Home › Forums › Once Upon a Time › Season Four › 4×07 “The Snow Queen” › 407: Sneak Peeks (1 and 2)
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November 6, 2014 at 10:02 pm #289319WickedRegalParticipant
To be fair in Robin’s Character…can we look at it from his point of view please? This man wife died 30 Years ago, he’s been a single father for about three to four years….he’s a very different man than when Marian last saw him. Even in the 30 years, I know some of you will pull the time was frozen thing, but the curse was broken for 2 of those 30 years, and Marian was dead at least two years before the Dark Curse was cast, so even still…it’s four years without Marian, long enough period for that love, which didn’t seem that far…I’d say Robin and Marian were married a year before Roland was born, evidence is the page in Regina’s book that looks like Robin marrying Marian only few years before the curse. Might I also add…that we still have no flashback, so the possibility of Marian leaving her ex boyfriend the Sherriff for Robin can still come up.
The point is…Robin Hood has changed! He mourned, and moved on…it happens folks! He fell in love with Regina, all his heart belongs to Regina and Roland basically now…well, Marian may have a small percentage of his heart ONLY due to the fact she’s the mother of his child. So…yeah, it’s very believable why Robin can’t just up and fall back in love with Marian, he mourned the woman! He came to terms with her passing! It was over and done with! But Emma Swan tampering with fate, brought her back which disrupted Soul Mates In Love.
Many complain OutlawQueen was rushed, while I do agree it could’ve been expanded…they were soul mates with an instant connection, love at first sight! OutlawQueen was a romance that was long overdue it’s time. And trust me…Adam and Eddy don’t want to set off the OutlawQueen/EvilRegal/Hoodie fan base, so Robin was the man with the Lion Tattoo. 🙂
Another thing…how can Outlaw Queen receive so much disdain when some of these other ships didn’t have the merriest, or wonderful background buildup either? Rumple originally locked Belle up as his slave for months before he fell in love with her. Snow White stole from Charming in the EF, and while in Cursed Storybrooke, she knowingly had an affair with David Nolan. Neal and Emma were both thieves in love. Killian was in love with Emma’s baby daddy’s mother, and centuries later fell in love with Emma. All OutlawQueen did was Regina killed Marian, who FYI could’ve gotten out of it had she snitched on Snow White, and then Regina has made up for it by saving Marian’s life more times than I can count!  So….what’s the issue?
[adrotate group="5"]"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
November 6, 2014 at 10:08 pm #289321CindersParticipantI actually thought a few weeks ago that they were doing some this on purpose, to us the viewers.
We started to dislike Regina for acting so childish, but we used to love her for that. We started to dislike Rumple for being conniving, but we used to love him because he was so deceitful. We began to dislike Robin for his need to be near Regina, but that’s what we were all begging for. I heard many complaining that Snow was too motherly but she’s always been that way.
I started to wonder if we were purposely being shown our favorite characters through shattered glass.
November 7, 2014 at 3:31 am #289336PheeParticipantThe point is…Robin Hood has changed! He mourned, and moved on…it happens folks! He fell in love with Regina, all his heart belongs to Regina and Roland basically now…well, Marian may have a small percentage of his heart ONLY due to the fact she’s the mother of his child.
It’s all well and good if he mourned Marian and moved on, that happens. But if he cares so much about his son getting his mother back, why isn’t he making more of an effort to try and save her now? He can see that it PAINS Regina to be around him…so he’s gonna go visit her in a private place she retreats to and keep saying, “But I HEART YOU.” The way he’s carrying on is making this whole thing so much harder for Regina, and he seems clueless about that. Like, dude, step off, give the woman you care about some space because it hurts her to even see you right now, and at least attempt to find enough love for your wife to be able to save her life if only for the sake of your son.
All OutlawQueen did was Regina killed Marian, who FYI could’ve gotten out of it had she snitched on Snow White,
ALL Regina did was kill Robin’s wife. That’s ALL, so no biggie? And implying that Marian deserved to die for trying to protect a good person like Snow is outrageous victim blaming.
November 7, 2014 at 10:01 am #289357WickedRegalParticipantAll OutlawQueen did was Regina killed Marian, who FYI could’ve gotten out of it had she snitched on Snow White,
ALL Regina did was kill Robin’s wife. That’s ALL, so no biggie? And implying that Marian deserved to die for trying to protect a good person like Snow is outrageous victim blaming.
I’m just looking at all the options Marian had…not implying that she deserved to die, but heck, she had a way out! It’s really not realistic seeing a mother/wife choosing to die, thus leaving her son motherless and her husband a widow, instead of just selling out whoever their captor wanted. Everyone knew the price of aiding Snow White, and the mere fact Marian was even offered a chance to snitch instead of instant death, is more than what probably some of the other people got.
Though I do agree @Phee that Robin should take about a week to leave Regina alone, just to sort through his feelings, and to allow her to heal a bit. Though I’m quite sure we’ll get the same results in the end…when Fate is trying to pull you together, there’s no stopping it.
And as I said…Regina has made up for killing Marian, over and over again! So the whole she killed her in the past thing just ain’t working as well as it used to….that’s like paying someone back money that you owe them, but they keep bringing it up. Yes, Regina killed Marian in the past(though she did have a choice), but Regina’s saved her life twice now, and is even willing to sacrifice her own happy ending to unite the woman with Regina’s only Soul Mate! So again I ask…what’s the issue?
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
November 7, 2014 at 10:12 am #289360KebParticipantRegina gleefully sentenced Marian, a perfect stranger, to death, because Marian chose to be a hero rather than a traitor to her princess and her kingdom.
Also, WR, you mention that death is stalking Marian a few times, but is that true? Maybe it’s just the opposite–the lady just won’t die!
So far she’s been saved by RH, Belle (who made it possible for RH to use the wand and save her life), Emma, and Regina (as you keep pointing out). Maybe fate doesn’t actually want her dead, and her role in fate’s plan is to make heroes out of those who meet or are inspired by her! Wouldn’t it be neat if Regina’s transformation to heroism was inspired by such a brave woman?
You know, if we’re going to look at it from different perspectives, after all.
Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
November 7, 2014 at 10:31 am #289364WickedRegalParticipantRegina gleefully sentenced Marian, a perfect stranger, to death, because Marian chose to be a hero rather than a traitor to her princess and her kingdom. Also, WR, you mention that death is stalking Marian a few times, but is that true? Maybe it’s just the opposite–the lady just won’t die! So far she’s been saved by RH, Belle (who made it possible for RH to use the wand and save her life), Emma, and Regina (as you keep pointing out). Maybe fate doesn’t actually want her dead, and her role in fate’s plan is to make heroes out of those who meet or are inspired by her! Wouldn’t it be neat if Regina’s transformation to heroism was inspired by such a brave woman? You know, if we’re going to look at it from different perspectives, after all.
And Marian willingly let herself die rather than think of her own family….in real life, a woman’s family comes first. I don’t know what type of trust and hope Marian had in Snow White, but it must have been something else.
Marian is invincible….NOTHING KILLS THIS WOMAN! And considering the fact that she did die in the original timeline…it was her fate to die, but everyone keeps stopping it. I’ve got a feeling Hades himself is going to rise up, and take her back to the Underworld…there’s the Season 5 right there!
I mean….if we’re bringing back dead exes to screw with the course of true love…let’s just bring back ALL the dead exes! Let’s bring back Millah, Cora, Zelena, and Neal….let’s see how well the Once fandom takes it! 🙂
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
November 7, 2014 at 10:41 am #289365KebParticipantHeck, I’d love to see them go to the underworld mostly because I want Rumple & Belle to go there, Rumple to face off Death with a game, and win Nealfire back.
BUT.
Sometimes people DO do the right thing even if it puts their family at risk. Sometimes people just can’t believe that, say, the Evil Queen is so evil she’d actually kill an entire village or an innocent woman with a young child just because she wants to get revenge on an equally innocent princess, because they could never see themselves being so evil. (I think that’s part of why Belle can’t help seeing Rumple in a better light–the utter darkness to which he’s succumbed on occasion is just beyond her comprehension, when the smallest failure to be a hero on her own part is soul-shattering to deal with.)
There are, in fact, countless examples in history of people choosing to die for a cause in the hope that their choice might make a difference, and even more examples of people willing to go to prison or otherwise suffer to try to change a horrible state. Marian was living under an evil, murderous queen who cared more about her revenge than about her people (though I will grant that she was good at knowing the names of her staff…you know, before she snapped their necks for the slightest failure). Snow White became a symbol of hope and a chance to change things–she had the right to claim the throne, and as her escapes and thievery against the crown mounted, she showed that she had the strength to fight back (even when she wasn’t ready to yet).
Marian’s decision wasn’t a choice to abandon her son (though it had that effect). It was a choice to try to make a better world for her son by keeping her people’s hope alive in the face of utter evil.
Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
November 7, 2014 at 10:50 am #289366WickedRegalParticipantMarian’s decision wasn’t a choice to abandon her son (though it had that effect). It was a choice to try to make a better world for her son by keeping her people’s hope alive in the face of utter evil.
Yet, as touching as that sounds…it still left her son motherless, and Robin a widow. I understand her want to save Snow White, but I don’t understand her choice in doing so. It was Snow or her….Marian had a lot more to lose. I mean, heck, she had a better chance at lying to Regina about Snow’s whereabouts, a town miles away from where she was! She didn’t even have to tell the truth, but she could at least try to lie before she automatically just sacrificed her life for Snow!
"If you go as far as you can see...you will then see enough to go even further." - Finn Balor
November 7, 2014 at 11:10 am #289367PanTheManParticipantI’d like to add my (a male) point of view to this discussion.
Robin Hood is between a rock and a hard place right now, due to magic disrupting his life. What I like about Once is the way they use magic to place the characters in a morally gray area. It becomes hard to know what’s right and what’s wrong.
Robin Hood was faithful to his wife. She died. He mourned. He found love again with Regina. His dead wife comes back to life through the magic of time travel. Ok…
So far he’s done nothing wrong. At this point, he is an honorable man and a source of good in Regina’s life. Without a doubt, Regina has become a better person because of Robin. Even in the current situation, Regina is trying to do the right thing because she believes in Robin’s code, and she wants to be worthy of the love they share – even if it means losing him. Robin is also prepared to lose Regina, or else he wouldn’t have gone back to Marian, but losing Regina is easier said than done.
After falling in love with Regina, Robin Hood returned to his wife. He’s honoring his code. HE’S DONE NOTHING WRONG! Being honest with Regina about his feelings for her doesn’t make Robin Hood a bad person or unfaithful. There isn’t a switch in the brain that allows him to just turn off his love for Regina. He obviously still loves and cherishes his wife, or he wouldn’t have gone back to her.
At times, I feel like people’s views on marriage determines the way they side with characters on the show, but other than snow and charming, there hasn’t been many respectable marriages in Once. Regina was basically forced by her mother to marry King Leopold, so it never bothered me than Tink tried to set her up with Robin Hood. Tink’s matchmaking could’ve saved a lot of lives by providing a better path for Regina. For the fans that have a beef with David and Mary Margret’s affair in season 1, HELLO! They were cursed. And technically, David married Snow first in the enchanted forest, so as far as i’m concerned, their affair was true love at it’s finest – though complicated and morally gray.
In my opinion, Robin Hood lying about his feelings for Regina would be worse than telling her that he still has feelings (the truth). Don’t put a guy down for being honest. Nobody lied to Marian about what was going on with Robin and Regina. She knew the truth, realizing that it was a tricky situation. What really made me hurt for Regina when Marian came back was that Robin didn’t hesitate to go back to Marian. It was the right thing to do, however, to have the characters pretend (or lie to themselves) by denying that those feelings exist, would be the bigger sin.
If Robin and Regina were making out in the room with Marian the Popsicle, I could see why people would be disappointed in Robin. All Robin has done so far is been honest about his feelings for Regina, which developed at a time when he was free to pursue a love interest. It’s not his fault that his true loves kiss won’t work on Marian.
For Robin to do the right thing in this situation, whatever the right thing is, he has to be able to communicate about his feelings.
November 7, 2014 at 11:30 am #289368KebParticipantI definitely think that one’s views of marriage influence how you feel about OQ. Would like to state, though, for the record, that while Cora forced Regina to become engaged to Leopole, Regina sent Cora to Wonderland BEFORE the wedding and had the chance to leave. Rumplestiltskin stopped her and offered to continue teaching her magic (in his usual conniving and manipulative way) and, for some inexplicable reason, perhaps that without Daniel she had nowhere else to go and she had some hope that magic could revive him, she went back and went through with the wedding.
She was forced to get engaged to the king. Cora was not there (and I don’t think Rumple really cared one way or the other about her being queen) to force her to marry him. She chose that, however bleak her other choices might have been.
David and MM’s affair was less squicky for me because we, the audience, knew they were already married. The fact that both slept with someone else due to the curse was more morally iffy, but there we can say that Regina was compelling them in that direction (minimal free will, and she was actively manipulating the situation at the time). Also, we learned that Kathryn was no more a willing participant in the charade than David was–and her own true love was alive, well, and sans curse would have been with her.
Robin IS in a thorny situation, and it’s fair to say that someone who accepted his wife’s death 4 years ago and moved on isn’t likely to love her suddenly returned person with the same ardor he would have the day after she was (supposedly, since the timeline shifted when Emma saved her) killed. To declare he has no love left for her is clearly wrong, though. I don’t think he’d have even tried TLK (pressure notwithstanding) if he hadn’t believed there was a chance for it to work.
But for Marian, it IS almost literally the day after she was supposedly killed. And Robin, who once truly loved her and was willing to sacrifice himself to the Dark One just to help her, recognizes this and cares enough about her and their son to try to make it work…and then goes and digs this hole that just makes him look awful because he’s hurting both the women he loves.
For me, marriage is a sacred thing…so ending it lightly, most especially when kids are involved, doesn’t fly with me. Having Robin or Marian leave the marriage just because of Tink’s little prophecy would be awful. Having Marian die to make OQ work would be worse, regardless of how it happens. I just can’t see OQ working in a way that I would feel good about at this point.
But I think that Regina can emerge from this heartbreak a stronger, more heroic person. And just because RH is or was her soulmate doesn’t mean that he’s the ONLY true love she could have. He’s already the second man she’s truly loved, so that right there says that there is more than once chance for her. Maybe Little John?
Keeper of Belle's Gold magic, sand dollar, cloaks, purple FTL outfit, spell scroll, library key, copy of Romeo and Juliet, and cry-muffling pillow, Rumple's doll, overcoat, and strength, and The Timeline. My spreadsheet: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6r8CySCCWd9R0RUNm4xR3RhMEU/view?usp=sharing
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