] As I see it, he was truly willing to make things right with Bae. But only Bae. It seems to me that, although he understood he was the responsible for his action of letting Bae go, he doesn’t regret all the damage he has caused on everyone else in his quest to find his son (or even before that, when he would kill anyone who crossed his son’s path). (there’s also the fact that in SB he don’t exactly have his powers, so he wasn’t really giving it up…)

Also, I don’t see how losing Bae and Belle were sacrifices. I mean, they WERE sacrifices, but ones he made in order to keep his power. The sacrifice we think that may be his redemption, is a choice he’ll have to make, putting someone else above himself. Like when Charming jumped in front of Snow’s arrow. He wasn’t thinking about his well being. He was saving Snow from a terrible destiny and it didn’t matter if he was going to die – she was the one to be saved.

[ms. pixie]

oh dear zeus, I have to learn to be more concise! (but I feel like I have so much to catch up!)

@Pandora’s Imp wrote:

I know I’m probably the only one, but I really don’t think he should be reunited with his son. All magic comes with a price. His was Bae and I think he has to pay it and learn from his mistake, not cheat it.

For me, Bae was the price he paid – Belle is his second chance.

Your not the only one! At least, not entirely… I mean, I don’t know if they should or not be reunited, but if they do, I wouldn’t expect it to be a ‘happily-ever-after’ encounter, but something that showed Rumple that ‘all magic comes with a price’, something that triggers his acknowledgement that his redemption depends on his ability to selflessness sacrifice something. You know what I mean?

I’ve seen a lot of people talking about the fact that this show is about happy endings, and I know they have even a close relationship with disney, but I hope they go for this more ancient (yet so modern) vision of tales, where they are more about educating then providing sweet dreams! 🙂

[ms. pixie]

first of all, thanks for all the welcomes!

I think it’s fantastic that people have different opinions on every and each character! It shows that the writers are doing their job, building these “personas” in various levels, so each viewer connects with a different facet of the character!

hjbau, I understand what you mean. I don’t think it’s necessarely the case, but I’ll definetaly put some thinking on it. I guess, unconsciously we can be, sometimes, still a bit sexist, because of a number of reasons. Of course it’s all assumptions and all. I actually feel that I do the opposite. I tend to find easier to justify a woman’s mistake then a man’s, I guess because I feel that man always had the “it’s in our nature’ excuse. Of course it doesn’t apply for anyone or anything, but, you know, my first instinct is this, I’ve noticed. 😳

One last thing. I don’t think Rumple was evil before the curse. I think he was weak and lacked in honour, but not evil. The things that people posted here showing how not-evil he was, well, I guess it depends on your interpretation, for example, I understood that the Dark One chose Rumple, not because he was good and gave him money, but because he saw that he was desperate – and this is what they do, they recognise a desperate soul and offer them what they “need”, in exchange for something they want, in this case, his freedom.

[ms. pixie]

Oh God! After 24 pages of caching up the discussion, I feel like I can take part on it.

First, I really think hjbau and charming are defending the same idea: a true love’s kiss can break any curse. death is not a curse, is just death, so a kiss won’t bring anyone back alive. 😉

Second, I know a lot of people really like Rumple – I get it, he is one of, if not the, most interesting characters of the show – but I think his human side is being way too much… cherished? (my English is good, but sometimes is just so difficult to find the proper word…)

Let me explain myself: yes, he is human after all. yes, he loves his son. yes, he fell for Belle, but I don’t think it justify all the damage.

As I see it, he became the Dark One to save his son from the war, but also, because it would give him power to shut up all those who called him weak and coward. I’m not denying his love or saying it wasn’t a good purpose, but at some point he even actually says that if his son is gone HE’ll have no one else. With Belle, when they kiss, he throws her away because he genuinely thinks she’s tricking him. Some people claim that he thought he wasn’t good enough for her and that’s why he couldn’t believe in their love, but I think it’s more than that, I think, yes, he still sees himself as a coward (after all he let his son go) but is, also, just too blind by his power to not suspect everyone. (by the way, for me, this power of his is, in the end, a easy way out of this coward thing – you don’t actually have to consider what’s right, honourable and etc., you blame the Dark force and just bully around)

Sooo… I agree with someone who said his redemption, if he’s to have one, is going to be about sacrifice, not just reunion ou standing by the “good” ones. 🙂

P.S.: for me, also, both him and Regina are evil for the same reason – revenge as they blame others for their misfortunes.

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