4 x 01 TALE OF TWO SISTERS — FAVORITE AND LEAST FAVORITE MOMENTS

As for Rumple…well, that’s Rumple for you. He had good intentions – he just didn’t follow through. He was too ashamed to tell Belle what he did and too cowardly to face her anger or hurt- that’s why he froze her . I’m not saying what he did was right. He still has a ways to go. Like Robert always says, he is an addict. He is a very flawed character, just like Regina is.

I 100% get that. However, it’s s4. He’s been back and forth: villain, hero, antihero, villain, hero, lair, manipulator, sacrifice. It’s wonky character development because there is none. It’s 1/2 step forward, 3 steps back and it’s because A and E don’t know how to push him toward the light (or at least something that’s lighter than what he is) because evil/villainy is sexier. Look at what Regina’s doing: self-declared hero last season, trying to manipulate fate for her happy ending this season.

Trust me. I get what a complicated character he is. I’ve spent the past 3 years passionately defending him. But this is too far. Anyone who spent 4 seconds with Neal would know that never in a million years would he wish someone dead and murdered. Rumple did it for selfish reasons. He’s lying, AGAIN, for selfish reasons. That whole speech at the graveyard was selfish; it wasn’t about Nealfire, it was about Rumple.

And Rumple’s making Belle look like a moron. She is either, at best, totally blind to what he did and has done in the past with her “you never give up on people”, or she’s intentionally ignoring it which is a whole other level of problematic.

But I just can’t get myself to jump ship and give up on them. They are Beauty and the Beast, and I still want a happy ending for them. I just hope they find a way of doing it that doesn’t involve Belle looking stupid because that would make me very sad.

Well to be fair to myself here…I haven’t jumped ship nor given up on them. Hello, profile picture.

But I am very disillusioned with how they are treating Rumbelle. Rumple confessing, pleading for help because he’s an addict, Belle being angry at him, but helping him…that’s watchable TV.

I think them never sliding back at all would be unrealistic. I think it shows character growth that he at least attempted to give Belle the real dagger, even if it was under shady circumstance. And Regina has definitely changed! She decided not to go back and murder Marian because she saw herself as she was and didn’t like it- that’s huge for her!

Bullet point style

1) Never said they wouldn’t slide back. But there’s sliding back, and then there’s throwing the baby out with the bath water. Rumple committing murder knowing full well it’s the last thing Neal would ever want? Baby. Bathwater. Bye bye.

2) Never said Regina hasn’t changed. Like I said: hero last season. Back tracking this one. But I disagree with your assessment re: Marian. Regina is trying to get HER happy ending, but that ruins Marian’s (this is also why I have a huge problem with Emma’s promise to Regina through the door–realistically, Emma should have said, “I’ll make sure you’ll get a happy ending because you’re a core character and a regular star. The heck with this innocent guest star chick). @PriceofMagic brought this up in another thread: Emma’s promise was really unrealistic. It’s impossible to give Regina a happy ending and not ruin someone else at the same time. And that morality of that is…problematic, though I grant it’s because “main character”

At least she backed out of outright killing Marian so I still say it’s a step in the right direction, if a small one

Morally speaking, you don’t get a cookie every time you don’t kill a person. It should be a given, not something you reward. We don’t applaud Snow every time she walks by someone on the street and doesn’t incinerate them. Regina shouldn’t even consider letting someone die. So the “well she came back and blasted Marshmallow!” for me is faulty: she shouldn’t have had to come back in the first place.

And I agree with something @Myril and @Schandalich said: Marian laying on the ground, pleading for help from the “villain” whereas the “hero” characters just run around doing nothing…ye gods. I know it’s been Once Upon a Villain since S2, but the heroes do almost nothing anymore. And that speaks to an overall problem of the writing of the show: the villains are the most popular so they get to do ALL THE THINGS. And have ALL THE CONNECTIONS. S2? Cora and Regina. S3A? Rumple and Pan. S3B? Regina and Zelena. We have to wait a few more episodes for the real stuff of S4 to take off. But let me put it this way: since WHEN is a fireball more effective than the power of true love? I don’t care how “new” Emma is at magic. She’s True Love Incarnate. She is true love in a fleshy shell. She’s the savior. Her power is supposed to be that which can transcend realms and break any curse not to mention open time portals.

And yet…who took down Pan, Zelana, and Marshamallow?

Why everyone is hating on Robin so much…he’s between a rock and a hard place- what do you think he should have done? Not said anything to Regina at all? Dumped his wife? Really? I don’t think either of those sound any better. He is trying his best to be honorable. He can’t just ignore the situation- it involves him. We’ll see where it goes from here.

I think Robin should’ve chosen Marian over Regina since the only reason he and Marian weren’t together was because of Regina. However, it’s the way in which he ended things with Regina that’s the problem. Rather than ending it once and for all, he gave Regina hope that they could still be together. He made it seem like the only reason they weren’t together was because of Marian being there and that he was only choosing Marian because he made a vow, hence Regina thinking getting rid of Marian would solve the problem. If Robin wants to be with Marian, he should be with her. If he wants to be with Regina, he should be with her. What he shouldn’t do is tell one woman he loves her whilst choosing to be with the other.

I didn’t see Rumple’s speech as justifying his actions but rather a promise to his son to make things right. Rumple knows what he did was wrong. He feels bad- that’s why he went to the grave making a vow to fix it. Or at least, that’s how I interpreted it. Obviously, many of you disagree.

I think it was inevitable that Rumple was going to kill Zelena because of Bae’s death. I agree that Rumple’s speech was him promising to do things right from then on even if it was a little exposition heavy.

As for freezing the lock, it’s my understanding that if things become cold enough, they can become brittle and break.

Considering Elsa didn’t damage the door in any way, using ice like she did should’ve frozen the lock in a locked position and made the door be jammed shut. Had she used her ice to explode the lock then it would’ve opened.

I do agree that Belle and Rumple breaking into a mansion was rather odd- especially for Belle of all people to suggest it!

The idea that Belle went on early morning hikes when she wears nothing but heels and Rumple was enslaved to Zelena is what is odd about it. We’ve never seen Belle even mention hiking so for Belle to apparently have been on enough hikes to see the house is abandoned was very plot convenient.

Regina would’ve murdered Zelena if Henry had been the one killed.