[kfchimera]

Again how can Rumble, Regina or anyone banish anyone to another realm to my knowledge except with the wrath. I think TB got caught in NL when the curse happened or went back before the curse happened.

Again, why would Regina get a Godmother, when Snow didn’t have one when she needed help and her mother was dying and it isn’t the BF.

Rumple used a mirror to trap Cora in WL, and he may have had other portals to trick someone that led to magic realms. He was short a portal to a non-magic land, but probably had acquired many means of travel to other magic realms.

Regina was Rumple’s student. She betrayed Jefferson and took his hat at one point. We don’t know the sequence of events here, but at various points in time, it is safe to say that these are two powerful users of magic with little moral restraint who could do something exactly like trap someone.

As to your second question–I admit there are some holes, but I was speculating that Tink was ALWAYS Snow’s family’s FGM, but that she was horrible at her job. She was partying and having fun (perhaps using Leo being away on the trip as an excuse to do so) when Snow needed her and Eva died. BF took her to task, but Tink tried to justify herself to BF that it was poison and their magic couldn’t have helped anyway. BF gives her another chance, and Tink decides to watch over the new queen, who may not resent her like Snow might for not appearing earlier. Tink thinks she can encourage Regina to be a good mother to Snow, and that is all the help Snow would need. Then of course it all goes sideways, and Regina maybe even tries to harm Tink. This way it makes sense Tink might go renegade and turn on BF (who told her it was the last chance) and Regina. Maybe even give Snow the dark dust as a way to make it up to her/get revenge.

Or Tink could be Xavier’s royal line of godmother, and until Regina became Royal again, Tink did not bother herself, since Henry Sr. lost the throne somehow. So she does not approach Regina until she’s married.

Interesting sidenote, but Ella isn’t a royal, so why did her FGM who was patron to King George, also want to help Ella? I didn’t quite get how FGM’s are assigned and what it means if they are patrons to various royal families.

I could see BF, knowing limited resources of magic, conserving her FGM’s to “important” people who will be rulers or might marry into rulers, or something like that.

[kfchimera]

I agree Cora could be the culprit, but has Barbara been spotted? I don’t think they can use Rose next to Parilla and have them appear like mother and daughter.

So while it is something she would do, not sure how they show it was something she did.

I have to agree, Regina is looking innocent, so it is either before Daniel dies, or before she realizes she cannot bring him back but chooses to learn dark magic anyway.

I am not sure Tink was making a power play for BF’s job. It’s possible but the character they gave her does not seem ambitious. She likes to have fun, party maybe play a prank, but if someone slights her, she will carry a grudge.

So, she is a young FGM, perhaps to LEO’s family. That explains why she does not help Eva or Regina previously. After Eva dies, she feels bad she did not help his previous wife ( but it was poison, so not magic, so not a situation they could touch). And she isn’t that responsible to come without being called. So she tries to do better and befriends Regina this time. Regina is having a hard time, as no one in the village really likes her as they resent a new Queen and compare her to Eva.

Tink’s friendship is like a life-line. Someone she can talk to about all she is facing and struggling against, and then Rumple banishes Tink to NL. Regina falls even further into darkness.

Regina feels betrayed by Tink, but Tink meets Hook and Bae. She helps one or the other or both of them to escape NL. Or maybe Hook helps himself to her fairy dust and escapes. Tink then becomes captured by PP but Bae frees her some years after the curse, and she helps him escape.

I’m rambling off other people’s rambles here. Does anyone remember how many episodes they have for Tink? I keep feeling like her story arc is short but I don’t know why.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

Nice Phee! Much as I love SF, what I love more is their storytelling in the universe they created.
If they just cave in to one set of loud fans, they’re likely to upset another set of loud fans. Jane Epenson has said somewhere you have to give fans what they need, not what they want. I think as writers, they are smart enough also to realize how our perceptions are manipulated too by the things they show us and when.

It’s still nice though to feel like our perspective as fans who generally like the show gets heard once in awhile above all the complainers.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

I fear too that the writers will change the story. But then again, I can see A&E thinking it is no fun if you think its too sure a thing so they almost have to tease things in the way they do. No one should be sure, that’s what they want, until the moment it happens. Then you’re not sure what you just saw!

Anyway, I am still often afraid of Tumblr, but occasionally I see something interesting, and saw this post on SwanFire from the writers and cast:

http://cassidyswan.tumblr.com/post/60021133316/pro-swan-thief-masterpost

I’ve seen a lot of people feeling down about Emma/Neal lately and what’s to come this season, so I decided to compile a list of quotes from the writers as well as Jen and Michael that will hopefully bring back some faith. Stay positive guys! 🙂 Special thanks to Aria and Ali for all of their help!

Feelings For Each Other

“I think what we love so much about Emma and Bae,is that they’re two people who grew up in similar ways without a family and with walls around their hearts and soI think they were each other’s loves and for us what’s interesting is why did they move on? What happened? And what happens nowand tomorrow’s definitely going to be a part of all that.”- Eddy

“We also see what Neal saw in August’s box, it was very simple and very elegant. So was it really fate that Emma and Neal met?” – Estelle
“Yeah.” – Adam
“Seems like it.” – Eddy
“Yeah, it is you know as kind of hinted that in the episode, there is an element to fate and destiny and that that is what we’re seeing transpired in these stories and we’ve seen characters who are fighting against and then coming to terms with those very issues.” – Adam (from the Manhattan podcast)

“Neal is always going to have feelings for Emma, no matter what. Those feelings can’t be put in a jar and set aside, you’re always carrying them with you. Neal is, anyway. As far as reconciliation between the two of them, there’s work that obviously needs to be done. In this week’s episode, you’re going to see them begin to scratch the surface of the unfinished business they have. Some of the things that haven’t yet been said we start to dance around.” – Michael

“It’s obvious she still holds a torch for Neal; it’s obvious that he still has feelings for her.” – Eddy

“Emma really doesn’t care about Neal’s fiancee or is she just hiding her jealousy behind that wall.”
”She looked to me like she cared a lot.” – Jane Espenson

“It’s sad because Emma loves Neal, but she’s never going to let her guard down again.” – Eddy (from he Queen is Dead podcast)

“Even though Emma’s saying she doesn’t care for him, you see that glimpse of, ‘Oh, I really don’t want to hear about this guy having someone he’s in love with.’” – Jennifer

“In the short-term, as glimpsed in these pics? A bit of side-by-side sword-brandishing. But as for them reconnecting in more intimate ways, “It’s hard for Emma,” says cocreator Eddy Kitsis. “Their dream was Tallahassee, to just go and get regular jobs — and now he’s doing that with [fiancée Tamara]. And since Emma’s the kind of character who has a wall up around her heart, I’m not sure she wants to admit it hurts her, but we’re definitely going to see that it does. And it affects him because we know that he didn’t want to leave her. He’s in love with her. What happened [in “Manhattan”] is a situation that neither of them ever thought would happen, so now what do you do? That’s what a lot of the rest of the season’s about.”- Ausiello

(about Rumbelle being the only couple to always be separated/other couples need to be separated too) “We’ve separated snow and charming multiple times. And Neal and Emma multiple times.” – Adam

“And he does of course love her.” – Eddy (from the Manhattan podcast)

“I think it is really sad, because we understand that Emma loves Neal, but she’s never going to let her guard down again. And what’s sad is that Neal clearly really loves Emma, but gave up on getting her back and that’s what’s the tragedy of their relationship, you know. They’re two people who were going to grow up without parents, that were trying to find their home together and what was so sad is that Emma realized that he did find it, but just not with her.” – Eddy (from The Queen Is Dead podcast)

Second Star To The Right

(about Emma saying “I love you” to Neal before he falls through the portal) “I wasn’t expecting it but I thought it was perfect. When the stakes are so high the truth tends to come out.” – Jennifer

“Bae really is a hero to me. He asked the blue fairy to help him save his dad, saved Wendy’s brothers from the shadow, left Emma for her destiny even when he loved her, and then he fought his fiance only to be sucked into another portal.” – Estelle
“And the more she tells Neal ‘It was ten years ago, I’ve moved on,’ we know she hasn’t, we know it’s hard for her to live Tallahassee with someone else. Neal has always regretted that day as he actually says out loud. So for us it’s how do two people who love each other come together when there’s so much hurt?” – Eddy (from the Second Star To The Right podcast)

“I think there’s no question that Emma is the absolutely love of Neal’s life. Whether or not that means anything is not for me to say. But when Neal lets her hand go, he knows he’s letting go of the woman he loves.” – Michael

“What was so heartbreaking about Tamara, he felt it was real, he thought he had found it, he had moved on, and I think secretly he’s always wanted to be with Emma, but never thought that was an option. I think he knew Emma well enough that it would be really hard to get her to forgive him. So he moved on, and then to find out that was wrong.” – Eddy (from the Second Star To The Right podcast)

“I am really secretly glad they finally admitted their love, even if it was like right before the moment he was ripped away.” – Estelle
“Seeing Emma say I love you to somebody is very powerful and to see that connection between the two of them was very powerful.” Eddy
“Even if it had to come at the most tragic moment in his life.” – Adam (from the Second Star To The Right podcast)

“So what’s your favorite scene from this episode?” – Estelle
“For me, it was watching Emma lose Neal. As heartbreaking as it is, it was so emotional, and so gut-wrenching, and they both played it so great, but to be at that moment that you can admit those feelings are still there, but then to lose the person you love, I mean there’s nothing that’s more heartbreaking than that.” – Adam (from the Second Star To The Right podcast)

Neal Isn’t Such A Bad Guy

(about Emma being underage when she and Neal were together/it being rape) “Your math is a bit off.” – Adam

(about Neal setting Emma up for jail) “He didn’t set her up for jail. That’s Not what happened” – Adam

“Neal never sent her to jail. Not what happened. And MRJ understands his character better than anyone.” – Adam

“Does Neal’s optimism play into his reluctance to see Tamara for who she really is?”
“Absolutely. It absolutely has to do with that. It also has to do with the eye sees what it wants to see. In this case, Neal is absolutely — he believes that there’s no way a second betrayal on the level of what happened with his dad could be on deck. He has been so completely fooled by — he can’t wrap his brain around that being a possibility. I think that sort of the eternal optimist, a street-wise optimist, but at the same time deeply wounded in things like love that he can’t — there’s no way it’s possible. It couldn’t happen again. That’s where Neal is coming from.” – Michael

“For us we loved that Neal came back for Emma. It showed his love for her.” – Eddy (from the Manhattan commentary)

“Whether he was protecting Emma’s destiny or not, do you think that Neal still harbors some guilt about what happened all those years ago?”
“I am glad you asked that. Yes. I think he does, but Neal feels that he really didn’t have a choice in the mater. It was a matter of her fulfilling her destiny and for the greater good. I mean, we’re talking about her saving a town full of people that I grew up with, people from Fairytale Land, so these aren’t total strangers where I can be like, “Screw them. This is about me and my love.”So, in Neal’s mind he was sort of jumping on the grenade for the greater good. But of course there’s guilt. Of course there’s pain for having inflicted pain on someone you care about. I don’t know how you get beyond that.” – Michael

“When you really love somebody, you just want to be with them. And to have to deny that is hard to yourself, and it’s also hard because he knew he was going to break her heart. So the fact that he would add to the pain that he was trying to take away is really hard to live with. He understands that this destiny is important for her, and he can’t be in the way, and that is, that is really a self sacrifice that I think he regrets everyday.” – Adam and Eddy

Kindred Spirits

“They were definitely kindred spirits. There was a reason that she was so drawn to him and him to her. They had to survive to make life OK. There’s an interesting parallel for them that they both are on their own in this world and have had to find inventive ways to make life OK.” – Jennifer

“She’s actually met a kindred spirit because he’s also stealing the car. What they knew at a young age, was the simple things were the important things. Being with each other, being in love, and finding a place to be together. They just wanted to love their lives and find a family, and wanted to be together.” – Adam (from The Price Of Magic special)

“He meets Emma, and here’s this kindred spirit, looking for the same sort of things. We fall deeply in love, and I start to scratch that itch again for the first time in a hundred years, at least.” – Michael

How The Cast Feels About Emma and Neal

“Emma has to end up with Henry’s real dad.” – Jared

“Snow likes her with Bae because snow’s experiences with Hook have not thus far instilled trust.” – Ginny

(about which couple she likes besides Rumbelle) “Emma and Neal” – Emilie

“Well my sister ships #SwanThief but I am good with however it works out, although I do think my dad is pretty cool.” – Jared

(about who he ships Emma with) “Maybe #swanthief he likes Neal” – Josh

“I love Emma and Bae.” – Ginny

Going Into Season 3

“I did not promote a triangle at CC. I can’t control questions asked. But I didn’t spoil anything.” – Adam

(about promoting Hook/Emma) “When? Not true. We have spoiled nothing about hook and Emma or Emma and anyone.” – Adam

(about promoting Hook/Emma and not giving hope to Emma/Neal fans) “Not what we said! Emma may be w/hook on boat but that has no reflection on possibility of ending up with Neal or someone else!” – Adam

(about Adam only being concerned about Hook/Emma fans and not other fans) “I want swanfire fans happy too!” – Adam

“Emma is not on the Jolly Roger thinking about romance. She’s not. She’s there to save her son.” – Jennifer (SDCC 2013)

(about a possible Mulan/Neal pairing) “Watch it! That’s my baby’s daddy your’e talking about!” – Jennifer

“It’s fun for us to have Emma on that ship with someone as handsome as Hook thinking the person she truly loves is dead, while he’s trying to get back to her.” – Eddy

“The last thing I saw Neal do was look up at the woman he’s loved for ten years and say ‘I love you too’, and right now, I mean, I can’t imagine he doesn’t want to get back to her and his son.” – Adam

“Neal’s gonna attempt at least to move heaven and hell and if there’s a captain in the way as well, so be it.” – Michael

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

They don’t HAVE to do it, and some of the hate is not based around the triangle at all.

I do think the writers could have done a much better job of telling Neal’s story, because there are so many pieces that I think were crucial to his perspective that I only got because of interviews or tweets. A lot of fans don’t see that stuff or even watch the “catch-up” specials. And I think it is fair to say “Show me, don’t tell me.”

So I sent Adam a tweet which he’ll ignore because I’ve never had a response yet, about that. Whoever they want to put Emma with, fine, tell your story, but there’s so much of the story they thought they were telling with Neal that some fans missed by a mile. Stuff I know they meant to tell because they said it in interviews straight out, or in tweets.

Adam is pretty sensitive it seems to accusations about his open mindness and misogyny, and the last thing I want him to think is they have to drop the Neal storyline because the public would never accept Emma going back to him. In fact, I think it’s horrible that people think its ok if Snow treats Charming like dirt but not if the other way around. People should be good to each other and the gender ought to have nothing to do with it. Maybe I will tweet that later.

He might respond to that.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

Well Adam does tend to respond on occasion to your tweets, maybe you can ask if that’s him saying SF has no chance. I think he’ll say “I didn’t say that.”

I saw that tweet and I had to take a deep breath. First, I get annoyed at the collapsing of a complex situation to “he hurt her”. Then I hate the “as a woman” she should know better than to take him back.” Does that mean it is ok for Charming as a man to take back Snow who broke his heart and forgot him? Really, most people were ok with it because gender aside, Snowing both LOVED each other still, and realized that Snow had hurt him only because she was forced into it, and then couldn’t handle the pain so she took a potion to deal with it. Snow had magic, Neal didn’t. 11 years later after waiting for Emma he met a conniving woman who preyed on all his insecurities and fears and he thought he should do the equivalent of a magic potion and try to move on with another.

It’s not easy to forgive, but it shouldn’t be impossible either. Not if they have true love for each other that survives trials like that. But instead of trying to explain it, Adam’s answer is almost too much the other way.

Maybe they have changed their minds due to the constant pressure, but I feel like a woman or man is not made stronger by lacking compassion and love. Love is strength, and Emma is strong. IF she forgives Neal, he will have earned that forgiveness by his actions within the story, and they don’t want to spoil what those things are.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

Hard to say, because he replied to both Keegan and the fan, there’s nothing to indicate whether he just meant the love story plot or the Depp part but I agree, there’s far too small a chance of them snagging Depp.

ALthough, Depp goes in for quirky characters, and OUAT has the potential for some VERY quirky ones, like say, playing the Sarlacc….an alien entity composed of the consciousness of various absorbed yet still alive, slowly suffering victims? I could see Depp signing up to do something crazy like that just for the challenge of it.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

Were they on a show together? He really has the Eric look, but I think he is the star of a show so would be hard for him to recur I think.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

Writing to the Pit of Carkoon/Sail Barge Assault track from Jedi soundtrack. Maybe a Sarlacc will show up…

— Adam Horowitz (@AdamHorowitzLA) August 22, 2013

@keegolicious @pammielima maybe

— Adam Horowitz (@AdamHorowitzLA) June 2, 2013

I am not sure maybe means yes, but I do think we will see Baby Henry! If it does mean yes, then expect a sarlacc and Depp.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

Wrong thread, along with a failed embed….but excited to see Tink!

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

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