Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
I have a theory. Black Fairy is the REAL villain on s4. I just feel like it. Elsa will be what they market and focus on, until we find out something more sinister and actually evil is at play: The Black Fairy.
To elaborate more on this, recall when A&E said that before it was confirmed they could use Elsa, they had written that someone else rises out of the vase but wouldn’t reveal who? I think that person was the black fairy and could explain why the wand came back. If the seasons are half and half then, I do believe that if not the black fairy, Jafar will be a major threat. I just don’t think frozen will be that big a deal when something more….. Well, actually evil shows up
Ohhhh!!!!! I never thought that it could have been the Black Fairy originally to rise out of the vase! I;m now further convinced that it will be the Black Fairy for our main villainess in S4B!!!
[adrotate group="5"]"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
I’ll go first!
Young Regina Flashback
I have a strong feeling, we’re going to get another Young Regina Flashback. There is a missing piece to her story, between Regina crushing the Gypsy’s heart, and her all of a sudden, stop attending Rumplestilskin’s Magic lessons. Like what could have freaked Regina out enough to stop attending Rumple’s lessons. I believe that this involves Elsa.
Perhaps in a way, Rumple had assigned Regina to get close enough to Elsa, in order to gain her trust. Perhaps Elsa really did trust Rumple and Regina, and believed she finally found people like her who could help her with gift. But an incident happened where Elsa learned the truth of them possibly using her, and nearly lost control. But the thing is Regina saw a kindred spirit in Elsa, and the two had really become good friends. And this incident could have possibly been Elsa being sealed into that urn, which could haunt Regina into thinking that she helped her master seal her own best friend, thus making her decide not to have anything to do with Dark Magic.
And now that Elsa being released…it’s possible that this misunderstood girl is looking for her sister, but may have a bone to pick with Rumple and Regina.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
Okay…to put things into simpler terms.
Everything that happened after Regina kicked Tinkerbelle out, is where I’d begin the “Regina made her own choices”. When she slaughtered the village, bad move. When she so called tricked Hansel and Gretel, she did warn them, and they could have said no, could have been handled a little different. And the whole waging war against Snow White, I really don’t know because there were so many instances where she could have just killed Snow White or Charming and she didn’t….I think somewhere Regina liked the “Tom and Jerry” game she was playing with them. Every Evil thing Regina did after the Tinkerbelle Fiasco, I will admit that falls on her shoulders, but some of the responsibility doesn’t belong to her, it belongs to the people who morphed her. I’d say Regina got about 75% of that responsibility, but those who had a hand in creating the Evil Queen in the first place deserve at least 25%. A la Cora, Henry Sr., Rumple, and Snow White.
Now everything that happened before Regina kicked Tinkerbelle out, that was not of Regina’s COMPLETE decisions. Because as I said, had Cora been a better mother, none of this would have happened. Had Snow White kept her secret none of this would have happened. And had Rumplestilskin never encountered Regina on that road leaving King Leopold’s castle, none of this would have happened. So as far as responsibility goes, the outside forces deserve their 75% for pushing her in that direction, and Regina deserves 25% for actually giving up, and falling from grace.
Now…I’ve a feeling we’re going to get a Young Regina episode to fill in another blank. Like what happened between the point between Regina crushing that Gypsy’s heart, and her just stop attending Rumple’s lessons. I have a head cannon that involves Elsa, Regina, and Rumple, and whatever accident happened, I think it freaked Regina out of wanting to learn anything else.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
You aren’t called Evil Regals for nothing. You feel in love with Regina, the Evil Queen, the woman in all black who dared to walk into a wedding and curse everyone. We celebrate her snarkiness and her cunning but we can’t go so far as to white wash away her crimes in order to, subconsciously I think, make her into someone we should like. So many of us like the villains, but we are guilty (all of us! for every villain!) of trying to take away their villiany because then it’s more acceptable to like them. They become flawed anti-heroes, or victims of fate, or lonely broken misunderstood creatures. And while I will acknowledge that all of our “villains” are anti-heroes it doesn’t change the fact that there is an anti in front of the word hero.Now on this I definitely agree…not just the Evil Regals, but Dearies, Swans, Charmers, Snowflakes alike…when it’s concerning our favorites, I will admit, we will pull every excuse out of the book, and can make them seem like a saint or a victim of fate.No one wants to see their favorite placed on a pedestal, and sadly, it mainly comes down between Regina and Rumple in that sense. The Evil Regals blame Rumple for turning Regina into what she was, and the Dearies use the excuse of him just trying to find his son. But both characters are at fault at a certain percent of their wrong doing, but I just don’t want to see them take the 100% blame when some percent lie upon other characters and their choices.In the eyes of an Evil Regal, all of it boils down to Snow not being able to keep a secret. And upon her blurting out the NL secret about Neal, we threw the “She was a child” excuse out the window, because it’s just clear that Snow White cannot keep a secret to save her life. So in our eyes, we blame Snow White for the hell Regina went through, but confusingly at the same time grateful because it brought Henry and true family into Regina’s life.And I am thankful that Regina was the Hero of Season 3, but I much prefer her to be an Anti-Hero rather than a “Mary Sue” as @PriceofMagic would say. 😛 Because if it wasn’t for the Evil Queen in Regina, while they were in NL…I don’t think the Charmings would have made it. So the “Hero” Evil Queen in Regina must stick around!! 🙂"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
1. Regina warned the kids…a dire warning, Touch Nothing. That should have been enough…don’t touch anything. And again, she gave the kids a choice, she didn’t just hurl them through the doorway, and lock it
you have children. What happens when you tell them not to touch something. They do it. Why? Because that’s what children do. She gave them a choice but children of this age don’t have the mental faculties of you and I. Children learn by doing both what they are told and more often than not, by doing waht they are told not to do.
4. I came up with the Belle logic based on a what if, like what if Regina learned Rumple had tricked her about Daniel. Payback on Belle would return the favor, and in my eyes, Belle was an innocent caught in a crossfire. But we can’t neglect that Rumple did kick Belle out, and had she been really killed by bandits or wolves, things would not have been good. So I tend to look on the bright side, sure Regina locked her away, but at least she gave her a bed, food, and I would say clothing, but I’m not sure on that.
Interesting that the “bright side of things” just so happens to make your favorite character look like a hero not a captor…. Also, so much wild conjecture on what would have happened to Belle! The episode The Outsider clearly shows that the girl could take care of herself. Something Regina KNOWS given that she took Belle right after she defeated a monster terrorizing a village.
5. The second Regina said “That’s Enough. This ends now.” That was an attempt to stop all of the vengeance, and to let things go. Regina let go of her vengeance on Snow, and I think she expected Rumple to follow his own advice and to let go of his vengeance on Zelena. I truly believe the cycle for revenge would have ended.
I think she wanted that too. I’m not denying that Regina did a good thing and Rumple did a bad thing. But if two wrongs don’t make a right. If Regina were to now go against Rumple for the sake of Zelena, then she’s no better than Rumple killing Zelena for Neal (and yes, I acknowledge that Zelena is not wholly responsible for Neal’s death, but let’s stick with what is in people’s heads and motivations)
1. True…very true….
4. Funny how we can twist things to make it seem one way instead of what was originally implied. 😛 But Rumple kicking Belle out…that still stands. And really, Regina saved Belle’s life because less we forget, Hook was going to kill her. Though a chess piece, it was her wildcard in case she ever needed to use it. Which means she could have used it at any second in Cursed S1, but apparently Belle was a wildcard Regina was holding for dire dire dire dire dire times.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
Awww…I love you too @RumplesGirl! 😛
1. Regina warned the kids…a dire warning, Touch Nothing. That should have been enough…don’t touch anything. And again, she gave the kids a choice, she didn’t just hurl them through the doorway, and lock it.
2.I never said devotion only to Regina was correct, but if you and your family want to live, then hey, tell the Queen what she wants to know. Go based on whose wearing the crown, not running around.
3. Kingdoms, Kingdoms, Kingdoms, too darn confusing! This is why Storybrooke is a better option!
4. I came up with the Belle logic based on a what if, like what if Regina learned Rumple had tricked her about Daniel. Payback on Belle would return the favor, and in my eyes, Belle was an innocent caught in a crossfire. But we can’t neglect that Rumple did kick Belle out, and had she been really killed by bandits or wolves, things would not have been good. So I tend to look on the bright side, sure Regina locked her away, but at least she gave her a bed, food, and I would say clothing, but I’m not sure on that.
5. The second Regina said “That’s Enough. This ends now.” That was an attempt to stop all of the vengeance, and to let things go. Regina let go of her vengeance on Snow, and I think she expected Rumple to follow his own advice and to let go of his vengeance on Zelena. I truly believe the cycle for revenge would have ended.
6. There are only two ways this Elsa thing goes….either Rumple trapped her, or Elsa sacrificed herself. Following the original Frozen would go with the latter, but knowing Adam and Eddy….I dread Rumple trapped her.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
Hmm for my part WR I guess I just have to say I disagree with you alot on the Regina character. But we love her the same
Long Live the Queen ♥ Long Live The Queen 😛
All I’m saying is…yes! Regina was Evil! Yes…Regina made some questionable decisions! And Yes…she earned her title the Evil Queen! But from Season 4 and onwards that determines how she uses the Evil Queen, either as a villain as it was in S1 or a hero as it was in S3.
But at the end of the day, you must admit that it wasn’t entirely her own doing! And that’s the issue some Evil Regals have with Oncers, who don’t want to look at the fact that Regina was probably the one villain dealt the crappiest hand! Once again…not taking away the choices she made, or the responsibilities on her shoulders, but the fact remains that she was backed into a corner with no other way to react without losing, so she did whatever she had to do.
#EvilIsn’tBorn….It’sMade
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
Yet none of you still answered my question…where were her options?
In S1…Regina knew the threat to her curse, and the consequences should it ever be broken. You don’t just sit back and wait for your own downfall, especially when you discover that the man who built the curse has double crossed you, and leaving you to the wolves to take the fall for both you and his part.
In S2….the curse broke, and the Charmings did save Regina, but only cause of Henry. Had it not been for him, they’d have left her to die. And once again…Regina was redeeming herself! She actually didn’t have to help David get his family back, and keep Henry to herself, but she decided not to. And it was Rumpelstilskin who said, to heck with it, he didn’t care if Snow and Emma died…he just wanted to make sure Cora wouldn’t come back. So Regina did fix her momentary wrong by absorbing ALL of the thunder in that well, which seemed pretty painful, and rescued her former nemesis. Then you don’t even get invited to the celebratory of the people you saved! But when you get there, you’re ignored… Then you are accused of killing your own therapist by people who took the memories of a DOG before they checked your own. Later on, Rumple convinces Snow to kill Cora, and the Charmings plan to, well technically Kidnap Henry(because Regina still has legal custody of Henry) from Regina and take him to a land that he knows absolutely nothing about.
I’m not taking away her responsibilities, I’m just stating the facts that everything is not black and white about the situation. That everyone had a hand in Regina’s backslide, and even the formation of the Evil Queen. And heck I might as well say, and I apologize if it upsets some of you, but for being a unborn baby picked to be created into a monster by the darkest man in the realm….yeah…Regina was a victim.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
Alright…overload with response on page ten, so I’ll do the highlights.
1. First and Foremost! The Kids and Gingerbread Lady
Much like Rumple, Regina can offer a deal that many couldn’t refuse. The kids as you all say, have a choice. and thereby granting them the right to say no. Now Regina never killed children, not even in the massacre did I see a child, and further proof is when Regina let Hansel and Gretel go, and then later their father. Even after insulting her, she still let them go because she has a soft spot for kids. So the Kids Death isn’t Regina’s entire fault because they still had a right to say no.
2. The Ruler
As far as we’ve seen…the only people Regina has executed were those helping Snow White. And c’mon…even Regina said “You mean to tell me she’s lived here and not one of you saw her” and as tiny as that village was, someone saw Bandit Snow, but their devotion to Snow White led them to their deaths.
And as long as a kingdom is flourishing, the King or Queen is doing a good job. Long as you don’t associate with Snow, or outright disrespect her, you were safe from the Queen’s wrath. And there’s no proof of Regina killing a plain innocent in the streets just for walking. The people may have lived in fear, but they still had somewhat good lives….long as you don’t cross the Queen.
3. Belle
I think Regina locking away Belle was personal payback for Rumple, and I still don’t understand why the man who kicked Belle out got so upset. Like dude, you kicked her out, I just took her in. When he kicked Belle out, she was at the mercy of the Queen.
4. Hearts
No proof whatsoever that shows Regina took the hearts of her guards…it may just be possible that they’re loyal like that.
5. Rumple Vengence
This is exactly what Regina meant when she stopped Rumple from killing Zelena! The only person in the group who sees the cycle of vengeance, and she tried to stop it. And Regina did have a point when she said “who haven’t we killed to get what we want.” But Rumple, being Rumple…he has to have his vengeance and kills Zelena anyway. Regina has somewhat of a right for her vengeance because not only did she try to stop the cycle, but Rumple made it seem as if Zelena would rather die than have anything to do with them. That’s a bad blow to brush off, so in some aspect, Regina has a right to her vengeance. Not to mention this whole Marian thing wouldn’t have happened if Rumple had just “let it go.”
6. Elsa
It’s not being a villain when someone locked you up for years in an urn. It’s called payback.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
If Regina were to stumble again (a la Rumple killing Zelena) what would you think of that?
I’d be disappointed. I want to see her redeemed but this flip-flopping “I’m good now, but next week I’m bad” has to stop. That was Regina in season two and it was it infuriating. I don’t want to see her become corrupted again and her heart darkens. I think she’s made great strides as a character, selflessly trying to be good without asking for anything from anyone. I understand the ‘wildcard theory’ too but it seems that Adam and Eddie have enough villains coming on per 11 episodes that they don’t need Regina to be the villain every season. I think ultimately, I want the writers to decide what they want to do with Regina’s character: do they want her redeemed, or evil, or a little of both?
But see the hard thing about all of this is…most of Regina’s back and forth stems from mistakes on the Charming’s end.
Think about it…
Regina was evil in S1, the most bad(beep) villainess ever! But it all stemmed from that one single moment where Snow White tells her secret. Had Snow kept the secret, and sure Cora was a master manipulator, but still…anyone above the age of 8 should be able to keep a secret. Heck, I’m still keeping my friend’s secret from when we were in the fourth grade, so Snow White knew what a secret was…it’s just she could never keep quiet about anything. And that is proven when she blurted out the Neal being alive secret in NL….#SecretSnow will never stay a secret.
In EF, being married to man thrice your age, while raising the child who ratted you out…where was the option? Before that, running away from a marriage, and risk being poor, homeless, and lonely for the rest of your days, but a “kind” Wizard offers to teach you magic, but all you have to do is stay. Where was the option? The only “Good” option Regina had was the Tavern and Robin, but Rumple scared the heck out of her with the “anger is all you’ll have” and “fate is sealed to be dark”.
Then we move onto S2, Regina was doing good for Henry, on her best behavior! Heck she had even started to bond a little with her son-in-law! Yet right when Regina saves their lives, Snow and Emma come back…Regina not only is neglected from the party by her own son, and family. Thank God Emma had the decency to invite Regina, and at least try to make her feel comfortable, even though she was being ignored. Then we’re onto the Cricket Game where the Charmings take the memories of a dog rather than Regina’s memories…and not only tried to trap her, but accuse her of killing Archie. That was definitely a set back, and it was too late to apologize as Cora found Regina first, and Regina craving love the way she does, gives in and decides to help her mother. Then mother dies, and Regina learns the Charmings are planning to take her son away, and abandon her in SB.
Finally we get to S3, where Regina is hero at last. Fighting like hell in NL to save her son, and fighting like hell to stop her sister. All is good, and all is well till the moment Rumple kills Zelena, opens time portal, Emma brings back Marian, and poof! Happily ever after snatched in one night.
Now I’m not taking away Regina’s hand in her choices, but given the circumstances she was dealt with…what else was she supposed to do? S1, let Emma break the curse, take her son, and let SB kill her? S2, suffer under SB scrutiny and deal with the Charmings not trusting her, and being the loneliest/hated girl in town. Where were her options? She did what she did best, fight for her happy ending. I’m sorry…I just didn’t see what options Regina really had, because it appeared that if she hadn’t fought for her happy ending, she’d be miserable for the rest of her days.
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
