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PanTheMan Participant No matter whether BF is evil or not, I’m convinced she’s manipulated characters for the sake of a certain outcome. We just don’t know her exact motivations.

I agree. Blue Fairy is certainly shady. She seems to have convinced herself she’s working on the side of the greater good. Yet, she’s also a hypocrite and known liar. She said fairies don’t lie, but then she lied to Snow White and Prince Charming about the enchanted wardrobe only being able to transport one person when in fact, it could transport two. What’s to stop her from lying again?

BF in the diner scene in Darkness on the Edge of Town really made me think she’s in league with the Sorcerer. I really like the idea that she’s out to destroy the dark one curse.

I certainly think the Blue Fairy and the Sorcerer and/or Author are in cahoots. If the Blue Fairy had wanted the dark one curse broken, wouldn’t she have told Baelfire about TLK, since that would’ve broken his papa’s curse once and for all? Rather, I think the Blue Fairy has designs on Henry. Instead of telling Baelfire about TLK, she gave the bean to Baelfire, which sparked all of the events of S1.

I almost wonder if what the Blue Fairy actually wanted was for Bae to come to A Land Without Magic, in order that he might meet Emma, and she would have Henry. Certainly, that was what Peter Pan was after: the heart of the truest believer. Might the Blue Fairy and the Sorcerer also have needed Henry for some greater design? Not only is Henry the product of true love, but he also is the product of the greatest light magic and the greatest dark magic, as both Peter Pan and Rumple have said.

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But does having a dark heart automatically make you a villain? Since this show is all about redemption, despite your past dark deeds, Emma would have to Do something villain-y to then turn into a villain. Which sort of makes the whole ‘oh Emma has to have a dark heart’ thing sort of wonky.

Ursula revealed to Hook that Rumple’s plan included darkening Emma’s heart forever. I don’t personally buy into this idea of Black Swan. I feel like Emma being labeled this way is being done to make the villains look better by comparison. I just hope Emma doesn’t become corrupted. Emma’s likeability was directly linked to her ability to overcome adversity and still choose goodness. Out of all the characters, Emma has perhaps some of the greatest reason to turn towards darkness (i.e. abandonment and feeling unloved), but she didn’t continue in a life of crime.

And really where did Rumple get that information? Does Rumple know who the Author is, but just doesn’t know where he is?

Who knows? Maybe Rumple foresaw it with his seer skills. Yet, Maleficent also knew about Emma having the heart with the darkest potential. So maybe it’s part of some prophesy. Or maybe it’s just a plot point that won’t be further addressed.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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Just makes me think the Author will be a victim, and then the Sorcerer will be evil.

Me too.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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I feel like he wouldn’t find it objectionable if someone compared to Neal to Kate, because he’s good people, not a “thug”.

True enough. Kate is not exactly a pirate now is she? While Neal was a common thief, he wasn’t exactly a thug. Too bad we never saw how Neal managed to turn his life around so that he could afford an apartment in Manhattan. We can only presume that after he fled the law to Canada he got a new identity. However, he was still going by the name of Neal when Emma found him again, so it’s not entirely clear. If he returned to the United States under the name of Neal Cassidy, he’d probably have been picked up by the police and done his time for stealing he watches.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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I just had a thought. If Rumple manages to corrupt Emma so that her heart becomes dark, then that would qualify her as a villain. I wonder what her happy ending would even look like. Would Emma have even been born in this AU? Regina not casting the dark curse means Snow and Charming may never have even met. Snow and Charming not meeting sounds more plausible than them getting together, because they’re heroes, and in this AU it sounds like the villains get a happy ending at the expense of the heroes.

If Emma somehow does manage to have been born in this AU in virtue of her becoming a villain, would her happy ending include having been born and raised in the Enchanted Forest by her parents? Yet, that still sounds like Snow and Charming’s idea of a happy ending, and they’re “heroes” so that doesn’t quite add up if only villains get their happy ending in this AU. Plus, Emma growing up in the Enchanted Forest would mean she never went to A Land Without Magic, never met Neal, and again, never had Henry, which is actually an unhappy for Emma as much as it is for Regina. Not being a mom to Henry doesn’t sound like the happy ending Emma envisioned for herself in 3×12 when she was just enjoying being a single mom to Henry.

Also, Emma wouldn’t have met Hook, because he would’ve been dead centuries ago by the time Emma was born. Hook wouldn’t have gone back to Neverland to seek revenge, meaning he would’ve aged normally and died a long time ago. Rumple going to A Land Without Magic with Baelfire means that Hook would’ve happily have lived out his days with Milha aboard his pirate ship. In this AU, Hook’s idea of a happy ending wouldn’t be Emma, but Milha, because she probably wouldn’t’ have been killed by Rumple in the first place.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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I’m not sure Regina wants to force the Author to rewrite her story. Keep in mind the Author or the Sorcerer sent Robin Hood the alternate page 23. Why would he do that if he felt like Regina was going about getting her happy ending by force?

Regina’s own choice of words in the start of S4 was “force” — that is what she said to Sidney Glass. Now whether Regina has changed her tune, on account of Henry, is another matter. However, my meaning is broader. Regina’s entire notion of getting the Author to rewrite her story is as ill-fated as Rumple’s, whether or not the desire is pure or selfish. Here is my reasoning behind that statement. If Regina had walked into the tavern and met Robin Hood, neither Roland nor Henry would exist, meaning Robin and Regina would’ve missed out on being parents to those particular children. Robin never would’ve married Marian and had Roland. Regina never would’ve cast the dark curse, meaning Emma wouldn’t have come to this world, met Neal, or had Henry. These children simply wouldn’t exist. So while Regina might get what she thought she wanted (i.e. Robin Hood), she would be missing out on being the adoptive mother of Henry. So for every pro, there would be a con. Not being a mother to Henry, and Henry never having been born in this AU, sounds like an unhappy ending, rather than a joyous one for Regina.

Speaking of Rumple, where’s he at in this AU? Did he let Belle’s kiss break the Dark One Curse? Is he even in FTL, or has he found a way to our word and is enjoying a life with Bae? Did he never become the Dark One at all, and he and Bae lived full lives and died centuries ago? If so, who’s the Dark One instead of him?

That’s a really interesting question. If I had to guess, I think Rumple’s happy ending would, by his own admission, include his son. Presumably, Rumple would’ve gone with Bae to A Land Without Magic. I don’t think Rumple would’ve given up becoming the Dark One though, because he did that to protect Baalfire in the first place from getting killed in the Ogre’s War. But Rumple going through the portal in the first place would’ve meant that he never went back on his deal, meaning his son wouldn’t have grown up fatherless. Also, that would mean Baelfire and Rumple are dead in the AU, and that Baelfire never became Neal, never met Emma, and never fathered Henry. It would also mean that Rumple never met Belle, because he would’ve left the Enchanted Forest centuries before she was ever born.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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While I can laugh at Shatner’s tweet, I actually wonder if he fails to see the hole in his own attempt to discredit the pairing. If he intended to throw shade at Hook, then he’d better start by calling him Hook rather than “Killian” (something only CSers do). Neal was born the son of a peasant, as was David, and they both managed to fall in love with royalty, Emma and Snow, respectively. So to me, the reason to not pair Hook with Emma is not owing to his low status, but rather, his behavior and the attitude he chooses to adopt (selfish entitlement and disdain for the feelings of others).

But for all I know, the writers are going to ret-con Hook so that he turns out to be a lost prince of some kingdom. *twitch*

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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I think Ursula is a victim of bad writing. Show don’t tell. They used her back-story, which was lifted directly from The Little Mermaid, to make us see her origins that set her on a bad path, but what they failed to demonstrate was exactly what villainous acts she committed. Her story was too rushed, and like Lancelot, Rapunzel and Tamara, she was another POC whose story had tons of potential, but which didn’t quite deliver. I wish the writers could be more self-reflective. It’s only 3 episodes into 4b and already Ursula’s story is done? While we might see more of her (squid ink being needed as a plot device), I think she was unfortunately gotten rid of too soon while traditionally white villains like Cruella and Maleficent still are around, despite Mal’s character-centric episode having aired already. She probably will be around for awhile, seeing how the Charmings are the cause of the loss of her child.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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Something tells me that the villains achieving their “happy ending” is not going to be all that it’s been cracked up to be. It seems like Rumple and Regina’s desire to force the Author to rewrite their stories is ill-fated, as Geppetto warned. As soon as you make happiness your sole goal, you’re bound to miss out on it. Probably Rumple and Regina will “succeed” in getting what they thought they wanted only to discover it wasn’t what they’d wanted after all. Here’s hoping Henry can fix what his mom and grandpa do to set the AU back to the real story. Otherwise, Regina will miss out on being a mom to Henry and Rumple will miss out, potentially, on being a grandfather to Henry, who is the only real family he has left.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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I really really really really really miss Neal Cassidy.

Me tooooo.

Whoever wrote this gets all the cookies.

Oh, and credit goes where it’s due. I believe @PantheMan posted a very similar, if not the exact same theory over the hiatus.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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