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I understand that some people applaud him for being “brave” because he said he wanted to fight the Ogres, if the “Law” required him to, but to ANY viewer who understands the story without being spoon-fed the details, it was obvious Rumple told Bae the honest TRUTH when he told him that the law doesn’t want him to fight, it wants him to die.
Duh! If anyone was listening in “skin deep” instead of drooling over Rumbelle, they’d understand that The Dark One has the power to STOP the Ogres. So obviously the Duke didn’t expect anyone to win the war, just to die.
Die for nothing, basically.
Does this make Rumpelstiltskin less brave than Bae, because he knew the truth? He’s just as brave as his son, except he isn’t applauded. (I’m not even getting into why I think Rumple is more brave than anyone BECAUSE he left that war) either way, he did not cheat, he did not desert the army, he PLAYED BY THE RULES!! If being injured or killed are the only options, he preferred to be injured. Simple.
so don’t gimme that “Bae is brave unlike Rumple who is a coward” RUMPELSTILTSKIN WAS NEVER A COWARD!!!
[adrotate group="5"]oh my, the ubove post was written long before anyone DREAMT that Bae would die… just PROVES that I didn’t quit the show “because I am angry they sent MRJ off the show”, or “I can’t accept swanfire not happening”, or whatever else fans would accuse me of, because I quit this show…
*sigh*
I’d think as time passes I would get less angry with this whole story trashing, but I’m just getting angrier…
this reminds me of a post I wrote in the Rumbelle thread…
I copied / pasted it here:I would say Belle understands Rumple far more than Nealfire does.
THAT is an understatement. Nealfire never gave Rumpel a chance. I have a lot of bones to pick with him
the guy goes off to face a terrifying monsterous being in order to save HIS behind from death in the ogre wars (not to mention Moraine and all his other little friends) and all he could say to him is “you hurt people all the time”?? how about some love and understanding? I GET that he’s a kid and he wants his father back, and I get he’s just a kid, but why not try to help your poor father fight this curse?Help him go back, back to the best version of him.
I was stoked when Bae heard His father tell Belle that IT NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE. no it never did happen before, because Bae never gave him a chance.
then the bean. I UNDERSTAND that he made a deal, but honestly! you see the man is terrified and is trying to pull you out of the portal, LET HIM!! why pull him in? why force him to go through the portal from hell, if you see he is scared??
the worst comes in Manhattan. this whole “get out of my apartment gig. seriously, your father finally found you and you won’t even TALK?? “you’ve got three minutes” and then he has the audacity to say “two minutes” like shut up, I don’t care what you have to say. Pinoccio/August didn’t time him, so look at the difference of how he talked to him.
even Emma had a little more compassion for him and she was very quick to blame him for killing Archie
He wants to talk to you, and you’re timing him?? what’s wrong with you, Neal??Henry was a much better son to Regina than Baelfire was to Rumpelstiltskin, and there were many times that I wanted to shake Henry.
maybe Rumpelstiltskin didn’t raise Baelfire very well. Maybe all of his abandonment issues played a role in how he treated Bae in FTL (spoiled him rotten most probably) so when HE became the weak one, when it was HIM who needed help and emotional support, the kid couldn’t provide it.
I mean look at Never-land. look at how Neal keeps goading him, save David because it’s the right thing to do -no favors,, gimme your dagger, gimme the Pandora box, and what did Rumpel do? give him whatever he asked for (unless the shadow took it. never reprimanded him for using the squid ink on him. (really cruel thing to do)
whatever you say about Regina, she did raise her kid well. he is the most well-adjusted, compassionate, supportive, mature child I’ve ever seen. and yes, HE helped Regina go back to the best version of herself. and he was also just a kid. a younger kid than Bae even.
(i’m afraid that Emma is doing the same thing now to henry – letting all HER abandonment issues cloud her child-raising judgement, and now Henry will be a troublemaker like drive a car or whatever, but that’s for another thread)
so someone mentioned ouat to me today
it’s like a bruise that’s still tender, someone touches it and you SCREAM
this is how I feel about this show. I’m done with it, but someone mention it to me and I have to RANTThe funniest thing about all of this is that all those people who LOVE MRJ and all those people who shipped swanfire and all those people who LOVED Neal / Baelfire are STILL watching this show, and I, who was annoyed at Neal, did not care for swanfire, (even though I knew they were obviously true love), don’t care for MRJ,
*I* stopped watching this show since 315. And not only did I stop watching ouat altogether (I used to watch S2 and S1 on Netflix over and over again – I can’t do that now), I can’t even bring myself to watch the LAST EPISODE of woatiw… I am SO DONE with ALL OF IT. How does this make sense?I think Baelfire is so GOOD, he symbolizes good. Just like Snow (and Charming) symbolizes good. The problem with good is that it gets trampled on very easily. It ceases to exist because it is too GOOD to fight. Where would Snowing be if not for the EVIL Rumple protecting them? Dead, that’s where they’d be. But see, THEY are so good, they are too good to fight for themselves, so Rumpelstiltskin has to do all the work to keep them alive and well. Where would Baelfire be if not for Rumple becoming the evil Dark One? Dead, that’s where he’d be.
See? All these good people refuse to even TOUCH something dark.
Emma, however, is different. She is good the way Rumple is good. They are both good, but will not refuse to protect their family just because they need to touch evil for a second. Look at Emma’s reaction when Snow lay in bed feeling all sorry for herself because she killed someone who would have KILLED THEM ALL! Emma just didn’t get it! Gold didn’t get it either. When Charming accused him of making Snow murder someone, he was like, “someone who was going to kill all of YOU…” I mean, like, how can you even complain about that with a straight face? Snowing and Bae are the kind of GOOD that can ONLY exist in fairytales. Emma and Gold, although they are both very GOOD people, would not turn away from evil if it gets them their family’s safety.
And this is why I never liked Baelfire/Neal. He is JUST LIKE snowing, and I am not a big fan of snowing. He just couldn’t stand it that his father became a monster. OK, I know, he was terrified by what became of his father overnight, he was just a kid, I get that. But he was 14 years old! For 14 years he has known his father to be honest and loving and good. His father was still honest and loving, he just wasn’t good anymore. If I were Bae, I wouldn’t go play ball with my friends while my father is struggling with the darkest curse known to man, and is almost getting consumed by it… if I were Bae, I’d stay home and help him fight it. After all, Rumplestiltskin became a monster to save BAELFIRE’s ass! Bae was SO unsupportive! And then when his father came ALL THE WAY to the LWOM to find him and say he’s sorry, he RAN? He spent years “running from that man”? what?? He was upset at EMMA for bringing his father to him? Emma had no idea what was even going on! HE never told her he was Mr. son of Rumpelstiltskin
See what I mean? I felt like smashing his face sometimes, this Nealfire. Yet I still wanted him to HAVE A HAPPY LIFE! It’s because I am a very big Rumpelstiltskin fan. You know, until I watched 315 I didn’t realize JUST how much I love Gold’s character. I LOVE him…. And it has nothing to do with RC, I do not like the actor too much at all. It is Gold’s character that I REALLY love. And this is why I love all the people that Gold loves. Or rather, I wish well to all the characters that Gold loves.
I THOUGHT that I loved Regina’s character, but I think it was really just Lana that I admire. (I mean she IS beautiful, the most beautiful and spunky actress I’ve seen in anywhere, really). I thought I cared SO MUCH and was SO EXCITED about Regina and her wicked sister. But no, after what they did to Gold’s character in 315, I just lost interest in EVERYONE. I lost interest in the whole show and all its’ characters.
I am sorry I called Neal “really stupid” but in that episode he was ooc, and really stupid….
what was his hurry? Emma and Henry were SAFE they were happy. His father took centuries to find him, he was patient and meticulous in his plans… Bae just… just… I don’t know, maybe he got that from his mother…did anyone really believe me when I said that I had to stop being obsessed with this story? with these forums? well if u did, you have more faith in me than I have in myself…
you know, sometimes I wonder if A&E are laughing at us or what? or maybe someone else is the real writer and they are just the faces that pretend to be the writers..? I say they are laughing at us.. they are pretending to be one of the less intelligent viewers on purpose. or one of their less intelligent characters…
here’s an example:
they can’t SERIOUSLY think that Baelfire was heroic for bringing his father back, can they? they can’t really believe that Bae did anyone a favor by “dying”/getting separated from Gold… can they? THEY wrote it! they know the result. how can this act be heroic? how is this in any way not just REALLY STUPID? by staying connected with his father he could have prevented the witch from ALWAYS keeping Gold a slave and a puppet. every time he came out, she couldn’t summon the dark one. (or at least that’s what I remembered in 315) and then in zap2it adam or eddy say something stupid about Bae becoming a hero unlike his father and grandfather WHAT?
from what *I* watched in that accursed 315 episode (that I try to unwatch ever since), it was undoubtedly Rumple who was the hero, he lost HIMSELF in a desperate attempt to save his REALLY STUPID son. the reason NEAL was still alive in that episode makes Rumple a hero, not the other way around. Neal should have been dead. if Rumple used his BRAIN instead of his HEART on that cursed night when Bae brought him back, he would not be a puppet/slave to darkness, and Neal, stupid Neal, would have been dead.
and after showing us this episode, they come and tell us in an interview that Baelfire will always be in our hearts and in flashbacks… and that his “death” was meaningful because he is the hero, unlike his father and grandfather who were cowards WHAT????
here is my theory: A&E and ABC are either 1) doing an experiment, a “TV show” experiment. they want to see what audience like better, story or actors. so they kill the story on purpose to make it look like they will promote actors, aka pretty faces, and they are conspiring to make it look REAL, so real that even the smart people who view this show will believe them because “its internal, rumor and all” that actor had to leave the show blah bllah blah then they sit back and watch all the fans’ reactions. or 2) they want us viewers to be frustrated and feel hopeless and angry because we will be so much happier when the happy ending (Neal+Emma+Henry) will finally come. they are taking their little show VERY SERIOUSLY, OK? or 3) they are laughing at society in general where people are so blinded by appearances, or NAME, (you know, if you call someone a coward again and again, everyone will believe it even if all evidence point to the opposite, or if you call someone a hero again and again – plus he’s pretty – everyone will believe it even though he obviously isn’t a hero) appearances are so important… NAME is so important… it fits right in with the theme, you know? I say, this whole show is one big satire.
unless my theory was correct: Hook somehow got in touch with Rumple, who gave him the remaining memory potion, and sent him to find Emma with a plan to restore Bae by killing Gold back, Hook wiLL help Gold, but in the end die instead of Gold. but it’s not gonna happen cause *I* said that. (I WANNA WRITE FOR THE SHOW!) but it would have been so so poetic… wouldn’t it? Hook saving Rumple… the two working together… yum!
especially since Hook’s expression since, like, 308 or so, has been of guilt. I noticed every time he looked at Gold he had that LOOK as if he feels guilty. (this is what made me believe that Peter Pan had Hook do a lot of ugly things to Rumple in the past when he worked for him etc.)
but no… it’s all in the name… appearances… IMAGE…
so Neal “dies”, everyone talks about how heroic his “death” was even tough it was not, everyone continues to see Gold as the villain/coward “reformed”, and Hook is the hero
[[[no no no no no…. what am I talking about? Neal is not dead. Rumple made sure to destroy that key to the vault years ago. no one can bring Rumple back from the dead. dead is dead. you can’t exchange a life for a life if someone is already dead… what am I saying… Neal is alive of course he’s alive *hands on ears closing ears really tight* lalalalalala (I un-watched 315, 315 never happened) *ears closed tight* don’t talk to me 311 was the last episode of the series…
ok I’ll put my head back in the ground. dig me out when Bae is back alive and with his true love and son.]]]
here’s something to lift everyone’s spirits till then… http://news.yahoo.com/ohio-couple-married-70-years-die-15-hours-145159516.html ITS THE STORY OF NEAL AND EMMA PEOPLE!!!! thanks to Rumple, Neal and Emma can have this story!
don’t forget to dig out my head from the ground when we see Neal alive again, and it better be a worthy story!
OK I HAVE to stop. I’m going to take a break from the forums it is unhealthy for me to even consider talking about this story that makes no sense…
now Emma can possibly lose her magical powers? the magical powers that GOLD GAVE HER?? by taking her parent’s powerful love and giving it magical properties? this power can just so easily just GO? what??
why am I talking about a show that I haven’t watched?
I am not planning to watch, even after Bae comes back.. I doubt I would sit myself through this episode, if it’s about what you guys are sayingI was reading your accounts about last nights “show”
lol
I don’t know why you are still torturing yourselves through this…
I have officially un-watched 315, and this is how I did it: in my head, it was Gold who was lying dead and Neal closed his eyes. it breaks my heart, but it was acted so well, that oit’s hard to just forget. everyone talks about the funeral, and I saw a gif of Belle putting dirt on the casket, so in my headcanon or headstory it was Gold she was burying. *omg I am sobbing now*but this way, Gold is still the winner… if Neal is alive and is happy, than Gold didn’t waste his whole life.
everything he did to protect his beautiful child wasn’t in vain.
he didn’t live for nothing. he didn’t die for nothing. he didn’t become a monster who had to struggle with darkness for nothing. and he didn’t lose his ability to be human for nothing (i’m sorry, that scene where he gave up that dagger, his humanness, his ability to control his own actions, he became a tool, a tortured tool, as a desperate attempt to save that child of his… he couldn’t have done this for nothing…)
so even though some powerful scenes stayed with me from 315… I have un-watched it. so my end of the story lies in 311…also, from all of your accounts, Hook is being set up to be bad for Henry, and it is pretty consistent with how they started it… when Emma said “we were eating [candy] and playing video games… doesn’t sound like such a great mother… Regina would NEVER let him eat stuff that would cause cavities or let him waste so much time on video games… it’s interesting to see where they are going with this, if I would still be watching I’d like to see Neal’s reaction to how Henry is being raised…
I love you too, RG and all ouat’ers… that’s why I have SUCH a hard time quitting the forums even though I cannot bring myself to watch a single episode. not even the last one of WL… I know I’m crazy…
but Neal symbolizes everything in this world that is worth fighting for… that delicate flower of innocence… so easily crushed… when Rumple was that fragile innocent boy he was crushed, so when his own little symbol of all that’s GOOD in this world was threatened, he embraced evil, just to protect it, to protect HIM, Baelfire… that little teeny flame of innocence so easily stepped on and killed… he couldn’t let that happen. he had to protect that little flame with everything he had…
this teeny tiny easily breakable flower of GOOD is what wars are fought over. this is what drives people to kill and die for… to protect that innocence, to protect GOOD from evil…
this is why I love Gold so much, he WON’T let good lose, no matter what… even if he will have to use evil to defeat it…
good WILL win
I realized yesterday that we were inside a month to 321 & 322. I can hold out for one more month before I close the storybook on this situation.
The hardest part for me is knowing that I probably can’t walk away fully. Even if I grow to really dislike the direction of the show….this place (ONCE Podcast) is still home. I’m still here an ungodly amount. I don’t know if I can fully quit.
I’ll just have to take my “ARG” someplace else
I hear ya. but the show IS over for me. and it’s been beautiful
