[Myril]

@Cinders The ratings are confusing 😉 First, a thing to really remember is: The networks have access to a lot more data than we have on the internet for free. The craze about the numbers is a craze, maybe showing a trend and at best good enough for a qualified guess, but executive decisions of networks are not just based on the free numbers we know, context plays a role like expected numbers, on which day the show airs, how does the network usually do in average and how on that day, investment (a show costing little in production might not need to attract big audience as much as a show costing a lot of money), advertising sales (a show could have seemingly good ratings and still sell not that good to advertisers, and that is were the big money comes from for the networks, not merchandise, not the fans or the audience, we’re just means to an end). With On Demand it’s a bit more complicate than DVR, it is only of interest for ratings if it includes pretty much the same advertising, because that is what all rating is about, looking good and interesting and strong for selling time slots to advertising. Not all On Demand is counted, but some is, like yours maybe was. Advertisers nevertheless are not so comfortable with On Demand, they assume people skip ads more readily, and even more the longer they wait to watch a show, so they care little about the 7-days ratings.

Now doesn’t seem to make much sense, that ABC and ABCfamily in January changed accessibility. Some On-Demand still have access next day, but access for everyone is offered only after a week. From a rating point of view maybe a little contradictory, but those still having early access are the ones paying (enough), and that is what the networks are after in this case. Others have to watch live to be good audience. And as long as numbers for On Demand are not huge, it doesn’t matter that much to them, advertiser still are more interested in live viewing numbers.

This article gives more insight.

[Myril]

PriceofMagic wrote:
The biggest downfall is the long hiatus. Had Wonderland been saved for the hiatus, I think the fandom wouldn’t be so frustrated at times because we would still be getting our Once “fix”. If they do decide to do a split season again for season 4, I hope they give us something to fill the hiatuses especially the winter one because winter is a gloomy season anyway made all the worse without Once.

That was the original plan for Wonderland, that it would air during the break between 3A and B, but for whatever reason, ABC set it to air at the beginning of the season.

Maybe they thought it could be a show not just interesting for die hard fans of OUaT? More than an interlude, a filler? If shown during the hiatus, Wonderland would have had to compete with big events, award shows, Superbowl, but most importantly the Olympics. It would have been a sort of throw away, a snack for the fans, or for people with little interest in sports and live events. Think they hoped, believed the show could attract broader audience.

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[Myril]

When trying to explore if a split season is/was a good idea or not for OUaT, this is in a way the wrong time to discuss it. The interesting question is not, if the first half did okay, because the first half, the fall season part has been more coherent anyway. TV schedules become more erratic after New Year, the winter season part – that is when all the award shows, Superbowl and other stuff as big events especially make it hard to follow serials, some shows air in between, some air nevertheless and other jump around like no good. The interesting numbers will be the upcoming maybe 3-4 episodes, if the audience is coming back: will there be a significant drop or will the numbers stay the same as before the break or maybe even increase.

Find it interesting, that shows being offered at once like House of Cards are watched by people in different ways. Some do binge watching (all at once), some do a few episodes every day, other maybe an episode every week. Different viewing habits and urges.

The challenge is to do a good promotion to let people know, when the show will back, and make it look interesting to watch again. Think a majority of audience is still not die hard fan of the show, they like to watch, but they seldom spend time on forums, don’t follow cast and crew on Twitter, each other on Tumblr, having eyes on every relevant hashtag, and don’t go crazy with details and speculations. It’s about a good attention grabber telling average audience right in time (not too early not too late): show is back and it’s the one thing to watch now.

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[Myril]

I know I’ve said it before too but Once is made for a board game. New lands can be game extensions, characters with loyalty cards. This isn’t just my boyfriend’s geeky influence on me, I need this.

Music to my ears. And though considering myself to be more of the digital branch of Generation X, if it comes to certain types of games I am more analogue, good old fashioned tabletop type. Okay, they could as well make some PS3 or Xbox whatever, if they have to. Funny, like doing sports competition, racing and that kind of stuff on those, but for something more elaborate like I think a OUaT game should be, could be, would go more for board games. Maybe including some open cards for own creativity. Or a whole online game universe.

@obisgirl This not show related Once Upon a time game looks interesting, I like games with creative touch, offering a different way of story telling especially.

Can’t stop wondering, why they are so uncreative if it comes to merchandise and franchise. Sorry, but I find t-shirts and mugs rather uninspired. If they would sent a shirt or mug with maybe basic background plus set of pens and template to make your own individual shirt or mug of your fave characters, that would be something. And include a competition during the seasons to keep people busy ;). Consumption with a creative, even interactive element, creative interactive consumption.

Anyway, encyclopedia. It’s nice that they seem to leave it to the fans at the moment to build a wiki at least. Print on paper is nice if living in a cabin in the woods or during blackouts though. Not to mention an official one might settle some discussions :p

Just realized how readily I associate printed paper version when reading the word encyclopedia. LOL Doesn’t have to be though.

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[Myril]

Has been said, Milah was more of a plot device than a developed character on her own merits. Nevertheless I found it interesting, how harsh reactions were particular towards this barely developed character. If there is any character on the show I have the impression of actually being hated by a significant number of people it is Milah – and I don’t use the word hate in connection with person/character loosely, it’s not just dislike or not understanding her motives and thinking in her case, and it’s not about any shipping wars.

I think that’s what bothers me about her so much – I just don’t get why Rumple was suddenly the ‘village coward’ and how this was so awful. Yes, what he did wasn’t brave but it wasn’t the worst thing in the world either. She seems to be the major catalyst in why Rumple thinks so little of himself and why he considers himself a coward.

Rumple became a deserter – and for some that is a one of the worst crimes, making you not just a coward but someone betraying family, community, nation. No matter you were rightfully scared for life, might have had family obligations and good reasons to leave even – if you leave a battle, deserts, you’re the worst of worse. Rumple left in a war situation, left the battle. He betrayed his comrades in arms, their families (some of them for sure living in the village), his own family by not staying in arms to protect them. Sorry, but I very well can see, why Milah reacted disappointed and angry. Doesn’t matter if that war was objectively worth fighting for or only the Duke profiting from it, the villagers and people at that point seemed to believe it was necessary (Rumple for sure was excited to prove himself a worthy member of community and not a coward).

She seems to be the major catalyst in why Rumple thinks so little of himself and why he considers himself a coward.

Was she? By now we got to know his father, Malcolm, and that man did damage to Rumple’s self-confidence for a lifetime. Rumple struggled with the heritage of his father, then with the prophecy telling him, he too would abandoned his own son. I am not sure that Milah could have counteracted that even if she would have been as supportive to Rumple as she seemed to be at first, before he went to war. Milah first didn’t want him to go, while Rumple was all excited about being drafted. Rumple wanted to go into war to prove he was not a coward like his father – and Milah didn’t push him to do so, it was very much himself rushing for it. War changes people, Rumple soon experienced that it’s not the big man hero adventure he believed it to be. And then came the seer and told, he would abandon his son, and he started to believe her, when other things she had told him came true soon. Rumple became a (mental) mess, obsessed with staying with his son, with not failing him like his own father had failed him. There was no place for Milah in Rumple’s live anymore. Her first angry reaction was her own wrong, but what followed with Rumple, their marriage dissolving was not alone her doing.

Milah sure was no saint, she did Bae wrong by leaving him alone with his obsessed father, but wouldn’t classify that as villain. Rumple made his own bad decisions. And so did Hook. Hook became a pirate, and though he made it sound like having noble reasons for that at first, from how he acted in the tavern with Milah it looked to me like he already had lost most of that nobility before he met Milah. Think Milah might even have been the one to somewhat remind him of why he became a pirat in the first place, but that is speculation on my side. Could say she might have been Hook’s Belle in a way (which makes it even more interesting to look again at the time when they turned Belle into Lacey).

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[Myril]

It would have made tons of sense. Remember when I watched Snow White robbing David and Abigail I instantly thought: Robin Hood! And then there are Snow’s skills with bow and arrows. Not to mention the irony, Graham saved Snow’s life (and was made lover by the Evil Queen), Robin Hood teaching Snow how to stay elusive and survive in the woods on the long run, maybe be being the one telling her about dark fairy dust (being the potential soul mate of Regina). And it could have been a nice example of the on screen so rare phenomenon of non-romentical buddy relationship between a woman and a man (besides Phillip and Mulan maybe, but I know some saw a romantic spark there, not contradicting that Mulan later developed feelings for Aurora, which could have made some interesting psychology in itself, but more something for franchise than on the show itself – someone writing a fan fic about it?). Big time missed chance here (if what tvline says is indeed it).

Just don’t buy into Snow learning how to survive in the woods all on her own (sorry, I’m all feminist game, but she needed to learn those skills fast, and had no books about it around). And as much as I like Red and think she is badarse, don’t think she had such skills (though Granny might taught her a few things and her wolf senses sure were helpful, but she lived well protected by Granny in a cabin, being part of a community), so don’t belief, Red taught Snow all to survive. Maybe Snow learned it from the animals around … It’s a detail, maybe, not overly important, but such things are nice cookies for fans.

Regarding the fairy dust, I always thought that Maleficent or the blue fairy gave Snow the fairy dust.

In my head canon it was instantly Maleficent, the moment they brought dark fairy dust up. Still think they underused this iconic Disney villain (and would have loved if they made her and WW sisters, a fairy and a witch, why not, to me a lot more interesting than what they seem to head to, could have brought in a new side of stories for seasons to come, because I think the whole Rumple/Regina/Snow/Emma family affair is beginning to wear itself out).

Whatever. It’s their show. And when deep in a project one sometimes doesn’t see the wood for the trees (which goes for fans as much as for writers)

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[Myril]

Brain eating zombie med student – kinky. LOL
Anders as bad guy, rich spoiled kid with criminal hubris in over his head, sounds like a good cast. 😛

I would also like to point out that a show on the CW about a medical examiner Zombie eating corpses and taking in their memories is probably not long for this world…

Who would have thought that the Walking Dead would stay with us so long before the first episodes aired (and it turned out to be a fresh, praised and very successful spin on the zombie overkill). 😉

Didn’t know about this comics (not much of a comics geek) but what I read in the Wikipedia articles does sound interesting even. Seems a sound mythology with over- and undersoul concept, and a concept with potential. It’s a crime show with a supernatural/zombie aspect says Deadline. Liv, the brain eating zombie turned med student uses the thoughts and memories she “gains” to solve crimes, homicides. Could be kinda Psych with a zombie. And Psych has its last season running, so there could be room for something like that. It depends on what they make of it. No to mention this is a new project of the creator of Veronica Mars, Rob Thomas. Before having seen at least a pilot would not render a final judgment, if this show will have a chance or not.

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[Myril]

YAY! We all figured she would be, but it’s great to have it made official.

RumplesGirl wrote:

My fear is that she’s only coming back for the season finale wedding, and she’ll just be seen in the “town” shots

Nah, they know how much people miss her and want to actually see her back on the show, and I’m sure they miss her as well, so I’m sure they’ll give her something significant to do.

Hopefully. Just with new characters around and all that is going on, I am not sure how significant they can make it. Other thought: because of where the plot is by now, it doesn’t make much sense to dwell on where she has been all the time while they were busy in Neverland, that ship has sailed IMO. And as long as it is unclear, if Meghan Ory could be more available again, her part in the story can only be short, but this time they better offer a good idea, why she might be absent then again. Tricky for the writers.

Taking my thoughts about Ory’s show Intelligence and its survival to the show’s thread.

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[Myril]

Now that some episodes have aired, what do you think, will the show make it to a second season? Or will OUaT have a chance to get Red back for more than just a flying visit?

Predictions based on ratings for Ory’s show on CBS, “Intelligence” are not bright at the moment, but opinions are divided. Mediocre writing because of nonsensical stories (science? logic? who wants to be bothered with that? we’re out of high school!), but the cast is getting some people. And it’s not all Josh Holloway (nope, couldn’t care less about seeing him even shirtless), I am not the only one trying really hard to still give the show a chance despite all because of Riley aka Meghan Ory, and maybe because of Dr. Phlox and his son (John Billingsley is always a joy to watch, the son is played by P.J. Byrne), they add a nice comedy touch to the show once in a while. Don’t mind that much, if the science doesn’t make all sense and plots have weaknesses(although it should it least make sense inside the show’s universe), but then their has to be intriguing human drama. Looks to me like the’re are getting slightly better with the latter, but still think there is some space for improvement. Not sure if there will or even should be a second season.

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[Myril]

I wonder, Adam says a lot of contradictory things. They have a vision that they must stick too–but oh, if Stan or Dorhnan has time–we’ll write them in because like the fans, they want them back. Right.

I do think they’re hinting at wanting to resurrect a character as that’s what the whole wraith/MAP story was, and it has been dangling and obviously fans will think “well if they’re bringing anyone back alive who ought to be dead dead….GRAHAMMMMMMM!!!!” so they’re just anticipating it and saying we would have done it (whether true or not) but Jamie’s too busy now so deal, we can’t do it.

It’s fan management basically and name dropping to take advantage of Dornhan’s profile, same with STan. Hollywood is all about the buzz, isn’t it?

Yup, entertainment, media and news are pretty much all about buzz, not just Hollywood. We don’t know though, how this about Graham came up, in which context. For all we know, they could have been explicitly asked about Graham during a general press tour/meeting, because anything Jamie Dornan did before, does now, will do is a matter of interest for enterainment Buzz machine now that he is playing a buzz character on a buzz movie. It’s a difference, if they’re asked or if they’re bringing it up. If thinking in SEO ways, name dropping might make a bit of sense, riding on the wave of recent attention (and attention span in entertainment buzz is often short and erratic), but being constantly asked, if you might bring back in some way a certain character and actor, when the actor very obviously is not available at the moment can as well be annoying. Think they’re happier to talk about things they can do than to get sentimental about things that can’t be done (at least not at the moment or in any foreseeable future).

Don’t think it’s fan management, because frankly IMO they mostly suck at it. LOL

Don’t agree on Adam (or Eddy as well) saying a lot of contradictory things, but what they say is often open to interpretation. They keep things vague if it’s about upcoming stuff, of course they do, and we all read into it whatever we seem fit. And they have their view on and understanding of their stories and characters, and that is not always what we want it to be nor what we read into the stories and characters. It probably would do them better to sometimes give no commentary instead of tease, but that is easier said than done, seeing how we here are hungry and jumpying for every crumb of information and spoiler, and how pushy journalists can be (well, it is their job to be).

Having a plan for a story doesn’t mean it’s sketched out in all detail. That is particular true for tv shows, where the story unfolds over time, where the story or plot is still in the making, being written, while parts of it are already shown to the audience. It would be something different if they would be done shooting all seasons before the first episodes airs. Being a story in the making while being consumed poses challenges but as well offers opportunities. In tv show business they learn to be flexible in story telling because they have to be, there are budget changes, actor availability is in issue – they have to adapt. But even writers of books adapt their stories and characters, have not all set when they start writing, but different from a TV show we get to see only the end product. If you ask writers, you can often hear, that part of their stories, plots, details changes while writing, that characters maybe develop a kind of life on their own even.

I don’t see anything wrong if A&E take a chance to write Graham or Mad Hatter or Red or others in as long as they do good job with it. If they just hope to get the actors, then they’ll have to change eventually if not, or if they know they can get them at a certain time, then I don’t mind if they change a story detail to take advantage of that. These characters are part of the UOaT universe, they’re interesting characters, and yes, missed or loved by a number of fans. Call it fanservice maybe, but I very much believe them, that they are the biggest fans of these characters themselves. They want them to be in the plot if they can make it happen, not just for the fans, but because they like the characters.

Not saying , that A&E always do a good job in what they are writing or have written, nobody’s perfect, but besides whatever critical view I have on some things, so far I’ve perceived A&E as primarily story tellers and not that much marketing driven.

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