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Oh, just another thought to add to the whole TLK thing….. would TLK even work in our ‘world without magic’? I mean obviously it worked in SB- SB was a magical town imposed on our magicless world, so I wonder- would ‘magic’ like that- magic that has to be ‘generated’ (not sure thats really the word I’m looking for) with-in, actually work outside of SB itself? I mean the price for bring magic to our world, was they lost their memories if they left SB, But it was pointed out to use more than once recently, that magic doesnt work outside of SB.
Yet, we know the Dragon gave people ‘magical’ potions- but we dont know if he actually ‘made’ them from some magical source brought to our world (like SB), if he ‘acquired’ them from another world & brought them here, or if he simply was able to ‘make’ magic here, as he was magical himself & was able to express it here (which we’ve been told he shouldnt have been able to by Rumple- like a million times)- so was he a one off, or was Rumple & Blue way off the mark calling this world ‘without magic’, because if magic can be used here (outside of SB), then this world isnt really ‘a word without magic’ but ‘a world with magicless people’ … wondering if this might be another plot hole :/
[adrotate group="5"][/quote]Snow’s quote. As both Snow & Mary Margaret, we saw her say that “happy endings aren’t always what we expect them to look like but it doesn’t mean we don’t get them” (paraphrasing, I need to find the actual quote).
100000000% this – I too keep saying it…. just because 1st loves together with kids, is what a HEA “should” look like, doesn’t mean it actually IS what a HEA really WILL be like.
Now about the ep …… SO MANY FEEEEEEEEEEELLLLLLLLLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I actually teared up & I cried- I honestly cried this time- it doesnt happen often, but Emma, Killian & Regina knocked it right out of the park this time- heartbreaking stuff!
Not gonna lie, have watched the last 13mins of this ep WAY more than I should lol 😉
Love the way Killian whispers “Emma” & she spins to look at him.
He sees she’s totally brokenhearted & trying to keep a hold of ‘keeping it together’, so tries to lift her up a little with a cheery compliment & a big smile “That’s quite the vessel you captain there, Swan” & she’s give a heartbreaking, bittersweet, little smile & breaths a tiny ‘ha’, appreciating his attempt (no, this bit is real- her response was genuine- I recently read some research articles on the subject, turns out it is quite well researched & has come in handy for this ep, when I put it on frame by frame {I didnt lie when I said I’d watched it WAY too much lol :p } the response she gave, is ‘actually’ genuine- so she nailed it, even if it wasn’t on purpose lol), then sniffs & looks at him with heartbreakingly sad, tearful eyes as she realizes this really is ‘good bye’.
Killian’s eyes get intense & full of love as he says “There’s not a day will go by, that I wont think of you” Emma’s face loses some of the brokenheartedness as she responds “Good”. To which Killian responds with a beautiful, heart warming, hope fulled smile, & Emma responds with her own little bittersweet, tenderly hopeful smile as they gaze into each others eyes …. can I just say it is AMAZING how many times in one ep A&E can kill you dead with CS feels- they break your heart, you die of feels, your heart starts bleeding again, they have you explode with hope, then they kill you dead, before they build you back up for some more death by feels lol
Can I also say, Killian is the only one whom she was able to attempt to smile for …. again, it is him who gives her her “happy” moments between the bad. *dies of feels*
Also the ‘triangle’ good byes were just so different, like STARKLY, contrasting in difference- The SF one was like friends saying good bye when going on a trip- Emma apologizing to Neal (close up of Emma’s face, which shows- sadness). Cut to group shot of Emma, Henry & Neal- side on, so no real emotional responses are shown. Cut to over the shoulder shot of Emma’s face/expression again as they hug (Emma looks sad again). Cut to over the shoulder shot of Neal’s face- smiling? (it occurs to me I could be reading him wrong- but thats what it looks like to me personally) at Henry, then cut to close up of Neal, being resigned… guarded… pretty sure he’s meant to be sad though???? (not gonna lie, I find it REALLY hard to pick his emotions/emotional expressions out- especially when we have so many fantastically talented core cast, who can say everything with a look & you just ‘know’ what they are feeling & thinking with out a word spoken), as he says “This isnt over, I’ll see both of you again”. Cut to side on group shot of Emma, Henry & Neal- Emma tightens her lips & nods once in response to his statement (I cant call it a declaration, because it just didnt have any feeling behind it)- but cant see their facial expressions/emotional responses again- there is just so little shown in the way of emotions- on either side here, which is why it is such a jarring contrast to the CS Good bye immediately following it:
This is like to lovers saying goodbye – Shot of sad Emma as she turns to Killian. Cut to extreme close up of Killian’s concerned, caring, then carefully cheery expression, as he tries to lift her spirits a little. Cut to over the should shot of Emma’s bittersweet response- zooming in as she follows that expression up with one of heartbreaking sadness, as she looks up into his eyes. Cut to close up of Killian’s intense loving/sad expression, as he says “There’s not a day will go by that I wont think of you”. Cut to extreme close up of Emma’s expression of sadness mingled hope (& dare I say belief & almost longing/want), as she responds “Good”. Cut to extreme close up of Killian’s hopeful, bittersweet expression & hope-fulled smile. Cut back to extreme close up of Emma still gazing into Killian’s eyes with an expression of sadness, hope & longing, as she give a little bittersweet smile. Cut to group main cast shot, show’s Killian & Emma still gazing into each others eye’s as Killian backs away, then turns away await his fate next to the Charming’s. SO MANY CLOSE UPS OF BOTH OF THEIR EMOTIONAL RESPONSES & EXPRESSIONS! These 2 good byes, were shot so differently & it’s not subtle what we are meant to come away from these scenes thinking! SO MANY FEELS!!!
I’ll also point out that Emma was pretty much done keeping it together after Killian said good bye & Regina called out to her expression when she says “What now” is so heartbroken & overwhelmed at the end of taking all this. At the end of the Regina giving her & Henry good memories, she glances at Killian & her parents, before Snow kisses her good bye & after they get in the car & we scan the expressions of those left behind, Killian, charming, Snow & Regina are the only faces/expressions focused on- again heartbreaking *sobs*
The amount of plant life in Emma’s & Henry’s apartment is very interesting- esp the type of plants chosen 😉
Can I just say LOVED Killian at Emma’s door- his face was so hopeful & lit up when he saw Emma (although I do wonder how he found her …..(*cough please be Tink showing him Emma is his TL/soul mate cough* Wishful thinking I know- but it could happen outside my dreams lol). I think it was Kat (sorry if it was someone else) who mentioned the similarity between Emma’s reaction after shutting Killian out & that of Emma’s reaction to Henry barging in & announcing who he was- she had a very similar expression on her face then & now- I do have to wonder if Killian’s kiss triggered ‘something’ maybe, or maybe she just felt he was being honest (as in he believed) in what he was saying- but was kinda crazy, either way he didnt scare her into calling the cops right then- I know I would have, I certainly wouldnt have left the door open long enough to chat some more, after having to kick some strange dude in his crown jewels, for randomly planting one on me’- the door would slam, the ph would be in use & the police called right then & there, so she was affected, be it his words about them being old friends, or her family being in danger, or the 1sec kiss – all I can definitively say is she seems to have been affected deeply, in a similar way that Henry affected her, back in the pilot.
Loved that we are proven right yet again, with Tink pushing the fact that Killian loves Emma, she may even be a bigger CS shipper than Regina is LOL 😉
Love the gifs & everyone thoughts- now for almost 3mths of Oncelessness :/
emmajones wrote:
will this help @rumplegoldfan ?I’ve known about the tattoo, but I’ve never noticed the tattoo with the watch specifically before. Time was a big deal with the clock not moving since time stood still until Emma decided to stay in SB so I wondered if there was a specific reason if one of the times we have seen the buttercup tattoo has been when we also see a big watch on her little wrist. Maybe they just put the watch there so we would notice the tattoo.
She doesnt have the watch anymore- they’d have taken it off her when she was arrested – I dont really recall her tattoo being ‘featured’ as such in the short time she had the watch on- because he gave it to her after she got back with them, kiss, he left, she got left standing waiting for him & we all know what happened next.
I do remember it being very visible during her S1 talks with MM on occasions.
@MysteryKat25 – love your new avatar, and loved everything you said about the triangle!!!! Very comprehensive
You took the thoughts right out of my head lol.sweetgrass wrote: I am not worried about PirateFairy. The marketing department may be gearing up for the made for DVD movie Pirate Fairy set to be released in march/April 2014. Hook is voiced by the actor who plays Loki. Sorry if someone else posted this.
I don’t remember reading this, but what’s this about????
It’s a cartoon/animation …. here’s some info ….
The Pirate Fairy is another in Disney’s line of Tinker Bell films and will apparently be the first where Neverland is shown. Hiddleston will play James while Hendricks is voicing a fairy named Zarina. ”James and Zarina are like best friends for a while. But you realize it’s all an act and he’s covering his ruthless and cunning nature,” said Hiddleston. “And his real name is Captain Hook. Captain James Hook.”
Hendricks said it’s been a life-long dream of hers to be in a Disney film and described her as“scrappy and inquisitive and smart and scientific and daring and really fun to play.” Holmes said Zarina is ”a tough, kick-ass pirate with some vulnerability.”
And since we did mention Hiddleston will have a song in the film we should probably also mention the audience encouraged him to sing a bit of “The Bare Necessities” on the spot as a preview. The Pirate Fairy is set for a Spring 2014 (presumably direct-to-video) release.
Hi guys, I’m new to this forum but I’ve been a lurker for a long time. As it seems, I am a HUGE CS shipper who wants them to be endgame. I’ve been in the CS tag on Tumblr for some time, and I wanted to discuss things with more people. It’s all very nice to want things for our ship (aka endgame), but I think sometimes we see too much into things and forget the larger picture. In my case, is to NOT only think about what’s happening in the present in the show, but also to see things in the long term. And things from the writer’s perspective. So… here it goes. As much as things are looking GREAT for our ship right now, I think we’ll be screwed in the long term (and DON’T quote me Hook’s long haul… more on that later). For me the basic hint for this is the typical “Wrong guy first” resolution to a love triangle on a series. SF in the past doesn’t count, as it’s not the present narrative. We follow the show in the present, so we should count that. This means Hook is the wrong guy and Neal is the true love guy (sigh). And no, for now I don’t feel that Neal will be the doom of this theory of mine, but Tink. NO, don’t tell me “bla bla she was so done with his flirting”. My reasoning for that are Rose’s recent interviews and also her recent tweets.
@euphoriapotion I hope so… @AdamHorowitzLA
— Rose McIver (@imrosemciver) December 13, 2013
@TigeyGirl I hope TInk gets a lovely relationship, must have been cold in Neverland in Winter.
— Rose McIver (@imrosemciver) December 13, 2013
So it’s pretty much confirmed that Tink will be in the second part of the season, and WILL get a love interest. Yes, she’s needed for the development of OutlawQueen, BUT. I don’t think they’d bring in her relationship with Hook in the past for nothing, for it not to be explored. Also don’t think we’ll be getting her flashback this Sunday. So although she said “That’s never gonna happen!”, I fear she might somehow fall in love with Hook in the future. Usually when a character says this, it means that it’ll work the other way around (much like Emma’s “one time thing”… still waiting for that second kiss!) We haven’t seen the moody Tink as well yet, she has been pretty much a “background” character. So… I have high suspicions they might use her to solve the CSF triangle. Some weeks ago, fellow shippers said “HA! Never gonna happen, she shot him down right away!!” but YOU CAN’T preview how things will be in the future. They could pretty much give all the CS goodies, and you could never know, towards the middle of the second part of the season, we could see the end of our ship
Much like the resolution to Jack/Kate/Sawyer/Juliet. I also don’t think that person will be Neal. They had almost no interaction at all until now, and I don’t think they’d tease her past connection with Hook only to have her end up with someone else – it seems to good to be true. It’s like trying to see Hookedqueen happen (almost no interaction at all… it’s easy to see the signs). Don’t know how it would work for Hook though. I don’t think he had any REAL feelings for Tink in the past (aka Ecco Cave revelation), but maybe something happens in the future where he realizes that maybe he wouldn’t be good enough for Emma, or something like that. And slowly, as Tink has been guarding her feelings for him (or maybe agressively pursuing him – that would be Tink), he’d start to realize that maybe he’d have a future with her. That solving Emma’s conflicted emotions, to ONLY after that, we start to see Emma fighting her emotions about Neal, only to end up in the end of the series with him (blabla family together). Since they reversed the roles of Pan and Hook here, they could have Tink with feelings for Hook instead of Pan in this series. And that would be convenient to work on the slow path of the reconstruction of SF. I TRULY HOPED I’D BE WRONG. But I see a big red herring in front of us. Everything looks great but that doesn’t mean it’ll be endgame in the end. Why would A&E refer to Hook “Hopes to see a future with Emma” in the beggining of the series? If it were true, it would be revealing the foreshadowed endgame too soon. Well… that was the post. Don’t want to rain on anyone’s parade… but I just don’t want to be led on as if I was a horse with a carrot. I think you point would be more than vaild- even likely IF you dont take current events into consideration alongside of the historic ones. Nor do I think any of us are thinking CS is going to be plain sailing- that would be far, far to easy! 😉
The one major floor I see in your logic of CS not happening as endgame, is ALL the CS frame work that has been laid down from S1… infact it started with the pilot!
Hook was supposed to be in S1, but they couldn’t work him in due to CR problems or something. So he was brought in in S2, he was to be HEAVILY featured in S2, but sadly for all of us, Colin broke his leg & couldnt do much in the way of filming. Now they could have set someone else up as a future interest for Emma, they could have deepened the whole Emma/Neal dynamic-oats they could have even deepened Neal’s character with Rumple or Henry, since they couldnt use Hook as planed- but they didnt, he just wasnt as important to the story arc they had wanted to show as Hook was- so we got more GOAT, more Regina & more Charming family stuff etc, Emma’s story outside of Henry pretty halted altogether when Hook disappeared & only started back up again on his return.
We’ve had ZERO Tink/Hook build up & I mean ZERO, every other couple has had a quick intro & with in a few short ep’s is ‘doing’ things with their future ‘romantic partner’ – this is the mthod A&E follow, it is true FOR EVERY SINGLE COUPLE ON ONCE!
Now we get to S3, Colin has healed & we can get the story arcs we were supposed to in S2, & then we get a bunch of eps showing us how much alike Hook is to our heros & how much we should like him- because he wasnt ‘really’ a villain as such, along with some other pay offs for hints dropped in S2 😉
There’s also the characters personalities to take into consideration- Hook doesn’t love lightly- nor does Emma, they cling to their love with their whole being- Killian has fallen for Emma & Emma is falling for Killian- that’s not something that can be turned off in 5-10eps 😉
Actually, for me personally- using your own logic, I can more easily see Tink & Bae/Neal being cast in a relationship, as Bae takes the place of Pan. Pan = Orphan boy, who thought his parents abandoned him, so didnt want to grow up & Bae- who thought his father didnt love him & gave him up, so he was an orphan too.You have to consider that Tink isnt the ‘same’ Tink from the stories either- she’s not quite as reversed as Pan & Hook, but she is jaded & magic-less, rather than vindictive, magic & in love ‘with the story’s hero’- she isnt in love with Pan, but I cant see her loving Hook ‘this story’s hero’ either- that only leaves her with the last NL tie in (using your logic) being the Pan stand in- Bae/Neal. If we go by facts, she didnt go out of her way to ‘help’ the NL 5- so I dont see her being in love with Hook at all, other wise she’d fall all over herself to help him (like she did with Regina)- they’re old acquaintances from what I can see. Then you have Tink being more than willing to help- keen even, when Neal/Bae shows up- so she does have ‘warm’ feelings for him. Then there is the very telling reunions – When Hook & Tink 1st meet again, there was no lovely big, warm smiles- so while they do have history, I cant see it being an overly likable one tbh, their meeting was less than ‘happy to see you again old friend’ Compared to the Tink & Bae/Neal meeting for the 1st time, where she & he both get lovely big smiles on their faces & share a long look- so they DO have a positive history (just not of the romantic kind I assume & we just havent seen it yet), so there is ALREADY ‘liking’ seeing each other now.
We’ve also been told that Tink can only feel one emotion at a time etc. So if she does have some feelings for Hook, she shouldnt be able to have them for Neal/Bae as well.
I’m not saying what say isnt possible at all, just that there is more to it than at 1st glance (for all we know Tink & Mulan could get together 😉 ) & personally I still see CS happening as end game- Rumple didnt ditch Belle & go back to Cora after all, so I’d rather follow the clues Adam & Eddy leave for us CS shippers & skip merrily down the CS path lol 😉
As doubtful as it is, if someone else came along, who Emma was better off/happier with than Killian & another charter that Killian was better off/Happier with than Emma came along, then I’d ship them with them- however Killian & Emma work, they complete each other completely- like Charming completes Snow, so I just cant see how they’ll top CS 🙂
A very good take on what the Winter Finale – 3.11 “Going Home” Link : Warning, May include SPOILERS: http://sdcitygal.tumblr.com/post/69868828255/thoughts-and-speculation-ouat-winter-finale Edit: for typo/ spoilers
I’m totally in love with this theory too!
I did have to laugh at this one though. Totally describes the ups and downs of shipper life. http://ashermajestywishes.tumblr.com/post/69810111447/basically-how-i-am-with-all-my-otps I’d say that’s….fairly accurate though they could have ended on a more positive note!
Haha, that is great!
Just quickly popping in before we go see the Hobbit, to link this awesome tumbler post I was linked to from FB (sorry if it’s been posted before- I dont have time to go back & check if it has already). Enjoy 🙂
http://mufflednoise.tumblr.com/post/68307832808/debunking-the-villainy-of-killian-hook-jones
Oh shocks, a lot to read after sleeping for 8 hours! Good job you guys! About the 2nd chance thing on Neal, I just thought that there’s a new character on her way, right?( The one who has long hair). In the Disney movie, her TL is a thief, and Neal is a thief… so…:)
Oh, good point- nice catch there!
Edited to add- Oh. Is she only meant to be 14? The actress looks much older in the pic I’ve seen going around- easily in her 20s, so I assumed, they’d cast her as such :/
Honestly at this point, I cant see ANY of them going into full blown romantic relationships- be it Neal or Emma, or even Killian (he’s the closest to it atm, but I dont think he 100% there yet- although he would give it a shot if Emma was willing), but it doesnt mean we cant have fun knowing someone ‘good’ is in the wings Or seeing how they support each other ‘as FRIENDS’ getting through all the emotional stuff that needs to be waded through.
I dont see a love interest for Neal, detracting from his arc with his father or Henry & Emma either- just like I dont see Killian as detracting from Emma’s story with her parents, Henry, being the savior- in fact adding Killian into Emma’s mix, is what has really helped to bring out Emma’s character more- we get to see more sides to her etc.
I think it could work in Neal’s characters favor to have someone like that.
On a related but slightly off topic note, I saw this on FB, analyzing why it is some people find it hard to ‘like’ Neal & I thought it was very well thought out.
Thoughts on Neal as villain vs hero.
I have given this some more thought. And I think the reason Neal doesn’t jive with a lot of people is because he’s supposed to be a hero character, but his actions often come across as villainous. I mean, think about it. How many times has someone said, “How are his actions as bad a Rumple or Regina?” And that’s exactly the problem. We shouldn’t be comparing him to the villains. We should be comparing him to the heroes. But he just doesn’t match up with them.
For example, he leaves Emma – the main hero of the story – which results in her landing in prison, drops her from a place where she had thought and believed she could open herself up to trust and love and puts her in a place where she emotionally closes herself to everyone and any opportunity she might have to trust and love again, and leaves her with a child she is not in a situation in life to care for even though it seems clear she would have rather kept him.
For some people, to make such transgressions against the main hero character, this casts Neal in a villainous role – even if these people might not actually consider or call him a villain.
Secondly, his words and actions come across as untrustworthy. The idea is that he loves Emma and regrets his decision to leave her. But unlike Charming and Snow – the main True Love hero couple of the show – he does not do all that he can to be with Emma. When the opportunity presents itself for him to reunite with her, he doesn’t go. And directly after being told he’s free to be with Emma, he meets another woman and becomes engaged to her. Again, these actions do not follow the True Love conquers all trend that we have seen in the hero stories.
So when he tells Emma “I will always fight for you” or “I always loved you,” his words fall flat or come across as untrustworthy because his actions do not follow the examples we have seen of what True Love is supposed to be. Even Rumple/Belle and Regina/Daniel are True Love villain stories that follow the same “do everything you can to be together” arc that the hero love stories have. But Neal’s love story doesn’t.
Another scene that people come back to is when he convinces Robin to use Roland to call the shadow. At first Robin refuses to help, not wanting to risk his four year old son. Neal only convinces him by telling Robin he owes him a favor because Rumple saved Marian’s life. This is an untrue statement. It was Belle who convinced Rumple not to kill Robin. And it was Robin who used the wand he stole from Rumple to heal Marian. Robin saved his wife’s life. Belle saved Robin’s life. If anything, Robin owes Belle. He owes Rumple – and by extension, Neal – nothing.
And here’s the thing. We have Robin – another hero character – point out Neal’s logic as wrong when he says, “So because I know what it is to value family, I should risk mine?” And even though we know Neal is wrong about who saved Marian’s life, Robin is an honorable enough of a character to feel like he owes someone something for the short amount of time he had with his wife.
This is supposed to be Neal’s hero moment, when he goes back to Neverland – the place of his nightmares and host to the most evil person he’s ever met and never wanted to meet again – to save Emma and Henry. But he does it by risking the well-being of a four year old and manipulating Robin into agreeing to it. It’s not Neal who comes across as the hero in this scene.
The question people ask is “Why do people hate Neal?” and I believe this is the answer: because for the people who don’t like him, he comes across as a villain, not the hero he’s supposed to be. There is no one specific action he has to do in order to atone or deserve Emma. He’s just needs to stop acting like the villain and become a hero.
