Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
[adrotate group="5"]
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
If they had mashed D&P into the Love Rhombus of death on that show, maybe it would be closer to their approach here. Question is..given Adam’s tweet about a love rhombus…I now think there will be another point in it to pop up, but question is who? Ghost of Milah from under the rug they swept her? Tink? Ariel? Regina? Robin (hah I love Litttle Birdies now for some reason).
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
That’s exactly it, Astrawoid and Slurpeez. Lost Spoilers, if you’re willing to spoil it, but Phee, that’s a great comparison — I definitely get Desmond and Penny vibes from Neal and Emma. I think A&E may have had a hand in writing some of their story, at least, they did the episode where Claire/Charlie/Desmond plays out to be not a real triangle at all and Charlie ends up sacrificing himself to make contact with Penny to help save everyone. Charlie having a big brother who’d sort of built up then messed up his life named Liam. Penny lived entirely in the real world, completely unaware of the mystical island that had a pull on Desmond forcing him apart from her. Little did she know her own father had been on that island and spent his life and much of his vast fortune trying to get back there, and that she had a half-brother even also drawn to that island, who ended up meeting Desmond. Daniel (another name ringer!) Faraday was a physicist who used the word constant in the mathematical sense for an equation to help locate the island which skipped through time. In turn, having someone as a constant, he thought, would anchor him enough to avoid his brain melting down from the time skips. He chose Desmond as his constant and in turn, Desmond chose Penny. Daniel thought, like Rumple, that he could change fate but it turned out he couldn’t, that all along he’d already been to his own past before he was born, to be killed by his own mother (and she’d sent him there on that mission too!). There’s definite parallels going on here but all the pieces are jumbled up all over the place.
Lost is a different story and set of characters, so I guess we just have to see where the writers go in this show. I agree though, Emma has to sort of relearn who Neal is, and realize he’s more than she’s given him credit for being.
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
Regina as Queen: I think Adam tweeted she was a better mayor than the Charmings (why she was in the office after getting kicked out after she got her magic back, post redemption, she was doing paperwork!). She may actually be a good manager/boss, but she definitely makes Donald Trump look like a pushover. It isn’t you’re fired, it’s…
I borrowed that one off Screwball Ninja’s page, she didn’t put up the source link. I need to be better about sourcing these pictures! Source
I think she likes being in charge now, so I’m not sure she’d want to give it up but that’s an interesting question. Give up magic? She might have to do that, but give up the control of being in charge? I’m not so sure she could.
That leads to another question I keep asking: Are they going to stay Feudal? Let’s call this one the Town-ship.
Would they want to actually employ that concept they’ve learned about called democracy, or are they really just going to go back to bowing to the nobles? Whale was quick to point out that Charming wasn’t his Prince, but no one else seemed to object, even though we know there actually were other Princes like Eric or Princesses like Abigail.
Gender of Charming Baby:
It should be twins, boy and girl!
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
slurpeez108 wrote: A concerned mother can’t afford to let her attention be diverted as it was in 3×5 from kissing Hook; I think 3×7 showed Emma getting her act back together by saying that none of the romantic attention she’s getting is important since what matters is getting back Henry.
Is it an accident that Emma started to get her act back together once Neal was alive and present? I think that the arc here is for Hook to eventually realize that Emma has feelings for another man. Hook may begin the process of understanding that everything isn’t about him and that could lead to the character growth necessary for him to have real relationships with people, like Neal, or a true friendship with Emma. Maybe that will lead to his ultimate happy ending with Tinker Bell, or Ariel (how set in stone is her thing with Eric at this point?). That Hook’s superficial intentions are being shown to the audience suggests that Emma will find out, too. She’s been subject to superficial relationships for most of her life so it will be familiar and not what she’s looking for. I’m not convinced that a full fledged CS thing is necessary to get all of this across. I’m not sure that it’s even possible with Emma’s two recent, “I love you” statements to Neal, regardless of how fraught with drama they were. Emma’s big fears with Neal seem to center around fear of not being loved (she’s coming to terms with Neal really having loved her) and fear of losing him/not being with him. With time, and the assurances of Neal’s ongoing presence in her life no matter what, those fears seem managable. From pages back, (I apologize for the lateness, I have a full time job and conversation moves fast here) I like Neal’s self-awareness. He seems comfortable with who he is, flaws and all. A barbeque at Neal’s house would be relaxed and fun.
Molly: Don’t worry about bringing in things from further back at all! Obviously a few of us have a bit of time on our hands here 😛 and it is awesome to have some more voices to speak up on their perspective too.
I agree completely about Neal’s self-awareness and it is interesting really to contrast it with Emma’s lack of that through the first few episodes and maybe you’re right that Neal is bringing out some good things in Emma that we will see more of in the next episode. I hope so!
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
I’ve just caught up on the last few posts and I just wanted to say how happy I am to have found this board. (THANK YOU HEATHER!!) It’s so refreshing to read all of your posts and I wanted to say how awesome you all are!
Awww, you are too, and not just for the vids! I’ve got a big ol THIS to your last post, but a few things to add in addition to that.
Anyway I wanted to add my thoughts on the latest interview with Jen. …From a SF shipper point of view the only positive thing I could take from her answer was the part when she said ‘whether or not it turns into something more.’
That is a good point, that she said that too. I think Jen was trying to answer within Emma’s perspective on Hook within that last episode. Yet the way things get written up keep sounding like Emma is in the same headspace as Hook about his “good form” but she isn’t. I don’t think she really thinks about the world in that fairy tale way of “honorable” people but there are people who are selfish and those who aren’t. People who will help her and people who might hurt her.
Compare these two sentences about Emma’s opinion of Hook:
Emma’s had such a hard life and such bad experiences, including with Hook, that Hook’s really impressing and surprising Emma with how he is acting. VERSUS Hook’s really impressing and surprising Emma. She’s had such a hard life and such bad experiences up until now.
The difference in meaning is huge, and if an interviewer is at all selectively editing what the actress says and how she says it, or is in anyway giving her a bit of a leading question, such as “Can you talk about Emma’s current view of Hook in that last episode?” We get this impression that Emma is thinking wow, no one’s ever stepped up like Hook (on), no one never took her side like Hook (on), never gave her a sword as a memento like Hook (on), …as if she’d turned into well….this:
When what Emma is feeling about Hook is more subtle and more like this:
She does appreciate that he’s being nice, and she isn’t looking to make him her enemy by hurting his feelings. She isn’t as sure as Belle there that Gaston is wrong, but who knows what Belle might have done in the future if the beast didn’t come along? Emma’s got far more issues than Belle did, so even Hook is being less dishonest than Gaston in his pursuit, it is going to take a bit more for Emma to really feel she could trust him because they do have a little bit of negative history to overcome too.She’s not restrained by feelings for Neal at this point, because she doesn’t really want to deal with those feelings. If anything, that Emma has feelings for Neal will only push her more towards Hook (very unlike how Belle felt about Gaston) because that’s easier and a good way to keep her distance from Neal, where some real potential pain might lie. The thing is, the more serious Hook is and asks her to take him, the less easy that option becomes too. So if he’s approaching her about “fun” versus “winning her heart”, that could make some difference on her end too. Emma isn’t a woman who I think would go right for the deep end of the pool in a relationship. She protects her heart too much.So with Neal, the approach would be friends and co-parents, but with Hook it would be don’t think just feel, but now it is obvious that Hook is thinking of more.
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
What if she is Cinderella’s HALF-sister? See in the story originally, Lady T has two daughters, then married Cindyy’s dad, but what if she had a child by Cindy’s dad?
Timeline wise not sure how it works but maybe Ana is the oldest. Lady T and Cindy’s dad were young and in love just like Wil and Ana, but poor, but when she got pregnant, Lady T married a rich man and passed off Ana as his. She also had two daughters by the Lord, then he died. Meanwhile, Cindy’s dad remarried, but became successful and rich. Lady T. got back together with her first love, Cindy’s Dad, but he fell sick and died and she grew bitter. She took it out on Cindy the most, but also on Ana who was the one child she cared the most for as her other two daughters she bore.
That is convoluted, Ana could also be younger (after remarriage) but timeline wise she’d barely be 16 then with Will?
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
I echo what Phee says, that we need to see what they want to do, not how it comes across in fan interviews. Emma shut down both guys to active romance, but more will happen in terms of Emma’s judgement of their characters.
I thought of J.Mo’s interview as a question of editing. For example, if J.MO were to say Hook is surprising Emma and impressing her, that is true but really the crux of it is that Emma has such low expectations for him in particular, but also in general due to her very hard life with so few people who have come through for her. Of all the people on her rescue mission, he has the least personal stake in saving Henry for Henry’s sake, so of course it does say something to her that he’s actively trying to help, as opposed to just looking out for himself. He doesn’t need to do it. In Emma’s experience, the “old Hook” wouldn’t have done it, except the “old Hook” was motivated by revenge. The new one is motivated by “his happy ending” that he’s defined as being with her. If the “new Hook” realized that no matter what he does, she just isn’t interested, would he still help, because he’s truly turned over a new leaf and is just an honorable man content to be her friend, if that’s all he’ll ever be? We don’t know because basically he refused to accept what she said about only having room for Henry in her heart, and said “Fine, when we get back, then I will win your heart because you will want me.” He’s being confident and perhaps that’s what Emma finds attractive, given her insecurities she needs someone who will intensely pursue her despite her fears of rejection.
What I don’t like is that it does create that sense that well, she couldn’t possibly reject him and mean it, that it’s always just she’s afraid to love, so he has to fight harder and “no” means “yes” sort of idea. He can’t take her at her word and that’s bad writing if she is still like this when she starts a romance regardless of whether it is Neal or Hook or whoever. I want Emma to get to a point where she isn’t being written in that confusing repressed feeling, in what the writers have termed a true Emma fashion, before they put her with either guy. She needs to be able to be in a position of emotional strength, I guess, not at a weak point where they wear her down until she gives in. I wouldn’t like it being written that way.
I feel so far SF is not being written that way, with Neal acknowledging her stated need for space to focus on Henry, and that he has no claims on her from the prior relationship. He’s on the same page that Henry is what matters, but he is still going to be there for her, romance or not. Hook’s more in the frame of mind that he’ll wait to push the romance until a more opportune time but only since she insists so much, but she cannot avoid him forever. He is not doing all this for nothing, even if he is doing it for her. That sounds romantic if she wants him, but if she doesn’t? CSers say that would never happen, he really loves her and of course she loves him. It is that circular logic–what he is doing is ok if it is ok with Emma, and we know it is ok with her because he is doing it.
Time will tell exactly what he meant, what Emma perceived and whether or not it matters. Hook may be showing “good form”, but does he have good substance? I think Neal is quietly being revealed as having a solid, steady rock type personality which is different than the shifty, unreliable personality Emma thought Neal had as a young thief with her. Even as she’s seeing all these new and good sides to Hook, she is also seeing them about Neal but the interviewers aren’t mentioning that in the latest batch. A week or two ago she said it was complicated, now we just hear selective good things about Hook and selective dismissive things about Neal. I think it is just off from what is shown in the last episode.
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
We still don’t know how Hook found them in NY. It is a huge city. Did he maybe use the compass and then it got dropped there so they go to retrieve it, but it is gone, along with Neal’s stuff? Home office being defunct it connects to something else (Oz threat?)
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
No magical reason that memories could not be retained. There could be different ways to stay young or turn back time.
I think their conversation works either as brother or estranged, irresponsible resentful father.
“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass
