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Writing this without looking at the other replies.
Not sure how I feel about this one either. It was another almighty mess because of
-The dropped storyline of Arthur wanting to take over SB and make it into his own personal Camelot. (Perhaps he will do this while our Heros are in the Underworld? Then we now have Hades and possibly Rumple as the antagonists, so would A&E add Arthur to the list?).
-The unecessary information about Hook killing his father etc-it added some amount of emotional depth, but I think that it would have been enough for Emma, the woman he is supposed to love, to be able to convince him to be a better man. (I was irritated that it took our queen to do it). As I had suspected a few days ago, it added nothing to the plot. It was as if they justed wanted to shoe horn in the EQ to keep the character’s fans happy. Well, I wasn’t.
-Lack of answers as to why it was darkness that came out of Merlin (when Emma used excalibur to revive Hook) when he was only supposed to be light.
-Lack of answers as to why not knowing you are the DO would not give you any of the symptoms.
-The EQ walking into a tavern (that looked remarkably the same tavern set for all 5 seasons), and no one paying attention. They didn’t bow down or anything….I would have thought they would be all too scard of her not to!
-The scene of young Killian and his father on the boat….couldn’t they have just put a large doll in one of the beds and called it Liam? It was weird to see his father only pay attention to him.
-Emma was too easily fooled by Hook-as-Henry. It was too obvious that it was Hook as no one came through the door, and Henry was standing in the wrong place to have come through a back door.
-It didn’t make sense for Zelena to plonk herself down in the Mayor’s office and tell Robina all about her changing her mind. At that point, the character thought that Robina were going to die and all she had to do was wait that out. (I did like the comment about the old ball-or something like that).
-Oh so Regina couldn’t work the wand because she didn’t believe in herself? Not because she wasn’t dark enough? Come on! The rules of using this wand are what, again? And how convenient that her believing in herself was a suddenly a requirement to use the wand successfully. And how did she come to the conclusion that the town had come to believe in her as a hero? She has actually done very little!
-where the heck was Zelena’s baby when all this was going on and who the heck will take care of her while Robin and Regina are in the Underworld. And Roland too??? Wouldn’t want to give either to Rumple and Belle!
But yeah.
Hook sacrificing himself and everyone going to the Underworld to retrieve him-called it, as did many others, I assume. I was wrong about the point at which he decided to sacrifice himself,though. He really did despise Emma for a time! Which I really don’t get.
[adrotate group="5"]Keeper of Regina's bravery
Favorites
-Everything Zelena, except the suddenness of her departure
-Regina: “So I hear we’re giving up?” (This was overheard in the writers’ room and picked up as an actual line. :P)
-Rumple’s selflessness in sparing Belle’s feelings by sending her away
-Belle’s return
-Emma back to being Emma
-Performances of our favorites, despite the material they were working withLeast favorites
-Everything else, including:
-Lack of established character motivations
-Lack of established plot mechanics enabling what was done via magic
-Ruination of the few things I liked with un-foreshadowed twists at the end
-Gutted result of all-season tension building, as I’d predicted
-The ghost town that is Storybrooke … some extras might add a little something to the production and the stakes
-Apparent all-dogs-go-to-hell worldview, robbing all people everywhere of all hope
-Charmings giving up
-Plot resets
-GOING TO THE UNDERWORLD
-“” TO BRING BACK THE DEADConsidering that almost everything in this ep falls somewhere on a scale from “nonsense” to “offensive” and all points in between…I’m not even really sure where to start listing all the things wrong with it. *sigh*
(This was overheard in the writers’ room and picked up as an actual line. :P)
Oh we could make a list of these! How about, “I wasn’t trying to replace him, I was trying to honour him,” in response to outrage over a BABY NAME STEALER because, “Was he really that easy to replace?” I’m not sure whether to laugh or cry that it was Hook who was the outraged one.
*skips off to flip some tables*
Liked:
Regina trying to make Hook see sense and Hook calling Regina out for her past misdeeds- It’s about time someone recognised the fact that Regina WAS the evil queen for quite a while. I like the fact that Regina also recognises the fact from experience that being consumed by revenge isn’t good. HookedQueen would make so much more sense than CaptainSwan.
Rumple lying to Belle in order to save her- it works two-fold. 1. He doesn’t want her to know what is about to happen to him, he wants her to be happy. 2. He knows that if she found out, she would try to save him and he doesn’t want to put her at risk. Rumple is sacrificing the last few hours he has to spend with the woman he loves in order to save her.
Zelena looking at colour charts to redecorate Regina’s office- Zelena has been one of the highlights of 5A. If the writers hadn’t made her so unlikeable in 3B and season 4, she would easily be one of the top 10 characters on the show.
Hook’s sacrifice- Emma stabbing Hook accompanied by the music was well done. Plus we got to see Emma in her red jacket again.
The RumBelle reunion- RumBelle happiness is so rare because inevitably it doesn’t last longer than a few minutes.
Mixed:
Zelena- Whilst Zelena can be amusing “I’ve decided to grant myself sole custody”, revealing her grand plan to OQ about how she was going to raise her daughter to become “wicked” was idiotic.
Regina in the EQ flashback- Whilst seeing the EQ is always good, if only to see how far Regina has come, the flirty posturing and touching was a bit much especially when it makes no sense whatsoever. How did Regina even know that some random barman was Hook’s father.
Snow giving up hope- on the one hand, it does make sense that Snow wants to spend time with her family instead of with her nose in a book. However, Snow claims she hasn’t given up hope (that they can save themselves) so what was she planning to do if not actively try to find a way to save themselves? Just sit around and hope for the best?
Regina said they’d be people in the underworld unhappy to see her and Rumple- Has Regina forgotten the scene in this very episode when Rumple said he’d already been to the underworld? He already knows that.
Emma’s upset over Hook’s death- Whilst it was well acted, it’s somewhat spoiled by the fact that Emma made less of a fuss when Neal died who she admitted herself in Neverland that she’d never stopped loving. That was a love she carried for 12 years yet didn’t bat an eye over his death. She’s loved Hook for a few months yet it’s the end of the world when he dies and she’ just has to get him back.
Disliked:
Hook’s sob back story- We’re supposed to believe that Hook’s father’s abandonment of him and his brother is supposed to be a bad thing, yet we saw later that Hook and his brother became high ranking officers in the navy and were quite happy. I’m failing to see the cause and effect here.
Snow’s pandering of Hook- “It’s not his fault, he didn’t want to become the dark one” It annoys me how the characters are so willing to overlook Hook’s bad deeds yet Rumple gets held responsible for even the slightest thing. It’s hypocritical. Either both men are pardoned for their actions as the dark one or both are held accountable.
Snow’s self-centredness come to the forefront again- At one point in time, Snow gave up her daughter to save the kingdom from Regina’ curse. Now, as far as Snow is concerned, the kingdom can rot in hell so long as she and her family are okay. Hook is a danger to the town therefore, and Emma knows this, he must be stopped by any means necessary no matter how hard it is. Snow’s answer “this is the man you loved!” I don’t know why Snow is so pro-Hook but S1 Snow would’ve done what’s best for the town, not risk it all because “love”. Snow is self-centred, something S1 Snow was not. If there was a trophy for character who suffered the most character assassination over the course of the series, Snow and Rumple would be serious contenders.
Robin not firing his arrow- There’s two dark ones advancing on you, Zelena has just said you’ll soon be dead, logic dictates that you fire the arrow and get out of there as far as your legs can carry you. Regina could even pouf the two of you away. Why would you just stand there pointing your arrow, doing nothing, say “stay back” when the dark ones have no reason whatsoever to take notice of you?
Snowing doing nothing- Same as above, when dark ones are advancing on you, why do you just stand there doing nothing? At least have a go at escaping!
Same with the dwarves- though at least they had the excuse that they were surrounded. Snowing and OQ could’ve just run in the opposite direction to the dark ones.
Same with Henry- Don’t just bloody stand there! Run!
Henry giving exposition on Charron- Everyone seems to forget that we saw Charron when he was trying to take Robin to the underworld.
Emma’s “you’re scaring Henry”- If Henry wants to play in the big leagues, he’s got to learn to deal with the big stuff. The fact that Emma then takes Henry down to the place that Gold was “scaring” him about is laughable. Jared’s acting just seemed wooden this episode.
The goblet that appears from nowhere when Hook is stood in the random FTL field- it makes no sense!
Regina summons a portal tornado and it causes no damage whatsoever- The one from the premiere cause Granny’s to rip from the ground and be transported to Camelot, this tornado runs right down the street and the parked cars don’t move an inch.
Emma falling so easily for Hook’s ploy- It was so obvious.
Hook killing his father out of spite- That boy is now an orphan because of Hook.
Hook’s sudden heel face turn- He’s spent episodes tormenting Emma, threatening her and her family, belittling her, making her cry, telling her how much he’s going to hurt her, etc but as Nimue prevents her from interfering, even admitting that she couldn’t kill her, Hook suddenly sees the light. It’s ridiculous.
There were a lot of dark ones considering they only marked 12 people to take there place- I guess some dark ones only wanted the “tourist visa”
Rumple turning evil again- There is no reason for it.
Emma threatening to tell Belle- Once again Belle is being used as a pawn. Rather than telling Belle for Belle’s sake, Emma will only tell her if Rumple doesn’t co-operate. The “heroes” lack of respect for Belle is staggering. Also it is highly manipulative to use Rumple’s love for Belle against him. He doesn’t want her to get hurt, yet Emma is threatening to do just that, without any thought of what it would do to Belle, just to get what she wants. Also everyone is now in on it. Does nobody care about Belle or her feelings at all? Not to mention, knowing Hook, he’ll tell Belle in the cruellest way possible what Rumple did, so once again Belle get’s hurt, Rumple ends up alone and everyone else feels good about themselves because they got what they want.
The whole “doing it for love” shtick- It’s getting old and most of all it’s being used in really unhealthy ways. “love” should not override common sense.
Emma using Snowing’s line- TLK doesn’t work for CS so Emma should not be using a TL phrase.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixZelena looking at colour charts to redecorate Regina’s office- Zelena has been one of the highlights of 5A. If the writers hadn’t made her so unlikeable in 3B and season 4, she would easily be one of the top 10 characters on the show.
The baby will always be Pistachio now, no matter what name they settle on.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"This half season started very promising and I was excited about the Dark Emma arc and I kept the optimistic approach as long as I could but this half season went downhill very fast to the show’s regular pit of shallowness and stupidity.
Favorites:
1) Emma got her red coat and princess curls back! I really missed those.
2) The writers probably understood that all of their plot twists are predictable and that the way to get those emotions from us during half season finales is by sadness, and they were right. Snow, Charming and Henry sitting together at Granny’s got me crying. And even Hook death made me shed tears, even though I already knew what’s going to happen and I don’t really like him. This part of the finale reminded me of the season 3b finale, which was one of the best half season finales of this show.
3) Snow’s coat this episode looked kinda cute on her. Finally some wardrobe choices done right.
4) I didn’t hear Rumple’s speech about how he got his powers back but I think I heard him talking about the Sands of Avalon? If he did then it’s nice to see this coming back and being used again.
Mixed:
1) I was sad to see Zelena go, she was my favorite character this season, but at least we pretty much had a confirmation that she would come back. And I’m glad they didn’t rehabilitate her, and if she stayed she would have had to stop trying to kill everyone eventually.
But I did not understand the wand thing. Regina could use it because she believed in herself? Wasn’t she unable to use it because she wasn’t dark enough or something?
2) The flashbacks were completely unnecessary. But I do have a feeling that they will be relevant in the second half of the season, like what happened with Lily. Expect the little kid to be revealed to be someone related to Henry at some point.
3) Apparently Rumple was literally in hell? To what moment are they referring, when he almost died of Hook’s poison or when he almost died from a heart attack in the hospital in New York? Because I don’t remember him actually dying and not breathing in any of them. But I could be wrong.
Least Favorites:
1) They killed Rumbelle. They killed it. They sent freaking Excalibur through it’s heart. There’s no coming back from this, there is no person I know who would be on board of this ship anymore. And that’s the saddest thing about this episode. And Rumple as a character is dead too.
2) Even the part that was supposed to be good, when he lied to her and told her to go see the world, felt really wrong to me. Like seriously? He kept the truth from her, a truth she deserved to know. She deserved to be able to decide for herself. To have the chance to say goodbye to him, knowing that they’ll never see each other again. To say goodbye to other people. Rumple is not the only person she’s close to! There’s Snow and Emma and Henry. She deserved to have the chance to decide to stay and help to save the town from the Dark Ones. I expected her to be outraged, not to think it’s romantic.
3) And like Rumple is now a Super Ultra Dark One with all the power of the other Dark Ones? But that doesn’t make sense. The darkness and the powers transfer from the Dark One to the one who stabbed him so how could they multiply? But I guess I had to ask that question a few episodes ago with Hook being a second Dark One.
4) Who’s gonna take care of all the babies? Belle? Granny?
5) Hook was super on revenge for some reason and then stopped when Regina reminded him of his daddy. OK. Also why asking Emma to stab you you can just stab yourself it will be less painful to her.
6) Emma was still the Dark One in this episode. She could freeze Hook, or the other Dark Ones or whatever, she could poof Excalibur into her hand. Why was she so helpless?
7) “Remember that thing we swore to never talk about?” “You mean the thing that the writers just thought of toady and shoehorned into the script?” “Yes that one”.
You know what I can't continue with the dead people brought back to life list I'm out of space in the signature and now we have an underworld arc this is to much I quit why do you bring so many people back to life OUAT WHHHYYYY
3) Apparently Rumple was literally in hell? To what moment are they referring, when he almost died of Hook’s poison or when he almost died from a heart attack in the hospital in New York? Because I don’t remember him actually dying and not breathing in any of them. But I could be wrong.
I’m pretty sure the writers are referring to Rumple after he stabbed Pan and then went to the Vault of Eternal Goo, but that’s problematic because it’s not the Underworld nor Hell. It’s a Vault. The Underworld appears to be a totally separate realm, not a part from SB, the EF, ect.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"Hook’s sob back story- We’re supposed to believe that Hook’s father’s abandonment of him and his brother is supposed to be a bad thing, yet we saw later that Hook and his brother became high ranking officers in the navy and were quite happy. I’m failing to see the cause and effect here.
I am thinking the FOSTER captain treated the boys better than their own father did… he probably got them educated in sailing a ship so they could go on to join the navy as officers. He sounded like a ROUGH TOUGH CAPTAIN WITH A HEART OF GOLD. Someone who make make the kids tow the line but was kind enough to give them a home rather than abandon them.
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.To say I disliked this episode would be a bit of an understatement. Actually, it started fine, but by the end, it was such a hot mess I don’t even know where to begin. So I’ll start with the few things I liked. I think a lot of people here have already covered most of the things that drove me nuts, so I’ll focus on the show’s mechanics, rather than concrete dialogues or plot points.
Liked:
Zelena. As usual, her sass was entertaining, but I’m glad Regina sent her on her way. While she makes for a good villain, the writers have gone overboard with her — and while I have nothing against the possibility of redeeming her in some distant, abstract future, I honestly don’t care enough to see that story play out. And that, more or less, sums up how I feel about most of the characters on Once at this point. More of this in a second.
Rumple’s speech to the crew about being with their loved ones, and his sending Belle off to see the world. The ending tarnishes it of course, but total character assassination shouldn’t technically color the good things that were there in the script before said assassination happened.
And that is pretty much it for likes.
Mixed:
Snowing and Baby Neal. Others have brought this up, but this has been a systematic problem on this show. Baby Neal is pretty much an accessory to Snow’s outfit, and this is starting to verge on the absurd. We have no sense at all of time passing, but we also have no sense at all of Snow’s (or Charming’s) relationship to their youngest child. That entire scene of goodbyes felt very flat to me. You’re leaving your infant, who it looks like is still at the age where they’re either breastfed or formula fed, and are totally helpless, to a completely uncertain fate. But neither Snow nor Charming seemed all that torn up about it. Yes, that scene was fairly touching, but it also felt completely unrealistic — the emotions I’d imagine would be happening under the circumstances just weren’t there.
Hook’s backstory. I’m not a fan of the character, but am happy to give any character the benefit of the doubt if the writers would actually bother producing a convincing narrative that puts things in context. I didn’t find the PapaJones story in any way interesting. So, another scoundrel abandons his son, who grows up to be evil(ish) and then they are reunited, and the son kills the father We have seen this story, or its variation, too many times on OUAT for it to be interesting. Yes yes, daddy issues. Who. Cares.
Dislikes:
Everything else. But lets start with the epic fail at plot.
Why did we need Camelot? Why did we need 2-3 episodes focused on a stupid mushroom? Why did we need Arthur, Guinevere, and Co? To get Excalibur, right? Speaking of that, I’d like something other than vague handwaving and smoke billowing in the general direction of an explanation for how Excalibur is supposed to work, because I have no idea right now. A 3 year old trying to tell this story would be more logical than this lazy garbage.
Let me get this straight. Hook is a hero because, at the last moment, he decided not to murder a bunch of more-or-less innocent people, including a child (Henry), and took one for the team? No, I’m sorry. A firefighter who dies while pulling people out of a burning building is a hero. An arsonist who sets the building on fire (with people in it) and who, having the choice of seeing a bunch of people burning to a crisp, or going down with the blaze himself, has a last moment pang of conscience and douses himself with the kerosene he saved up for others is NOT a hero. That’s a psychopath with a hail mary conscience pang, nothing more. That’s just not the kind of character whose redemption arc I find myself compelled to give a rat’s tail about.
Rumple is the DO. Again. This is so ridiculous and infuriating, I simply have no (polite) words for it. Other than “surprise! The one character that doesn’t fit the hot white 30 something rich/aristocrat is INHERENT EVIL.” On the tail end of another POC being killed off, on the tail end of a 1/2 season that was meant to be about a woman and ended up being about her boyfriend’s man pain. Thank you, OUAT, for another reminder of how much you like to shove your innocently racist/classist/misogynist/ageist message down our throats. There’s a point where “ooops, that’s just plot” doesn’t cut it anymore.
And before I slip into more ranting, I’ll try to meta it instead. First of all, this totally kills any remainders of Rumbelle there might have been left, and it finishes off Rumple’s character as someone complex and layered. At this point, I’m ready to root for Cora over Rumple — she has more nuance left.
And that’s where I feel this show has completely failed. The writers no longer understand what they’re writing or how to strike a balance. Why would the audience want to see the stories of characters who aren’t compelling? Yes, loathsome characters might be entertaining for a brief moment — say, like the characters on House of Cards. You tune in, prepared to be horrified and disgusted, think to yourself “Thank heavens I’m not exposed to creeps like this, my life’s not so bad!” and tune out. Why would you want to follow their nasty little lives? If I wanted to dig around in the unsightly psychological messes of deeply unlikable, vile people, I’d go read Dostoyevsky. That’s not why one would tune into something like Once.
And this brings me to the second thing that infuriates me about this arc. The amount of story recycling and self-plagiarism. When someone is trying to sell you a product they’ve already sold you under a different name, it’s hard not to feel like they’re trying to pull a con — so either the writers are assuming the audience are amnesiac (or idiots), or they are writing with no plan in mind, the night before, while drunk. Honestly, I’d expect a better product from the latter configuration, so I’m assuming it’s the former.
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