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gypsy.
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October 5, 2012 at 2:01 am #134964
gypsy
ParticipantThe creators of OUAT- Kitsis and Horowitz- are LOST alum, and Damon Lindelof, also a LOST alum, is a consultant for OUAT. There are so many LOST nods throughout OUAT, so, I thought this would be a good place for OUAT fans that are also LOSTies, to discuss some of the similarites/and or differences of both shows….or anything else OUAT/LOST 🙂
[adrotate group="5"]October 5, 2012 at 2:03 am #155501marilou
Participanthere is a pretty good place to start it off:
http://seriable.com/once-upon-a-time-1-01-pilot-lost-easter-eggs/
October 5, 2012 at 2:11 am #155505gypsy
ParticipantHey, thanks Marilou 🙂
October 5, 2012 at 2:37 am #155514marilou
Participant@hjbau wrote:
But they weren’t flashes into an alternate reality. They weren’t. That was why Desmond was so at peace near the end of the last season. You know how his power was that his mind would move through time and he would see bits and peaces of his future and his past. So he was at peace because he had popped into their futures and seen them all together their in the afterlife. That was the real and true future in the afterlife of all of the characters. They were attempting to imply throughout the season that it was an alternate reality, but it was not. It was the future for those characters.
My LOST is a bit rusty but I’ll give it a try.
The flash sideways were not the afterlife nor an alternate reality. Desmond’s mind (vision, intuition or whatever you wanna call it) never saw the flash sideways. The “afterlife” was the white light in which they all bathed at in the chapel in the very last scene.
For the sake of the argument, let’s call the flash sideways limbo. While the survivors were there, their job was to find each other and remember their past so they could move on together. It is said that they didn’t die at the same time and implied, that some people made it off the island for a second time and lived for an extended period of time(the ones who were on the Ajira plane flying off the island). sideways was just the place where their “soul” would go and wait for everyone else.
Desmond’s gift, was nothing more then high tolerance to electro-magnetic field, only after intense exposure to EMF his mind started glimpsing and traveling back and forth into the future and past. The assumption is, anyone who would have survive that kind of event, would suffer the same consequences. Lucky for him he had Penny.
October 5, 2012 at 3:34 am #155527gypsy
ParticipantI couldn’t put it any better than Damon or Carlton:
EW: The whole idea of flash-sideways and the plan to use season 6 to show us a world where Oceanic 815 never crashed — how long has that been in the works? Why did you want to do it?
DAMON LINDELOF: It’s been in play for at least a couple of years. We knew that the ending of the time travel season was going to be an attempt to reboot. And as a result, we [knew] the audience was going to come out of the “do-over moment” thinking we were either going start over or just say it didn’t work and continue on. [We thought] wouldn’t it be great if we did both? That was the origin of the story.
CARLTON CUSE: We thought just doing one [of those options] would inherently not be satisfying. Since the very beginning of the show, characters started crossing through each other’s stories. Part of our desire [in season 6] is to show that there’s still this kind of weave, that these characters still would have impacted each other’s lives even without the event of crashing on the Island. Obviously, the big question of the season is going to be: How do these [two timelines] reconcile? However, for the fans who have not watched the show closely, that’s an intact narrative. You can just watch the flash sideways — they stand alone all by themselves. For the fans who are more deeply embedded in the show, you can watch those flash sideways, compare them to what transpired in the flashbacks and go, “Oh, that’s an interesting difference.”
LINDELOF: Right out of the gate, in the first five minutes of the premiere, you get hit over the head with two things that you’re not expecting. The first is that Desmond is on the plane. The second thing that we do is we drop out of the plane and we go below the water and we see that the Island is submerged. What we’re trying to do there is basically say to you, “God bless the survivors of Oceanic 815, because they’re so self-centered, they thought the only effect [of detonating the bomb] was going to be that their plane never crashes.” But they don’t stop to think, “If we do this in 1977, what else is going to affected by this?” So that their entire lives can be changed radically. In fact, it would appear that they’ve sunken the Island. That’s our way of saying, “Keep your eyes peeled for the differences that you’re not expecting.” Some of these characters were still in Australia, but some weren’t. Shannon’s not there. Boone actually says that he tried to get her back. There are all sorts of other people that we don’t see. Where’s Libby? Where’s Ana Lucia? Where’s Eko? These are all the things that you’re supposed to be thinking about. When our characters posited the “What if?” scenario, they neglected to think about what the other effects of potentially changing time might be and we’re embracing those things.That said, are you saying definitively that detonating Jughead was the event that created this new timeline? Or is that a mystery which the season 6 story will reveal?
LINDELOF: It’s a mystery. A big one.
CUSE: We did have some concern that it might be confusing kind of going into the season. To clear that up a little bit: The archetypes of the characters are the same and that’s the most significant thing. Kate is still a fugitive. If you were to look at the Comic-Con video, for instance, that now comes into play. There was a different scenario in that story. She basically blew up an apprentice plumber as opposed to killing her biological father/stepfather. Those kind of differences exist, but who the characters fundamentally are is the same. If it becomes too confusing for you, you can just follow the flash sideways for what they are. It’s not as though there’s narrative that hangs on the fact that you need to know that this event was different in that world, in the flashback world versus the sideways world. That’s not critical for being able to process the narrative this season.Is there a relationship between Island reality and sideways reality? Will they run parallel for the remainder of the season? Will they fuse together? Might one fade away?
LINDELOF: For us, the big risk that we’re taking in the final season of the show is basically this very question. [Lindelof then explains the show has replaced the trademark “whoosh!” sound effect marking the segue between Island present story and flashbacks or flash-forwards, thus calling conspicuous attention to the relationship between the Island world and the Sideways world.] This is the critical mystery of the season, which is, “What is the relationship between these two shows?” And we don’t use the phrase “alternate reality,” because to call one of them an “alternate reality” is to infer that one of them isn’t real, or one of them is real and the other is the alternate to being real.
CUSE: But the questions you’re asking are exactly the right questions. What are we to make of the fact that they’re showing us two different timelines? Are they going to resolve? Are they going to connect? Are they going to co-exist in parallel fashion? Are they going to cross? Do they intersect? Does one prove to be viable and the other one not? I think those are all the kind of speculations that are the right speculations to be having at this point in the season.
LINDELOF: But it is going to require patience. We’ve taught the audience how to be patient thus far, so while they’re getting a lot of mythological answers on the island early in the season, this idea of what is the relationship between the two [worlds] is a little bit more of a slow burn.Did Jughead really sink the Island? And is it possible that the Sideways characters are now caught in a time loop in which they might have to go back in time and fulfill the obligation to continuity by detonating the bomb?
LINDELOF: These questions will be dealt with on the show. Should you infer that the detonation of Jughead is what sunk the island? Who knows? But there’s the Foot. What do you get when you see that shot? It looks like New Otherton got built. These little clues [might help you] extrapolate when the Island may have sunk. Start to think about it. A couple of episodes down the road, some of the characters might even discuss it. We will say this: season 6 is not about time travel. It’s about the implications, the aftermath, and the causality of trying to change the past. But the idea of continuing to do paradoxical storytelling is not what we’re interested in this year.There you go. Some food for thought. Dan and I will have more Messrs. Cuse and Lindelof later this week at EW.com and in the new issue of Entertainment Weekly, on sale Friday. If you’ve made it this far into this post, stay tuned: There’s a monstrously epic recap coming your way tomorrow. Until then, please: Get talking! What did you love? What did you hate? What left you totally baffled? What theories do you have to explain it all? The floor is yours!
October 6, 2012 at 3:38 pm #155694hjbau
ParticipantOkay. Whether it is called limbo or the afterlife, what was called the flash sideways was in actuality after every characters death, which is why i am calling it the after life. Because whether you believe in limbo or that there is a place of waiting between the two is not sort of important. Either way this place is in the future of all of the characters on the show. Their future after death. Like you said some people died right away like Jack or died before like Charley or died long after like Hurley, but everyone dies. Once you die you are outside of time and in this place of waiting where they are all together.
I think it makes sense that Desmond’s mind did go to the after life because he was at such peace. I know it was never shown on screen, but the only thing that makes sense to me is that Desmond went into that machine and that took his mind to the limbo/place of waiting and he felt them all be at peace because from that moment on Desmond was no longer worried about anything. He knew that no matter what happened that eventually they would be there together.
October 6, 2012 at 3:51 pm #155697hjbau
ParticipantAbout what the producers said, it seems to me that interview was given before the show was finished when they were still trying to pretend that the flash sideways were like an alternate reality. The thing was that they were not an alternate reality. They were real and true future times after death for all of the characters. The two times never interconnect, they are not happening concurrently, the blowing up of the bomb in the future hatch in 1977 did not create another reality.
I think from a story telling perspectives that it totally makes sense that they kept that information close to the chest into they revealed what was happening in the last episode. The thing is that this was not a flash sideways, meaning two separate and concurrent timelines. They are one timeline where what we saw on the show from Season 1 is the real in life events of the characters lives and the so called flash sideways were future events in those characters lives.
I think on ONCE and say Fringe, there are two separate realities, Storybrooke and fairytale land present which they introduced in Broken, that are happening concurrently and that is what i would consider a true flash sideways. In the past they have only had Storybrooke present and fairytale land pre curse flashback, but now we have Storybrooke present and fairytale land posthypnotic present day. Both of those times exist from time moving after Emma returns to Storybrooke her being the pivot point of this story.
October 6, 2012 at 4:55 pm #155705nonnie
Participant@Gypsy wrote:
The creators of OUAT- Kitsis and Horowitz- are LOST alum, and Damon Lindelof, also a LOST alum, is a consultant for OUAT. There are so many LOST nods throughout OUAT, so, I thought this would be a good place for OUAT fans that are also LOSTies, to discuss some of the similarities/and or differences of both shows….or anything else OUAT /LOST 🙂
I am not a Lostie as I did not care for the show and if you missed the first couple of shows you could not catch up until the DVDs were released. I do think it is a great IDEA to put ALL the LOST related post into one thread… helps keep the forum organized.
N.
October 6, 2012 at 5:00 pm #155706gypsy
ParticipantOk, I get what you’re saying about the OUAT ‘flashsideways’ as opposed to the LOST ‘falsh’…the events in both OUAT ‘worlds’ were actually happening at the same time, where as LOST was not. I do, however, consider the events happening in 1977 and the events happening in the ‘present’ as flashsideways. Although the year 1977 was obviously the past, the events with jughead, Jack, Sawyer, Kate….ect….were happening at the same time as the events in the ‘present’ with Des, etc…
October 6, 2012 at 6:00 pm #155715gypsy
ParticipantBy the way, hjbau- I gotta ask- what did you think about the ending? Love it? Hate it?
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