Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
I agree with Crystal Princess…. Although if Idina Menzel is up for it, then she would totally nail the plot so hard we’d need a hammer to revive it
You would need a mass electric jolt or tons of smelling salts to revive a number of fans around the globe.
E!Online suggests Dakota Fanning – what? Someone like Dakota would be too young IMO – I know in the movie Elsa just came of age, so was in her early tweenties maybe, but Fanning looks too much still teenager to pull of such a character. Not to mention I think they better make Elsa a bit older considering the age of Regina, Snow and Emma and most around, it should be more closer to 30. And she has not the voice IMO for the Elsa – not talking about singing, the speaking voice doesn’t do it. To change looks is easier than to change the tone of a voice, Lana Parilla knows something about that, she had some voice acting training, and Liv Tyler can tell a story about it. Dianna Agron would be a better fit (surprise maybe for some, but she is closer to 30, and the voice fits better), if they stick to the look of Elsa in the movie as being more white, caucasian like, pale skin, platinum blonde. Well, we already saw Elsa as blonde and white in that last scene in the final here. Could be still Sami, because one couldn’t always tell by physical appearance in this case (it’s said that Rene Zellweger might have Sami ancestry). Megan Hilty would be a good fit and fun (but she just announced she is pregnant). Somehow Sarah Jones comes to my mind (Alcatraz, Vegas).
We have all summer break to go crazy about it 😛
[adrotate group="5"]¯\_(?????? ?)_/¯
Yep, Believe got cancelled, and so did Meghan Ory’s show Intelligence, so we can hope they might have time, eventually, Mulan and Red both.
And now there is Elsa.
If they don’t make any of it in season 4, then, I don’t know, it is the chance to do it, they would be fools, or restrained by other powers.
#reditgo – nice one.
alternative FrozenRed, RedElsa, FrozenWolfif Mulan FrozenWarrior
¯\_(?????? ?)_/¯
I’m not sure how I feel about it. I don’t want Elsa to be a villain because she’s not in Frozen either (and yeah yeah yeah I know: OUAT twists things).
Maybe it is more complicate. Just struck me, that I, we shouldn’t so eagerly assume that she is the big bad. I mean, she probably is the antagonist of the next season, or half of it, but as well we know, Regina has a reason for another big beef with Emma now, who destroyed her happy ending though without any intent (like mother like daughter), and Rumple betrayed in my view very much Belle, lied to everybody and I bet he is cooking something. Who the villain is can be a matter of view – which would be very fitting as story considering the movie character and that TPTB always insist evil is not born but made.
¯\_(?????? ?)_/¯
Very much there with you. Icequeen for sure, if they actually use Elsa, well, she looked a lot like her, so the thought will be there. No, the thought is there. They better work with this.
I also dislike the “why can’t she be a strong independent woman” line because that doesn’t seem to fly as a defense against the het romances.
Indeed, seldom used as argument against het romance, although, think I did once in a while, might have been even in connection with Emma. I am tired of women being whole only when they find their true love white knight, while for the white knights it’s their reward for being an accomplished guy, more the icing on top of finding a good life. And even less like it when finding true love is kinda used to put women into the “right” place, home, family, kitchen, kids, and that’s it, they’re reduced to it then. Yeah, great, with postfeminism it now has become a choice to stay there, ignoring how societal structures still make it a lot harder and close to impossible for women to be seen beyond (well, sorry, still more of an old fashioned feminist, so to speak, I see not much of a choice but plenty of societal constraints and restraining images).
Just to make that clear: strong never means having no weaknesses, flaws, struggle with things, it means interesting character, a character standing on its own and not just as an appendix to some other character. They’re trying with Emma, not always successful, but find it interesting, how people react to Emma. Prove to me that we still have to go a long way to overcome some images in all our heads.
So, strong female character doesn’t mean no romance, just doesn’t make romance all that she is about. It’s hilarious when people come with the strong, independent women trope any time when a woman might threaten masculinity and heteronormativity not just by being independent but maybe even by being attracted to women, and winning them. If a woman can do her own (sword) fights and doesn’t need a guy for pleasure either, that is scary.
Just hoping they’re not doing another whiny female big bad, because, Regina, Zelena – we had that, enough of it. Cora was a lot more intriguing as big bad until they decide to soften her and she became wishy-washy and her character development finally incoherent in this season. Time for a fiery cold female big bad. I could already sympathize with her when she simply calls out the main characters for their crap and foolishness, Rumple, Regina, Snow even Emma, they all are ignorant in some ways and too busy with themselves and their families to see how what they do does effect “bystanders”. No need for another sob story.
edit: One thing the TPTB (The Powers that Be, aka show runners, writers) did just with this last scene and tease for the new big bad: they got me intrigued again. My head is exploding with ideas for story, which I better should tune down, it’s so easy to get disappointed, particular on this show.¯\_(?????? ?)_/¯
As a miller’s daughter she hardly should have been among the poor of a village, but I know, OUaT is only following common misconceptions about medieval times, societal structures and economy. Maybe as the daughter of a miller’s hand she could have been called poor in comparison, but whatever.
No, don’t see Cora as a harlot in the sense of regular selling her body to whoever. She was the Queen of hearts later, but not quite the Woman in Red. Think though that Cora very well was striving to become more than just a miller’s daughter and was ready to do everything for that.
Had the impression though, that somehow we were meant to see her as a bit naive falling for that con guy, being somewhat of a dreamer hoping for being found by a prince some nice day (don’t all girls dream of that?… No!) instead of just letting her be an ambitious young woman using whatever means she had available. Some girls, some women are ambitious and don’t feel guilty about it, and don’t see their happiness just in a husband but maybe more in a good job, respect, status and enough money to do whatever they want to do, what’s wrong with that? I disliked that they made Cora now even more wishy-washy, more or less mitigating her into some ingenue dreaming of becoming a princess falling for some con man (might have not quite worked, Rose McGowan never is believable as ingenue, no matter how charming and disarming her looks and smile can be, and I love her for it).
¯\_(?????? ?)_/¯
I get your frustration about Emma’s behavior, and I am not happy about how they’re writing Emma at the moment myself, but different reasons, more that the writers fail to show where she is coming from, where her feelings and reactions are coming from.
If it is any alike what we know from the fake memories everyone had or got with the first Dark Curse, then Emma (and Henry) have now two sets of memories, what really happened and the fake memories. They never made that much of a point in their writing, which I think is a failure, but it was told they have both memories. Think they didn’t say if it is the same now for Emma, but it would makes sense. It means a part of her is the memory of giving up her son for good, and living a rather lonely life of a single working woman then, though she managed to make a living, and a part of Emma remembers to have raised Henry herself, a single mother managing her life with a kid and making a living, a less lonely, more emotionally satisfying live than Emma actually had. Can understand she wants what she had in New York back, although she never will get it back like that. But these memories and the real year she had with Henry in New York is pretty much the best time she had in all of her life, besides maybe the time she had with Neal over 10 years ago, (but then he left her without any explanation, and Emma went to prison, so probably not a time she likes the remember).
Emma knows pretty much nothing else than abandonment. For 28 years she had to wonder why her parents left her, and you don’t get over that in just a few months, after just some hugs and lovely words. Her first foster parents abandoned her for their own blood child. Neal abandoned for whatever reason. Right, Emma knows now why most things happened the way they happened but that doesn’t make the feelings go away.
What abandonment issue have her parents to struggle with? Snow lost her mother early, yes, when she was a teenager, but she had a loving father and mother in her childhood. David parents might have given up his twin brother, but he stayed with them, loving parents. They have not suffered any childhood trauma alike Emma. Regina might have had a crappy, narcissistic mother and a weak father, but she wasn’t abandoned either. Neal had a loving father as child, though a mother who probably didn’t care much, his mother left, his father became the Dark One, but at least as child he had a father, and he knew what happened to him, different from Emma. Nevertheless could Neal name as someone who knows something about abandonment, and Rumple, those two might have a bit of abandonment issues as well, but not Emma’s parents, not Regina.
Not saying Emma had a tougher time, but it took Regina a lot longer to start getting over some things. It’s confusing, I know, but since Henry showed up at Emma’s doorstep and where we are now in the presence of Storybrooke maybe a year and half might have gone by, and most of the time Emma spend with fake memories with Henry alone in New York. Regina had more than 30 years with knowing a lot more to suck it up and grow up.
What reason have her parents, Snow and David given Emma to stay with them, did they really made her feel at home with them? We had a great moment with Snow and Emma when in the nursery, when they were looking for a way back from the EF to Storybrooke some weeks or months ago, but since then Snow had growing problems to connect, and that is not just a problem on Emma’s side, I see Snow as much as responsible. Yup, it was taken away from Snow to raise her daughter, and that Snow recently seemed so little bothered how her daughter was doing can be somewhat explained with being pregnant. Snow snapped at Emma for still not feeling totally happy family with her and David and thinking about living with Henry in New York after she had saved just again her parents and the Enchanted Forest folks from some evil, showing how little Snow understands her daughter’s feelings and situation.
The way Snow and Charming were portrayed in this 3B season either the writers failed in showing that they cared about Emma and genuinely were interested in her as their daughter and not just as the savior, or the writers actually mean them to be as ignorant has they came across. I even defended them for first seeing that some things were set up when returning to the Enchanted Forest, as leaders they had to. But besides David indirectly admitting, that he feels like they failed Emma (creating angst to fail his second child as much) there was not much indication, that Snow and Charming even though of looking for a ways to get back to Emma and Henry or Emma and Henry back to them. Does anyone think David or Snow wouldn’t have started immediately to look for ways against all odds even if they had been separated from each other? But their daughter again had to life without them. Or in other words: Parental love is less true than romantic love, at least that is what I get from this season so far, exception special super snowflake Henry and his two mothers.
Yes, Emma pushes people away and is a runner, but that is, because it gives her the sad comfort of feeling at least in control of her life, of leaving before she is left.
And why should Emma care that Regina is Henry’s mother as well? Does Regina really care that Henry has two mothers? Of course it is not really thought through by Emma, she is reacting emotionally, falling back into her runner habits. As Regina had no problems to consider leaving with Henry while Storybrooke and everyone there would have been destroyed before the end of season 02, and then conveniently wiped Henry’s memory so no one besides her would remember she thought of doing it – guess that worked even on many in the audience.
I am not saying Emma has been through more than others, is worse off or more to feel sorry for, but neither should she been given less leeway than others.
Yes, maybe Emma will feel at the end of this season a bit more that home is with her family. But as well I hope, that her family gets over mostly seeing her as the hero and savior and starts seeing her as her. Everyone has to do some work here and change.
¯\_(?????? ?)_/¯
Cyrstal Princess wrote:
Does anyone have an actual link to where Eddy said no? Also you are aware showrunners can and will lie so they don’t spoil potential future plans, or that plans can change for a long list of reasons? It just bothers me that people act like it’s set in stone. For all we know they went to one of Lana’s LGBT ally talks and it inspired them. Who knows. It’s just not fair to nuke a ship like that either way.Don’t think they ever said no in the sense it never can happen, more that they haven’t done anything on purpose (that was what Eddy said on the SDCC 2013 panel), in other words, they’re not deliberately writing SQ (so far), so no queer baiting, no intentional subtext, it is all reading by audience. That’s why I am saying, they have no intention (so far). BTW wouldn’t say they’re lying, but writers know something about playing with words, imaginations and minds, nuances and subtlety of phrasings. In interviews it’s more improvised, but it comes there with practice.
No intention so far doesn’t mean though there is an absolute no for the future, things can change, nothing is set in stone, whatever some fans claim or prefer to think. Until the last episode of the last season has aired we can’t be sure. And while Adam and Eddy said, they have an idea about how OUaT will end, they also say, it’s not painted out in all detail. It’s serial writing, and that is story telling on the go, some things are set, some things are set for the moment, and some things will change.
Do I think SQ likely to happen? No. Don’t sense any intention by the showrunners to go there, how ever open they leave things in interviews, but that’s me. That is my interpretation. And there can be surprises.
Cyrstal Princess wrote:
… how far away are we from seeing a trans character(i.e. someone like me) on a show like this? I guess we’re a bit rarer but being trans in of itself potentially has so much fairytale like stuff in it.Probably still some way to go, sadly. But thankfully there is a bit more media attention by now. About time to show there is more diversity, more diversity than occasionally even the queer “community” knows to handle, haven’t been all nice to each other either, but the more important to be confident now and help each other to show there is so much more color in everything and everyone. Though think to overcome the binarity of sexes and gender is for a lot more people a much bigger challenge at the moment than accepting that same sex/gender love is real and no illness.
And agree, Red would be good as character to go there as well.
But polyamory? The new Battlestar Galactica, and more so the prequel Caprica offered it or hinted at it (too bad Caprica got cancelled with just 1 season), yes Wicked touched it as well. But as much as OUaT is mixing up fairy tale stories and gives them some, geeky, twists, they’re still rather traditional if it comes to romance, and the show’s audience is in the majority even more conventional IMO. It would be something exotic (and something mirror universe, AU or alien culture is good for), which always has a certain appeal, but nothing that would be shown as more or less normal or acceptable. Not there yet, even less in OUaT (sorry, A&E are good writers but profound story telling is not their thing, trivial geek fun with a touch of innocent morality suits them better, which is fine).
That is one of the nice things about shows like Star Trek and Stargate, at least they can take us to different cultures, even if our culture is not there yet, and thus give different ideas form and more visibility. Working with alien or supernatural (sub)cultures offers space to play with other ideas, like they do it now in Defiance, Star-Crossed (another show with queer characters we forgot to name, airing on CW, broadcast network), Lost Girl with Fae culture(s), True Blood.
OUaT could have done something with different realms, but it’s a family soap opera, that is where the focus is on, not on realm travelers. Well, it started with Snow White and not Gulliver, so, no surprise. Maybe in 10-15 years Henry will turn into Gulliver and we get a sequel, Next Generation sort of OUaT called Henry’s Travels 😉 And his sidekick is the son of Dreamy and Nova, who they named Sandy (diminutive of Alexander, if some wonder, yes, it can be a male name, Alexander meaning the defender of men, here though as well as nick for Dreamy and Nova’s son being a sandman). Of course they will have to master a great quest together and their friendship is more than bromance.
¯\_(?????? ?)_/¯
Because OUaT is about true love, thought this course on Coursera might be interesting for some:
Marriage and the Movies: A History.
No, it’s not about fairy tales. It’s a look on movie history and business and how marriages were portrayed, and why Hollywood might shy away a bit of making movies about marriages (not where just married couples are in a movie, but movies about marriage). Course started 2 weeks ago, but still possible to enroll, it’s free. And it’s done by
Jeanine Basinger, Professor of Film Studies at Wesleyan University, called by some one of the most important film scholar alive (one of her students and graduates of the film studies program at Wesleyan University now working in the bizz: Joss Whedon)¯\_(?????? ?)_/¯
