March 17, 2018 at 10:35 am #345994hjbauParticipant
I agree. Any sort of pre existence of the wish realm makes no sense. The wish realm has no real history. The writers just don’t care.[adrotate group="5"]March 17, 2018 at 8:15 pm #346007StahlopParticipant
I’d also like a lot more explanation, but I’m happy in taking solace that at least this jump isn’t between our world and Wish Realm or anything, but between two magical realms.
The thing that doesn’t make sense to me, is I thought the Wish Realm did not exist until Emma wished it into existence? Wasn’t that stated somewhere? If that is true the wish realm should not be in existence at this time, right? I don’t know it is all way to convoluted for me now and I totally forgot that Alice and Emma where basically the same age in wish realm timeline but does that only count as Nook as he can travel back and forth to the wish realm? Anyway I think it was an incredibly bad idea to bring the wish realm back at all, it complicates a lot of story lines at least it should.
I think Regina thought it didn’t exist until it was wished it into existence. Or if it didn’t exist until then, then magic somehow made up for all that would have happened up to that point. Because only one Emma seemed to exist when she was wished there. Or maybe they merged into one because of the wish, still not sure about that. Either way, because it is in existence now, the people there have to have a past and that past would have to include things that could have happened had the curse not happened (I just used happened way too many times there). I don’t know if the past was altered once the Wish Realm was wished into existence or memories were altered, but they are definitely real to everyone involved.March 17, 2018 at 11:49 pm #346009RumplesGirlKeymaster
. Either way, because it is in existence now, the people there have to have a past and that past would have to include things that could have happened had the curse not happened
Yes but I think the rub is that having memories of something that happened doesn’t actually mean that it happened. This happens all the time in our non-TV reality but usually only that we’ve misrembered something to the point of believing our mis-memory is truth (ie: something like the Mandela effect)
I have no issue with Nook having memories of a life with Alice because it matches pretty neatly with the way things worked in SB during the Original Curse; think about Lacey–in reality Belle was locked up below the hospital unaware of anything but as soon as Regina gave her the persona of Lacey suddenly she had a whole slew of memories about what kind of person she was. So Nook having memories of a life with Alice isn’t a big deal but it’s the idea that these memories actually, literally happened on a definitive timeline is less okay.
And as a side note I wouldn’t have a problem with this reality of memory–other, more nuanced sci-fi/fantasy shows can play with that. A show like Westworld is all about memory and its relation to reality and identity. But OUAT isn’t trying to parse out those tricky topics. They need a…cheap answer, for wont of a better word. They need Nook to have had an actual past with Alice because without out his character has no arc so therefore, they don’t explore what the Wish Realm actually is, how it works, and how memories and experiences inside the Wish Realm work."He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"March 18, 2018 at 2:03 am #346013
I agree. Any sort of pre existence of the wish realm makes no sense. The wish realm has no real history. The writers just don’t care.
The only way I can make sense of it is that when Evil Queen Half Regina made her wish, she accessed the already existing “Wish Realm” rather than wishing it into existence. Perhaps a number of actual worlds/realities truly exist in the show that involve our characters with key events occurring/never occurring. It’s super messy and not what the writers led us to believe in S6, but it’s the only way I can reconcile it in my head.March 18, 2018 at 2:05 am #346014
Still pretty sure EF2 and Wish Realm are 2 separate worlds that Hook is travelling back and forth from.
Okay, yes. The timeline makes a little more sense now but now I’m bothered by the whole world hopping thing. But I guess it’s just much easier than it used to be.
I was really hoping we’d get more on Jack/Nick’s backstory, and that he just happened to get a whole cache of beans after his experience with the giant. Although, I guess that doesn’t explain Nook’s ability to realm jump whenever he’d like.
YES. I want a Jack backstory that explains the abundance of beans too! Maybe he discovered a whole bunch more and now everyone and their mom has some including Henry who gave some to Regina, Emma, and Hook during his visits? back to Storybrooke before meeting Ella.March 18, 2018 at 2:32 am #346015rikucrafterParticipant
I’ve been thinking about the Wish Realm as a concept, and I’m thinking that, perhaps, there are indeed a lot of alternate forms of reality. These of course, include the Victorian world (an alternate form of one of our eras). I’m thinking that perhaps Hyperion Heights exists in one such of these worlds. That’s how its 2017 there, that explains why they can’t get to Storybrooke (if its in another world).
But, of course a nice, logical solution to a problem the writers have created is going to have an awful and inelegant solution. It will be 2017 in HH because it is. With no explanation.March 18, 2018 at 7:40 am #346018hjbauParticipant
Especially in this show, the memories of having something happen does not mean it happened. All the main characters have multiple versions of memories of their pasts in their heads. Versions of living in Storybrooke, versions of raising Henry, wish world versions, rewritten author versions. That doesn’t mean that all of those things really tangibly happened. That is the problem here.
It is a problem of their own making too. They were very clear when they created the wish realm. That it wasn’t real. It was a created construct of Emma/split Regina’s wish. Real Regina did not murder a Snow and Charming and then steal a version of Henry’s mother leaving that Henry parentless and desperate and alone. They wanted to make sure that we knew that it wasn’t real because of that.
Then they lost most of the cast because they didn’t want to be on the show, so they just decided to ignore what actually happened on the show. Regina pretty much created a situation where there is now a Henry who could become darker and more evil then she was as the Evil Queen and they have just completely ignored that, so that they could take that Hook and reuse him while keeping real Hook with Emma in Storybrooke.
That is the entire game here. Now, they are pretending that fake Hook is a real person who has existed for hundreds of years and that actually did these things. They just took something that existed and rewrote it, just like they have done many times before, just like they rewrote the characters of Regina and Hook many times, just like they rewrote Emma’s backstory, and Regina’s backstory, and Snow’s, to the point where the show is just one big convoluted mess that doesn’t make any sense. That’s it. That’s the show.March 18, 2018 at 9:15 am #346019RumplesGirlKeymaster
I’m thinking that perhaps Hyperion Heights exists in one such of these worlds. That’s how its 2017 there, that explains why they can’t get to Storybrooke (if its in another world).
That’s interesting. That would explain that bizarre comment from Regina (not to mention other oddities like Robyn being an 18 yr old). But I think it unlikely to actually happen that way–I think you’ve hit the nail on the head with this:
It will be 2017 in HH because it is. With no explanation."He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"March 18, 2018 at 10:13 am #346023StahlopParticipant
Maybe the writers were watching too many episodes of Sliders when they decided to being the Wish Realm into reality (and maybe I’m the only one who remembers Sliders and this will only make sense to me, LOL).March 18, 2018 at 3:02 pm #346028
They were very clear when they created the wish realm. That it wasn’t real. It was a created construct of Emma/split Regina’s wish. Real Regina did not murder a Snow and Charming and then steal a version of Henry’s mother leaving that Henry parentless and desperate and alone. They wanted to make sure that we knew that it wasn’t real because of that.
I think the writers always intended the Wish Realm to real because the episode after Regina killed Wish Charmings, she was able to bring Wish Robin to Storybrooke. They needed Regina to think it wasn’t real so she could kill the Wish Charmings to wake up Emma and still remain a good guy. They did however, lead us to believe in S6 that the Wish Realm didn’t exist until the wish was made, hence. It actually being a real alternate reality would be fine, if they had acknowledged it at some point. If I’m remembering correctly, original Hook questioned how WR Hook could exist, but they didn’t give an explanation- it was just “because plot.”
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