[kfchimera]

@obisgirl wrote:

In real life, if someone I loved did that to me, and people were ‘shipping me with that person b/c they were first love, I would question, ‘What is the matter with you?’ No matter the circumstances, it was a horrible thing to do to Emma.

Is implying something is the “matter” with someone for having an opinion with which you don’t agree a good way to keep things polite?

I determine if I hate a character based on a combination of the character’s actions and the circumstances, including the character’s intent in doing what they did, not just the outcome.

So for Neal, I find it hard to separate what he did from the fantastical “fate” and “Curse” circumstances set in the show. The best I can do for a real life parallel is some scenario involving a criminal organization and witness protection.

For example, Neal and Emma were mixed up with a drug cartel, but the only way for them to ever be safe and free is if the cartel was taken down. He gets approached by the FBI to be an informant, but he cannot reveal that to Emma. As part of witness protection he knows he’ll be separated from her, cannot contact her or anything until a decade later. Yet if he turns this down, not only will he and she suffer, but so will her family at the hands of the cartel. So he does what he thinks is the right thing, even though it tears him apart. If I were in those circumstances, I might find it a “star-crossed” lovers kind of thing, and might understand why people who knew the whole story could root for a reunion. It isn’t about “first” love, or even for the sake of a child, but about reuniting two people who have always loved each other but they had limited choices about how to really stay together.

This “he did it for her own and the greater good” interpretation isn’t just my unique way of seeing it–the actress playing Emma draws a parallel between the Charmings choice to send Emma in the wardrobe and Neal in J. Mo’s Tvline interview of March 1. It is the same one where the actress talks about Emma having “an undeniable connection” to Hook, so you might have seen it. The struggle that J.Mo. talks about for her character is how do you love someone who chooses the greater good, rather than putting you first? She doesn’t talk about what he did as how can you be with someone who is selfish enough to sell you out, or put you in jail, because it’s just something so awful you could never recover from it.

So for me, I do not hate Neal, but I also do not think there is anything “the matter” with those who dislike what he did or think it is something, even with the explanation, that they could never forgive. We all see things differently. Discussing why ought to be the fun part of having a forum like this.

Now if I were to ignore circumstance and intent, I probably would include Hook on my list of hated characters. He robbed Belle of her memories, her entire identity. Belle was unwilling to forgive her own father for even attempting to do that to her, so as a viewer, I wonder why I am inclined to forgive Hook. Maybe because I feel sure she will eventually get her memories back?

Then there’s what he did to Emma. As bad as the US prison system may be, it certainly beats being left for dead in a cell with no hope of escape (far as they all knew), with no food, water, bedding or any comforts of any type. Again, not something that is easy to put into real world terms outside of some fantastical third world or again, mafia situation. Even though Emma had betrayed him, she had not left him for dead, so his response was not proportional to the harm she’d caused him. I still do not hate Hook though, because I consider the rest of the circumstances. I know Emma escaped quickly enough. I imagine Cora would likely have wiped the floor with him, had he dared to turn on Cora. I interpret the scenes that Hook was reluctant, even despite Emma’s betrayal of him, to leave her and the princesses to that fate. So I excuse him (for now), thinking it is something Emma can forgive, and that I as a viewer can forgive. I still can see why someone might hate the character, even if I don’t.

[kfchimera]

That’s really creative and well done! Perfect with the teacup dress !

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

I have to agree with Demileto, that a happy reunion is probably not in the cards. Putting Greg with Tamara eroded some of the sympathy I had for Greg back in Welcome to Storybrooke. It’s still going to feel tragic that he can’t reunite with his father, but I have a feeling they’re going to have some more twists and turns in this story.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

Thanks for the link, it was pretty funn!

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

I agree, I LOVE the friendships in the show and often people get too caught up in the love and hate to talk about “the like”.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

A lot of people only react after the show airs, and want to stay fresh until then, with no spoilers. There are also likely people who participate solely by reading, perhaps reacting elsewhere or not. Chatter on the forums is only one measure of “fan enthusiasm” really, so while it’s less fun for those of us who check in frequently to not see a lot of new conversation, we kind of should expect it would not be so active during hiatuses.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

I hope we get a scene between Regina and Rumpel, because those actors play so well off each other. Yet I think it is the kind of thing that they may skip over and leave it to our imagination how she knew.

If not what HappyEndings suggested, then perhaps she knew because it IS a small town, and one in which people don’t seem to think much of having private conversations where people can overhear (like that Diner scene in last episode …..). In small towns where no one ever visits, people have got to be gossiping about not just Greg, but Tamara and Neal.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

Yay, we finally get a scene of Regina reacting to Neal being in town and Gold’s son. So apparently, she didn’t know before who he was (and probably did just think he was a stranger meddling).

Emma is telling the truth in that she’s not actively scheming anything–but the beans are a secret from Regina, plus there’s the worry Emma has over the “safety” of Storybrooke. She isn’t sharing something with Regina and Regina picks up on it.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

Fun to watch….her outfit seemed like it took a pinch of inspiration from Regina’s closet, especially those awesome shoes!

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

[kfchimera]

A lot of songs remind me of characters in the show, in a Rorschach test kind of way. My mind just connects it even when it does not fit the song really. A while back I heard a song on the radio that made me think of Rumbelle, which I did not know the artists or title to post here. I finally heard it again and found out it was “Little talk” by Monsters and men. Oddly enough, that is the band that the show just used for the animated promo! Different song thouh.

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?” -- Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass

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