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RG I agree everything Hook has done so far this season is because he wants Emma. I think Hook knows deep down that Emma doesn’t feel the same way for him and that she really does love Neal just as much as she loves their son Henry. What did David say to Hook in 305 “Let me give a bit of advice Hook She’s never going to like you” “How so ?” “How could she you’re nothing but a pirate”

I think Hook earnestly would like to be more than a pirate; he wants to be a hero and to reclaim the “good form” he lost, but he’s not really sure how to do that. He was honest to tell David and Snow that Neal was still alive, which was the honorable thing to do, and Hook overheard Neal telling Emma he’d never stop fighting for her. At that point, Hook should’ve honored Baelfire, his so-called son figure, by stepping back from Emma to let her have the space she needed to focus on Henry. Also, Hook knew at that point that Emma loves Neal, as Peter Pan was quick to point out in 3×5. I think deep down, Hook knows full well that Emma and Neal love each other, and that winning Emma would be a long shot.

Yet by 3×7, Hook went against the “bro code” to pursue a woman whom he knows is Neal’s great love. How Hook could even justify going after Emma, the mother of Neal’s child, is an anathema to me, considering Neal is his so-called “good friend” and his son figure, whose mother Hook ran off with and whom Hook then handed him over to murderous Lost Boys. Hook owes Neal, big time, and yet he’s continuing to act dishonorably by vying for the woman whom Neal loves, knowing full well that Emma still loves Neal, not him. It’s bizarre to me, and even if I did’t ship Emma with Neal, I just couldn’t support Hook’s rationale. Hook still operates with the principle that if he wants something, he must therefore get it, which is very self-centered. That is what he did with Milha, even though she was Rumple’s wife. Even when it seemed like Hook was stepping back from Emma in 3×10, he really wasn’t, because he was just hypocritically jeering that Neal had left Emma and would fail miserably. Yet, Hook doesn’t admit that he himself has left Emma twice to die, which is way worse in my book than leaving Emma in a minimum security juvenile correction facility for 11 months.

To me, Hook has an obsessive personality that boarders on unhealthy; he was obsessed with avenging Milha for centuries, which makes Regina’s revenge against Snow White look like child’s play. And suddenly, when his revenge streak was complete (out of the blue), he fixated on the first woman who reminded him somewhat of Milha’s adventurous spirit, and Emma just happens to be the biological mother of Milha’s grandchild. It’s just bizzare. The real caveat, however, is that Emma is not anything like Milha, because she would never abandon Henry the way that Milha abandoned Baelfire, and deep down, Hook knows it. Peter Pan even taunted him with the idea of letting Hook and Emma leave Neverland while leaving Henry behind, but Hook didn’t take the offer, not because he didn’t want to, but because he knew Emma would never stand for it. Emma is in a completely different league than Milha, and therefore I believe, out of Hook’s league, and I think he knows it. Hook had no difficulty in getting Milha to agree to his favored lifestyle on the the high seas, but she was the sort of woman to run out on her child because she craved adventure, Hook, and his idea of a happy ending (his true love is the sea). Neal withstanding, I think that Hook an Emma would be wholly incompatible in the long run for these very important factors alone. If two people aren’t agreed on what they want out of life, they’ll never be happy together in the long run. Hook may think he’s in it for the long haul, but I don’t think he’s considered what that means for his own happiness. Would Hook really be happy wearing J. Crew sweaters and living a “normal life” in Storybrooke or NYC as I’m pretty sure Emma would want? Let’s just say I have real doubts. His idea of a “happy ending” is the life he had with Milha, a woman who had no scruples about leaving her son behind to sail the seven seas with her sea-fearing, swashbuckling lover.

Emma and Neal, by contrast, are two lost children who were always searching for a home and family, which they found in each other. They may not have had the means to get a place, but their yellow bug was their home, and they soon realized they wanted to settle down and “get a real place” of their own. Their dreams were, and still are, pretty simple: to have a home-life and family. Deep down, Emma still wants to find Tallahassee with Neal, otherwise she wouldn’t have confessed to Neal how much it hurt that he’d supposedly fond Tallahassee with Tamara in 2×21. Emma still dreams of home, as evidenced by the way she said it in 3×4 the way she did in 2×6 when Neal and her had that dream.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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In the chat, I was reflecting what it means to be a true hero. Here is what I wrote. A true hero is willing to die for the sake of others. Charming was willing to die fighting to protect baby Emma to put her in the wardrobe. Snow willingly ate a poisoned apple in an attempt to save Charming and her friends. Ruth died so that Snow would be able to have a baby one day. Neal was willing to die so that Henry wouldn’t have to grow up alone. Regina was willing to die to protect Henry from the fail-safe, and Emma joined her. Rumple sacrificed himself to protect Neal/Belle. All of these examples are self-sacrificial in which the person making the sacrifice doesn’t expect to live but is willing to do it to protect the people he or she loves. I think Hook making this sort of self-sacrifice would complete his S3 motto, “Believe a pirate can be a hero.” As I’ve said previously, in 3×11, both Regina and Rumple scarified this own happiness for the sake of giving their sons, Henry and Neal, respectively, a chance at happiness, even though that meant not being with them. While we’ve seen Hook come close to doing a truly noble deed, like putting his own life in jeopardy, he’s yet to do it entirely for the sake of others, because he always expects to gain something by it. A truly final heroic act in which he willingly sacrifices himself to give his son-figure, Baelfire, and Emma, whom he claims to feel something for, another chance at happiness would be very heroic.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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I was just commenting on how, while it doesn’t mean it’s likely that the writers have the same thought line as all the fans, it can be used as a somewhat accurate representation of who the fandom wants to die out of the regulars.

I agree that the story the writers choose to tell is largely independent of fan polls. ABC marketing is fully separate from the writing team. While the promo department might use these polls as a rough estimate to gauge what or who they think online viewers want to see, the results don’t accurately reflect the actual number of voters or viewers; the poll just reflect the number of times a group of dedicated fans obsessively hit ‘submit’ for their favored outcome.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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Polls which allow a person to vote ad infinitum are going to be inherently skewed. The practice of stacking online polls, which often let people vote more than once, is called “freeping”  and is largely considered wholly unreliable as an actual statistical modeling tool. In order for results to be considered scientifically viable, the number of votes must reflect the actual number of voters, otherwise the tendency to stack votes creeps in. When “freeping” occurs it’s because the goal is to direct people to online polls to intentionally bias the results to support their point of view.  As Phee showed with her maps, all it takes is a dedicated group hitting the “submit” button over and over to the point of mania. That is why presidential polls which don’t limit you to one vote are considered unreliable in actually predicting the next president. Even when a person is limited to one vote per online device, they can usually get around that by voting again and again from a second and third device. One person might vote from three different computers, a cell phone, and an iPad with the hope of stacking the poll to reflect his or her opinion.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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More wonderful explanations and answers from Schmacky. Pretty much what we’ve been saying, but still nice to read it.

More pretty SF things!

 

 

 

Tell me you love me, come back and haunt me
Oh and I rush to the start

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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Pretty SF things! From Tumblr

 

 

I screwed up the first time, hopefully I get another chance.

*Believe in second chances! * Rumple sacrificed himself to make sure Neal got another chance at happiness. This isn’t over guys! Neal will see Emma and Henry again! *Believe!*

Charming: “True love isn’t easy, but it must be fought for, because once you find it, it can never be replaced.”
Belle: I will never stop fighting for him!
Neal: I’ve got a secret, too, Emma. I’m never going to stop fighting for you. Never.

This is true love all! Do you really think it was going to be easy? 🙂

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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 Phee wrote: As for promo, yeah they have promoted the wazoo out of Hook and CS, and Colin is undoubtedly a big draw for many viewers. But has that excessive promo seen ratings sky rocket? Nope. Ratings haven’t had a massive decline, they’re holding relatively steady, but all that Hook/CS promo hasn’t exactly drawn in more viewers. If people are staying away because they’re not super fussed about Hook, the ep of his death could likely see a ratings spike, and while they might lose some viewers after the fact, they might well win some others back.

What’s interesting is that if you study the ratings for S3, “Good Form” only received a slight spike in viewership after a marked decline after the season 3 premiere, despite the ABC promo’s department to sell the CS kiss. The next episode, “Ariel” drew a much higher viewership, however, because she’s a lot of people’s favorite princess. Then the ratings pretty much consistently fell, with a marked dip in “Dark Hollow” which focused too much on the triangle of doom. This attempt to white-wash Hook as a hero and to sell him as a viable suitor for Emma has not been successful across the board and has actually probably cost ABC more viewers than its attracted. A lot of the viewers who stopped watching the show did so after “Tallahassee” which means they lost interest. The other episode which generated a lot of attention was, “Manhattan” in which it was revealed Neal was really Baelfire, which was a major mystery that remained from S1, which was pre-Hook. Go figure. Getting rid of Hook once and for all might actually draw back a lot of viewers who felt he was a badly written character who didn’t add anything to the plot at all.

Phee wrote:  Speaking of attempted heroic acts in NL, Hook was trying to act the hero part by saving the life of a man who Emma loves, but he did it for his own personal gain, so it wasn’t a true heroic act. So might they have him saving the life of another man who Emma loves, this time doing it truly not for any personal gain, because he’d give his own life in the process? Could be a nice little climax to his story arc where he’s striving to regain his good form.

While Hook may want to be a man of honor again, he doesn’t really know how, so long as he continues to only put his own interests first. Even when Hook played a hand in helping to save Henry, Charming, and Neal, he really only did it to be appealing to Emma. His “stepping back” from Emma wasn’t really honorable because he just expected Neal to fail miserably. And Hook’s drunken pass at Tinkerbell was in keeping with his womanizing history, and it was dishonorable to Tinkerbell and to Emma. Hook is still a pirate, and one whose redemptive arc is far from complete. Hook sacrificing himself for the cause of others, without expectation of self gain, would be a true hero’s end and a good send-off if ever there were one.  

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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Hurray for pretty things! Neal’s second chance is still forth-coming. I believe it!

RumplesGirl wrote:  the one thing I’m seeing in various locations is the idea that Neal is superfluous to the plot as a whole. He isn’t doing anything on the show. I don’t understand this argument. He’s Rumple’s son, Henry’s father, the reason for the Curse (ie: the show), he’s part of the co-parenting team of Regina/Emma/Neal, Belle’s future step son, an old friend of Emma’s if nothing more. So while I’m still leaning towards Neal, it’s not because he’s expendable. He’s not expendable at all. Seriously, the sheer fact that he’s Henry’s FATHER means he’s not expendable

*sigh* That is just nonsense being perpetuated by CS fans. Neal is certainly an important character, both in a supporting role and in his own right. I saw this on Tumblr and thought I’d share here considering its relevance:  

Why are people saying Neal hasn’t done much this season? How is that even true?

• He was in the EF.
• Found a way to get to Neverland to rescue Emma & Henry.
• Got to Neverland on the shadow.
• Reunited with Rumple, confronted Pan.
• Rescued Henry. Got captured himself.
• Got rescued.
• Explained the coconut.
• Went to the Dark Hallows
• Confronted Rumple.
• Reunited with Wendy.
• Went to Skull Island.
• Used the coconut to help get out of Neverland
• Was with everyone at the return party.
• Went to the tomb with everyone.
• Helped destroy the shadow.
• Was with everyone in the town when Rumple destroyed Pan.
• Said his goodbyes to Emma & Henry.

I’m not going to do the math, but I was thinking he even had more screen-time than Hook in the back portion of the Neverland arc. I mean, he was essential and involved, while Hook took a backseat. Neal has done a lot this season. He’s been essential to the plot. Fact.

Beyond the Neverland arc, however, Hook isn’t exactly central to the plot, and even in NL, his interactions with Peter Pan were cut short! We never found out what dirty work he did while working for Peter Pan! All we saw was Hook make goggly eyes at Emma. And after 3×7, Hook just sort of hung back while Neal stepped up and filled the natural role as Emma’s partner and co-parent of Henry and made peace with his father. Hook just hung out with Tinkerbell. Talk about expendable. If I had to choose an ending for Hook, I’d have chosen to partner him with Tinkerbell, his Neverland counterpart, and have them sailing off together in the Enchanted Forest. That would be a natural and happy conclusion to their story arc with the completion of Neverland now done. However, if someone has to die, I’d say Hook is the most expendable and the one whose death would least negatively impact the rest of the core characters. Neal’s final death, however, wouldn’t only be redundant and ruin his chance at a happy ending, but would ruin the happy endings of Rumple, Henry and arguably, Emma, who loves him.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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lunatiger wrote: I don’t believe it’s Neal. It just doesn’t make sense from a writing standpoint. He already “died” last season and made everyone a mess because of it, especially Rumple and Emma and Henry. To have him die again would be soooo redundant. We’ve already explored all the characters emotions when he supposedly “died”, it doesn’t add anything new to the story to have him die again. It would just be a rehash of the beginning of season 3. Also there is much to be explored with his character. I still have hope that it will be explored in the later episodes of the season. It took over a year to get an Emma backstory. I’m not surprised that it might take that long to get Neal’s. Emma and Neal’s backstory in our world isn’t quite as thrilling as seeing magical EF stuff. But Nealfire’s conception was from the beginning of the show. I can’t see them killing off such a major character after so much happened.

That is another excellent point! Why on earth would the writers have Neal nearly die, only to bring him back and then kill him permanently? It doesn’t make any sense to put Emma, Rumple and Henry needlessly through the pain of thinking they’d really lost him at the start of S3, only for them to lose him forever by the end of S3. That is cruel to all of them. True, Emma said it would have been easier if Neal had died, because then she wouldn’t have to face all of the pain they went through again. Emma is so afraid of losing Neal again that I can’t in any world imagine her actually losing him forever. That would be the end of her hope. To have Neal die “for real” this time would just leave Emma not dealing with her true feelings and burying them in the sand again. Neal really dying would be the easy way out for Emma and would bring her character development to a screeching halt! I think Neal will live, not just for the sake of his own happy ending, but also for the sakes of being a dad to Henry, a son to Rumple, and Emma’s happy ending. Just as Emma has touched the lives of all of those around her, so has Neal. Deep down, I think Emma still wants to have her Tallahassee with Neal, otherwise she would’t have told Neal in 2×21 how much it hurt to see he’d found Tallahassee with Tamara. Emma has never stopped dreaming of a home with Neal. And now she’s going home.

For now, I’ll repeat what Snow White told Emma in 3×6 when Emma was afraid to believe Neal could be alive:

Snow White: Emma, I get what you’re doing you know. You don’t want to open yourself up to the hope that he’s alive, but you should.
Emma: Why?
Snow White: Because you deserve a happy ending, and happy endings always start with hope.

#HopeforSwanFire

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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